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Like everything else, it's down to education. if motorway driving was a mandatory part of the driving test, lane discipline might be something that drivers are actually aware of.
A friend of mine was doing it when he gave me a lift to Wales.
I was embarrassed to be in the car with him and asked why. He said he thought it was safer driving in the middle lane.
I'd think the inside lane is the safest personally.
How about these websites:
www.people-who-leave-the-seat-up-when-they-use-the-toilet.com
www.women-who-only-get-their-purse-out-when-they-get-to-the-checkout.org
or my favourite:
www.people-who-insist-you-take-your-shoes-off-when-you-enter-their-house.co.uk
http://www.people-who-insist-you-take-your-shoes-off-when-you-enter-their-house.co.uk
My house. My f$%#in rules. Not difficult that one.
I try not to get annoyed with anyone on motorways, full stop. Doesn't always work, but honestly, I don't really want to die horribly as a result of some anger-fuelled manouevre, mine or anyone else's. At least middle-lane hogs are predictable, I'm more concerned by the deluded Highway Code sticklers who scream up behind you at three-figure speeds, slew left across the three lanes of traffic into the lefthand land, sit there for three seconds, then swing right with instant indication as they move, out back across two lanes to the outside, past traffic, then back in etc, ad nauseum.
I'm sure these people think they're fantastic drivers, but honestly, if you have the faintest semblance of spatial judgment and acceleration sense, you'd work out that there's not much sense in pulling in and out like a demented yo-yo, especially when you're driving 20mph faster than everyone else on the road.
Middle lane hoggers - they turn a perfectly good 3 lane road into a dual carriageway
if motorway driving was a mandatory part of the driving test, lane discipline might be something that drivers are actually aware of.
I disagree - you are required to indicate on a driving test. You are expected to use your handbrake when waiting in a queue on a driving test. You are required to look both ways before pulling out from junctions on a driving test. You are required to use your rear view mirror on a driving test.
I could go on... 😉
You should take a look at:
www.people-who-don't-use-their-handbrake-when-waiting-in-a-queue-on-a-driving-test.com
Boils my blood!
...deluded Highway Code sticklers...
Exactly BadlyWiredDog. So incensed are they by the perceived highway code violation of the middle lane hogger, that they are compelled to perform a dangerous manoeuvre and break at least four or five [i]actual[/i] road rules to point out what a terrible driver he is. 🙄
And of course all this showy melodrama doesn't actually work.
The hogger doesn't scuttle back to the left lane, suitably chastised and in awe of the superior driving talents of the stickler. Instead they just shake their head, think "What a complete c**k" and turn up The Archers.
http://www.people-who-don't-use-their-handbrake-when-waiting-in-a-queue-on-a-driving-test.com
🙂
It doesn't bother me - I was just commenting that good motorway driving will not be achieved through education in driving tests as no other good practice in driving test conditions are maintained by some drivers.
Exactly BWD/grahams - if the stupid middle lane hoggers didn't hog we'd have fewer of the people who get very upset about middle lane hoggers doing things they shouldnt. So lets get rid of middle lane hoggers and the problem is solved and everyone is happy and the roads are working as they should.
I cannot believe there are people out there that are that annoyed about it they built a website. Get a life FFS
As above, maybe you just dont realise how annoying it is to people. Also maybe you dont realise just how easy and cheap it is to make a website.
If everybody stuck to the Highway Code I bet that accidents on Motorways would reduce by more than 50%. If everybody stuck to a 70mph speed limit, a 75m stopping distance at 70mph, returned to the inside lane after overtaking and used their mirrors and indicators before changing lanes, then motorways would be a whole lot safer and traffic would move along a whole lot easier.
Middle lane 'hoggers' need to realise that they are just as dangerous as the bloke in the car behind you tailgating. If you weren't hogging the road then they would have no one to tailgate.
It's quite simple. When overtaking you return into the inside lane when you are 75m ahead of the vehicle you are overtaking and not within 75m of the vehicle in front. I'm sure we've all driven on motorways with those chevrons painted onto the road to give you an idea as to how close a safe stopping distance is from the car infront, that's the distance that you should leave between yourselves and other cars. The safe stopping distance at 70mph when converted to time is 2.4secs.
So middle lane hoggers next time you are driving ask yourself 'Am I more than 3 seconds away from the car infront on the inside lane'? If the answer is yes then you are risking your own and everybody else's life.
I hate motorways, ever since I was involved in a nasty accident that nearly did me in, lorries hurt like hell when they hit you!
(Had a lorry crash into me as I passed it in the middle lane, that went on to block all three lanes of the motorway, with other cars using me as a sandwich filling against the lorry!)
Now, I am happy to go with the flow in the inside lane, that is, as long as I don't have some nutty lorry trying to tail gate me, I don't think I will ever feel 100% safe with lorries on the motorway again.
So I guess you could call me a inside lane hogger 😉
hogging any of the two [b]overtaking[/b] lanes on a motorway is just wrong !
No !!!!
"Middle lane 'hoggers' need to realise that they are just as dangerous as the bloke in the car behind you tailgating."
This is not right and is what I was trying to describe earlier and BadlyWiredDog also is trying to express the same thing and did a much better job.
If everyone drove like a middle lane driver the motorways would probably flow but extremely slowly and there would probably be few accidents.
However if everyone drove like one of those tailgating luns who insist on pulling in and out when there isnt any need, the motorways probably wouldnt flow at all because there would be so many accidents.
So what you've stated is wrong, middle lane driving is bad and exceedingly annoying but not as dangerous as other bad driving techniques such as speeding / tailgating.
I don't know, the french can speed and tailgate very well but they also have much much better lane discipline than us. Their motorways may well not be as busy but you never ever see middle lane hogs.
middle lane driving is bad and exceedingly annoying but not as dangerous as other bad driving techniques such as speeding / tailgating.
Wrong.
If everybody stuck to a 70mph speed limit, a 75m stopping distance at 70mph, returned to the inside lane after overtaking and used their mirrors and indicators before changing lanes, then motorways would be a whole lot safer and traffic would move along a whole lot easier.
Any guesses which of those is the least important factor in safety and good traffic flow?
"If everybody stuck to a 70mph speed limit, a 75m stopping distance at 70mph, returned to the inside lane after overtaking and used their mirrors and indicators before changing lanes, then motorways would be a whole lot safer and traffic would move along a whole lot easier."
Im not arguing that point am I ? I agree with everything you've wrote there. Your not changing one variable at a time there are you.
However I dont see how that in any argues against this point.
"Middle lane driving is bad and exceedingly annoying but not as dangerous as other bad driving techniques such as speeding / tailgating."
Your best argument would be to say I have no data to back this is up which is true. But then you have no data to back this up
"Middle lane 'hoggers' need to realise that they are just as dangerous as the bloke in the car behind you tailgating."
So its opinion against against opinion and I disagree with yours
Oh yes Im meant to guess order of importance. Well one I wasnt arguing against traffic flow was I ?
Ok Safety
Joint First (im not sure to be honest)
1. Speed 1. Stopping Distance
3. Getting in the Right lane
Traffic Flow
1. Getting in the Right lane
2. Stopping Distance
3. Speed
You seems to be suggesting safety directly correlated with good traffic flow but I would disagree with this as queuing in a traffic jam is normally very safe.
Although I will agree that driving on a open road tends to be pretty safe as well so there not directly correlated I would not know what the relationship is.
i'd say the speed limit, all other factors should work out even if doing 300mph
ENOUGH OF THIS PETTINESS!!
Let's get onto the really important stuff that makes my blood boil - people who don't press the hand brake button in when putting it on.
I wasn't using the second as evidence to disprove the first - just making two points in one post (though they're not totally disconnected, hint).
scu98rkr - When you are driving you can't control the other vehicles on the road, you can only control your own vehicle.
For somebody to tailgate it requires another car to be in front of them so that they can drive too close to them. Are you following so far?
I would hazard a guess as well that the reason that most people tailgate is because they want to get past the vehicle in front. Would you agree?
So if you return to inside lane as soon as it's safe rather then just stay in the middle/outside lane then you can't be tailgated because there will be at least one other lane in which they can pass you.
You cant stop somebody driving too close to you, but what you can do is make sure that you minimise the amount of time you spend in a lane that could result in you being tailgated. As I have already mentioned if you are driving in the middle lane and there is a gap of more than 80m between yourself and next car on the inside lane then you are causing an obstruction and you are therefore a hazard to the road.
Why would someone tailgate you in the middle lane, would they not go out to the overtaking lane?
matter of principle if the inside lane is clear
So if you return to inside lane as soon as it's safe rather then just stay in the middle/outside lane then you can't be tailgated because there will be at least one other lane in which they can pass you.
Yes and no. I'm not about to defend somebody not pulling in given the chance, but I've been tailgated in the right hand lane when I was overtaking something in the middle (presumably they think I might speed up or somehow get out of their way quicker - given the fact I can only control what's in front of me I tend to do the opposite to decrease the chance of having to stop suddenly).
I didn't argue middle lane hogging wasn't bad/dangerous.
I understand the cause and effect relationship however if you could isolate the techniques by making every driver on the road do either middle lane driving/tailgating I believe middle lane driving would be safer hence my statement.
"Middle lane driving is bad and exceedingly annoying but not as dangerous as other bad driving techniques such as speeding / tailgating."
Therefore I also believe this statement to be incorrect
"Middle lane 'hoggers' need to realise that they are just as dangerous as the bloke in the car behind you tailgating."
matter of principle if the inside lane is clear[/i]
But its not there are slow moving lorries in it and even if it was not, surely someone not aware that middle lane hogging pisses people off so much is not as bad as someone deliberately tailgating them when he could safely overtake
You do still seem to have added an extraneous point in there, which you're not actually justifying - did you not get my hint?
If you weren't hogging the road then they would have no one to tailgate.
And why exactly isn't the tailgating bloke in the outside lane??
'Am I more than 3 seconds away from the car infront on the inside lane'? If the answer is yes then you are risking your own and everybody else's life.
Genius! Except that rather assumes that the car on the inside lane is travelling at the same speed as me. Which clearly it isn't if I'm passing it.
If the car on the inside is doing 50 and I approach it at 70 until I am 3 seconds behind it, then I only have a second to either overtake or brake before I'm in closer than the safe braking distance.
Likewise you say pull in when "not within 75m of the vehicle in front", but if they are only doing 50 then that gives me [url= http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=75m+at+20mph ]8.3 seconds[/url] before I crash into the back of them.
So forgive if I stick with the Highway Code and only pull in when it is clear ahead.
On the way down the M1 with a car full on the way to our hols, pulled out to lane 3 to get past someone going even slower than me (I guess I was doing about 70 indicated speed).
Merc coupe comes up behind ultra ultra close and stays there while we went past the slower traffic.
As I pulled in felt obliged to offer a finger in return for the nice road manners - and got the same back from the old dear in the passenger seat!
We fell about the car for the next 5 mins after that one.
GrahamS - Highway Code stopping distances relate to your car, the speed of other cars are irrelevant. A modern car can go from 70mph to a complete stop in anything between 20-60mtrs, thererfore if you are travelling at 70mph 75mtrs(2.4 secs) is more than enough braking distance between yourself and the car in front. If that means that after overtaking another vehicle you only come back into the inside lane for a couple of seconds before you pull back out again then so be it.
If you are not comfortable complying to suggestions within the Highway Code may I suggest further driving lessons before you cause an accident.
If that means that after overtaking another vehicle you only come back into the inside lane for a couple of seconds before you pull back out again then so be it.
Sorry, but that's silly. I'd not do that, nor would I expect anybody else to. Fairly sure there's even provision in the HC that you don't have to do that, but can't be bothered checking right now. The people who cause the problems are those who could spend at least 20s in the inside lane.
I love the noise it makes when I don't press the handbrake button in. Sounds like going up the first climb on a rollercoaster!
the speed of other cars are irrelevant
Not when you are approaching them its not.
if you are travelling at 70mph 75mtrs(2.4 secs) is more than enough braking distance
Yes it is. But at those relative speeds [url= http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=4+seconds+at+20mph ]after 4 seconds you'll be at half that distance[/url], so pulling in 75m away with no regard for your relative speed is frankly a bit mental.
If you are not comfortable complying to suggestions within the Highway Code may I suggest further driving lessons before you cause an accident.
As I said before, the Highway Code explicitly contradicts what you have just said.
It says [i]"drive in the left-hand lane when the road ahead is clear"[/i], not pull in for a [i]"couple of seconds before you pull back out again"[/i].
I am quite comfortable following its advice and I suspect it is you that needs the lessons.
Hogging? Absolutely not. I think I know when/how to safely get out of people's way.
GrahamS appears to be the only one that knows what they're doing here. It's all in the planning. If you are still gaining on the traffic and nobody is playing silly buggers behind you then it is best to just stay in the lane you're in as it cuts down on unnecessary maneouvres and therefore risk.
Also, if anyone wants any lessons you know where I am. It would give you a good excuse for a ride too.
GrahamS - How would you define 'when road ahead is clear'? Are you saying that if you can see another car on the inside lane regardless of how far ahead that may be then you will stay on the middle lane?
The Highway Code clearly states that in a car travelling at 70mph you should keep a distance of at least 75mtrs between your self and the vehicle in front. Therefore I would say that anything over 75mtrs between yourself and the next vehicle would be considered to be a clear road.
Have you got any other definition as to what a 'clear road' could be?
I knew a lad (used to work for us) who sat in the middle lane as it was safer (he could 'see' what was happening on both sides.
He also drove everywhere with his fog lights and main lights on. This was because drivers kept on pulling out of sideroads infront of him.
Ta-dah! The Troll appears.
Same lad- had a almost new Audi A4 convertible on HP. He couldnt afford to service or buy new tyres for the car so it was sat most of the time at home.
[i]. Therefore I would say that anything over 75mtrs between yourself and the next vehicle would be considered to be a clear road.[/i]
You would?
The 75m is presumably set as the absolute bare minima rather than a desirable distance. So you class this absolute minima as clear road?
thats why i said 'anything OVER 75mtrs'
Like 76m?
Hora - I meant Trolling Zoo Fighter, not you.
I never drive my hairdresser's car in the middle lane - it's always parked on the pavement, on a pedestrian crossing, outside TanFastic whilst I nip in for a quick tan session.
😉