MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
How are we going to do this then?
Elf flinging contest?
No good, I weigh far too little. Got to be someone who weighs 100kg.
No, I'm serious. If people really think such feats are easy, then they can come and prove so.
Easy to say stuff on tinternet, but not so easy to prove it in real life.
they been doing that daily since they left school, its conditioning. We are weedy girls compared to your average 18th century labourer. I call it progress.
As no-one has actually provided any proof of such claims, instead resorting to pathetic attempts to insult people from London, I'll consider this matter done.
Well, I think you've provided proof of some of the claims about people from London
Edit: Everyone else... take a look at videos of scaffolders playing around on youtube
Got the builders in at work. One of the bricklayers is around 16st, spends a lot of time at he gym lifting pretty big things, likes to think he's fairly tough. Got into an arguement with a scaffholder who just lifted him up above his head, and put him in a skip. Been a bit quieter since.
Personally, I can manage squats with 50kg, 25kg each hand, with which my team-mate can do arm-curls with seemingly no effort at all...
I have no upper body strength but am quite happy to enter this STW strongest man thingy if I'm allowed to do leg-presses 😉
Well, I think you've provided proof of some of the claims about people from London
Oh really, what's that then, Mung Bean? Hmm? Come on, enlighten me.
This has descended into the usual 'I can't beat Elf in an argument (cos he's right, basically), so in frustration I'll resort to attempting to insult him'.
Amuses me, but a bit of a waste of energy, don't you think? I mean, you could use that energy to lift 100kg sacks all day... 😉
I reckon the truth here is that that little bloke might possibly have bin able to lift the odd 100kg sack, and then Chinese Whispers turned it into 'ooh he can do it all day long'.
An amusing and entertaining tale. Nothing more.
'I can't beat Elf in an argument (cos he's right, basically), so in frustration I'll resort to attempting to insult him'.
😆 You really think that's why we do it? That's hilarious!
Erm, it is, actually, Mung Bean. And you know I'm right.
It's ok, I'm not really all that bothered by it tbh. I don't take it seriously. In fact I find it fascinating, studying other's behaviour.
It's bin entertaining, this thread. Bit tired now so shh, sleepy time.
No. Have you?
Yup ok not as full on as a brickies mate but I regularly lift heavy loads in a many an awkward position. We have a lot more equipment then we use to and have a minimal lifting policy but it still has to be done pretty often due to constraints.
lets do this scientifically:
Poulsen E, Jørgensen K. Back muscle strength, lifting, and stooped working postures. Applied Ergonomics1971;2(3):133-7.
70kg men regularly lift 120kg loads.
in the early 70's
and, more recently:
Simple anthropometric and physical performance tests to predict maximal box-lifting ability Author(s): Williams AG (Williams, Alun G.), Wilkinson M (Wilkinson, Mick)
If people really think such feats are easy
We're not saying it's easy, we're saying it's possible and people do it.
100kg is two old bags of cement. I can believe people used to do that.
Have carried two a few years ago, not sure I could have done another one afterwards though! Struggled to lift my cup of tea!
Erm, it is, actually, Mung Bean. And you know I'm right.
Well, just to be clear, I don't really know what the argument, is or know which side of it you are on. Hence i have no interest in 'beating' you in it. I'm insulting for the sheer joy of it. I daresay that's why most folks here are doing it.and just incase you want to find some other reason, to go with that one, or explain it. There isn't one. That's all there is. It's turtles all the way down.
Look at how much porters in Nepal, Peru, Kenya etc can carry as part of their day to day job, ****in loads and at altitude! 'tis amazing what the human body can do with the right 'training' and 'motivation' (ie. doing it from the childhood with the threat of starvation from the lack of a job...).
Some short bloke syndrome in this thread for sure....
I can see that it's possible, depending on how the weight is packaged and how you lift it.
I can 'lift' the OH who is 100kg and walk a short distance (not really lifting, more balancing on my back) and I only weigh 65kg and I'm a girl
I used to hire men for heavy labouring in a limestone quarry where the temperatures in the bowl of the quarry were often 40 - 50º or higher (outback Queensland).
The big body builder types never lasted. It was the short wiry guys like the OP shows, and it was usually the old guys who were best.
In countries that don't have health and safety legislation to protect workers it's up to the individual to protect themselves. As pyschle says the importance of looking after yourself increases when there's no benefit system!
If you want to see good lifting techniques from the past watch a laurel and hardy film, they used to shoot the action scenes so many times that they had to have really decent manual handling techniques!
When I started work hefting 1cwt (50kgs) loads was the norm. I did however take a degree of micky taking from the older guys who remembered the days of 2cwt loads being routinely manually shifted. However, it has to be said that much of it is about technique rather than brute strength. Shifting a 50kg sack from the deck to your shoulder was bloody hard then and still is. It was extremely unusual to have to do that, mostly it would be a load being delivered onto your shoulder in a standing position.
Having spent most of my working life dealing with manual handling I for one am quite happy with the way things have changed. These sort of changes are why people now live longer and have better health in their later years. So being an old farty no complaints from me.
I used to move pig food bags about and one day I thought to myself, the more I carry in one trip, the less trips I have to make. So with some difficulty I loaded 2 up on each shoulder and staggered off across the yard. Each bag was 25kg, but I'm from the country and not from London. Doable, but I then realised a wheel barrow would probably make the job easier so used that.
you're all lying. Elf says so.
No I'm not Stoner. I'm saying no-one has provided any real proof that such a scrawny bloke did actually lift 100kg sacks [b]all day[/b], in what would have bin a 12-14 hour working day. It's all just anecdotes and hearsay.
I have seen blokes in Bangladesh lift stuff that most blokes on here couldn't. Little skinny fellers, 8 stone or less. Of course it's all about conditioning. They die pretty young, mind. Many have heart attacks, as the strain is simply too much for their bodies.
I can 'lift' the OH who is 100kg and walk a short distance (not really lifting, more balancing on my back) and I only weigh 65kg
I've done the same with a 17stone bloke. I've had a 13 stone bloke stand on my belly, using my stomach muscles.
All I'm pointing out, which most people just don't seem to have got, is that such tales are little more than exageration and embellished to sound good.
When I started work hefting 1cwt (50kgs) loads was the norm. I did however take a degree of micky taking from the older guys who remembered the days of 2cwt loads being routinely manually shifted.
Like this. 'Ee, in my day, we'd pick oop entire 'ouse and walk fifty miles with it'. Come on.
And this:
I used to hire men for heavy labouring in a limestone quarry where the temperatures in the bowl of the quarry were often 40 - [b]50º or higher[/b] (outback Queensland).
Erm, [url= http://wmo.asu.edu/australia-highest-temperature ]highest recorded temp in Australia is 50.7ºC[/url]. So again, exaggeration. 🙄
You can believe what you want. I prefer to live within the realms of reality.
So, anyone for the STW Strongest Mayn then? Or does MTQG win by default?
we have new TJ people
🙄
Does the winner get to stand on your belly?
Only seems fair...
See, you simply don't have anything intelligent with which to answer. Because you know you can't prove your own claims.
Put you down for STW Strongest Mayn then? Or is your back a bit hurty?
I like the idea of winning by default.
Saves me a lot of effort.
Well, it seems that most fellers on here are all mouth and no muscle, Graham!
Like that's a surprise... 😆
Erm, highest recorded temp in Australia is 50.7ºC. So again, exaggeration
Yeah, If it wasn't measured in a way approved by the Guinness book of records, then it didn't happen.
tales [s]are[/s] [b]can be[/b] little more than exageration and embellished to sound good
I don't think you can legitimately be so cock sure Elf. You can be sceptical, but you can't maintain that it's impossible since you've got no proof either way. Consequently it's time to move on... to the STW's Strongest Man competition...
I'm in.
However I doubt that it'll happen for insurance reasons 🙂
Time for another self promotional photo, I think.
100kg stone from floor to barrel.
[url= http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2171/2530985982_1677a720a2.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/8805115@N04/2530985982/ ]100kg stone[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/8805115@N04/ ]Vegan Graham[/url], on Flickr
Could you do that all day long, Graham? For 12-14 hours? Every single day?
How about BBB cage fighting?
I'm near certain people would like to test your London hardman fighting credentials Elfin?
No eye gouging or blows to the testicles... everything else is fair game?
Like this. 'Ee, in my day, we'd pick oop entire 'ouse and walk fifty miles with it'. Come on.
Pretty sure I didn't say that. What I said was when I started work 50kgs, i.e. 1 cwt was the norm for a lift, I did however throw in a caveat to that, in that we are not talking about a dead lift. I'll go one step further now. 2 cwt was the norm earlier especially in farm and building work, albeit with the same caveat.
You are perfectly entitled to call me a liar of you wish, it doesn't strengthen your argument or make you right. It is noticable that you chose to do that from behind the saftey of your keyboard and not face to face with someone who actually has worked all day carrying 50kgs loads and has routinely worked in excess of 100 hours per week while doing so.......... Probably wise 😉
Definitely not.
1 rep with 100kg was my limit.
I think I did 6 reps with 80kg.
No eye gouging or blows to the testicle
Yeah, someone blowing on yer testicles would be really ticklish and might put you off the fight.
A couple of minor points;
I think record temperatures are measured in the shade. If so, then it is quite possible to reach higher temperatures in direct sunlight. There may also be heat reflecting off the quarry walls.
I've heard of grain, flour etc. being carried in 2cwt sacks. In every case though, it was from the bed of a lorry or waggon straight on to the shoulders, not from the floor.
Yeah, someone blowing on yer testicles would be really ticklish and might put you off the fight.
Sorry... no biting is also a standard rule.
cant link a picture ATM, but materials handling on site can involve a lot of mass or awkwayd objects.
At one point recently a mate and I had to move 40 x 160Kg 150mm x 4.5m concrete T beams for a beam and block floor.
man at each end, arms at full extension, walking 30yrds with beam between. awkward and heavy. Not nearly as easy as 100kg shoulder load but comparable for effort. but entirely doable.
You are perfectly entitled to call me a liar of you wish, it doesn't strengthen your argument or make you right. It is noticable that you chose to do that from behind the saftey of your keyboard and not face to face with someone who actually has worked all day carrying 50kgs loads and has routinely worked in excess of 100 hours per week while doing so.......... Probably wise
Where did I call you a liar? Hmm? Where?
All I said was that it's likely the old hands were exaggerating, to try and belittle you. Did you never think of that?
And actually, I would say such to your face. Why wouldn't I?
[i]Could you do that all day long, Graham? For 12-14 hours? Every single day?[/i]
MidlandTrailquestsGraham - Member
[b]Definitely not[/b].
See? That's someone who knows. And Graham is a big bloke, who is very fit, and works out with big weights.
Not a scrawny little feller from Bristol. 🙂
Is the Bristol bit relevant? No, but I'll bung it in, as people seem to think being from London is somehow relevant to strength... 😉
Elfin: Try to get this will you. 2cwt sacks were a standard unit and were routinely handled as such by one labourer. The norm would be that it would be delivered onto your shoulder, you would then walk with it to a lorry bed or storage area and "shrug it off" onto the load. It is work that was normal, routine and regular. It would be extremely unusual however for a dead lift from the floor to be carried out as per Grahams picture. Frankly thats a pretty daft lift and will hurt you eventually if repeated too often.
elfin, do you turn every thread that you think you are right in to an argument?
do you turn every thread that you think you are right in to an argument?
youve been here too long to play dumb like that si 😉
Here you go a selection of references where you can check it out. The hansard one is quite telling in that it talks of the risk of rupture from handling these weights, but handle them they did.
http://www.witheridge-historical-archive.com/threshing.htm
http://www.harpershaulage.co.uk/history.htm
http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1943/may/19/sacks-size
so who is Fred? Was that Elfin? Was he banned from here?
youve been here too long to play dumb like that si
I SHOULD know better 🙂
elfin, do you turn every thread that you think you are right in to an argument?
Erm, no. I state the truth, and other people can't handle that, so resort to pathetic attempts to have a pop at me. S'ok, don't bother me much. Just makes me even more right. 🙂
I'm bored now anyway and there's stuff to do so play nice amongst yourselves.
[s]I'm bored now anyway and there's stuff to do so play nice amongst yourselves[/s]A number of people have posted quite a bit of proof, so I'm going to pretend they haven't
FIFY
I think if you're posting on this kind of thread (or any thread for that matter) in the early hours of the morning - then that speaks volumes...
Surely there are other ways to deal with being lonely?
Back to my other question. Why do people also call Elfin fred?
Elfin is like Dr Who. He regenerates periodically, with a different name.
One of which was Fred related.
Be interested to know what he was banned for.
lol, you really believe that don't you? anyway, I am right your wrong and you can't handle that. so ner 🙂I state the truth, and other people can't handle that
Elfinsafety - Member
Yeah, right.That little skinny bloke could carry 100kg all day long?
You seem to keep on a bout the fact that he is skinny but he is obviously getting on a bit in the photo. It's perfectly possible he was much bigger when younger, his baggy collar would suggest so to.
Be interested to know what he was banned for.
As far as I remember, with him being right all the time, he was in danger of making the Web redundant. It was a conspiracy perpetrated by 'The Man' so that they could continue with the 'panem et circenses' of the Web and keep us warm and contented.
i'm bored now anyway and there's stuff to do so play nice amongst yourselves.
Or as its known a Dead Fred Thread
He is right quite often, a bit like a Jeeves to Stoner's Wooster.
Not read all of this but I was always under the impression that a bag of coal weighed 1cwt. ??????
And as an aside, when I was 15 (and weighing some 9st) I used to work as a chip shop peeler/chipper and one of my duties was offloading all the bags of potatoes. I could happily carry two 56lb bags - one on each shoulder (and could pick them both off the floor and on to my shoulders somehow). In the busy summer months we used to do (IIRC) about 30/40 bags twice a week so I regularly lifted 4,500lbs a week.
So - given MY experience, I could believe that someone knowing the right technique could be able to lift 2cwt pretty much all day.
Finally - I know someone who was a coal man and he couldn't stand straight in his 50s so I guess doing it may not actually be good for your long-term health.
Elfin is like Dr Who. He regenerates periodically, with a different name.
Doctor Who regenerates periodically with the same name, I think you'll find.
(-:
Doctor Who regenerates periodically with the same name, I think you'll find.
...and is generally quite entertaining 😯
See, you simply don't have anything intelligent with which to answer. Because you know you can't prove your own claims
i showed peer reviewed scientific studies. it's as intelligent as you can get.
but then you can prove any argument with facts.
Jeez. Whats happened to my thread 😯
My nan found the article but not the BEP version. Scan to follow.
Jeez. Whats happened to my thread
You're a liar, we all found out and now we're going to lynch you
Here we go...
130 tonnes of cement in a day 😯
Basically we are a bunch of pansies now 😉
[url= http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5306/5781988717_589e5d32d3_o.jp g" target="_blank">
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/58162507@N07/5781988717/ ]Iron Man Jim is still going strong at 81[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/58162507@N07/ ]SGMTB[/url], on Flickr
Must remember to always have a camera to hand to take pictures of the monotonous, heavy, day to day lifting.
Still can't guarantee you a picture though Elfin, as I must admit it takes me two hands to carry such loads.
Elfinsafety - Member
...And this:I used to hire men for heavy labouring in a limestone quarry where the temperatures in the bowl of the quarry were often 40 - 50º or higher (outback Queensland).
Erm, highest recorded temp in Australia is 50.7ºC. So again, exaggeration.
Mmmm, seeing as you are suggesting I'm a liar, how can I respond to this except to suggest you are displaying monumental ignorance of real life conditions in places you have never been, and obviously you have never worked with real men.
A limestone quarry is a white bowl and any time the sun shines into one, it is a lot hotter than the rest of its local environment, and as pointed out by someone else, temperatures are measured in the shade. These guys were not working in the shade.
EpicC. Don't dignify his prejudices with elaboration. The rest of us understand the conditions you were describing
Yeah Stoner, I realised after I posted that it will end up looking like 2 fools arguing. 🙂
When I were a lad...serving my apprenticeship as a plasterer in the early 80's.One of the rights of passage was being able to carry two bags at once.I mean you didn't,that was plain stupid, but you had to be able to,or continue to get the poo kicked out of you as the easiest target.That would have been at about 10 stone body weight.Plater was easier because it was looser in the bag, I would imagine coal would be similar.
C'mon be fair, Elfin was only playing. Now he has clearly lost the game, on so many levels, he will gracefully turn up and admit it.
Or invoke the Scottish defence....
that would be the [i]edinburgh defence[/i]
[i]scottish defence[/i] infers that there is a scot involved
* I fail *
Will this draw the righteous elf out from his lair? is the bait just too tempting to resist?
I used to hire men for heavy labouring in a limestone quarry where the temperatures in the bowl of the quarry were often 40 - 50º or higher (outback Queensland).
Erm, highest recorded temp in Australia is 50.7ºC. So again, exaggeration.
Official temperature record will have been measured in the shade. He may have been working in direct sunlight. I don't know for sure.
HTH
That 130 tons of cement a day claim...
Let's make that a 13 hour day, without breaks, to make the maths easier.
So that's 10 tons an hour.
One ton every 6 minutes, or 360 seconds.
1cwt every 18 seconds.
Then we get on to the 22 hour working day shifting coal and coke.
18s a night at 5d a ton.
It's not quite clear, but I think it means 18s each at 5d a ton between them.
So that's 54s/5d = 130 tons of coke loaded a night, or 43 tons each in 11 hours.
Approximately 1 ton every 15 minutes, or 1cwt every 45 seconds.
It's a nice story for a local paper to print.
MTG you've shattered the myth with your simple maths, you should be ashamed.
1cwt every 18 seconds.
Thus proving that he must've been able to carry 2 bags at a time 🙄
That 130 tons of cement a day claim...
That's not what the paper cutting says. It's '130 tons.... in a single day', so maybe not every day. Maybe that day wasn't a 'normal' day. Still sounds alot.
TSY, how have I proved that he carried 2cwt every 36 seconds rather than 1cwt every 18 seconds ?
Richmars, good point, it could have been a one off challenge to see how much he could shift in a day, not a normal working day.
It still sounds like a lazy journalist reporting folklore as fact to me.