MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
yep guilty as charged... but i thought it was a two day course but its 4 hours apparently, can they really be that useful as a training session in that time?.
if it was two day course I'd have taken the points.
can they really be that useful as a training session in that time?.
Take the points if you don't think its long enough to be worthwhile 😉
Who said there was any 'training' involved?
Has it ever been a two day course? News to me.
Youll feel like it was 2 days after enduring one though 🙂
It was four hours when 'my friend' did it.
Interestingly, 'my friend' noticed that when appying for a quote from Admiral, they asked if he'd ever attended a speed awareness course. My friend was told on his course that he wouldn't have to declare it to any insurance company. He did a bit of Googling and apparently the Police aren't very happy with Admiral doing this as it's against the spirit of the initiative.
I did a 4 hour one about 8 years ago.
Worth its weight in gold. I passed my driving test 25 years ago. The driving test has changed out of all recognition in that time. It was a really good refresher and hazard awareness session.
Interestingly, 'my friend' noticed that when appying for a quote from Admiral
When "my friend" did one the presenter definately didn't give a list of the insurance companies that ask you this question and tell you to avoid them. Nope, never happened.
The Mrs did one a few years ago and it was definitely 2 days for the same type of offence (fixed camera). I was just wondering what had changed. It was my mistake so i'm prepared to take a bit of time out and i'd rather not have the points to be honest. And yes training may be the wrong word, I was just wondering how much information could be conveyed in such a short time. On a lighter note I've just had a parking fine cancelled so I'm feeling chuffed to get at least one car related issue sorted!.
1 day, nomally lasts a morning or afternoon (4hrs). Run by the AAin my area.
The Mrs did one a few years ago and it was definitely 2 days
Ha! She said.
IHN , admiral are a bunch of chunts anyway - would rather a pair of book ends fighting my corner in any future accidents where cars drive into the side of my car and ram it into a bus.
Interestingly, 'my friend' noticed that when appying for a quote from Admiral, they asked if he'd ever attended a speed awareness course. My friend was told on his course that he wouldn't have to declare it to any insurance company. He did a bit of Googling and apparently the Police aren't very happy with Admiral doing this as it's against the spirit of the initiative
You might not like it (if you've been caught speeding) but it's a perfectly sensible question for an insurance company to ask.
Been caught speeding = points or a course.
(IF) being caught speeding = a higher risk for the insurers then only asking "have you got points" is going to miss out some of the caught speeders and therefore miss some of the 'knowable' risk.
I don't know if they treat the course as worse than not being caught but better than just points due to the improved driving skillz or not though.
I did one recently. I thought it was ok actually and covered a fair bit in 4 hours.
Insurance companies can ask whether you've been on a SAC. What they can't do is tell you that you have to tell them before renewal if you've been on one - or more to the point, if you had an accident, they couldn't withdraw your insurance because you hadn't told them.
Funny thing about the insurance q - you don't have to declare convictions after they're spent, you wouldn't have to declare a court appearance which didn't result in a conviction, you don't have to declare points once they're cleared off your licence, so it would be a bit of an anomaly if you had to declare points avoided through a course.
The Mrs did one a few years ago and it was definitely 2 days
Was it residential?
I did one last month and was pleasantly surpised. Good instructors who didn't lecture, but got everyone involved. The issue of insurance was raised and their suggestion was change insurers.
Interestingly they said in ten years of doing these courses they'd only had two people who were adamant they'd done nothing wrong and there was no issue in speeding. They failed the course, so got the double wammy of course fee then fine and points.
residential with benefits?
I did one a while ago, I was in the wrong and I knew I was in the wrong...
it was a am or pm course that you selected.
It staggered me how many people on the course had what appeared to be no understanding of the rules of the road, or the highway code....
Like the am i going to get a visit from the police thread....
frankly 2/3 of the people on my course should have their licence revoked there and then, and made to re-train and test.
given i was aware of my speed and the rules, I probably shouldn't have been allowed to take the course...
It staggered me how many people on the course had what appeared to be no understanding of the rules of the road, or the highway code...
Yeah, I know someone (really, not me!) who went on one.
"What's the national speed limit on a single carriageway road?" answers varied from 40mph to 85mph 😯
Someone else was moaning about being there and insisted she was only 2mph over the limit. Instructors said it must have been more or she wouldn't have been there.
"No, it was definitely only 2mph, it's stupid, I shouldn't be here!"
"Well how fast were you going?"
"38 in a 30"
"So that's 8mph too fast then"
"No, because everyone knows you get 10% plus a few more, so that's 3+3=6mph, and I was only doing 2mph above that". FFS...
There were others but can't remember them now.
Worth its weight in gold. I passed my driving test 25 years ago. The driving test has changed out of all recognition in that time. It was a really good refresher and hazard awareness session.
Comments like this actually scare me a little, because
It staggered me how many people on the course had what appeared to be no understanding of the rules of the road, or the highway code....
... was my experience of it. As a driver I try to keep abreast of any major changes, that's just the responsible thing to do. I know the Highway Code as well if not better now than when I passed my test. One young lad on the course I went on confessed that he knew what road signs were asked on the test so just learned those and hadn't a clue about the rest. 😯
The test has changed over the years sure, and roads have got busier, but how to drive hasn't fundamentally changed in the 20-odd years since I passed my test. They didn't redefine what a red light means or suddenly make us go the other way round roundabouts one day.
Myself aside, on the course the only people who knew the speed limits were the younger drivers who'd passed more recently. And once the intellectual proletariat had come to a consensus, no-one really understood what a single / dual carriageway actually was.
Yet another call for mandatory re-tests really. Every ten years would be a good start.
4 hours. Wrote something (note contains sweary words) http://pickled-hedgehog.com/?p=3154, learned something, did change some habits. Was mildly terrified about how little 'qualified' motorists understand about driving hazards and road signs!
4 hours but spread over a day with lunch for me (bloody revenue trap on M4 after the Seven bridge. Costly BPW trip 👿 )
Actually did find it useful. Not in terms of the speed thing, but stuff about hazard awareness. Am quite aware of potential hazards, especially bikes around me, potentials pulling out from side junctions ahead etc, but still it did point out how I drop into an automatic mode when commuting.
Was a little annoying though when discussions lead to bikes though and all my fellow convicts went into a rant about cyclists.
Yeah, we had one of those. She'd recently knocked a cyclist over and thought she was entertaining us all with this hilarious anecdote.
"No, because everyone knows you get 10% plus a few more, so that's 3+3=6mph, and I was only doing 2mph above that". FFS...
I've seen similar said on here about that.
I'm not sure about it, at 87 quid and a day out of your life it's a hefty punishment for 35 in a thirty, but I did learn a few things and I noticed the gorilla, then nearly spoiled it all with an argument about what they should advise drivers to do in circumstances when they've pulled out without noticing a bike motor or otherwise.
I haven't exceeded the speed limit since and I'm still not sure why, i'm normally far more rebellious against driving authority, getting 500 miles + out of every tankful since as a welcome bonus may also have something to do with it.
PS you need to put down the blast shield against patronising bullshit and grit your teeth a bit.
"38 in a 30"
Had these from some in our group. Response from the cops running it is that was the amount recorded by the cops and cars read about 5mph over, so her speed would have been showing 43mph (for example).
Response from the cops running it is that was the amount recorded by the cops and cars read about 5mph over, so her speed would have been showing 43mph (for example).
Pretty sure all my cars have shown under (comparing to multiple GPS sources), except for the Triumph Spitfire, which just gave an indication you were moving. Actual speeds indicated would vary wildly!
Response from the cops running it is that was the amount recorded by the cops and cars read about 5mph over,
Which of course is bollocks.
Someone who isn't me went through a camera on the A1 at 80 the other week. They didn't see a flash but have apparently been constantly doing the '10% + a few?' sums in their head since it happened... I guess time will tell.
Just did mine Sunday just gone, found it quite informative seeing as I passed my test @ 30 years ago. Thought I new my stuff, but rapidly came apparent that I'd forgotten a lot!
Correction, all mine were showing over (I blame being ill for reducing my mental capacity to that of a chubby crayon), so at an indicated 30, I'd likely be doing an actual 27
Drac - Moderator
Which of course is bollocks.
Usually reads over in most cars I've driven. Noticeable compared to speed warning signs that flash up your speed.
Though those can be wrong, but (based on my Civ)... http://www.civinfo.com/wiki/index.php?title=Is_the_speedo_accurate%3F
According to the guys on my course (both ex-Police as it goes), speedos don't under read - at least nothing remotely modern - the manufacturers design them to typically over read to avoid that. That certainly matches my experience of every car I've driven.
The anti cyclist thing briefly occurred on my course too though it was quickly shut down when it was pointed out that riding two abreast was legal.
Under reading would be illegal.
Usually reads over in most cars I've driven. Noticeable compared to speed warning signs that flash up your speed.
Only by a about 1 or 2 mph in all the vehicles i've driven.
The average speed thingy on my transit reads 3 or 4 mph under the speedometer when I set the cruise control. I'm assuming that under those conditions the average is closer to the true road speed.
4 hrs = tea and biscuits.
I'd be expecting dinner, bed and breakfast for two days.
I think she was working off what the police had told her rather than what she thought her speedo said so the over/under argument doesn't really apply (to that particular example).
I have just sent my fixed penalty off, I decided to take the points rather than sit the course.
My reasoning is as follows:
3 points makes no difference to my insurance premium
I would have to take a day off work (losing a days pay)
The fixed penalty goes to central government to spend on useful things (maybe?)
The £110 for the course would go to the local camera partnership to spend on more cameras
What really took the p***s is that the guy in the camera van was a former employee, whom I gave a blooming reference to allowing him to get the bloody job in the first place. Where the karma?
Price seems to vary a lot around the country. Mine was £95. What was funny was everyone playing "recognize the road" as all the film and stills shown were made locally (Reading area).
Right at the start we were asked how many of us were regular bike riders, turned out to be about 75% of the class (22 of us). Also with one exception we were all over 35 years old. Make of that what you will.
[quote=Drac ]Only by a about 1 or 2 mph in all the vehicles i've driven.
That's similar to my experience in the 30-40mph range - previous car was barely 1mph over and still probably only 2 or 3mph over at 70. Current car close to 5mph over at 70.
[quote=tom200 ]I have just sent my fixed penalty off, I decided to take the points rather than sit the course.
My reasoning is as follows:
3 points makes no difference to my insurance premium
I would have to take a day off work (losing a days pay)
I'm pleased to see I'm not the only one who's used that reasoning.
Found this on another forum
"The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, as amended, allows the use of speedometers that meet the requirements of EC Community Directive 75/443(97/39) or ECE Regulations 39. Both the EC Directive and the ECE Regulation lay down accuracy requirements to be applied at the time of vehicle approval for speedometers. These requirements are that the indicated speed must not be more than 10 per cent of the true speed plus 4km/h (2.5 mph)." "In production, however, a slightly different tolerance of 5 per cent plus 10 km/h (6 mph) is applied" "The requirements are also that the indicated speed must never be less than the true speed. A vehicle meeting these requirements would not be able to travel at a greater speed than that shown on the speedometer and a driver could not, therefore, inadvertently exceed speed restrictions.
Did a 4 hour one, actually very useful. Early on, a bloke fell asleep in the course and the instructors went beserk, virtually threatening to march him to the local police station, everyone was quite a bit more attentive after that. Also a few people were late and were almost excluded. Just like being back at school!
Its £75 in cheshire... i wish i hadn't started this now especially as the mrs said it was only one day.... 😳 still never mind carry on
@ Cougar,
I feel I should defend my comment that you quoted;
I was the most experienced road user on my course. Had been driving longest, among these I spent 6 years as a professional driver, I have ridden motorcycles since I was 18 (now 43) and regularly commute on my bicycle including a 4 year solid stint up and down the A30 dual carriage way which I blame for being grey haired.
I was there for doing 80mph on a 70mph dual carriage way through rolling country side.
If anyone was to come out of the course and say they hadn't learnt anything would possibly indicate their lack of ability to be aware of what is going on in front of their face.
a slightly different tolerance of 5 per cent plus 10 km/h (6 mph) is applied
That's really interesting reading, assuming it's still the case with moder manufacturing. Presumably the 'tolerance' is down to manufacturing / reading inaccuracies? So at 70mph, your speedo is deigned to read 64mph, and with variation in tolerances the absolute fastest you can be going is 67mph, the slowest 61mph.
That's not a million miles from the anecdotal 5%-10% I pulled out of the air earlier. Cool.
Mine felt like it lasted a lifetime but my watch said 4 hrs. I have never had to sit through such a patronising collection of half truths and dodgy statistics in all my life. I was told on mine that the speed of impact is irrelevent, only the speed you were doing when you hit the breaks (really).
I can only assume given the number of courses being run that someone is making a shed load of money out of this.
If anyone was to come out of the course and say they hadn't learnt anything would possibly indicate their lack of ability to be aware of what is going on in front of their face.
Yeah, sure. But there's quite a gulf between saying you hadn't learnt anything and asserting that it was really good and worth it's weight in gold. Reading back and in light of what you've just said I can only assume that you were talking about being great generally rather than speaking specifically for yourself.
I don't doubt that I learned [i]something[/i] on mine. The sheer volume of people involved / affected when there's an RTA for example, I had never really considered.
But for me personally, I didn't get a huge amount out of it that I didn't already know. That's not being smug, just that my driving theory was pretty solid to start with. I wasn't there because I didn't know any better, I was there because I wasn't paying close enough attention to my speedo and thus didn't decelerate soon enough / far enough down to 30mph when leaving a 50mph zone.
That's not to say it's a bad course. For the other attendees, I wouldn't have trusted most of them to drive a golf club so I'd like to hope it was inordinately valuable to them. Which is where my comment came from; if you came out going "wow, that was ace, I learned tons!" then you must've been pretty shocking to start with. If you were just generalising then I've misunderstood, and I apologise for that if so.
I thought it was a good course, did one six or seven years ago - I wasn't a particularly reckless driver before but I think I was even more sensible as a result.
Thanks Cougar. I agree with everything you said. I was talking generally.
Trouble is, its often the people that need it most who are super cynical and regard it as a waste of time and money. I was attempting to counter the negative nelly's and trying to show it in a positive light. I genuinely think it is a good initiative. If you choose to take this route rather than just accept points, at least try and get some benefit out of it, you have to pay for it after all and all you need to do is sit on your arse and listen.
@Cougar, take your GPS in the car or use the sat nav. Then you can get an idea of the real under-read car by car. I confess I often drive at say an indicated 57 in a 50 by example as aside from over-reading speedo the GATSOs won't give you a ticket until you are over by a certain amount. Of course all dependent on road conditions, traffic etc etc.
All the ones that "my friend " has done were 4 hours. "my friend " has got 11 months before he can get caught again but I suspect that he has learned his lesson.