[Closed] What's the point of a T5 type van?

I've just bought a Caddy, so not quite the load capacity of a T5 but big enough for my needs. Mine has the VW lowering kit with bigger, slightly wider wheels and it's still very easy to push the front end. Handling wise it's on par with the soon to go Laguna estate wifey is driving at the moment. In the near future I'll swap out the front/rear shocks and change the wheels for bigger, wider items to try and get it handling slightly better. I've got a 2 litre Highline, so all the toys including cruise control and satnav. I'm using it every day as a commuter and getting 50ish to the gallon with mixed London,country and motorway.

Van vs Estate. As there is only wifey and I, we don't need the people carrying capacity of the estate, this is all about luggage. The Laguna estate isn't a small car, with the seats folded down the load space is longer than the Caddy. It'll take one 29er with the front wheel off and the bike lying down, plus enough room for some luggage. Take a second bike and it has to go on the back of the car. Load up for a camping trip and it's both bikes on the back.

The Caddy will take both 29er's with wheels on and plenty of space for luggage. For fully loaded camping I've fitted a couple of Seasucker mounts to load bikes with the wheels off. There is more than enough room for any amount of luggage we want to take. If all it was doind was carrying bikes, using the Seasucker mounts I reckon I could get 5 in the back with enough space to store the wheels plus take kit for a day or so.

The van is smaller all round that the estate, more secure and carries more. The only reason for not having one is if you need space for more than 2 people.

weeksy - coincidentally, from the same seller, I'm currently lusting after [url= http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221792395575 ]THIS[/url]

Would make an awesome bike / adventure camper 8)

I have to admit though, A T5 is still kind of tempting for lots of the reasons mentioned. I'm sure as a pragmatic motorist, molgrips would acknowledge that the low depreciation makes for low running costs even with the higher fuel cost - though how does servicing compare (has anybody done a full comparison of running costs?) Will probably get one if business venture takes off (and I can offset cost against tax )

Seems to depend what and when you buy. I had a quick look at a T5 and Traffic (Vivaro/primastar) and the depreciation in £/10,000 miles was much lower on the Renault, simply because you could buy one new for £15,000, compared to £22,000 for the VW. The VW was probably worth £5k-£6k after 10 years, the Renault ££4k-£5k. The VW was only about £10/month more on finance, so if badge snobbery was an issue to you then it's not an expansive option that way, personally I'd have saved the £7k and put that towards a conversion.

One other thing about vans, the depreciation is always more sensible than cars. Take the new price, the residual price at 100,000miles, and the depreciation is pretty much linear between the two because businesses buying/selling them just want to know what it will cost per year over the long term, irrelevant really whether they buy a van with 50,000 on the clock and keep it for 50,000 miles and repeat it or a new van and keep it for 100,000 miles. Whereas a car drops like a stone initially then levels off after 3 years because people want 'new'.

The difference between the Vans seemed to be that the VW then stops depreciating, presumably because they get cheaply converted into campervans with a plywood kit and then just get repaired by 'enthusiasts' rather than scrapped by sensible people when it becomes un-economic.

To be honest, 'the scene' is the only thing thats stopped me buying one. I'm terrified of being stuck in a beach car park with someone who wants to talk modding when the suns out 🙂

As a pragmatic motorist, I'm more than happy to save fuel and purchase cost by buying a regular car and simply remove the wheels from my bike when I put it in the car 🙂 Far too much is being made of the ability to take bikes with wheels on, imo.

I'd love a T5 but I don't think I could bring myself to illegally tamper with a number plate.

What Brassneck said! yep, the other week me and Mrs Hound were camping in the T5 for the weekend at British super Bikes. We're bike fans and not into the Dubber scene but the full on dubbers were like flies, hovering around asking about mods and did we want to see the shower unit in their tail gate, blah , blah, blah... I was only a bit flattered by the attention.

"Far too much is being made of the ability to take bikes with wheels on, imo."

Its the easy clean interior that does it for me on any van.

with the best will in the world if you ride regular your cars interior will get trashed.

now i dont need any will - i open the door and throw it in regardless of how dirty it is.

get to the other end sweep it out and the vans like new again.

mean while i take my dirty riding gear off while hiding under the tail gate out of the rain.

how ever i dont have a VW and although never say never - ill not be buying one (another VW of any kind) of my own free will. They really know how to extort the scene/reputation when it comes to parts.

with the best will in the world if you ride regular your cars interior will get trashed.

Not really. It's not that hard to look after them, all you need is a tarp. Never bothered cleaning before loading.

Far too much is being made of the ability to take bikes with wheels on, imo.

To be honest for getting away use I do think the T5's are just too small, just look at the number with bike racks on. I used to take the front wheels off my bikes to fit them under the bed but having the room and the permanent set up was great, You could also chuck the bikes in the front half if I didn't want to take the wheels off. For weekend duties cars just weren't that practical so I lived with the van in the week. The downsides are not that bad. My only rule for vans is being able to stand up in the back, too long moving kit in a low roof work van made that clear for me.

I compromised.

audi with a towbar mounted bike rack for day to day local mtb ferrying.

T5 for longer journeys.

8)

all you need is a tarp.

that for your sunday jaunt to the trail centre ?

It's just a vehicle you can lob all the family, bikes, other stuff in and go. No faffing with roof boxes, multiple bike racks, etc.

T5 has the best residuals, but if I didn't have one, I'd have a different combi van from another manufacturer. I'm not into modding the thing, or anything like that. I treat it like a van, although I treated cars before like vans too, and the interiors always looked manky.

I think a LWB would be perfect, but happy with the compromise of being able to get a SWB into parking spaces.

Not really. It's not that hard to look after them, all you need is a tarp. Never bothered cleaning before loading.

I do that with my C-max.

With the best will in the world, the interior is trashed. One winter so much mud accumulated on the tarp it was nearly 3" deep by March*! And that's before you look at the state of the front seats.

*riding 3 nights a week it was rarely worth getting the bike out of the car, let alone removing/refitting the tarp. So the mud froze to the bike, went in the car, defrosted, fell on the tarp, repeat.

The C-max will be replaced by a Van when it dies. Probably a traffic, probably with just a kitchenette and garage inside, with a small double above it for car park camping and storage, and a roof tent for sleeping.

[quote=pirahna ]Van vs Estate. As there is only wifey and I, we don't need the people carrying capacity of the estate, this is all about luggage. The Laguna estate isn't a small car, with the seats folded down the load space is longer than the Caddy. It'll take one 29er with the front wheel off and the bike lying down, plus enough room for some luggage. Take a second bike and it has to go on the back of the car. Load up for a camping trip and it's both bikes on the back.

I'm thinking you take too much stuff. I tend to take a lot, and never used a bike rack before kids.

I've had a few VW vans, they were great for me, might not have suited others, probably going to sell the current one in August.

What I don't understand is the vehement hatred some people have for them, do you really care what other people spend their money and time on? If you're that convinced in their inferiority, surely you've won already?

I'd like a Cali Beach if anyone wants to swap theirs for a T4 California Exclusive, not a yellow one though, thanks.

Not much hate but looking at things like this
http://vans.autotrader.co.uk/used-vans/volkswagen/transporter/2003-volkswagen-transporter-2-5td-888-special-panel-van-2461cc-diesel-halesowen-vfpa-8aa245704d9b30fa014d9b5babf10c0e/makemodel/make/volkswagen/model/transporter/radius/100miles/mileage/150000/174999
at 12 years old with 150k miles for £5k isn't residuals it's a rip off, you pay a chunk more up front, you get some of it back at the end if the magic residuals come off it's great but it's a lot more than equivalent vans.

Not so much hating VW's just not seeing the point of tieing up £7k in a van (the difference in new cost between a Traffic and a T5). That and some people just want to be different and not fit into a 'scene' whereas rightly or wrongly there's a perception T5's are driven by people who ride teal and pink Santa Cruz bikes and refer to the van's appearance as 'stealth' or 'murdered out', when in reality it makes them stand out like a sore thumb amongst real vans.

pictonroad - Member

What I don't understand is the vehement hatred...

do calm down.

all you need is a tarp.

that for your sunday jaunt to the trail centre ?

Ooh you tough guy, too hardcore for trail centres?

Sometimes trail centres, sometimes mountains, sometimes races. Not sure what difference it makes where I was going.

What I object to slightly is the idea that you need some kind of big expensive gadget or 'lifestyle option' gear to solve a problem so utterly simple. Sure, buying a van instead of a car is convenient but buying one as well as a car just for a pretty bloody tiny bit of convenience is a waste of natural resources to be honest, and the way that biking with a normal car is portrayed as some huge issue doesn't help.

Campervanning is a different issue.

I'm firmly a T5 fan, on my second one now. Economics wise 40mpg, insurance no more than a nice estate car, tax is a bit more but not horrendous. They're not like a car to drive but are very nice, lowered suspension gives a better ride than standard, I've fitted air suspension for flexibility on campsites and also added bonus of looking nice (IMHO).

There's a wealth of products/parts for the vw vans. Anyone can turn a van into a camper, finish and final product quality may vary though.

Something nice about the way vw owners respond to each other aswell.

Here's mine in posing mode

[img] [/img]

Why's it parked in a council estate for pics ?

Just out of interest for all you owners - who is good for insurance? Just been quoted £600 for fully comp with 180days european cover & breakdown - not sure if that is good or not.

Why's it parked in a council estate for pics ?

Just out of interest for all you owners - who is good for insurance?

Brentacre. Office in Wales. Understand camping and biking etc...

Why's it parked in a council estate for pics ?

Dick comment.

Just out of interest for all you owners - who is good for insurance?

NFU worked out ok for me. gave me 7 yrs NCB based on background as I couldn't transfer my 12 yrs car no-claims over.

About a mile away from where I'm currently sitting houses that pretty much look like that are going for about £600,000. So how much does your wonderfully private house cost then?

I compromised.

audi with a towbar mounted bike rack for day to day local mtb ferrying.

T5 for longer journeys.

Honey, you're sooooooo SingleTrack World 😀

I've fitted air suspension for flexibility on campsites and also added bonus of looking nice (IMHO).

Forgive a bit of idiocy - but is this adjustable then? So you can later ride height (simply) to suit where you are? Only asking for future purchase knowledge, as lowered wouldn't work for me but adjustable at home might.

We like camping, going away etc and out of (genuine) interest what would £10,000 get me? In a couple of years time how much of that back would you see?

The 2003/150k 4.5k T4 linked above - I wouldn't go anywhere near that. All I could think of is sleeping inside an old knackered car looking at that.

stick in £10 in the search
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/vans
then see what the age/price looks like for 2 year older vans

Then stick in the other modern vans and get an idea

I've been looking for a T5 on and off for a while now but some of the prices people are asking for them are insane. £30k+ for a 6 year old camper van conversion 😯

Despite looking at Vivaros and Transits as well, it seems that there's nowhere near as many on the market as there is T5's unless I'm looking in the wrong place.

Honey, you're sooooooo SingleTrack World

i had to sell the five and I'm quite happy drinking instant coffee...

I'm with Direct Line for insurance, no issue transfering NCB from car policy.

What Brassneck said! yep, the other week me and Mrs Hound were camping in the T5 for the weekend at British super Bikes. We're bike fans and not into the Dubber scene but the full on dubbers were like flies, hovering around asking about mods and did we want to see the shower unit in their tail gate, blah , blah, blah... I was only a bit flattered by the attention.

Maybe it was you, maybe it was the van, or...... is Mrs Hound hot? There are other 'scenes' 😉

I've been looking for a T5 on and off for a while now but some of the prices people are asking for them are insane. £30k+ for a 6 year old camper van conversion

Driving through the Lakes on Saturday I clocked a camper on a dealer forecourt at 36k for a 2010.

I thought I must've been mistaken.

We like camping, going away etc and out of (genuine) interest what would £10,000 get me? In a couple of years time how much of that back would you see?

Since that sounds like your first genuine question I'll answer it.

I gave myself a maximum budget of ten grand a few years ago and I ended up with an absolutely spotless 2004 T30, 130bhp, 2.5, LWB with 75,000 miles for £9500. It came with colour coded bumpers and privacy glass in the side and not looking like a builders van helps it pass for a car on the ferry and through the local tunnels.

Three years later I sometimes check ebay and see what they're going for and I feel like I could comfortably advertise mine for 10k.

It's been everywhere from the Scottish Highlands to the Cote d' Azur and it's never missed a beat. It's had a new starter motor, new oil colour, 17" steelies with Bridgestones for £470 and a couple of oil changes.

We sound deadened it and insulated it. It's trimmed in nice gray carpet with cheap lino on the floor. I may be a precious and delicate flower for enjoying a warm place to get dry and changed after a ride but my main riding partner is now my girlfriend and she loves it. She can strip and freshen up in privacy then we get the camping stove out and do our meal.

I don't participate in the 'scene' wherever it is but I do get the odd thumbs up from other VW drivers. I travel around a lot for work and I think of it as a mobile bedroom. I can pull up anywhere and crash out in comfort and privacy then move on. Yes we could do everything we do in the T5 in almost any other vehicle but to be honest in the past I have done and it's never been as easy or enjoyable as it is now.

No it doesn't drive like a car but it doesn't drive like the rotten old Tranny or Sprinter or Vivaro that I've had in the past. I generally avoid twisty roads if I can and don't 'push on' as they say.

I do look at cars as I'm surrounded by classics and modifieds and track cars but there's nothing I really want. The only thing I'd trade the T5 for is a newer, posher one and I've got the girlfriends blessing as she loves it.

I like the idea of a camper but I think a caravan might be more suitable for my needs.

For those with campers, what do you do if you go somewhere for more than a night? Do you end up having to pack everything up each day to go out and then set up again each evening?

molgrips - Member

What I object to slightly is the idea that you need some kind of big expensive gadget or 'lifestyle option' gear to solve a problem so utterly simple. Sure, buying a van instead of a car is convenient but buying one as well as a car just for a pretty bloody tiny bit of convenience is a waste of natural resources to be honest, and the way that biking with a normal car is portrayed as some huge issue doesn't help.

Is this a case of it's molgrips way, or the highway......?

What is all this about waste of natural resources? From the sound of it on here, a lot of people seem to be getting higher mpg out of their vans than you can get out of a lot of petrol cars.
And while people are driving their vans, they aren't driving their cars so it's not like they are using twice the fuel.....

How is a caravan sat on the drive any different to having a van sat on the drive?

Is this a case of it's molgrips way, or the highway......?

AKA, bizness as usual.

no one said buy one as well - we said buy one instead of a caravan/camper van that can be used as an every day car...... havnt missed my car ever to be fair- just means i am never designated driver on the rare occasion i go out in town.

it was more an - its easy to keep your car clean through occasional use jibe - racing 3 times a week and being pushed for time at each end every time meant the interior of my car was manky after a winter.... all a tarp did was let the dirt fester and stay damp.

that and I/my neighbours dont have to look at an ugly fibreglass tin tent on the drive/street

Forgive a bit of idiocy - but is this adjustable then? So you can later ride height (simply) to suit where you are? Only asking for future purchase knowledge, as lowered wouldn't work for me but adjustable at home might.

Flick a switch and the suspension goes up/down. The springs are replaced with airbags and a small compressor fitted so in order to raise/lower it you just adjust the amount of air in them*. Ain't cheap though, £8k or so. For 95% of people just fitting the most appropriate springs would be <£400, as van's they have quite stiff/tall springs to deal with heavy loads, if you go for a light-ish campervan conversion then you could probably lower it 2-3" and get a normal ride height equivalent to a loaded up van.

*sometimes there's some hydraulic wizardry too to keep the spring rate constant otherwise you'd have long travel that never moved or short travel that was always bottoming out which is the opposite of what you need! But then it's a van so handling isn't really an issue (they only handle like a car if the last car you drove had a man walking infront waving a flag).

What is all this about waste of natural resources? From the sound of it on here, a lot of people seem to be getting higher mpg out of their vans than you can get out of a lot of petrol cars.

Buying two vehicles where one would do? That's a waste, no? Cars are costly to produce. I'd guess much more so than a caravan.

a lot of people seem to be getting higher mpg out of their vans than you can get out of a lot of petrol cars.

And a car that does worse MPG than a van is also wasteful.

Is this a case of it's molgrips way, or the highway......?

Just stating things as I see them. If you think it's not a waste, then let's hear your arguments.. if you want.

I clocked a camper on a dealer forecourt at 36k for a 2010.

Sounds reasonable. Our 2010 Ducato has about 36k miles on the clock too.
Coincidentally it cost us about £36k newly converted, since when we've slept in it for 30+ nights per year and had a humungouse amount of fun. It's not a VW, of course, but that means the double bed is always up so there's no faffing around when it's snooze time.

[img] [/img]
A good and sustained effort 😉

Three years later I sometimes check ebay and see what they're going for and I feel like I could comfortably advertise mine for 10k.

Now that I do like the sound of. Your moneys working but it aint costing you a penny.

For those with campers, what do you do if you go somewhere for more than a night? Do you end up having to pack everything up each day to go out and then set up again each evening?

We had an Iveco camper van and used to basically have the same routine whether staying one night or multiple (s we'd usually go out in the van during the day). Have breakfast, clear away, pack up, go out for the day, come back later maybe before tea / maybe after. The key was being a little bit tidy/OCD about putting things away when you'd used them, admittedly a striggle with small child(ren). So 'packing up' was never a major chore. Disconnect leccy cable (if on hook up), turn off gas, put away a few things, be off. Well organised storage in the van helps, it took us a while to get it right, but once you do it makes life much easier if you are moving daily. If your van/pitch looks like an explosion has gone off with your belongings strewn everywhere, then yes it will be more hassle to move on / go out each day.