MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
Never thought I'd see the day I'd ask for car-buying advice, but here goes:
I'll be returning to the UK come March, and I would like a car. It'll be for pleasure mileage only, no commuting or anything of that ilk, and I'm envisaging somewhere around the 4-5000 miles a year mark. Fuel economy is therefore not my major priority. Nor does it need to be able to carry a bike, cos Mrs Flying Ox will be getting some type of do-it-all car that will cover bike duties. Budget is anything under new Focus money, say up to £18,000. 2nd hand only: I don't want a new car due to depreciation. And it must be powerful. Why? Because.
Current cars on the list are:
Infiniti G35
Nissan Skyline R32/R33/R34
Mazda RX7
Honda NSX
Honda Integra DC2/DC5
TVR Cerbera/Tuscan
Honda S2000
Vauxhall VX220 Turbo
E46 M3
Maserati 3200GT
That should give an idea of the type of car I'm after. Any others I should consider? Any experience of the above?
Cheers.
And for the haters, I'll save you the effort and do my own "The Flying Ox Has A Tiny, Wizened Penis So Needs A Fancy Dan Car To Compensate"-style tags.
Unless you want to spend lots of time repairing I would forget the TVR (although they are beautiful cars).
You do have a mix of 'muscle' type cars as well as Jap screaming engine cars - what sort of driving do you do?
How about a supercharged Exige? Not disimilar to the VX220 I guess, but then you can throw down your Lotus keys on the bar in the pub rather than your Vauxhall ones.
For some reason I have got a thing about some of the big American muscle cars at the moment too...
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Boxster?
what sort of driving do you do?
Bit of everything really. A1 visiting my family, B-roads visiting her family, out into the great Scottish Highlands for holidays and the like.
I do quite fancy the idea of a car that wouldn't embarrass itself on a trackday though, hence most of the above shortlist.
If I had that money and that list, it would be the NSX everytime. Only had the chance to drive one once, but it was the 3.2 V6 VTEC Manual, such a great sound screaming away just behind your ears....!!! Saying that, the S2000 is great fun too.
No Audis on that list?
Audi S3
You have a G35 but not 350z on that list. Could also get a 370Z for that.
You get get american 1.25" hitches for them and stick a bike rack on that 🙂
thepurist - Member
No Audis on that list?
You say that like it's a bad thing...!!! 🙂
I don't know much about cars but the NSX is rated as one of the best drivers' cars ever is it not?
Not cheap to run, even in that company tho.
Porsche 993
Lotus Exige
for me.
For me the NSX looks very dated.
The S2000 would be the most flexible and take pretty much all of the driving you do in it's stride and is relatively cheap to run compared to some on your list.
It's the one I would go for I reckon.
How about being all-out silly and get a Westfield/Caterham? My father in law has one (set up for hill climbs and geared as such) that would leave all of the above dead in the water in a sprint situation. It does only have a top speed of about 95mph but 0-60 in almost motorbike speeds is a fair compromise 🙂
370z if you can afford it.
TVR's are the ugliest cars ever made.
BMW z4m, coupe or roadster available within budget.
E60 M5s are creeping into budget too, 500bhp V10 😈
Ohh and I drove an Exige at Silverstone and it is such a forgiving car. Amazing.
Barrelling into corners at speeds I didn't think were possible and ramming brakes on, feeling the weight of the engine behind almost pushing you on but still staying sure-footed and composed. It was so easy to have the beating of the bigger 'supercars' on the track that day.
TVR's are the ugliest cars ever made.
Your eyes are clearly broken.
[i] I don't want a new car due to depreciation.[/i]
All cars depreciate - basically whatever (£18k) you spend, you can/will lose.
But what about a Caymen, test drove one last year - 3.4s tiptronic - very impressed.
http://www.whatcar.com/car-reviews/porsche/cayman-coupe/summary/25487-4
oooh 370z is a good choice makes the 350z feel like a toy car...
s2000's are great as is the DC5.
lots of truely amazing cars about for that budget.
From your list - Honda NSX
Newer:
Focus for Focus money - RS
Renault Megane R26.R
Porsche Cayman
TVR Tuscan.
Everything else seems a bit tame after that.
Porsche! How could I have missed that one out?
Not keen on the Boxster, but Cayman is a good shout.
Keep 'em coming 😀
NSX - fantastic but too sanitised
TVR but Tuscan, Griffith or T350
Mazer 0 stylish
The rest are for chavs not men. Honda S2000 is excellent but like a TT it is for girls.
I don't know much about cars but the NSX is rated as one of the best drivers' cars ever is it not?
Dunno whether it's the turning wheels of fashion or not, but in it's production days it was largely characterised as clinical but soulless, anything but a drivers car.
It'd still be a nice choice though, and unlikely to depreciate further.
Oh, and at that price the Maserati would be a money pit. IM (mates) E.
As opposed to a TVR which would be reliability personified. My uncle loves his Tuscan, and the multiple engines it has required!
911 964. I'm a luddite. TVRs look interesting, but never driven one. Scary Caterham for the shit your pants factor?
+1 Z4M coupe
I have just bought a BMW 135i because I could not find a Z4M coupe in the colour spec I wanted. 135i would not be special enough for a weekend only car for me though.
Not sure if you would get a decent 993 911 for that money but would be nice if you could. You could get a 997 911 for that but I am told there is a reason for them not holding there value as well as the 993 cars.
If it really is a toy rather and it really does not have to double as sensible transport, how about a Caterham.
You are into TVR T350 territory or a Tamora etc. Sagaris still way more expensive.
People keep mentioning Caterhams (me included) so how about it?
You could get a twin motorbike engined one.
Crap driver in that clip though - barely kissed an apex.
993/996 if you want a sports car, E55 if you want a cruiser, M3 for something in the middle.
Vauxhall VX220 Turbo - cracking little go-kart that's quick enough and fun enough for weekend driving. I used mine daily at times, but I wouldn't recommend it, especially in shit weather (prone to misting and moments of bad visibility). The only electrics you'll get are heater, stereo and C/L. Brilliant on the track too. Check out the best [url= http://www.vx220.org.uk/forums/ ]best VX forum here[/url] - which I think they relaunched a year or so ago, so may not have all the history dating back to when it was proper busy. Defo go for the Turbo as opposed to the NA. Easy to tune too (engine, zorst and handling).
E46 M3 - extremely capable point-to-point car with everyday abilities. Proper rapid for its size. Does come with an attitude on the road though - that didn't bother me though. Check out Tyresmoke among other forums.
Maserati 3200GT - nearly bought one of these instead of the VX. Very weird steering (because of the "can't remember what it's called) that makes you twitchy and prone to over-steer for quite some time. Lovely cockpit with all the stitching and dials etc. Typically Italian. Plenty of things to look out for though, so I'd recommend checking out the forums. Can't remember which I used - but I do remember some users offering to do viewings with me. They were a nice bunch.
Skylines - pah, bit old hat now. Avoid IMO.
Thread might be over. Just spied a couple of Cobra replicas on Autotrader that come in under budget. I honestly thought they were in the high £20k bracket.
Any reason why a Cobra would be a bad move over, say, the TVR?
You'd do 1000 miles/year in a Cobra, maximum. Fun for 10 minutes, appalling for 60. Unusable in the winter. Fast, but that's it. All the finesse of a steam-hammer.
Astonishingly pointless, but fun as a 4th car, the sort of thing you use 10 times/year.
Hmmm. Maybe not then.
Westfield SEight?
Westfield SEight?
YES.
i was a member of a car club a few years ago and they had a cobra replica. It was mental to drive - it was the only car in the fleet that you had to be tested in before you were allowed to drive it yourself.
In terms of experience it was great - so much presence. You'd pull up at traffic lights and people would hear the rumble of the engine and put their window down to ask you to rev it!
Driving it however was a alot less fun 😀
For some reason I have got a thing about some of the big American muscle cars at the moment too...
It's cos you have the brain of a 12 year old boy.
how about somethnig a bit more classy, like a Merc 380SL
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You can pick them up at silly cheap prices so you'd have more than enough money left over for any future work required.
You could get a twin motorbike engined one.
I have worked on one and believe me the twins are not worth the agro keeping them going. The transfer boxes that link the two engines together overheat and shed their oil everywhere. The 4WD versions with an engine driving the front and one driving the rear, just drive plain weirdly.
I had a Westfield Megabusa with a Hayabusa engine in it and its pretty much all the power you need really as standard (180BHP). I turboed mine to 300BHP but to be honest it did not make it any more enjoyable to drive and I was worried about blowing up a very expensive engine. It was flipping fast though 🙂
A seven type car with a Busa or R1 engine in it, is a joy to drive on track. I think they are less fun on the road but plenty of people disagree with me.
I had a TVR 5L Chimaera about 12 years ago and that was a lot of fun. I really liked it. Sensible enough to actually go places in but still raw and interesting. I would really like a Sagaris now 🙂
Edited to add
I always thought the SEIGHT missed the point of a seven type car, but each to his own 🙂
Current cars on the list are:
Infiniti G35
Nissan Skyline R32/R33/R34
Mazda RX7
Honda NSX
Honda Integra DC2/DC5
TVR Cerbera/Tuscan
Honda S2000
Vauxhall VX220 Turbo
E46 M3
Maserati 3200GT
So basically its a list of ****er cars, no?
p.s. the **** rhymes with banker. :o)
Quality Sunday Car Pinkster, Bobby Ewing tastic.
So basically its a list of * cars, no?p.s. the
* rhymes with banker. :o)
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The Pinkster: I like Mercs as a rule, but I want something less... sedate.
From your list, the S2000
Not on your list:
A Noble
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3255702.htm
Cayman S
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3221916.htm
Exige
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3558626.htm
I'm considering selling my '86 Golf GTi cabrio this year and getting something a bit more modern but still as much fun. Boxster S, Cayman S, Elise, or Exige are on the list. My cousin built himself a Caterham R400 and it's mental but you come back from every drive 1/2 exhilarated, 1/2 exhausted. 5k a year would kill you! 😀
All common cars.
Get a second hand Wiesmann.
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Oh my, that's phallic. 😀
It's cos you have the brain of a 12 year old boy.
No I haven't.
Now bog off willy face or I will get my dad onto you.
A Noble
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3255702.htm
Cayman S
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3221916.htm
Exige
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3558626.htm
Noble - get one that doesn't break. That's the tricky part. Some are known to chew gearboxes.
Cayman S - not that impressed with those IMO. A mate bought one 2-3 yrs ago (as his first car!). Really wanted to like it but felt sterile and unengaging.
Exige - like the Noble, get one with full history and not broken. Quite decent on a good day, but a bag of rattly bolts on a bad one.
See this is why things like the G35 are on the list.
£8k for a really good one, and I could spend £6k on a supercharger and suspension tweaks and still end up under maximum budget.
[i]Cayman S - not that impressed with those IMO. A mate bought one 2-3 yrs ago (as his first car!). Really wanted to like it but felt sterile and unengaging. [/i]
Eh?
It revved like a motorbike, gripped well and in tiptronic form you could just plant your right foot and take off - but that was on the A413 'racetrack'. And you'd get a bike in the back 🙂
[url= http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201149434025164/sort/priceasc/usedcars/price-to/18000/make/aston_martin/radius/1501/quicksearch/true/page/2/postcode/bd111dr?logcode=p ]Aston??[/url]
[img] http://pictures2.autotrader.co.uk/imgser-uk/servlet/media?id=1874936124 [/img]
To my eyes the DB7 has aged really badly. So it's a no, I'm afraid.
Vauxhall Monaro?
It revved like a motorbike, gripped well and in tiptronic form you could just plant your right foot and take off - but that was on the A413 'racetrack'. And you'd get a bike in the back
I wouldn't disagree ... it's just that I felt detached when pushing it. Not in the same way you can in an Evo though. Like I say, I wanted to like it but it somehow left me cold.
Mercedes Benz SL500
Jaguar XK/XKR
993/996 if you want a sports car, E55 if you want a cruiser, M3 for something in the middle.
yep, spot on that!
Track-wise you could also consider something more youngtimer-ish like Porsche 968 CS or BMW E30 M3
I also like the VX220, Megane R26 and Exige proposal.
Imprezas maybe? Integra Type-R, Clio renaultsport AND something silly for the track (Caterham Classic)?!
Avoid tiptronics on Porsches! PDK is okay but too new to be within your budget.
Then again what do you really want from it? Outright pace, brute power or handling finesse? Do you give a damn about image and looks or does that play a part, too? Fun starting at licence friendly low speeds or competitive track day speed? Should Ms Ox be happy (in terms of ride, perceived safety, practicality, image...) on the passenger seat or is she used to worse?
Lotus Evora?! But north of your budget (>30k).
Good luck!
TVR Tuscan Six engines can be modified by Racing Green as part of a service.
They are as reliable as a toy car needs to be.
And goodness are they quick.
Or you could just buy a motorbike, which will out-accelerate (plus greater top-end than) anything above, and a fast car for your £18k
Then again what do you really want from it? Outright pace, brute power or handling finesse?
All 3? Brute power is nice but I do like my twisty roads, so I reckon handling finesse.
Do you give a damn about image and looks or does that play a part, too?
Looks play a part. It would be nice to be able to drive somewhere fancy for a meal and not require 4-point harness and a crash helmet, but there'll always be Mrs Flying Ox's car if not.
Should Ms Ox be happy (in terms of ride, perceived safety, practicality, image...) on the passenger seat or is she used to worse?
She's been used to pillion on my motorbike, hanging on for dear life in my old MR2, roughing it in her old mk1 MX5 and the comparative luxury of an E36 3-series. She'll just get on with it, I think, whatever it is.
The more I think about it, the less suitable an out-and-out track day car seems. Porkers are still a decent shout though. Liking the Cayman S.
Or you could just buy a motorbike, which will out-accelerate (plus greater top-end than) anything above, and a fast car for your £18k
This is the other option. Buell XB9S/Duke 748 and a xxxxxxxx?
If looks are important, and you don't want depreciation, I think the very best E39 M5 you can find makes some sense. All the rubbish is dropping out of the market, and if you don't buy one now, you'll never get a good one.
There are a lot of great cars out there for the £18k you have in your budget.
My vote would be a Porsche or TVR.
The 996 is not loved by the market, so is relatively cheap compared to the 993 (air cooled) or 997 (newer)
I have a turbo which is exceptionally fast when you want it to be, but you dont need to drive it at 10/10 to enjoy.
The other car I would look at is a Cerbera, you can pick them up ex TVR power who give a 5 year warranty on the engine which removes a lot of the worry. The TVR option is also likey to come in much less than budget, leaving you with a war chest if the anticipated problems arise.
Hope you choose well and enjoy!
Al
Compliments for the lady who roughed it with her MX5! 🙂
Cayman sounds like a good solution for you! It's got the everyday, the long-haul, the bad weather, the B-road and the track day covered. A save bet really.
Avoid tiptronic (neuters the car) and big 19" wheels (wooden on B-roads, 18" better, 17" best but look feeble).
Nice to have: sportchrono pack - it comes with a silly clock on the dash but more importantly gives you an ESP sport option with more leeway (standard, sport, off).
Compared to the MR2 and MX5 it will feel more solid, has more grip and might feel less engaging at legal speeds as a result. Upside: it's actually fast on a track and not just fun.
Enjoy the test ride I'd say! 🙂
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Then again, you can always drive a grown-up car when you are older! 😈
At least go for a test-ride with an Elise/Exige/VX220, too! 😛
All the best!
This is how i roll.
[img] http://www.flickr.com/photos/73773087@N07/6721154257/ ][img] http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7032/6721154257_82fc171dc5.jp g" target="_blank">http://www.flickr.com/photos/73773087@N07/6721154257/ ][img] http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7032/6721154257_82fc171dc5.jp g"/> [/img][/url] [url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/73773087@N07/6721154257/ ]phonepics 187[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/73773087@N07/ ]h4muf[/url], on Flickr[/img]
P.S.: E39 M5 is nice but will feel like a barge compared to any actual sports car!
I really like them but it's just 300 to 500 kg more than most of the others mentioned here.
Don't get me wrong they can still be fun and fast. But in a different way.
P.P.S.: you could also get yourself a copy of the evo Performance Car Heroes and/or Track Day mag books for inspiration and advice.
[url= http://www.amazon.co.uk/Performance-Car-Heroes-MagBook-Evo/dp/1907232605 ]evo mag book Performance Car Heroes[/url]
[url= http://www.magbooks.com/magazine/motoring-transport/cars/the-evo-guide-to-track-days ]evo mag book Guide To Track Days[/url]
Both feature all the right (2nd hand) cars and have buying guides for the most relevant ones.
robowns - MemberTVR's are the ugliest cars ever made.
Errr. I don't think so...
TVR Tuscan Six engines can be modified by Racing Green as part of a service.They are as reliable as a toy car needs to be.
They're rubbish as a toy car as you can't seem to leave them for weeks and then go and have a play. This was a friends experience with a Tuscan anyway. The only sensible way to use them seems to be own two, use them frequently and accept one of the two will probably be broken.
For the op my money would go on a good e46 M3 with a brake upgrade for track work, or if you're happy with a very moddified car then a R33 GTS-t skyline. I had a ride at Elvington in one and it made the 300bhp 200sx I owned at the time seem very very slow.
I would go for a 993 personally like [url= http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3444694.htm ]THIS[/url]or [url= http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2661255.htm ]THIS[/url]
For that infrequent use you want something special really, 993 is significantly more desirable than a 996, drives better and looks better. Depreciation wise you will be more protected in a 993. I sold mine for more than i paid for it (first time ever).
Or a nice M3, or a B5 RS4 would also be a good bet (twin turbo V6). Or a classic RS2 perhaps ?
Evo 10 ? Or maybe a arial atom
you'd get a really good Mitsubishi Evo for 18k, or a nice (and my choice) Porsche...
£18.5k
[url= http://www.vcars.co.uk/used-cars/cardetails.php?t=autotrader&u=427454 ]RS4[/url]
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Ha - was just about to link to that Noble in Pistonheads!
Nice cars, not 'that' well known, and faaaaaassssttt..... (fastest I've been in a car, anyhow)
DrP
As an RS4 owner, and looking at your list, don't get an RS4. Brill car, but sounds like you want something sillier.
Silly is the key, yes. RS4/M5 is a bit grown up. I'd *love* a Noble, but I reckon it might cost more than a TVR to keep on the road...
I'd be going Caterham/similar just for a fun car - don't take it out in the wet though - or so I've heard.
Renault Clio V6.
A most awesome car.
One that Clarkson said would have in his top ten of all time garage.
They are superb. The noise, the drive, on a twisty road they are fabulous. I'm comapring them against recent Lotus, Nissan, and Merc 'Sunday Best' cars that I have used.
SB
EDIT - Oh yeah. Limited Edition. Practically handbuilt. If you look after it and don't trash it, it will be an investment.
rx-7. awesome cars.
Why are people suggesting RS4's and other similarly dull cars. Get something badass
Why are people suggesting RS4's and other similarly dull cars. Get something badass
Errrm... I mean, I really don't care so much about looks but I definitely wouldn't want to be seen in one of those [i]modifieds[/i] with corrupted handling and nonsense ornamental pseudo "aero" battens!
500bhp is all good, but what is it good for when the rest is just bling? Heavy bling as such?!
It's cruel! An Impreza wants to be kept in an adequate free-range way.
It might even get muddy once in a while! 😯
People are calling MX5s and Boxsters etc girly cars but for me these pimped beauty queens are the real automotive tarts .
EDIT Sorry for the outburst. Just my personal [s]opinion[/s] taste. But really... how can they... 😥
David, I do hope your tongue is firmly in your cheek because that really is one helluva collection of chavmobiles.
THIS CAR SOUNDS LIKE THUNDER!! AND IT ATTRACTS MORE ATTENTION THAN A FERRARI ENZO.
Yeah - from people laughing at how big a cock you look.
Comparing any of those with an RS4 is plainly infantile.
If its just a fun/weekend car go for something that the top comes off..makes a day of driving so much more fun than being sat in a tin box
and its not all about how fast a car goes, some are fun to drive some are not.
happy shopping !!