Oh driveshafts. ****ing things.
T5 driveshafts.
This is hysterical. There's going to be so much gnashing of teeth....
This tie-up shouldn’t damage the brands. ..... VW has to sell the idea of a Ford-built, Ford-powered Transporter to its loyal fan base of surfer types. (
Love it.
Will probably be more reliable if it's made by Ford.
Probably push the price of “real” VWs up even more though as the cultists fans won’t want to drive a Transit 🤣
Just looked at some finace examples for California on Vw website.
£15-16000 deposit, £360 -£400 pm rental for 60 months and then £24000 to own it if you want at the end......
Thats mental to me, is that really representative?
I spent £8000 cash on buying and converting a 5 year old low mileage Vivaro to my own spec 3 years ago and judging from adverts online I would get the same back if I was to sell it now.
Excluding running costs, and I have only spent £400 on the Vivaro over that time, I would have had to outlay around an extra £22000 over a 3 year period assuming the VW figures were roughly comparable at time of purchase.
Fair enough you might get some of your deposit back when you come to rent your next one but your not actually getting it back unless you end the rental cycle. I understand that if I sold mine then its the same thing if I use the money towards a replacement.
£400 p/m over 60 months is £24000, are people really saying that they can run one of these for that time frame, with that monthly outlay and break even at the end?
I don't have any negative feelings regarding VW's like some seem to, maybe I'm missing something on the finacial side though and would have been better of going with one new on finance?
Love my T6 and the T4 I had before it. There is not another van which more perfectly fits my needs. Peoples needs vary obviously but it works for us.
When people say ‘we used it to go skiing” is that drive to the alps and stay in a bite/air B and B ?
Or do you live in it for a week in -10 c? If so how much is it a night on a campsite?
I can see the attraction but just trying to get my head round the realities ?
Camping in a van whilst skiing sounds pretty miserable to me. Maybe fine if your young with no kids but not a lot of fun as a family.
There is not another van which more perfectly fits my needs.
Other than allowing you to identify as a "Dubber", what does your T6 do that a Vito/Transit/Vivaro/Whatever doesn't?
When people say ‘we used it to go skiing” is that drive to the alps and stay in a bite/air B and B ?
Or do you live in it for a week in -10 c? If so how much is it a night on a campsite?
There is a (caravan) campsite alongside the slopes in Gridelwald in Switzerland that appears to be in use in Winter. Last trip we did was to Veija in Spanish Pyrennees and there were camper vans in the car park at the bottom of the lifts.
Does. Not. Appeal.
Last trip we did was to Veija in Spanish Pyrennees and there were camper vans in the car park at the bottom of the lifts
.Does. Not. Appeal.
To be fair in the right van - why not.
I use mine to get to avoid getting up at stupid o'clock for a day or 2 skiing at glenshee
It's fine leaving the heater on thermostat getting back to a 16 degree van for a cuppa rathwr than waiting in the grim queue for the worst burger and chips you've ever had
Waking up at 7.00 ready to go rather than getting up at 5am and driving in the melee
Afterall the holidays the skiing .not the hotel room. - unless your there for the apres ski which is not really my bag
When people say ‘we used it to go skiing” is that drive to the alps and stay in a bite/air B and B ?
Nope we stay in the van. The diesel heater in my California is fantastic. Someone will be along in a sec to tell me that it isn’t.
Mate of mine just bought a pov spec caravelle, Windows all round, air con, rear seats that come out. Here in Spain she paid 25k gbp equiv for a dealer ex demo.
I d buy one, she loves it, car type money, just puts camping gear in the back. I looked on uk vw site and the cheapest caravelle was 40k so must be a Spain model.
're camper I m so tempted but like my luxuries and city breaks, so I d get the caravelle.
Poolman, exactly what I’ve got. German import Multivan (same as Caravelle) with diesel heater already in it. Bought it from a bloke in Pamplona who imported it then got banned lol
Will do a multi week camping trip, can overnight in it in an aire or whatnot, fits under city center car park height limits (usually).
We have thought about skiing from ours. The bit that put is off is not keeping warm, thats easy. Its drying the kit each day thats a bit more of a pita
Cheers that's brilliant, can you spec captains seats? And is 25k for the base engine, I m sure hers has 5 speed but it's a Euro 6.
I really like it, looks good with tinted windows all round. It's a lot of van for the money. Best thing it looks like a work van so is fairly anonymous overnight in city centres. Hers says caravelle on the back.
Its drying the kit each day thats a bit more of a pita
Yep I can get that in a small van. Hence my right van comment. Many have shower areas within the heated zone you can hang your clothes up in. Some even have a utility / garage space.
My twopence worth 40k not a Cali but a decent conversion (Hillside),e been tweeked along the way solar panels and recent roof bars on the pop top. My only vehicle and its now paid for, had it 5 years. I,m located in the Lakes and I can say I,ve probably been out in it every other weekend pre covid from just parking up in a pub carpark to staying in some great campsites that you would struggle to get anything else on due to it size. Great for 3 people but as its been said its like a military operation to pack and unpack if your the outdoorsy type.Had some amazing holidays in it and looking forward to more planning on keeping for at least 10 years until I need something a bit more bigger due to my age 🙂
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48340961447_2ca5f96572_b.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48340961447_2ca5f96572_b.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2gDJ4Ex ]67339576_10157598696041474_2054182149283643392_n[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/145353521@N03/ ]Richard Munro[/url], on Flickr
I,ve always been into the scene though 🙂
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Just to annoy a lot of the haters, I have a T6 professionally converted so a bit cheaper than a Cali, paid just over £50k. We paid cash for it (I put in £38k and father in law gifted me £15k). Yes I could have invested the money elsewhere, but that’s not me and nor does it fit into the way myself and the kids live.
For a family of 4 it’s not great for a weeks camping, but we also have a drive away tent which gives the additional room that makes it more comfortable for everyone. Only use this in the warmer drier months.
I also use the T6 for riding, for taking the kids to XC meets. I have to admit the wife isn’t a fan of staying in it, but she’s very much a 5 star hotel kind of person. She loves it when it’s just the two of us, but even when we go on holiday she likes to stay in a suite so we have some space.
I’m not into a “vw way of life” in fact I don’t really know what that means. I’m a cyclist who travels to different places in the UK riding my bike while staying in my van.
I take my daughter XC training on a Wednesday afternoon. I sit in the back drinking coffee and working. I then make her a hot chocolate for when she finishes training.
For me it’s the ideal vehicle for my lifestyle. A larger motor home would be better for longer family breaks, but then I’d lose out on all the other uses the T6 offers.
wouldn't have a California but there's a company who convert Transporters (or the superior Custom) with a railed floor and then everything can be modular (seats, bed, kitchen etc) which makes it mega versatile. Could easily spec it with internal bike garage, little kitchen & porta-potty, double bed in pop-top but then whip it all out in the week as work van or people carrier. Ideal for only vehicle! Would definitely look into it more if I had the cash (which I don't sadly 😭 still works out cheaper than Cali I think tho)
@poolman mine doesn’t have swivel seats although the middle 2 do. Camping stuff lives in the ‘boot’ year-round and you can cook under the tailgate.
If I were buying again I’d want a pop top as the lad needs his own bed. I’ve owned a full camper before and definitely don’t want to go down that route. Ideally I’d get this converted but the homologación makes it prohibitively expensive.
double bed in pop-top
PMSL
don't get me wrong, I gotta VW which I like,and have had for 16 years. But
Double bed.... LOLZ
@thegeneralist fair point, I would not be stoopid enough to buy a VW though 🤣 (it's at least 20cm wider in the Custom)
What's a custom?
Is it a tranny?
Always think the new Fords look nice.
@thegeneralist yes, I have the panel-van version as my only vehicle now, they are great to drive! Really good spec/gadgets too for the money.
if you can make the payments, a california isn’t the worst way to spend your money. hotels and fast cars are just as appealing, but not as economical.
i fancy a mitsubishi delica, but my wife isn’t interested in a right hand drive vehicle (we live in canada). they make so much sense; camping, shuttling, overlanding.
I bought a 2009 California (2.5 litre 5 cylinder 174 ph) in 2012 with a few months of warranty left.
Its, (Mrs Wachowchow) and my forth camper, from ex german army t2 to a t4 caravelle conversion.
We had our first baby on the way and started looking to convert a newer van with what we would need with a young family. TUV approved rock and roll bed, another bed in the pop roof, heater etc. Once I started pricing up the cost of a conversion we very quickly found ourselves in California territory cost wise.
It cost me £34,000 with 13,000 miles on it and was immaculate 9 years ago.
It is our only 4 wheeled vehicle, pretty a daily driver, we have 2 small kids now and it has taken us all around Europe. We love it. Is amazing as a 'day van' when we used to be allowed to have days out, cracking festy van and we have had 2 week touring trips around france, up to the alps fully loaded with bikes and awning. Pretty good tow weight as well
Its a commitment certainly. We don't do hotels or flights as that was the deal when we shelled out the money for this.
It now has nearly 200,000 miles on it, the interior is beaten to crap, the service costs to keep it as good as it needs to be is pretty typical of any other large vehicle.
I hope to pass it on to my boy in another 10 years and I will then be in the market for an electric one.
I bought my wife a 2004 T5 camper conversion (home conversion - not professional) for her 50th Birthday 6 years ago. She absolutely LOVES it, and it's a daily driver for her. She loves doing 'Camper Van Coffee' with her dog-walking friends and wouldn't trade it out for anything.
Despite a few big bills (dual-mass flywheel, driveshafts, etc... all of which you'd expect on a 16-year old / 170,000 mile vehicle), looking at values, if we were to sell it we'd likely get about what we paid for it 6 years ago.
So aside from running costs & repairs it's been a 'free' vehicle 🙂
Good on those of you who enjoy it, but just the thought of camping with two kids in a vehicle that size stresses me right out.
And I wouldn't sleep all night anyway if my bike was outside the van.
Does anyone put their dirty bikes in a nice camper? I like the idea of @zilog6128 and the modular system. Over the years a few mates have had them, but mostly due to cost they understandably didn't want anything muddy or sharp rattling around inside.
The ideal seems a van plus camper. Two vans, um.
Hired a couple, really nice. Best camper is a mate's borrowed 😉
Does anyone put their dirty bikes in a nice camper?
Yes all the time. I have 3 blankets specially for this and in my Cali they go under the seat/bed. I have fitted a thin carpet as well. We are not super precious about our van like some can be
I'd love one, we've talked about getting an older Hymer but they are too big for threading through small Lakeland/Snowdon roads were I tend to go on hikes with the dog quite a bit.
A California / Marco Polo appeals as the quality of trim and furniture is far superior to the 'knock on trim' furniture and fuzzy carpeting of the majority of converters.
I leave my bikes outside, on the van rack. They’re about 1 metre away from my head. Along with the rack lock I also have a D lock on the frame and wheel, a 1.5 metre Kryptonite fuggaboutit lock for the rack frame to the bike frame and a hiplock for the frame and rear wheel. Obviously someone can come and rob it, but they’re going to wake me up.
I tend to stay on camp sites, not sure that reduces the risk, but I’ve not had any problems.
Does anyone put their dirty bikes in a nice camper?
Yes! That’s exactly how we designed ours - it’s a LWB T6 with a bike garage at the back.
Takes 2 bikes with the mounts but with wheels off etc we probably could fit in 4.
Leaves space on the other side for a fold out 180 x 180 cm king sized width double bed.
The skiing question - yeah for 2-3 nights no problem at all. Our van has plenty of insulation and very good heating and hot water. It’s fine off grid or plugged in- we usually got to Glenshee as I sometimes work weekends. Plenty of space to dry gear in the bathroom post shower and enough room. Did it in the Cali before kids but not now too small. Not sure I’d take it for skiing abroad unless I had loads of time - more for the driving time from Scotland though. My wife would be keen as she detests flying.
@the generalist my pop top is a double a very comfy double slept up there many a time!
The ideal seems a van plus camper. Two vans, um.
Or a larger van with a dedicated bike storage /garage.
I've not got a problem leaving the bikes on the rack outside when I'm sleeping in the van. Less confident when leaving the van to go shopping or traipse around town. Bikes are obviously locked up several times over.
ashat has a nice solution, but obviously eats into the interior space.
We've owned out T5 conversion for over 6 years now. Reckon if we were to put it up for sale tomorrow I could ask somewhere in the region of £27k it meaning we'd have lost around 3k on it in 6 years. Admittedly the market is mental at the minute but even before covid, I reckon it was still worth £24k pretty comfortably.
Some people get them, some don't. We wouldn't be without ours but conscious of kids growing at an alarming rate and my wife's MS means its got a finite lifespan with us now.
my pop top is a double a very comfy double slept up there many a time!
Who slept up there with you?
How wide is it?
I’ve slept in my pop top with the wife. But we’re both pretty small, I’m 5 foot 7 and 68kgs she’s about 5 foot 5 and less than 60kgs.
Does get chilly up there in the winter though.
Hiya,
If I may add. My brother in law had a California T5, it was a little unreliable and needed a lot of dealer interaction. He isn't that practical, so it was probably of his own doing. I was looking at a campervan at the time and was concerned after his experiences plus a few other mates, and the cost put me off. I spent a lot of time on forums and looking at the issues. In the end I couldn't justify the cost to myself, so I got a Renault Traffic Sussex campervan conversion. That was in 2015 and so far touch wood only one MAF sensor issue and a badly wired split charge system that I figured out. Now the van has done 45K miles it may not be worth as much as a T6 California, but I have no intention of selling it and planning to convert to EV at some time.
Only problem so far with Renaults is the gear linkage is terrible but if you grease it regularly it isn't a problem, oh and change the gearbox oil every two years. PS I paid 36K for my van brand new.
JeZ
I’ve slept in my pop top with the wife. But we’re both pretty small, I’m 5 foot 7 and 68kgs she’s about 5 foot 5 and less than 60kgs.
Does get chilly up there in the winter though.
Same here. Thermal wrap sorts it out - proper cosy.
I have a 2013 Beach (ex-demo six months / 60 miles on the clock) bought as a replacement for an estate car when prices (it now seems) were reasonable. Intention back then was for lots of weekend camping and the occasional longer trip and we did pretty well with two little kids. It's tailed off a lot since we had #3 but still do the occasional weekend and have an awning. Though all week-long UK holidays are self catering now but we have room to take all the toys!
BUT on top of the occasional camping trip, as a day trip van, load lugger, people carrier (sixth seat), bike carrier, sit and work whilst kids are doing sports it is and remains brilliant. I've deliberately kept the mileage low by using my Mrs car for general duties so I'm confident the TCO will have been peanuts, but I have no plans to sell even though I expect it'll start costing me a bit more in terms of repairs.
Current economics look a bit scary though.
Owner of a homebrew Mercedes Vito camper here. Its 11 yrs old. Low mileage (6500mls per annum average) and mint. It owes me less than i could sell it as a base van but i have a full camper conversion in it.
Anyhow, the Calafornia. It stacks up for a lot. The depreciation is probably the same or even less per annum than, say a BMW 3 series, Volvo whatever or a Merc C class estate which i suspect is the kind of car a family with upto 80k to budget on a camper would be looking at minimum. The £80k is irrelivant for most as they budget on a monthly basis. I know people paying upwards of £400 per month for a car they hand back after 3 yrs. Over 5 yrs thats £24,000. So if a 5yr old Calafornia is worth £56,000 its a similar deal.
They are lifestyle vehicles for lots. I daresay anyone with a real lifestyle need wouldnt look at such a polished finish with such a huge budget. Anyone who really has a use for a camper like these gives it plenty of work, risks marking the interior all the time and probably hasnt got much time for the layout available.
Lets face it. Most of these vehicles are used by the wife as the second car. The family as a big estate car and at the weekend (If they are lucky) to take the dog for a longer walk or the bikes on the back. There are a few where we live. Parked up on driveways looking extra polished. Never getting out (Pre covid) and if they do, its a trip to the shops to make sure it starts.
I am into climbing and used to be into biking. I must admit the camper vans i witnessed being used as lifestyle/activity vehicles were never the posh stuff like a VW calafornia.
Cali T5.1 Owner (8yrs and 60K miles to date)
Yes its gone wrong a few times both in and out of warranty (EGR/Roof corrosion/AC pump...)
But the smiles its allowed us as a family (as previous posts) using it as daily driver,
day van, weekend camper and even the European tours outweigh the higher running costs.
Its like the faithful Pet of the family so we glaze over its faults.
We luckily bought ours before it got trendy and expensive, I hope to keep her another year
and based on the current market value roughly estimate 20% depreciation. But I won't buy
another new or used as they are just now too pricey.
My money will be going toward a Fiat Ducato Panel van conversion for more space and better
value for money.
