Forum menu
Some absolute weapons calling in.
It’ll be the usual thing with red-faced middle aged men who’ve not read the Highway Code since they passed their test in 1987. As a total aside, I wonder how long it will be before an insurance company will offer a discount for people who’ve re-done their theory test.
I wonder how long it will be before an insurance company will offer a discount for people who’ve re-done their theory test.
Or, for those who got their licence pre-1996, "ever done a theory test"
I always thought the pedestrian crossing the junction having priority was always a thing anyway?
Lets just check our bingo cards...
1. Cyclists don't pay road tax
2. Cyclists should have registration plates and insurance
3. Cyclists all cycle 2 abreast to wind drivers up
4. Cyclists jump red traffic lights
I always thought the pedestrian crossing the junction having priority was always a thing anyway?
The rule has changed though hasn't it? Previously it was if the pedestrian was already on the road, whereas the new priority is for the pedestrian waiting to cross but still on the pavement.
The rule has changed though hasn’t it? Previously it was if the pedestrian was already on the road, whereas the new priority is for the pedestrian waiting to cross but still on the pavement.
Yes, I thought once you had a foot of the pavement you had priority, although no end of drivers have explained to me that they disagree! I regularly assert my right to see what happens....
Or, for those who got their licence pre-1996, “ever done a theory test”
It's entirely plausible that someone whose done their theory can drive just as badly as someone who hasn't. Just an FYI.
Have any actual "rules" changed? The highway code just references pieces of legislation for the "must" rules.
Has any parent legislation changed or is it just that the wording in the highway code has changed?
Have any actual “rules” changed? The highway code just references pieces of legislation for the “must” rules.
It's just a more clearly defined set of rules that formally establishes the hierarchy of road users. This is one of the better articles on it.
https://www.which.co.uk/news/2022/01/new-2022-highway-code-changes-are-you-aware-of-the-new-rules/
As an aside, some of the media frothing and clickbait has been appalling. It really shows that a high percentage of the mainstream media is not interested in informing the readership of facts, it's interested in generating as much angry clickbait as possible. Some of the mis-reporting has been almost criminal.
Or, for those who got their licence pre-1996, “ever done a theory test”
three questions while parked up in the test centre car park at the end wasn't it?
Have any actual “rules” changed? The highway code just references pieces of legislation for the “must” rules.
Has any parent legislation changed or is it just that the wording in the highway code has changed?
A bit of a moot point.
The Highway Code functions similar to an ACOP.
It's not actual law but is seen as "best practice", so if you have an incident and you weren't following it, you should be in the shit.
If you weren't following the highway code, there's a law behind that "rule" that you actually broke. That's what they'll get you for. No one ever got nicked for breaking highway code, rule xyz.
1. Cyclists don’t pay road tax
2. Cyclists should have registration plates and insurance
3. Cyclists all cycle 2 abreast to wind drivers up
4. Cyclists jump red traffic lights
5. War on motorists
6. Will cause an increase in pollution
7. Lycra clad
8. Some hard man story that never happened about getting one over pedestrians / cyclists
JefWachowchow
Free MemberI always thought the pedestrian crossing the junction having priority was always a thing anyway?
Only if the ped was actually in the road wasn't it?
Good change to start seeding the idea that cars aren't the most important thing in society. Doubt in itself it will make much practical difference as a significant amount of drivers already ignore zebra crossings.
Really does make me thing we need regular testing for drivers.
It's always seemed slightly dangerous that cyclists are taught to "take the lane" at pinch points, but drivers are never told about this. Recipe for conflict.
Even an online highway code test every few years would help.
Stop trying to logic or argue your way to peace with the idiots. Even if they do know the rules, they just don't care.
Unless there is regular high profile and well publicised enforcement, all that's changed is that more people will get to say "but I had right of way" on their headstone/claim form.
I was listening to a LBC call-in on Saturday morning, same subject and same folk calling in I bet.
Funny how so many car/van/lorry drivers are incapable of overtaking a pair of side-by-side cyclists.
No one ever got nicked for breaking highway code, rule xyz.
No, but people have been nicked for driving without due care and attention (or similar) when they didn't do something they "should" have done.
It’s always seemed slightly dangerous that cyclists are taught to “take the lane” at pinch points, but drivers are never told about this. Recipe for conflict.
Interestingly, or not, when I learned to drive in 1992, my instructor was very particular about me understanding about cyclists and other vulnerable road users and how they should behave for their own safety and how I should behave as a motorist. She wasn't a cyclist - just felt it was really important that as a new driver I knew. Also made sure I knew how to change a wheel if punctured; top up washer; oil etc. Not required but so very very useful. Stuck with me ever-since. haven't got a clue how cars actually work though haha
To be fair, I thought it was a pretty reasonable discussion with the exception of a couple of knuckle draggers. The ex copper / driving instructor was especially good.
Really does make me thing we need regular testing for drivers.
+1.
lowey
Full MemberTo be fair, I thought it was a pretty reasonable discussion with the exception of a couple of knuckle draggers. The ex copper / driving instructor was especially good.
Missed that, was it Reg Local? If so he also has a youtube channel, few books etc.
I'm not sure some people actually know how to drive, on a discussion somewhere a driver was asking what he was supposed to do when he was giving a cyclist 1.5m clearance when overtaking but there was a car coming towards him on the other side of the road. I presume he just regularly overtakes and crashes straight into other cars as he's not sure what he should do.
As a total aside, I wonder how long it will be before an insurance company will offer a discount for people who’ve re-done their theory test.
Even an online highway code test every few years would help.
Given that insurance cost (a pretty good proxy of risk?) gets cheaper the longer ago you sat your tests I think we can presume that insurers don't actually see a link between theoretical HC knowledge and likelihood of causing injury/damage to others.
It might be a reasonable sanction for those caught breaking the rules though rather than (a) sit in a classroom and nod politely for a morning; (b) pay a little over a tank of fuel in a fine. I don't know if anyone has any actual data on whether those involved in (serious) accidents are more likely to have previous points (or awareness courses)?
However, I suspect most of the fear we experience on the roads is not from people who couldn't pass a test if they had to, so not sure what a retest actually achieves for 99% of drivers - except a cost, hassle etc - and probably some perfectly good drivers getting in a load of shit for simply forgetting (or being unable to book a test in time).
Really does make me thing we need regular testing for drivers.
Plenty of knobbers know the rules but choose not to follow them. Regular enforcement is required, but round town traffic cops are a distant memory and after 7pm it's practically anything goes.
This seems a sensible report:
Chris Boardman was on BBC TV on Saturday morning. Usual rubbish coming up. Chris do you know the new rules etc etc ?
Questions from viewers. I'm in my car at a junction and the lights have changed and there is a pedestrian crossing, what should I do ?
Chris was a little taken aback, and said, "well and sensible driver would wait for them to cross".
As we all know there are many 'entitled' drivers out there that give way to no-one, including other vehicles.
Round here people are whining about a proposal for 20mph limits in villages - 'can't drive that slow', 'won't be enforced', '30 is fine' etc etc. You can point out the difference in survivability of getting run over at 30 vs 20 but it makes no difference. Some people are just immune to having their mind opened even a fraction.
1. Cyclists don’t pay road tax
2. Cyclists should have registration plates and insurance
3. Cyclists all cycle 2 abreast to wind drivers up
4. Cyclists jump red traffic lights
5. Cyclists should wear helmets and high viz
Ride as and where you feel safest.
And that includes the pavement.
But always with due care and attention.
I regularly assert my right to see what happens….
Yeah I had a bit of a run-in with a bloke a couple of years ago who swerved around me when I was in the middle of the very minor road (in fact it was just an access road to a school) and was so close I banged on his side window (how very dare I). Apparently he knew the rules about who has priority but it was my fault because it was dark and I was wearing a dark coat.
You can point out the difference in survivability of getting run over at 30 vs 20 but it makes no difference.
This is the one that gets me - the difference is huge & the 'inconvenience' minimal. What's the fing problem?!
These reactionary motorist types get so angry because motorists have been treated as the most privileged road users for several decades now and they resent any loss of privilege. However, driving a car was already fairly miserable - think the tragedy of the commons - with a huge gulf between the dreams of open roads and personal autonomy vs the reality of busy roads and other motorists. If hell is other people it's also other motorists!
There is hard evidence IIRC that driving actually raises stress levels, which probably explains road rage. Sadly, cyclists (as an undifferentiated group) are a scapegoat for this miserable reality of motoring.
Apparently he knew the rules about who has priority but it was my fault because it was dark and I was wearing a dark coat.
That's why I'm more than happy to look like a dork wearing a hi-vis all year. Also, I always wear a helmet and use lights and reflectors when dark or low light.
If I'm ever in an accident and it goes to court I want there to be no doubt that a) I'm a responsible cyclist, and b) I made every effort to be seen.
jimdubleyou
Full Member
No one ever got nicked for breaking highway code, rule xyz.No, but people have been nicked for driving without due care and attention (or similar) when they didn’t do something they “should” have done.
Correct. That's the Road Traffic Act 1988 section 3 IIRC and makes my earlier point that was only particularly quoted.
That’s why I’m more than happy to look like a dork wearing a hi-vis all year. Also, I always wear a helmet and use lights and reflectors when dark or low light.
Steady lights on F & R all year long. Something nice & bright too. No so bright it's blinding but bright enough to make me look like a scooter or moped. Tends to have a positive effect IMHO.
Stop trying to logic or argue your way to peace with the idiots. Even if they do know the rules, they just don’t care.
This.
Facts mean nothing in this discussion. As pedestrians and cyclists there needs to be a moving on from trying to persuade around facts, because the argument for many is a zealous expectation of a right to drive a motor vehicle unimpeded.
There is hard evidence IIRC that driving actually raises stress levels
I think the problem is the human brain/body has not evolved to travel at the speeds cars allow. We evolved over many years to travel at 5-20? km per hour. The brain can cope with seeing the environment at that speed.
Head up to 30mph in a car, add modern distractions like other cars, road signs, music etc and there is no chance a human can process all the information and not miss things, like other cars, cyclists, pedestrians (even roads sings for congestion charging!).
So the rules and guidance might change but we will all be in self driving personal transport long before we have evolved to physically handle the speeds we want to travel at.
Oh and none of the above applies to the driving gods on here. I was meaning drivers in general not the highly experienced and evolved drivers of STW 😉
Turned off after a few minutes. Can't be bothered. **** the lot of em.
Having had two offspring pass their driving tests in the last few years, I was shocked at how little attention the Highway Code got. In fact, I don't think it got any attenton whatsoever (apart from this old duffer banging on about it...)
There is a brief focus on the "Theory Test" which is a glorified video game / monkey-multiple-choice test, that you're coached to win/pass. Once the "Theory Test" hurdle is overcome, it never figures again and one is free to get on with DRIVING. With both of my kids (neither of whom are aggressive, and both I would now class as decent drivers) I had to point out that it was the car driver's responsibility not to run people over, rather than the pedestrian's responsibility to get out of the way.
It could be the instructors we used (we only used a couple), but it's a far cry from when I did my test(s) in the 1980s where we had to learn our braking distances, and pretty much the whole of the HC, chapter and verse*.
(*I knew I had failed my first bike test when, at the end, the examiner started asking questions about what the differences were between various types of level-crossing signs.)
Ride as and where you feel safest.
And that includes the pavement.
But always with due care and attention.
Crap haiku but agree completely. Some pavements are fine, others are unsuitable but that's covered by due care and attention.
There is hard evidence IIRC that driving actually raises stress levels, which probably explains road rage
Yup, I hate it, just had some idiot overtake a cyclist and force me to slam the brakes on this morning, couldn't wait a few seconds until either I passed or the cyclist went round the outside of the 2 lane roundabout they were approaching.
It’s entirely plausible that someone whose done their theory can drive just as badly as someone who hasn’t. Just an FYI.
@mrlebowski I don't disagree - and as others have noted, there will always be some who are aware of the rules but choose not to comply with them. Was just making the point that there's a significant proportion of drivers out there who took their test before the separate theory test was introduced - myself included. Whilst the theory test in it's current form isn't perfect, it surely has to be a better test of knowledge than being asked to correctly identify 3 road sign plates having made it back to the test centre as I was. Assuming most licence holders will have changed from paper licences to photocards which need renewing every 10 years, I really don't think it would be too difficult to require applicants to take a theory test...?