MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
They’ve had a couple of good eggs over the years, Kate Hoey (I voted for her), and … erm…
Thanks for the laugh!
Anyway, come on Britain… why are we thinking small scale? Let’s not just get the Tories out of government… let’s get them off the front benches. The LibDems as the official opposition is entirely doable as long as voters use the voting system in front of them, and don’t fall into a “my vote isn’t needed” mentality. Get everyone out. Make your vote count against the Tories by voting for whoever can send them home defeated in your seat in a few weeks’ time.
I’d be surprised if there weren’t shifts in attitude even amongst the boomers.
I would like to see the 70+ age bracket broken down a little. I'm 70 (so a boomer) and most of my friends are around that age. I know very few who are Tory supporters. OK the reflects the circles I move in but I think it's actually an older set of the 70+ range (our parents) where most of the Tory support lies. As they die out I think tory support will decline further amongst the elderly - not least because the next generation of OAPs may well not be as well off as the current ones. Yes I include myself as "current" and "well off", whilst not exactly rolling in it my house is paid off and I have a reasonable pension pot. I think before long parameters other than age may become stronger indicators of voting patterns.
the little fella is heading to the ‘Red Wall’ today with some loose change he found down the back of the sofa…
I shall be interested to see how well that goes down.
In total that’s less than 2 months worth of UK road deaths.
And also 0.1% of the 232,000 covid deaths which were way worse than they needed to be due to the incompetence of the Conservative gov't prior to the pandemic. I very much doubt if Labour had stayed in office they wouldn't have prioritised the NHS.
[Blair] lent his poison voice to remain thus facilitating Brexit
You can say a lot about Blair but blaming him for Brexit because he supported remain (which must have been a pretty marginal contribution to the debate because I don't even remember it) is silly.
They’ve had a couple of good eggs over the years, Kate Hoey (I voted for her)
Hoey is not a good egg. She's gone from being an advocate of Irish nationalist terrorism to an apologist for chauvinist unionism. Each of those positions is reprehensible - going from one to the other is nuts! She's also a Brexiteer and anti-immigration.
In the 97 manifesto [Blair] promised not to introduce tuition fees but did so immediately after the election.
This is simply factually wrong. Labour promised to implement the Dearing Committee's recommendations. Everyone at the time knew this meant tuition fees in some form. You can read the manifesto here - look at the "Higher Education" section. It does not say what you remember it as saying.
http://www.labour-party.org.uk/manifestos/1997/1997-labour-manifesto.shtml
John Smith apparently had a few skeletons in his closet that never got revealed due to his untimely death. My father was well aware of them, as were a lot of the political commentators of the time, but he didn’t detail them to me. Something to do with goings on in Monklands. But who in politics doesn’t?
Personally I liked JS and he would have balanced Blair and Brown nicely.
Moving on.
It’s generally good to see some positive stuff though as we’re surely short of good positive ideas these days.
Get the infrastructure spend moving, and in the right place. Rail to tie southern Scotland and northern England together - cement the union and give the country a second economic block similar in size to London. Roads less so going forwards.
Build routes to the rest of Europe that are less dependent on the Southeast. Trains to Paris for both passengers and freight that don’t require a change in / near London.
Use energy for social-engineering. The transmission tariff mainly encourages generation to be near use. Change it to encourage use to be near generation. As industry decarbonises that will encourage jobs and industry to the areas that need “levelling up” (Sorry for using that phrase)
Let’s see some honesty about tertiary education. My parents were bright working class kids - so the state funded them all the way to PhD, because we want the best and the brightest in this country. I have no problem starting with today’s tertiary sector funding model, but layer grants and scholarships over the top on it as a minimum.
Minimum wage and in work benefits - why should we find Tesco’s profits via in work benefits because they don’t pay folk properly? If folk qualify for in work benefits, fine, but charge them back to the employer.
Let’s get a sensible immigration policy - acquiring the best and the brightest from abroad but not the rest of the workforce means indigenous Brits will be disadvantaged in the jobs market because (to massively simplify) given the choice of promoting a Brit that you can’t replace or bringing someone in at a higher level from elsewhere there will a ever so slight bias in favour of bring someone in. Immigration is good but it needs mirror not to distort the jobs market.
PS - unashamedly centre left type here, happy to listen to both right and left of me and look for pragmatic solutions preferably without unforeseen consequences (though they’re not always easy to foresee) that benefit people. People not organisations and not ideologies.
why should we find Tesco’s profits via in work benefits because they don’t pay folk properly?
You've got that the wrong way around, paying the workers more will just put prices which will in turn affect everyone, it'll also speed up automation of Jobs and reduce headcount. What we need to do is get the cost of living down so people on a Tesco wage can actually afford to live on it. Jacking up the cost of food won't help them or anyone else.
The government needs to massively invest in 2 keys areas as well introduce some controls, housing and energy. Both achievable at a national level, gets those costs down to where they should be and suddenly a Tesco wage looks ok.
The alternative is probably ultimately online shopping picked and delivered by robots from an unlit warehouse, not an ideal future on many levels.
They’ve had a couple of good eggs over the years, Kate Hoey (I voted for her)
The female Farage? I’ve always been mystified as to why she was ever in the Labour Party
Anyway, it looks like this thread has become ‘that’ thread with the same 5 tedious lefties wanging on about Tony Blair
You really will never forgive him for winning 3 general elections, will you? 😂
You’ve got that the wrong way around, paying the workers more will just put prices which will in turn affect everyone, it’ll also speed up automation of Jobs and reduce headcount. What we need to do is get the cost of living down so people on a Tesco wage can actually afford to live on it. Jacking up the cost of food won’t help them or anyone else.
Still feel I’m paying Tesco’s wage bill whether I shop there or not. Less so at Aldi (as I understand it, and the point works whether or not it’s technically correct) where the base wage is a touch higher.
As for getting cost of living down, that’s just inflation rebalancing the system. Getting CoL down means deflation or wage rises.
And to be fair inflation is normally (though this time perhaps not entirely) the rebalancing of government spending / money creation. Inflation and wage rises are a way of devaluing debt - not great if you’re part of the lending / investing class.
paying the workers more will just put prices which will in turn affect everyone, it’ll also speed up automation of Jobs and reduce headcount.
Well, we have a skills shortage and the lowest unemployment in 40 years and an aging population and massive demand for carers and large scale immigration and a housing crisis, so why are taxpayers subsidising Tesco to keep these low productivity jobs that apparently could be done by robots anyway?
I'm holding off calling for fully automated luxury communism but I don't entirely understand why having a human pack and deliver my groceries is important in itself.
Smith apparently had a few skeletons in his closet...But who in politics doesn’t?
To be fair to them, you could never suggest that Hoey or Corbyn or Abbot or Patel or Rees-Mogg do. Their skeletons are all out in the middle of the street dancing in a conga line accompanied by a mariachi band.
You really will never forgive him for winning 3 general elections, will you? 😂
Will you ever forgive Corbyn for losing 2?
You’ve got that the wrong way around, paying the workers more will just put prices which will in turn affect everyone, it’ll also speed up automation of Jobs and reduce headcount.
I've never understood the logic of keeping people employed for employments sake. If a job can be automated it should be automated (with the assumption that the robot can do the job as well as or better than the human).
If keeping jobs in the hands of humans is a sign of a successful economy then couldn't we just ban certain machinery from farms and get everyone back out in the fields planting and gathering crops?
You really will never forgive him for winning 3 general elections, will you?
Well every day is a school day - I thought you were not a fan of Tony Blair?
Although I guess the truth is that you probably just changed your mind. I remember when you were Corbyn supporter. And I dare say that at some point you will starting hating Starmer.
With you it's all love or hate, there is no in-between. Which is why you assume that if anyone doesn't hate Corbyn they must love him and hero worship him.
Will you ever forgive Corbyn for losing 2?
It's the idea that winning and losing elections are politically and morally equivalent that's so frustrating. Elections aren't just debating competitions - winning an election is a chance to preserve lives and the planet. Losing an election is squandering that chance and failing. Unlike for Blair (Iraq War vs Sure Start), there's no argument to be had about the legacy of the Corbyn government (or the Miliband government, or the Kinnock government) because there wasn't one.
But this is a niche concern for cranks now - like people who hate decimal currency, or think that that much protein creates lost, or want to reinstate the Tudors as the Royal Family.
Well every day is a school day – I thought you were not a fan of Tony Blair?
I’m pretty much ‘Centrist Dad’
You don’t have to be a ‘fan’ of Blair and Brown to be able to appreciate the good they did without screaming IRAQ! like the woman on Tom and Jerry when she sees a mouse.
If some people can’t acknowledge the huge increase in funding for the NHS, education and Sure Start and so much more, and say that it’s no different from the Tories then there’s really not much point engaging with them as they’re either being wilfully ignorant or they’re just morons. Quite possibly both.
As for Magic Grandad, I was willing to believe that after the disaster of Ed Milliband (delivered by Len McClusky and Co, lest we forget), he could move Labour to the left, but moderate his position on some things and deliver something decent
You know how long that misplaced optimism lasted for? About a week. I made the error of going to a Momentum meeting and it rapidly dawned on me that Corbyn and his supporters were all absolutely hatstand. Completely mental!
I’m not making this up… they spent half an hour discussing what they were going to do to prevent Jeremy being assassinated by the ‘The State’ to prevent the bright socialist future, then they started going on about Venezuela
Since then I’ve absolutely despised their tinfoil-helmeted, 6th form level, ****y, placard-waving, middle-class, self-indulgence that was never going to deliver anything but permanent opposition. Not that anyone seemed to be too bothered by that.
Anyway.. FFS Lets get back on topic.
This thread is meant to be about this election campaign, though I know you lot love rattling on about 2017 when your bearded superhero didn’t lose as badly as expected, so apparently that represented some kind of victory
It didn’t, but this one might. Though I suspect the usual suspects would rather see Starmer lose so they could carry on whining about Blairites/centrists/whatever and carry on dreaming of the socialist utopia and Weimar Republic monetary policy that is never ever ever going to happen
That's a big long spiel on a subject that you don't want to talk about binners! 😊
And on the contrary, I am very happy to talk about the present. I find it's you who generally wants to bring up Magic Grandad, as you amusingly call him.
Earlier in the thread you started to become hysterical because people wanted to discuss the crisis facing Labour's current election campaign.
And on the contrary, I am very happy to talk about the present. I find it’s you who generally wants to bring up Magic Grandad, as you amusingly call him.
Nothing says "let's move on" clearer than that.
Anyway back on topic I might not be a political fan of John Rentoul but I reckon this must be the most insightful article I have read so far during this election campaign, at least with regards to Labour.
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/angela-rayner-keir-starmer-diane-abbott-b2554990.html
Starmer contracting out his beliefs to Morgan McSweeney is not a new perspective for me but I was interested in Rentoul's observations of how deliberate and calculating Angela Rayner's manoeuvers were after she correctly read the situation surrounding the crises.
I can see a situation where in a few months time, when Starmer's already low level of popularity totally collapses under the pressure of premiership, where Angela Rayner stages a coup.
The Tories might be on to something if they use the line "vote for Starmer get Rayner".
I tried “move on” earlier. It didn’t work.
What do folk want from the next administration whomever they might be?
What interesting campaigning has gone on, slips, trips and political falls have you seen, did you spot a poll or a story that smack of a change in the wind?
That’s what I want to hear.
(And don’t let any 50 something, centre left types with deceased psephologist fathers prattle on about John Smith)
Nothing says “let’s move on” clearer than that.
I'm glad you agree!
Nice spot on the red queen article. I’d be surprised if she goes for it as you suggest that early, but get a decent ministerial role (not deputy leader), be seen to make a difference for a few folk and she does look good longer term.
I’d love an argument with her. I suspect she’d run rings round me without breaking sweat, but just to see that mind at work.
PS - I doubt that Starmer’s popularity will be that low if he returns a good majority - not in the short term.
kelvin
Let’s not just get the Tories out of government… let’s get them off the front benches. The LibDems as the official opposition is entirely doable as long as voters use the voting system in front of them
That's a situation I would love to see happen and not just because it would be so humiliating for the Tories.
A well functioning opposition is almost as important as a well functioning government to me.
Both sides should be advocating for a better society even if they disagree on the way to do it.
A bit like this thread in fact, epic arguments sure, but they are almost exclusively about how to make the UK a better place for all it's citizens not a worse one. That's how it should be both on here and in government. 👍
I suspect she’d run rings round me without breaking sweat, but just to see that mind at work.
I have heard Angela Rayner speak a couple of times, both in front of a very large crowd and a small group. She is very good indeed, speaks without any sort of hesitation and without looking at notes, and with easily expressed passion. She knows how to play a crowd.
One of things I like about Rayner is that she won't shy away from speaking to a left-wing audience, something Starmer would not dream of doing, despite the inevitable heckles and criticism she receives.
As far as how long I expect Starmer to remain Labour leader I don't know. But I have little doubt that he will cease to be leader at some point between July 4th and the 2029 general election.
Magic Grandad
Life of Brian meme, we need a Life of Brian meme !!
“vote for Starmer get Rayner”
At last - a reason to vote Labour !!
What do folk want from the next administration whomever they might be?
Fully automated luxury social democracy. The end of right to buy on social housing. A restriction on non-residents buying residential property outside designated investment zones. Total legalisation and taxation of cannabis. Decriminalisation of mere drug possession on the Portuguese model. Massive pressure on UK overseas territories to speed up transparency of ownership of offshore companies. An end to Scottish Partnerships. Termination of outsourcing of immigration functions to Sopra Steria. Termination of outsourcing of army recruitment to Crapita. A pathway to economic reintegration will the European Union. Reduction in the number of flaky tertiary education colleges offering dodgy courses for visa support. Cap on the number of foreign students at top tier universities. Long term plan to increase real foreign language learning in primary schools. Prohibition on flights between London and Glasgow/Edinburgh/Newcastle (maybe exception for much smaller number of flights for pax connecting to international destinations). A prohibition on outside employment of MPs (maybe exception for legitimate public service professions in which they were already working prior to Parliament eg medicine, public interest law, education). Restated media regulation. A monument to Diane Abbot in every town square. A comprehensive restatement of foreign policy that picks a limited number of issues and goes deep into them. A reinstatement of the fuel duty escalator. A shift in HMRC resources to high value tax evaders. De-recognition of the Royal Family, full transfer of the Crown Estate to the state, and creation of a Presidential position on the Irish model, to rotate among the 4 nations every decade.
But in the first term I'll settle for the Tories out.
Rishi’s listening. He’ll try to deliver at least one of those demands.
Rishi’s listening. He’ll try to deliver at least one of those demands.
LOL! Nice one! 😁
Tories have claimed they've had a good week 😕
https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1796980059829387317
George Galloway says the Workers Party is standing hundreds of candidates. He says he is expecting hundreds of thousands of votes and will be extremely disappointed if the number elected is not in double figures.
Well, he shoots high does George.
Tories have claimed they’ve had a good week 😕
They've been claiming that the last 14 years have been a triumph so a week of falling polls is neither here nor there for them!
George Galloway says the Workers Party is standing hundreds of candidates
He’ll be more than familiar with the words ‘lost deposit’ by the morning of July 5th then
Why can't George Galloway be the Nigel Farage of the left? He's seeing deep into a few niches (the 6th form left, Muslims, anti-wokeists) and there's an assumption that Labour is going to walk into power so there's no jeopardy in not voting for them. Plus unlike Farage he is a grafting campaigner and has been elected as an MP before. I suspect he has more access to campaign finance than you might expect... The danger that he scoops up seats is real.
It's worth noting that Opinium use a methodology that favour the Tories by squeezing the Don't Knows & weight based on who people voted for previously
Considering the methodology & that this is well after the start of the campaign, seeing this poll widen, will be setting off major alarm bells in the Tory party, be very interesting to see how Sunak & the rest of his party react
I see a story that the Tories are warning members that the campaign is short of money with a claim that they might start triaging constituencies within 48 hours.
Liz Truss has made the papers again too, pronouncing Tony Blair the worse UK PM. 🥬
Liz Truss has made the papers again too, pronouncing Tony Blair the worse UK PM.
She could win a Nobel Prize from here on in, and still no one would take her seriously.
But she did what her hedge fund backers wanted, though, so she's never going to be short of a bob or two.
I'd quite like Blair to drop the swede on her if a meeting could be engineered. That would be redemption for him in my eyes. A full Duncan Ferguson job.
💥😴
I see a story that the Tories are warning members that the campaign is short of money with a claim that they might start triaging constituencies within 48 hours.
they'll be saving some for the final week ad blitz, but it may be why they've call it for July, party finances might have been completely shot by autumn (Hester probably not going to bankroll them now his knighthood probably went west due to his big mouth, and probably got bored of having a microphone stuck in his face everywhere he goes).
Considering the methodology & that this is well after the start of the campaign, seeing this poll widen, will be setting off major alarm bells in the Tory party
Yep, I find it fascinating! 😀 You would have thought we had got to the saturation point where Labour had already taken as much support from the Tories as possible, and that any further movement through the course of the campaign would have been back to the Tories.
I wonder if the Diane Abbott row played a part? It was widely suggested that some in Starmer's team wanted a public row with the Left, which they would of course win, because they believed that it would play well with some Tory voters - those who hate leftie black women, I think it is fair to say that Diane Abbott is hated by a lot of Tory voters. In fact according to Forde KC she is hated by much of the Labour establishment.
So maybe they were right? I don't think the Opinium poll had a chance to be affected by Starmer's U-turn on Diane Abbott yesterday. It will be interesting to see if next weeks Opinium poll shows a drop in Labour support.
I’ve never understood the logic of keeping people employed for employments sake
Because people get a lot more out of work than just a pay packet, it gives people a reason to get up in the morning, a sense of self worth, social interaction. A ,ot of people dislike their jobs but socially interact with colleagues. When we get to the point of automation being cheaper and better quality than people on basic wages which results in a lot of people not working we will end up with a very divided society between those with the skills and motivation to work and those stuck below the glass ceiling who survive on state support. I cant see that being a very pleasant or equitable society, it really will become a two tier society with many people struggling to move from the not working to working groups like we see with multi generational out of work families.
The other problem is we will see the basic skills, attitude and intelligence requirements for the remaining jobs increase locking more people out of the opportunity to work.
I know a lot of people yearn for the days of UBI plus benign AI but I'm not sure it with quite as utopian as people hope.
As yet I’ve not had a robot spend their wages in my shop.
Plus unlike Farage he is a grafting campaigner and has been elected as an MP before.
And he invariably loses his seat. Which is why he has so much experience in winning seats! In the case of Bradford West they kicked him out after just 3 years.
Support for George Galloway is a little complicated, many of the people who vote for him, ie Muslims, are very aware of his failings. The support he receives is often an act of desperation by those who feel ignored, disenfranchised, and taken for granted.
I suspect that under the present climate the Workers Party will do better than some imagine likely. He was clever and got his candidates in early in carefully targeted seats (about 145 I think) before more sensible ex-Labour Party Muslims had a chance to organise. Although the Muslim vote has been desperately trying for a few months to organise properly for the general election they still have some way to go, certainly in respect to approved candidates. Galloway didn't hang about.
I think DA only really frothed up the left who used the situation as stick to beat Starmer with and people in her constituency. Starmer has actually played it quite well, she's back in as candidate so that avoids losing a constituency and giving the left something to coalesce around. In the meantime it's quite clear he didn't want her back but accepted it in a procedural way which will play well to centralists and those on the left of the Tory party.
If she's still an MP and party member at the next GE I'd be surprised, I imagine she will get purged at the first opportunity. It would appear according to the Sky journalist on HIGNFY that Abbot was the source for the rumours of her being blocked from standing. I think she's made herself persona non grata with Starmers team and they will get shot as soon as they can, she's a complete liability and rallying pojnt for the left. Getting shot quickly will cause some short term shouting but reduce the long term pain. She might of course tow the party line but I doubt she'll manage that.
Liz Truss has made the papers again too, pronouncing Tony Blair the worse UK PM. 🥬
I now believe that Liz Truss is an abstract performance art piece. It’s the only possible explanation
I’m not sure the Abbot row really had much cut through
Despite the best efforts of the media and the Tories, nobody outside Hackney actually gives a shit
I’m not sure the Abbot row really had much cut through
Well you need to ask yourself why people who were not saying that they would vote Labour a week ago are saying they would vote Labour this week. And why those who said they would vote Tory are now saying that they won't.
Presumably something has influenced them in the last week.
Starmer has actually played it quite well
Excellent .
She might of course tow the party line but I doubt she’ll manage that.
Grrrr
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/stuff-that-makes-you-disproportionately-cross/page/56/
Despite the best efforts of the media and the Tories, nobody outside Hackney actually gives a shit
And the Deputy Leader of the Labour Party.
And senior members of the Shadow Cabinet.
Apart from that no one cares at all. I can't imagine why Starmer waited until yesterday to perform a U-turn on an issue which no one cares about. It would have stopped all the pointless distraction if he hadn't waited so long.
Dialling in a report from the shires - where the GE will be won or lost; no comment about or reference to Diane Abbott from anyone on the doorstep during two canvassing sessions.
No comment about her at the market stall before canvassing; jenrick and a handful of his acolytes hung around for a while before acknowledging they were out-numbered and cleared off. They had nothing to say about Diane Abbott - or anything else.
Will be canvassing in two constituencies on Sunday and predict...no-one will refer to Diane Abbott.
Maybe I'm missing out on those constituencies where it's a discussion matter - maybe I'm not as it's a non-issue.
Hmm, wonder which it is?
For those who think it matters or has any relevance - carry on frothing.
Have a look at Sunday's front pages - nothing.
It's yesterday's news - same as Natalie Elphicke.
Because people get a lot more out of work than just a pay packet, it gives people a reason to get up in the morning, a sense of self worth, social interaction.
What drove to get up in the morning was to get work over as quickly as I could to ensure I spent as much time as possible out on the bike in the hills and avoiding all interactions with others.
To equate work = self worth sounds suspiciously like talking point #1 straight out of a capitalist workhouse playbook
Perhaps I just had the “wrong” type of work.
self worth sounds suspiciously like talking point #1 straight out of a capitalist workhouse playbook
I was waiting for that sort of response but I'll accept there is some merit in it as what I was arguing could be construed as keeping the masses in their place. But that's honestly not what I'm getting at, even in your case maybe the desire to get out and ride was heightened by the contrast of work, maybe it wasn't but a lot of people don't have other interests that would take up the void not working leaves.
Personally I get a lot of personal self worth out of my job and really struggled when I was unemployed, maybe I'm an exception but at least I'm assuming that others would struggle like I did.
Perhaps I just had the “wrong” type of work.
Or maybe your colleagues didn't like you 😆
Because people get a lot more out of work than just a pay packet
I think that's true (maybe I lack imagination) but we don't live in a country that has an excess of labour that needs to be soaked up by low productivity jobs. Quite the opposite.
I know a lot of people yearn for the days of UBI
Subsidising people to work for private industry on minimum wage is halfway to UBI!
Or maybe your colleagues didn’t like you 😆
Quite possibly true, only had one “proper” well paying job using my degree straight out of uni (gates power transmission) but I only lasted 6months due to my senior manager blaming me for a machinery failure that was due to his fault in not listening to me with regard to a potential major machinery failure issue. I punched him during the investigation meeting as he said it was entirely my fault, I walked out/quit, so yeah……….i can imagine my colleagues didn’t like me much in that job for sure. 🙂
Subsidising people to work for private industry on minimum wage is halfway to UBI!
My last job I had from 2008 ish to 2018 was minimum wage so my pay was subsidised through working tax credit by the government, no different really to ubi
To equate work = self worth sounds suspiciously like talking point #1 straight out of a capitalist workhouse playbook
What utter cobblers!
What is it about those on the left who have this monumentally patronising narrative that if you enjoy your work then you’re some sort of capitalist lackey, an unthinking drone and slave to the military industrial complex
It really is the most condescending bollocks and seems mostly about an air of superiority in the person making the statement
Personally I get a lot of personal self worth out of my job and really struggled when I was unemployed
I had a similar problem when I first retired. It took another ten years before I was actually ready to quit work - and even then I'm still actively doing voluntary work.
What’s wrong with you binners?, it was a somewhat light hearted comment. I’ve never met nor talked with you in my life but you appear to be on an “attack dog” streak lately with some quite abusive posts towards other users of this forum.
The sooner we get a functioning forum with the ability to block folk the better as I’d much rather not read nor see another post of yours again.
Now’t to read here, just a misunderstanding
Sorry @somafunk. Nothing personal and apologies if you perceived it as an attack. It wasn’t meant to be.
I say this in the least argumentative way possible and apologise for taking the thread further off topic but I do agree with somafunk's statement regarding work and self worth.
Different people have different metrics, life experiences and expectations. Somafunk is just expressing how some, even many perhaps, feel.
Each to their own I suppose I'm just saying really and we all have different motivations in life both in work and in a myriad of other ways.
Anyway, sorry for taking this further off topic.
Edit: I see everything cooled down whilst I was typing my thesis!😁👍
I see a story that the Tories are warning members that the campaign is short of money with a claim that they might start triaging constituencies within 48 hours.
I thought with all the taxpayers money they'd handed out to mates and cronies, they'd have a huge income stream available to fight the next couple of elections.
Is there an election?
Blimey. Next thing, someone will be teling me Joe Cocker is dead.
Anyway, what about that Diane what's her name?
I thought with all the taxpayers money they’d handed out to mates and cronies, they’d have a huge income stream available to fight the next couple of elections.
I could have swore I read that the Tories had a much larger fighting fund for the GE than Labour did??
Mind you, a lot of that is going on coke and hookers at the moment as Rome burns but still.
Anyway, what about that Diane what’s her name?
You really are determined to endlessly bang on about something which you claim is of no interest and importance to anyone, just to prove that it is of no importance! 😂
You seem as obsessed with Diane Abbott as Keir Starmer was!
Well until yesterday that is, then suddenly it was strangely no longer important to Starmer whether or not Abbott was a Labour candidate, it was apparently up to her and her constituency.
Now that this unfortunate and distracting misunderstanding has been cleared up can we move on please?
Within the Labour party the message is that the tories have much more money than us which is probably true; it helps the central messaging and the continued appeals for donations
They should get Rishi up in court for paying off a porn star. Apparently Trump has raised 35 million in campaign donations since he was convicted
Well the Tories can spend no more than £54k per constituency, even if they wanted to. I would be surprised if the Labour war chest was short of the £34m required to cover all 650 constituencies.
What is it about those on the left who have this monumentally patronising narrative that if you enjoy your work then you’re some sort of capitalist lackey, an unthinking drone and slave to the military industrial complex
Nobody has said that, but also not everybody (in fact a lot of people) have jobs that are helping them in anyway.
Would you be happy working on a till in a Supermarket for 40 hours a week for 30 years all while not getting paid enough to live on? How would your self worth be?
A good experiment would be to make all jobs pay exactly the same and then see which jobs gets filled/have a queue of people and which jobs don't. I say that as an overpaid office worker who would be rather doing a lot of other things if the money was the same.
Politecameraaction.
Read the 1997 Labour manifesto you linked. There is no mention of tuition fees. Only maintainence is mentioned. They were proposing a pay back system to replace grants but you need to quote if you think they had announced tuition fees which came later when they won the election and the commision discussed both.
Either way making the poorest pay fees was one of the Tory things Blair did, not the Tories.
It was Blair himself that u-turned. He promised no tuition fees. Just before the manifesto was published.
Anyway, what about that Diane what’s her name?
You really are determined to endlessly bang on about something which you claim is of no interest and importance to anyone, just to prove that it is of no importance! 😂
Blimey some people were tired and emotional last night!
In the context of the post referencing Joe Cocker, it clearly wasn't serious, but away you go, in the same way as binners leaping in with two feet a bit further up.
Calm down dears, it's just an election.
It was Blair himself that u-turned. He promised no tuition fees. Just before the manifesto was published.
How many manifesto claims (from any party) have actually been enacted in full and in the manner intended?
It's got worse recently but everything now is either a pack of lies or it's like someone's created a Prime Minister's Lucky Dip jar to the question "what would you do if you were PM?"
Today I would...[rummage in jar]...make sure that Premier League games are on free to air TV! (the latest Lib Dem one).
Ummm... OK, lay out to me your actual workable plan for that. Broad strokes, don't need the full details yet but how? And why? And what are your metrics for success and achievements?
Claim after claim which can't be backed up, probably can't be achieved anyway or which - even if it could be achieved - is irrelevant. Or which can simply be forgotten about or binned off with an "ah well yes we did say that but it turns out we hadn't actually looked into any of the details and we were in fact talking bollocks"