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This dismissal of the potential seriousness of what occurred last week
I didn't dismiss the seriousness of the situation, or downplay that it was a coup attempt, I was pointing out that a specific claim that America had "succumbed to mob rule" was obviously incorrect, because America is still being run by it's elected government.
The threat is still there, and I'm all for vigilance - especially over here. We are on that same downward spiral.
But overly dramatic language, in my opinion, risks both encouraging the nutters who think they are succeeding more than they are, and making ordinary people dismiss the danger as being overblown hysteria.
That footage of the cop getting crushed in the door looks like a medical siege. It reminded me of a scene in that Luc Besson film 'Joan of Arc'. I bet that's who Ivanka will style herself on in the coming months.
I read an Umberto Eco essay from the late 70's called 'The new middle ages where he foresaw a post cold war and the asymmetric nature of the conflicts that would ensu. In a way it kind of predicted the end of the age of reason and I think this is what we are seeing here.
This activity doesn't belong in a world shaped by the French revolution, (That has shaped politics left and right for 200 years). It comes from a time before, it comes from the dark ages, a time when superstition ruled, a time before the adoption of the scientific method.
Other films / plays that come to mind are 'The Crucible' by Arthur Miller, set in a time just before the enlightenment took hold. And Umberto Eco's 'Name of the Rose' where a pre enlightenment monk applies forensics, science and light to a world of dark superstition.
I’ve read that Trump is considering Rudy Giuliani for his defence team against impeachment
Let's hope so. The Giuliani, Lin Wood, Sidney Powell dream team has served the US public well so far.
Kraken++
Parler Says It Has Removed Lin Wood's Posts Calling For Mike Pence to Be Executed
Sellouts! I'm off to Gab!
That’s quite interesting, the Trumpists are so reactionary they probably already are turning on Parler.
Kamala Harris is an anagram of shark malaria (@Grauniad Everyman xword), makes you think!
There is a debate to be had about how a few tech firms can wipe out free speech
Twitter has been 'a thing' since what 2007 or some such...Are you suggesting that Free speech was only a thing for a little over a decade?
https://mobile.twitter.com/sullydish
EDIT:
didn't embed properly, clip shows a policeman actively opening the barricades and imploring the mob to invade.
@thols2 - I see the irony of Parler censoring it’s user’s fReSpeACh™
It could have been a ‘moment’ for Parler users to have a few rational or even confusing thoughts erupt in their heads?
But wasn’t that only just in before Amazon and Apple withdrew those services and have effectively deleted Parler? That will only inflame Parler users and send them to find deeper rabbit holes and further into ‘dark web’ terrain? Or will they leave social media and be content with shouting at random immigrants in pubs and bars? Oh, the pubs are shut too.
This is beyond ‘ideal’ recruitment ground/fertile spawning waters for terrorists, nihilists, etc. For a growing conspiracists and cults the internet seems a goose which can lay nothing but golden eggs. Every act of suppression or defence is counted as an attack on fReEsPeAcH and/or further validation of (xyz) conspiracy theory/ies. Double-bound double-binds all round. Argh, my tin foil feels so unreal. Or is it real? 🤪
What is worrying is that there are fascist/racist/supremacist iPhone users! 🙂
@klunk Kraken double plus good, if you will.
There is a debate to be had about how a few tech firms can wipe out free speech
There's no debate really. Twitter is a business. It supplies a soap box. It's their soapbox and if they don't like some of the people standing on it they can push them off. You sign up to the Ts & Cs when you join. It's generally more "inclusive" than some of the billionaire owned press and TV businesses.
There’s no debate really
Agreed. It’s just becoming a widely accepted ‘fact’.
#alternativetruth
https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/1348252477850841089
https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/1348252483857080321
thols2,
No, it shows a fat cop running up to the barriers and gesturing vigorously towards the mob, saying; GO, GO, GO.
like an army sergeant ushering the troops up Omaha beach sort of thing.
Anyone else see a purge of the Police and Military coming?
I know you pointed out how difficult it is for government to introduce police reform but these are extraordinary times. No doubt Federal over reach would be resisted but with 50% of Republican voters supporting the coup attempt you can't afford to ignore the cancer within.
I imagine there are tens of thousands of police and Military personell bricking it right now / hastily deleting their social media accounts.
They are really claiming you should be able to directly threaten to kill people and organise a coup under 'free speech' - does that extend to Islamic terrorists I wonder?
They literally don't think white christian 'patriots' should have to be constrained in any way at all because they are so obviously right.
Anyone else see a purge of the Police and Military coming?
If they've been posting on social media about doing illegal stuff, sure. But that will only catch the truly stupid ones. The less stupid ones will still be there.
didn’t embed properly, clip shows a policeman actively opening the barricades and imploring the mob to invade.
Timestamp? Was he threatened?
Agreed. It’s just becoming a widely accepted ‘fact’.
#alternativetruth
What's also interesting is this push to remove section 230, when in reality removing the liability protection that provides would make hosting Parler/Twitter/Facebook etc. impractical.
People often see their "rights" in isolation - from other people having that same right and also other people's other rights. So your right to free speech cannot interfere with someone else's right not to be attacked by other people. The exact balance is always the key, but generally the right to not be assaulted or killed comes above the right to say what you want.
every time you think things are calming down they seem to be getting worse. I wonder what Trump is actually up to as you never hear anything any more from him.
Yup. John Mulaney comes to mind. The horse loose in the hospital has gone quiet.
Steven Bumbera (@bumbera_steven) Tweeted: Confirmed that some police were involved in the Capitol attack yesterday #CapitolRiots https://t.co/XawgoRK8T8 https://twitter.com/bumbera_steven/status/1347270969988173825?s=20
Hope this link works, it's worth seeing.
EDIT:
Yes it works, it's absolutely damming, not a case of complicity but active direction so the mob.
As I said earlier, just like a sergeant leading troops up Omaha beach.
Good interview with the Parler chief exec by Kara Swisher on her Sway podcast. Very timely. Interesting that he portrays himself as politically agnostic, refuses to vote, although his platform and investors are predominantly right-wing.
Matt Hancock is also failing to understand how free-speech works according to the latest news.
Matt Hancock's not confusing censorship with community standards is he?
All Twitter and the like have done is got the mods in.
Hancock is not renowned for being smart.
Evidently he's not overly busy with covid-19 and the near-collapse of the NHS either.
But the really important question to be answered about these social media platforms is still whether or not you're a customer
The same government that apparently cares about free speech, as long as it's the right kind of free speech
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/capitalism-teaching-school-racism-violence-democracy-gavin-williamson-b625480.html
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/20/teaching-white-privilege-is-a-fact-breaks-the-law-minister-says
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/jan/09/students-quit-free-speech-campaign-over-role-of-toby-young-founded-group
That’s a pretty strong, but accurate somethingion of where we are.
When the bloke from Twins makes more sense in 5mins than years of Whitehouse bile
In the first paragraph that Forbes article says America is "the world’s oldest democracy..." and I've heard that mentioned previously in the last few days. It isn't though, is it? Google* says they're been around for donkey's years, why do the American's keep saying this? Weird.
Edit: maybe it is more their electoral college & gubbins that they're referring to being so great.
Edit2: DuckDuckGo actually, dunno why i typed Google.
But the really important question to be answered about these social media platforms is still whether or not you’re a customer
Reminds me of zokes. 😀
Sounds like Parler is hosed. Chief exec is doing interviews. Amazon gave them 24hrs notice of termination of their hosting, their lawyers have dumped them, no other tech companies will work with them - so it all gets turned off at midnight PT.
Sounds like Parler is hosed
How excellent. I'm sure that there will be some non-US sites that could host it but lack of lawyers is a different matter for those in charge. Looks like civil society is now protecting a failing government.
It isn’t though, is it? Google* says they’re been around for donkey’s years, why do the American’s keep saying this? Weird.
I think it’ll be tied into when a country with democratic features truly becomes a democracy. Or some other such set of criteria to get the result.
e.g. For the U.K.
Britain did not become a democracy until the Representation of the People Acts of 1918 and 1928 that gave the vote to all men and women over the age of 21.
Although that would challenge the assertion the US is as old as I’m seeing claimed when they still had slavery.
And they’re also probably referring to surviving examples.
Just popped in to link to Parler Watch on Reddit but seems like it’s a bit late
https://www.reddit.com/r/ParlerWatch/
Just took a look at bi*chute dot com as that’s now being lauded as the ‘non-PC’ and non-‘state-controlled’ alternative to youtube.
If that is where the future lies, then I give up on humanity*
Trending today:
Chauvinistic cult leaders
Anti-vaxxing
Conspiracy
Racism
Conspiracy
MAGA
Infowars
americafirst
Flatearth
Nice to see some balanced and nuanced views eh?
*Disclaimer: Working on the assumption/historical trend that where The Great US of A leads - little Britain follows. A race to the bottom?
US did not have a full franchise for voting until the mid 60s. Democracy was founded in ancient greece which is where the word comes from. Its just another example of US exceptionalism and ignorance to call it the oldest democracy
Democracy (Greek: δημοκρατία, dēmokratiā, from dēmos 'people' and kratos 'rule')