[Closed] To politicians, we're little more than meaningless blobs on a monitor

I can't disagree with any of that. I'm sure this shower will be voted out at the next election only to be replaced by another.

We need a radical change.

This does nothing to help my growing feeling of nihilism.

you elected them

you elected them

I didn't either.

Neither did I.

Nope, can't say that I did either.

I shall, of course, be working to vote them out, however.

I voted for them. I will again, given the sorry excuse of an alternative.

I will again given the alternative.

Ah, so its either officially a two party system or you are a defeatist.

Vote Green!

I'm hoping Vince Cable will form his own party.

Ah, so its either officially a two party system or you are a defeatist.

What evidence is there that it's anything other than a 2 party system ? Lib Dems ? Yeah right. Greens ? Laughable. BNP ? Can't believe I've even brought them into the debate. Not much left is there and out of the two, I would [b]never[/b]vote Tory.

I never bloody voted for them!

30% of the population did though (feel free to correct me)

To think I was mug enough to sign up and fight for them as well, still makes me #violent swear word deleted# sick! 👿

The reason we only have a "two party system" is that people can't see past the smoke screen the powers that be put up. Vote for who you think is the best, not who you think will win.

Empathy is a disease!

I have to say, much as I am disgusted with the whole horrible, failed New Labour experiment - I would be tempted to vote for them, just to stop the Tories getting in. Which says a lot about the state of our political system.

I also think there is a lot of moronic bitterness and blaming of Gordon Brown for things which are entirely beyond his control.

Personally I think some kind of PR system needs to be brought in, but there is zero chance of either of the two main parties doing that.

.... and out of the two, I would nevervote Tory.

Ah, so you're one of [i]them[/i].

With my upbringing and background it would be assumed that I would vote nothing but Tory yet I have on quite a few occasions.

Voters who vote based purely on the colour of the rosette the clown who knocks on the door is wearing are by far the biggest single problem with the democratic process in this country.

I also think there is a lot of moronic bitterness and blaming of Gordon Brown for things which are entirely beyond his control.

Such as selling off the gold reserves after announcing he would be doing so and hence devaluing the market, p!ssing the 3G licence money up the wall and generally falling over himself to protect the votes, I mean jobs, of employees of Northern Rock?

Aye, completely out of his control.

Voters who vote based purely on the colour of the rosette the clown who knocks on the door is wearing are by far the biggest single problem with the democratic process in this country.

I think you'll find that first past the post voting rather than a system of proportianal representation is a bigger stumbling block to a democratic process than people who refuse to vote the way that you want them too.

I also think there is a lot of moronic bitterness and blaming of Gordon Brown for things which are entirely beyond his control.

The pound has dropped against the Euro because we never adopted it in the first place.

Isn't the weak pound a good thing for British industry though?

I'm not saying he's blameless, but there seems to be loads of idiots saying 'I've lost my job thanks to Gordon Brown' etc - which for the most part is just nonsense.

Curious how the tory voters here seem to think that it'll all be alright once they get into power. Blind faith I call it.

The two main party's are merely a variation on a theme.

.... than people who refuse to vote the way that you want them too.

I'm not bothered for who people vote, just by what means they use to determine how to cast that vote.

How many die-hard socialists do we hear bemoaning the current Labour party for their lack of socialist values?

Whilst the idea of "anyone but Tory" may sound good, by voting for a Labour party that is basically Tories in red ties those self-same die-hard socialists who disapprove of Labour's swing to the right are also approving of them. Far better to vote for policies that you agree with than "well I've always voted for them".

As we have seen with Labour (and the Tories to a small extent), policies change.

well i'm not allowed to vote

Voters who vote based purely on the colour of the rosette the clown who knocks on the door is wearing are by far the biggest single problem with the democratic process in this country.

I was thinking about a revolution. What day is good for everyone? Next Thursday?

By the way, continuing to vote labour to prevent the Tories from getting in is almost as stupid as someone continuing to drink meths so that they don't have to see how badly they are messing up their life.

If politicians are messing up the country, do something about it. if that means voting for another party, vote for another party. If that means starting your own party to deal with those specific issues, then do that. Our "democracy" may be flawed, but you can do that and at least say that you tried to change something.

There's an awful lot of [url= http://architectures.danlockton.co.uk/2009/02/27/the-convention-on-modern-liberty/ ]talk[/url] about this. It's not about whos in power, it's about showing who it is in power that we won't put up with it. The only way of doing that is to remove them from power, surely. Then the tories do it some more, so we remove them from power too.
/misguided

if you try and change anything you'll get arrested and held without trial under the anti-terrorist laws or sommat

Not like that rosette would tell you anything about their poilitics now is it?

Jacqui Smith and Dennis Skinner both wear the same colour rosette when pressing the flesh but Jacqui Smith is far from being the type of Labour politician I respect or support the personal policies of.

Far better to vote for policies that you agree with than "well I've always voted for them".

TBH, it's sometimes a case of voting against rather than for. When I first moved to the SW, I voted Lib Dem as it was the only viable vote against the Tory candidate in this area. Since 97, it's been worth voting for Lab as it has seemed worth voting for them. Next time, I'll be voting whichever makes sense to keep the Tories out.

But therein lies the problem.

You should vote for who you want in, not who you need to vote for to keep someone else out.

No wonder their is so much disillusionment of the democratic system in this country when people ignore policies of the party they are voting for purely to keep a rosette out.

No wonder their is so much disillusionment of the democratic system in this country when people ignore policies of the party they are voting for purely to keep a rosette out

Sorry, you've lost me. Do the Tories have policies ?

excercising of political choice due to no PR in my opinion - tactical voting is still voting why not moan at those who dont actualy vote and then complain?.

Jacqui Smith and Dennis Skinner both wear the same colour rosette when pressing the flesh but Jacqui Smith is far from being the type of Labour politician I respect or support the personal policies of.

Curious how the tory voters here seem to think that it'll all be alright once they get into power.

The pound has dropped against the Euro because we never adopted it in the first place.

Do the Tories have policies

Not since Nu-Labour stole them!

[img] [/img]

As I understood it the £ has gone down more than some others because of the large share of our GDP that comes from the financial sector.

Whilst I don't think the current govt are *particularly* good I don't think the others would be any better, possibly worse and definitely further from my idealogical standpoint. I would rather have a competent mid-left government in power but I'm basically sh*t outta luck on that score.

Long live democracy eh....

We need PR desperately.

I'm quite looking forward to a summer of rage, arn't you?

Aye, should be interesting.

With train fares from Nottingham to London being so cheap it might be worth popping down for May Day this year.

It makes no difference which mainstream party you vote for, because they are effectively one.

This is democracy at work. The parties have converged on what we want, because that's what'll make them electable. So we as voters need to get a clue.

Education is the key.

[i]The parties have converged on what we want[/i]
Or it's a case of regression to mean, and what we want is invariably to the left or right of what they offer.

Or it's a case of regression to mean, and what we want is invariably to the left or right of what they offer.

Quite possibly, yes. That's really why we need PR. A wider variety of politicians in the house would surely open up debate?

The theory of PR is great, but in practice it leads to coalitions that spend all day bickering and no time actually doing anything useful. While the UK version of democracy has a fair chunk of autocracy built into it, it does allow for things to get done.

As for who to vote in next, Labour and the Tories seem to be stuck in their never ending loop of repetition and its getting very boring indeed. Why not vote Lib Dem? They have some interesting policies, they're quite open and honest about how they're going to pay for things and I honestly can't believe that they'll be any worse than the rest.

I agree with what Molgrips says, before I read that, I was just about to post that the problem is us, the people. We don't know what we want apart from more for nothing. To me there seem to be two general outlooks that are quite contradictory. 1)No one seems to give a monkey's about anyone else anymore, and 2) there is an emphasis on the state/government being responsible for all society's ills and this means that no one wants to take ultimate, especially financial responsiblity for themselves and their families anymore.

Ok, that's a very simplistic analysis of societal change that has occurred over decades, but the attitude shift to these mutually opposed viewpoints has ended up with the 'I want everything for nothing and see them next door, they don't deserve anything'.

Regardless of what you think of their policies or whether or not they'll win, a big increase in the Lib Dem share of the vote would hopefully be a pretty strong signal to the others.

I'll be voting for the Lib Dems at the next election, because their candidate here is the best candidate.

This is democracy at work. The parties have converged on what we want, because that's what'll make them electable. So we as voters need to get a clue.

I think it's more a case of the two parties converging on what the constituents of the marginals want.
If we ever want a govt that governs for the people then we need PR. Until then, it's just a case of picking whichever you consider to be the lesser of two evils.

[i]p!ssing the 3G licence money up the wall[/i]

The £22.5bn raised actually went straight to pay off the National Debt.

Carry on.

The £22.5bn raised actually went straight to pay off the National Debt.

Aye I've seen that trick before, pay off the credit card then hammer it again the next month.

No more 3G licences to sell off now though, and no gold stashed away for a rainy day and my god, its belting it down now and oh my, look how the price of gold has climbed.

[img] [/img]

nulabour have just followed on with the same old torry policies

if you disagree with how gordon has run things, especially the financial side then voting torry would the worst thing you could do

oh and one of my biggest regerets is not joining in the anti-iraq war demo

if it kicks off this summer i may just pop down and burn some effigies of cameron and blair coz they both repulse me

[i]No more 3G licences to sell off now though, and no gold stashed away for a rainy day and my god, its belting it down now and oh my, look how the price of gold has climbed[/i]

Now don't take this for a moment as a defence of Brown's botched Gold sell off, but gold's only of worth if you're selling it, and now would be a good time to sell some as it's worth loads. But it's worth loads because people currently don't trust something as intagible as money and prefer to place there faith in gold. Of course as soon as people trust money again then they sell the gold and it drops in price and having gold seems daft. I think i'm loosing the thread of what i'm trying to say, but it's something along the lines of it's rarely a good time to either buy sell or own gold, but sometimes it feels like it is. Or something like that anyway 🙂
Anyway the 2bn squandered on that cock-up barely covers the cost of banker's packed lunch 🙂

it's rarely a good time to either buy sell or own gold, but sometimes it feels like it is.

nulabour have just followed on with the same old torry policies

Sootyandjim
We have all realised where your politics lie perhaps you and Flash could just e-mail each other and moan?

Junkyard - You've worked out who I vote for based on a few garnered snippets on an internet forum? My you must be one of the great sleuths.

Actually, whilst I see eye-to-eye with CFH on a few points they are very few. I'd suggest we have differing views over more than we agree on.

Ah I see what has confused you though. I'm sure in your little mind any criticism of the current version of the Labour party must mean I'm some love-child of Thatcher and in no way could I actually have more socialist leanings than the good Captain.

Isn't it easy, this black and white politics thing?

Oh and BTW, do the 'we' mind you speaking for them or is it the royal we you refer to?

'Sorry, you've lost me. Do the Tories have policies ?'

Yes they do, their own insurance policies.