So you were speeding on the way out? 🙂
Probably a little at times, I set the limiter to 80mph on the way there - indicated speed too. but the max range mode sets the limit to 70mph, so 10mph difference in max speed, but only a 7mph difference in avg speed cannot result in a 48% increase (2.3mpkwh to 3.4mpkwh) in efficiency - surely?
Did you precondition it?
No, no precondition at all today.
The trip out was at 12c, the trip back was at 15.8c, so approx 4c warmer on way back.
I would expect the limiter also works on indicated speed for the same reasons the speedo under-reads in the first place, so that's 14% more airspeed on a still day, which is 30% more air resistance. According to the Met Office it's currently 10-20mph westerlies in NE Wales Assuming that it was less windy in the morning, given that you say it was more typical in the morning, you're looking at effective airspeed of around 55mph on the way home which is around 45% slower than your 80mph trip out. If my maths is right that's just over half the air resistance on the return leg. Of course air resistance isn't the only factor, but the numbers are plausible and give support to the theory that it could have been a combination of your lower speed and a tailwind.
Headwind and 80 will destroy your economy in an EV. Add in an uphill finish and that’s the final nail in the coffin. Uphill/downhill makes a much bigger difference in an EV due to regen.
Avg was 54mph on the way there, and 48mph on the way back
Yes, that'll be a large part of it. Wind resistance is proportional to the square of speed.
80mph is 14% faster than 70mph, but when taking the square into account it's 31% more wind resistance.
Add on a 5 mph average headwind one way / tailwind the other and that's 85mph vs 65mph effective airspeed, which is 31% difference, but the squares are an extra 71%. So - yes, the speed difference and headwind CAN make the level of difference you're seeing.
I was also quite shocked by this at first - I thought something was broken on my car some days, until I realised the above.
All of which is great as it means you get a better understanding of how the car reacts and means you can choose when to just boot it and when to dawdle depending on charging needs, plus if on a normal drive you have an in-build range extension feature which really helps with range anxiety.
Warner weather helping noticeably on the range now. Just over 100 miles today in my i4, with a mix of city, motorway and dual carriageway and it averaged 3.7m/kWh. The same a month ago would have been 3.2. On the motorway I tend to set the cruise at 67, rather than the 72 i used to set in previous diesel car. I find that 5mph difference makes quite an impact, tying in with the above.
All a bit academic when 100 miles costs about £2 of electricity on IO 🤪
We're now on 4.8 in the Ioniq 🙂
What would be considered either good or bad in terms of kWh? Interested to hear some real world feedback.
5 is very good currently, some prototype/testbed merc has managed 8.something
What would be considered either good or bad in terms of kWh?
3.5 is decent for a large-ish SUV, but it's not good efficiency in general in the same way that 40mpg is not. Over 4.0 is good, generally the best smaller cars will get 4.0-4.3 or so. The Ioniq Electric is exceptional, we averaged 4.7 over 2 years and we can get over 5 on an A road trip without any special behaviour. It can return 4.7 on a motorway trip at 70mph. It's possibly the most efficient general production car ever made in terms of CO2 I reckon.
However that highlights how remarkable the Mercedes EQXX prototype is. It's a real road-going car, but it's not on sale yet. It easily gets 7.5, and it's a good sized four door coupe, fast and comfortable.
I’m pretty much besting at 2.8miles/kWh in the Polestar… eek!!!
Whatevs..!
DrP
We've currently got two budget tyres on the front, which knocks the efficiency down a bit, I reckon 5%.
That seems odd to me, since your car always uses a certain amount of power to accelerate a certain amount. To see savings like that from limiting acceleration you’d have to have been accelerating wildly all over the place, like smashing it along a windy road, or weaving in and out of traffic at high speed on a motorway I reckon.
I suspect that when used at their peaks, the battery/motor give off more heat per kw output, which is wasted. Certainly when you watch videos of folks doing 1/4 mile runs in a tesla plaid or similar, they seem to rinse the battery fairly hard despite not actually moving the car very far.
Its a bit more likely though that the lack of acceleration simply calms the overall driving of someone, making their average speed, braking inputs etc less, thus improving efficiency?
I suspect that when used at their peaks, the battery/motor give off more heat per kw output, which is wasted.
That's true, but you aren't accelerating hard for long, are you? That's why I said that this probably isn't a factor unless you are driving hard on a windy road which is where you would see the most acceleration.
Its a bit more likely though that the lack of acceleration simply calms the overall driving of someone, making their average speed, braking inputs etc less, thus improving efficiency?
Whilst some people may be unable to control their subconscious boy racer impulses without electronic assistance, I don't find this a particularly plausible hypothesis... Personally, I drive as fast or as slow as I want to drive at any given time, I don't simply leave my foot in the same position and see what transpires 🙂 However, I am only speculating.
I seem to get a reasonable improvement in range in 'eco' mode. You can also feel a slight change in the way the car drives, so I think it certainly changes the way the suspension / compressor is working, perhaps shuts down a motor ?? and some of the other gubbins.
I've been looking at servicing from Hyundai. The services are pretty cheap for a main dealer- £64 for a small one and £150 for a major one - although you might think this is a lot for basically nothing, but the 80k/8 year service is £535! Turns out that it's a coolant flush, which is a long procedure driven by the official Hyundai computer, and it needs 13 litres of special low-conductivity coolant.
Oh well.. still works out cheap overall though. I found this out when pricing up the Hyundai service plan which lets you pay for the next 4 years of services with a monthly payment. The total of the monthly payments comes to more than the total for all the individual services and MOTs though...
I believe that coolant flush service is due at 40k for the ioniq 5.....grrrrr
I don't follow much of what's happening with electric cars at the moment, but e-mail offer arrived with me from the folks I bought my van from 7 years ago. Guessing it must be old tech and/or due for replacement soon to warrant a 40+% discount?
£17.5k for a new Nissan Leaf 110kW N-Connecta 39kWh (£13k off), 2-3 week delivery
Yes that's what's happening. I think they've already stopped making them, this is old stock. You're still better off with a more modern car though even if you buy used, I reckon.
I’m pretty much besting at 2.8miles/kWh in the Polestar… eek!!!
“Long term” (since beginning Dec ‘23) in mine has been 3.3miles/kWh, mostly long distance motorway driving. Recent motorway trips have been nudging 3.5. I reckon it’ll hit 4 in the summer.
'classic' Ioniq coolant flush is also due at 40k! But... may have had this done already as part of the coolant recall that was out early last year. I was very pleased that the recall came at just before 40k miles completed.
The regular servicing is a bit of a joke though, but needed to maintain warranty. The standard service seems to be an expensive wash and someone walks around the car and tells me my tyre tread depths.
The Ioniq Electric is exceptional, we averaged 4.7 over 2 years and we can get over 5 on an A road trip without any special behaviour. It can return 4.7 on a motorway trip at 70mph. It’s possibly the most efficient general production car ever made in terms of CO2 I reckon.
The finance on ours is up in a few months time so I've been looking what we could replace it with, but I can't really see anything newer that is worth the price increase so I'm tempted to keep it. If only it charged faster and was better at carrying bikes, but in pretty much every other way it ticks boxes that other cars don't without costing an awful lot more...
Following my comment on the last page about seeing a Fisker Ocean on the road & the fact that multiple reviews for it didn't paint it in the best light, I saw this the other day.
Not great news, as there seems to be some nice touches on their cars & I think they were competitively priced
https://techcrunch.com/2024/03/18/fisker-production-pause-going-concern-cash-raise/
3.2kW/mile averaged since July ‘23 (ioniq5) Though average was over 4 over summer and is now starting to creep up again now that temps are in double figures. As others have said, cost wise… meh… but the biggest impact is range for longer single trips.
The standard service seems to be an expensive wash
In our case it was £5 of someone's time and £70 worth of air 'freshener' dumped all over the car.
Just seen this deal on a top-of-the-range Lexus Rz. It even has a dimmable panoramic sunroof! I think it is a great looking car.
https://centralukvehicleleasing.co.uk/car-leasing/lexus/rz/101086/450e-230kw-takumi-714-kwh-5dr-auto
Oh that Lexus looks terrible. Well - not bad, especially, but not special. Looks like it should be a Mazda not a prestige manufacturer.
On the subject of subjectivity, most of us on here hate the Ioniq 6, along with most of my workmates; but today my neighbour (who is into cars) said "I saw one of those Ioniq 6s the other day, looked amazing!"
Oh great, more clickbait videos from anti-EV YouTubers 😀
You want “connected” cars that you can control with an app and that can perform software updates without you having to take them back to the dealer? That means the manufacturer can control them too. Got nothing to do with whether they are EVs or not.
My Enyaq iv arrives on Tuesday - am I needing the Skoda app to make it all work? If so, which Skoda app as there appears to be 2 or 3 (and they all get terrible reviews)...
Got Zap-map, but needing to actually look at it properly as I still haven't gotten round to working how to to charge the car...do I need to join a card scheme to get cheaper charging rates or is it just a case of looking around for the cheapest charge rate near me (central Scotland)?
Aware I've had this on order for over a year, but just realised I've not paid it any real attention until now...so needing to do some research over the weekend! Ordered it knowing it was going to be ages before it arrived and then forgotten about doing any of the finding out bits...idiot!
do I need to join a card scheme to get cheaper charging rates
Only if you're using public charging a lot. Otherwise it's not worth it, just beep your debit card and plug in. Do you not have a home charger?
do I need to join a card scheme to get cheaper charging rates or is it just a case of looking around for the cheapest charge rate near me (central Scotland)?
I joined ChargePlace Scotland last summer when I got my EV. I haven't used it yet, with the only public charging so far having been on the rapid Tesla ones on the A1 near Bamburgh.
Oh great, more clickbait videos from anti-EV YouTubers
Not YouTube, an actual [big] newspaper that goes on to point out that the Chinese authorities have already banned Tesla's from certain sensitive areas for exactly the same reason.
Do non-electric cars have such embedded software?
Do non-electric cars have such embedded software?
Yes. Mercedes had remote control options in 2015 ish I think.
Do non-electric cars have such embedded software
Depending on the car - yes
<quote>
Do non-electric cars have such embedded software?
</quote>
yep, not all obviously , but the ones that have an app that you can use to view the status of the car, lock/unlock it etc could all feasibly be disabled remotely if desired and designed with that intent in mind.
Its not limited to cars, Its just the (potential) nature of any internet connected device,not just cars, if the vendor wants to , they can remotely break it/disable it/limit it.
Didn't Cipher in "the Fate of the Furious" take control of loads of ICE cars and drive them all off a car park. this was in 2017 too... Makes you think eh...
DrP
sharkbait
Interesting….. Hiding thought of that…
China could potentially gridlock UK roads
Someone has written an article using the plot of a recent Netflix movie there
No option for a home charger as car is parked on the road...I'm hoping I can grab a space at work as the charging is either free or very cheap, so if that works, I don't need to worry too much about the public charging, but would be good to make sure I'm not a complete luddite when I come to use it first time round. Aware I should have been doing this much sooner than 4 days before the kit arrives!
I'll avoid the Skoda app as I suspect it is an extra rather than a requirement...will now spend some time trying to work out how Zap-map works...
Next daft question - for my thick maths in my head...the Enyaq is a 62Kwh DC120kW battery - is that the capacity of the battery - and is is 62 or 120? I'm guessing one of those numbers is the battery capacity so it I was to charge from absolute zero in the battery, then the per Kw charge would be whatever that is times the amount of the battery capacity - yes? Is it as simple as that? (I'm absolutely convinced I ordered this whilst hypo as I appear to have ticked some options and now wondering what I've picked and why!!! Looking forward to it but now thinking it wasn't properly thought out!)
62 kWh is the capacity of the battery, like gallons or litres.
120 kW is the max DC charging rate. i.e If the battery charged at 62 kW it would take an hour to charge.
Bear in mind that the 120kw speed is just a peak on a charging curve. It will not charge at that rate the whole time it’s plugged in. The Fastned website will show the charging curve for your car.
No option for a home charger as car is parked on the road
Don't give up just yet. Some councils are making it easy for you to run a cable across the pavement. I think you always need a permit from the council - some are handing the permits out to EV owners automatically, I think. Give them a ring. What council are you in?
The apps from Skoda are probably there to allow you to start warming or cooling the car remotely, or lock it - which is dead handy.
the Enyaq is a 62Kwh DC120kW battery
Science lesson: kW is kilowatts which is power, like horsepower. It means how fast your car can accelerate. kWh is kilowatt-hours, which is a quantity of energy so 120kWh is the amount of energy you'd get through using 120kW for an hour, or 60kW for two hours etc. In theory, you could recharge your car at its max of 135kW and get the battery filled in half an hour - in practice this isn't the case as some is lost and they slow down as they start to pass 50 or 60% full.
This is how the 60kwh car from 2022 charges, but I think the new model is a bit different.
You want to look for the 10-80% charge time, which is often quoted. Seems to be 35 mins for your car.
62kWh is the 'fuel tank size'.
So to fully charge at, say, 10p per kWh, it'll be £6.20...
DC 120 is probably the max charging speed.
DrP
Thanks very much for this info - both @perchypanther and @molgrips...so my thinking wasn't that far off and it means as long as I'm not running it flat, then I should be about £20 to charge up (depending on how much charge and cost per kW) - that was what I was thinking it would be around and it appears I'm not too far off that.
Cost of public charging varies wildly.
anywhere from Free to 80p per kWh
So it might cost you pennies or it might be up to £50
But yeah at normal domestic tariffs about £20
@DickBarton one watch out, some charge place scotland sites are ac charging only, so slower to charge. AC uses the onboard car charger, 11kw for your car, so if you use a 22kw AC charger it will only charge at 11kw speed. This is one reason most home chargers are 7kw as they use AC. The 120kw rate for your car is the fasted DC charge it can take.
Public charging is sodding expensive. Expect to pay 50p per kWh for a 7kW AC charge (which will take you many hours) and around 80p for rapid 150kW charging. Compare this to 7.5p for home charging if you get a cheap EV tariff.
