[Closed] The awful, shocking, terrible, horrible realisation...

But do tell us more about this, you seem well informed.

That's not likely to happen, seeing as he was banned for being Fred earlier today.

It can't be Burnley, he states it has a perfectly integrated British Asian community...

@ Cougar- that was Jambalaya's quote, not Quartzfred's.

Bury

Its elementary my dear Watsons

@ Cougar- that was Jambalaya's quote, not Quartzfred's.

Ah yes. As you were.

Can't be Bury either...

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

Of course not, I just want it spelled out, it all sounds a bit 'isn't it obvious?!'

Junkyard,i actually know the people who were racially abused and pelted with stones by Asians.I helped them move house when they had had enough of the area.

So is that an immigration issue?

It is Burnley I believe, or somewhere near there.

molgrips - my school, which was almost exclusively white, was pretty racist. We had to have a special assembly when a black kid came to our school to warn us not be racist towards him. I'd be surprised if a school with the opposite ethnic mix didn't have some of the same issues in reverse. Plus the issues Junkyard mentioned.

I'd be surprised if a school with the opposite ethnic mix didn't have some of the same issues in reverse.

Hmm, seems unlikely to me.

Molly. whilst the forum needs folk who question you have taken this to extremes here IMHO

I'm sorry that the facts are unpalateable for you and that you readily dismiss as "pub talk" opinions and experiences from other contributors of this forum.

I explained why i thought what I though and IMHO there is little mileage to be gained by us repeating this unless you can offer some proof that they were racially abused by Asians to the point they were driven from their home for a loss or you can prove house prices drop because asians buy homes. I doubt this happens but if it does could you show how it is their fault rather than racist white folks fault for not wanting to live there. If you cannot prove any of this shall we leave it there then? without getting personal?

offer some proof that they were racially abused by Asians

It's them immigrant neo-nazis, innit.

Here's one shortly after arriving at Heathrow :

[img] [/img]

I'd be surprised if a school with the opposite ethnic mix didn't have some of the same issues in reverse.
Hmm, seems unlikely to me.

Why?

Molgrips, it can and does happen.

When I arrived in multi-cultural Brum aged ten, I was not Asian enough for some of the Indians and ****stanis, nor English enough for some of the whites. I couldn't bloody win. I also was attacked for somehow upsetting some of the Asian children - attacked by some of the white children. Even better some of the white children were at most second generation immigrants...

Also I was lambasted for being both a toff and a Cockney. You couldn't make it up!

There was no racism at my 99% white school- all the non-white pupils were either Razaks or Nazirs and they were all either massive or mental. I think this is a good model.

I experienced zero racism in my previous 99.9% white populated school in Surrey. I was simply accepted as me...

I experienced zero racism in my previous 99.9% white populated school in Surrey. I was simply accepted as me...

They probably had the special assembly too. 😛 Good to hear though.

I went back to my home town at Christmas several years after leaving and was briefly having a drink with some old school acquaintances when one of them actually started telling me how Hitler wasn't such a bad guy and he was just trying to do what was right for his country at the time, blah blah blah. 😯

I can't quite believe that wrecker knew nothing about Idi Amin and the expulsion of the Ugandan Asian population! That's very recent British history, I've even seen it mentioned on TV within the last couple of months or so.
Is our education system [i]that[/i] fubared, or is talking about such aspects of our history frowned on for getting too close to the 'immigration' question?
And I've realised my understanding of 'shibboleth' is wrong, I always thought it meant;

[b]shibboleth[/b]
a manner of speaking that is distinctive of a particular group of people,
motto, slogan, catchword, shibboleth
a favorite saying of a sect or political group

I did a phone interview with a chap from Bangalore for a computer programmer job. He was bright, enthusiastic, easy to talk to and knew his stuff. Chances are quite good we'll hire him and bring him over to the UK. Is this wrong? Will Rusty's friend be cross with me?

...made-up stories from the tabloids or chinese whispers heard down the pub.

Racist.

😉

On the house selling issue, sad to report, there are people who will be swayed by their preconceptions. When my parents sold their house to a brown-skinned family, in a leafy suburb of Cramond (itself a posh-ish suburb of Edinburgh), our next door neighbours came round and berated my mother for bringing down the tone of the neighbourhood!

My mum is half Chinese 😀

Racist.

🙂

I just Wikipedia'd it - never knew it's an expression that 'contains an implied racist stereotype'. You learn something (is racist) every day. 😛

For a dissertation I followed up work regarding different types of prejudice within different cultures and supported the findings of the parent research - although to lower statistical significance (c95%). Let no-one tell you that all groups cannot be prejudiced... I was able to: -
- identify that a proportionately larger population is more likely to be more sophisticated in it's articulation of prejudice towards other groups
- the more recent the large-scale immigration of individuals from a particular culture had occurred, the more likely that they are to be prejudiced in their attitudes towards other cultures
- in terms or articulation in prejudice of higher or lower sophistication, broadly individuals from Afro-Carribean cultures were least likely to display attitudes of prejudice, then individuals from white-European cultures and finally individuals from cultures originating on the Indian sub-continent

Obviously, there were significant caveats on my research but still...

It can't be Burnley, he states it has a perfectly integrated British Asian community...

Correct, I'm afraid. Burnley has a very polarised population of embittered white working class and resentful Asians. Asian gangs control parts of Burnley and on two occasions I've experienced them in action intimidating white people who happen to have strayed into their area.

Thirty years of travel to Africa and sub-continental Asia has shown me that there's no love lost between the two races. This has got me wondering how moderate Asian Muslims must be feeling about last week's murder in Woolwich where a huge muscular testosterone-fuelled African, a former devout Catholic who had "converted" to Islam, slaughtered somebody in the most public and casual way possible in the name of their religion. No wonder they rushed to disassociate themselves from him.

jamj1974 - I was also attacked at school fairly regularly, despite everyone including me being white.

Kids always fight in schools. If it's not race it's something else, isnt' it? So is it really an immigration or race issue?

Are there any studies into incidence of violence in schools compared to ethnic diversity, adjusted for socio-economic factors? If not, there should be.

There was no racism at my 99% white school

Why am I NOT surprised by ^that^ lil snippet...

And the OP becomes null and void by associating 'Northern ex-mill town' and 'perfectly integrated British Asian community'.

If you think this is true then you need to remove your head from up your arse.

Ignorance is indeed alive and well.

Kids always fight in schools. If it's not race it's something else, isnt' it? So is it really an immigration or race issue?

FFS molgrips - racism has nothing to do with race? Ok then. 😕

There was no racism at my 99% white school

Why am I NOT surprised by ^that^ lil snippet...

I don't understand what point you're trying to make.

A lot of the bullying attempted on me from 10 onwards was outwardly racially motivated, even when I moved to secondary school which was in a more affluent area... Fortunately for me and unfortunately for bullies, I had a short fuse and didn't mind confrontation... Not proud if my responses, but I did keep myself safe and sound.

Kids always fight in schools. If it's not race it's something else, isnt' it? So is it really an immigration or race issue?
Are there any studies into incidence of violence in schools compared to ethnic diversity, adjusted for socio-economic factors? If not, there should be.

Sometimes it might be a race or assimilation issue, other times it is just about difference...

Interestingly though, most people at first introduction think I am white, many think I am of Mediterranean extraction...

CountZero - Member
And I've realised my understanding of 'shibboleth' is wrong, I always thought it meant;

Your understanding of the word was so well established that you felt the need to google its meaning! 🙄

Much like everything else you post, like your last entry which scoffed at others' lack of understanding of a situation which you no doubt also googled.

Have you ever seen that episode of The Office where David Brent keeps nipping off to google Dostoevsky quotes? That's EXACTLY how you come across.

I can't quite believe that wrecker knew nothing about Idi Amin and the expulsion of the Ugandan Asian population! That's very recent British history, I've even seen it mentioned on TV within the last couple of months or so.
Is our education system that fubared, or is talking about such aspects of our history frowned on for getting too close to the 'immigration' question?

There is an quite a lot of history about you know. What would you suggest dropping to include the module on post-colonial politics? Would this be at key stage two or three?

Let no-one tell you that all groups cannot be prejudiced

If you think this is true then you need to remove your head from up your arse.

Ignorance is indeed alive and well.

That's EXACTLY how you come across.

"Shibboleth - Member
It'll be an absolute disgrace if it is closed MT... Nobody has expressed a remotely racist - or even bigoted - view so far."

You are allowed to express that view but not everyone will agree.

I can't quite believe that wrecker knew nothing about Idi Amin and the expulsion of the Ugandan Asian population! That's very recent British history, I've even seen it mentioned on TV within the last couple of months or so.

Is our education system that fubared, or is talking about such aspects of our history frowned on

FFS molgrips - racism has nothing to do with race?

What I'm saying is that race is sometimes just an excuse for finding differences over which to fight, especially with kids. If it's not race it's something else.

Racism is about pre-judging people based on race. Subtle difference imo.

Given that we (apparently) live in a country riddled with "institutionalised racism" that affects major parts of our wider, establishment, can anyone suggest countries where this is absent, so that we can use them as a case study to look up to? I can't think of one off the top of my head!

Isn't the sad fact that people, simply discriminate against those who are different. Difference can be race, sex, nationality, hair colour, religion, sporting ability, looks, accent, wearing glasses, riding 29ers etc...(in other words, mol has a point). IMO, society in the UK is no different in this respect other that I believe we are more open at standing up to hostility and discrimination with legal sanctions for those that don't get it. We should be pretty thankful for that.

(Ernie, surely that T shirt is the alternative use of the swatsika found in Indian culture today?)

I didn't know much about the Uganda thing from school either - we were busy learning that everything is the fault of the English. 😆

Seriously though, I didn't until I met one of the displaced in my first job here. His story was horrible. Had I not met him, it may well have been until the film [i]The Last King Of Scotland [/i] that I'd have known. By all means, use it to have a go at someone, but it's weak to do so.

Isn't the sad fact that people, simply discriminate against those who are different. Difference can be race, sex, nationality, hair colour, religion, sporting ability, looks, accent, wearing glasses, riding 29ers etc

A few of those are relatively trivial (in terms of this discussion). A few are quite serious.

mt - Member
You are allowed to express that view but not everyone will agree.

I stand by my view MT. If you try to understand that an opinion diametrically opposed to your own does NOT equal bigotry, you might be inclined to agree.

I find that on the whole, people's misunderstanding of what constitutes racism and bigotry - and their eagerness to accuse others of those things - causes as many problems as actual racism and bigotry.

deadlydarcy - Member

Seriously though, I didn't until I met one of the displaced in my first job here. His story was horrible. Had I not met him, it may well have been until the film The Last King Of Scotland that I'd have known. By all means, use it to have a go at someone, but it's weak to do so.

Very well put Darcy...

Isn't the sad fact that people, simply discriminate against those who are different.

It is possibly correct that those who discriminate may just pick something different but who knows- perhaps the EDL would go back to hating folk based on the football team they support or perhaps that would just be the founder reverting back to type?

As for us being brilliant I would be careful about that on the day when the EU charges us with discriminating against EU members over benefits Do you think tolerant UK will back down to this?
Also worth noting the rise of the right wing UKIP who are pretty much the embodiment of xenophobia

yes we think we are tolerant and we are brilliant but I am less sure it is true ...probably better to ask an immigrant or someone gay for example than hear the opinion of some white middle class types with polite tolerant views.. I assume neither of us hang out with bigots or racists.
We still dont have an openly gay football player for some reason.

I find that on the whole, people's misunderstanding of what constitutes racism and bigotry - and their eagerness to accuse others of those things - causes as many problems as actual racism and bigotry.

Yeah right, falsely accusing someone of racism or bigotry as much of a problem as being the victim of racism or bigotry

*rolls eyes*

I find that on the whole, people's misunderstanding of what constitutes racism and bigotry - and their eagerness to accuse others of those things - causes as many problems as actual racism and bigotry.

TBH I find the problem is people making up totally false stories, that portray the Asian community in a negative light, with no basis in reality. The sense of righteous indignation they have when they get uppity about perfectly accurate labels is rather amusing.

Yeah right, falsely accusing someone of racism or bigotry as much of a problem as being the victim of racism or bigotry

Ernie, a gang of predatory Asian paedophiles had been targeting young white girls in Blackpool for years. Whenever the Police became involved, these people played the race card and accused them of discriminating against them on the basis that they were institutionally racist.

2 girls disappeared - presumed murdered - and yet a report written in 2003 was kept under wraps for fear that its authors would be branded racist. It's only in light of similar problems in other towns that it has become clear that this sort of thing is endemic, and the report has surfaced.

I'm afraid the only link I can find is on the [url= http://www.****/news/article-1374443/Police-hid-abuse-60-girls-Asian-takeaway-workers-linked-Charlene-Downes-murder.html ]Daily Mail Website[/url] - I'm sure many will decide that this alone renders it inadmissible to this discussion - but the local press websites aren't much use.

So yes, accusations of racism by these people meant they were pretty much free to carry on their abuse unchecked, resulting in the murder of at least one other girl.

You still wanna roll your eyes at me? 🙄

Whenever the Police became involved, these people played the race card and accused them of discriminating against them on the basis that they were institutionally racist.

If you've got issues with how the police in Blackpool conducted their investigations then that is a completely separate matter.

And whether you agree or not, it is a fact established by a public inquiry, and accepted by both the government [i]and[/i] the police, that institutional racism has seriously affected the police in the UK.

2 girls disappeared - presumed murdered - and yet a report written in 2003 was kept under wraps for fear that its authors would be branded racist.

Well that's absolutely pathetic/shameful - but I fail to see how that's the fault of anyone but the police. It's no-one else's fault that they were too spineless to do their jobs properly.

If they had good evidence of what these people were doing, saying 'yeah but the police force is racist' wouldn't make for a very convincing defence.

probably better to ask an immigrant

The numbers of immigrants would hint at an answer. Anecdotally, the UK seems to have a good rep overseas.

Your evidence undermines the majority of your claims

Children as young as 11 were targeted by [b]mainly [/b]Asian staff

There were claims last night that the report was suppressed for reasons of political correctness.

ndeed, a former senior detective at Lancashire Police yesterday blamed political correctness for its failure to highlight its 2003 findings in Blackpool.
But the force denied this, saying the report had been available online since 2007 but had never been intended for publication.

Senior officers insisted an intensive programme to break the cycle of exploitation had been a success and that in the last six months 50 of 54 grooming suspects were white.

If you've got issues with how the police in Blackpool conducted their investigations then that is a completely separate matter.

No it isn't! It's EXACTLY the matter I was referring to! You can say the Police were at fault, but certainly since the Macpherson report which Grum mentions, Police are terrified of being branded racist. That isn't the fault of the Police, and it's unfair to brand them "spineless" - the Police Service isn't there for the purposes of 'derring do'!

Society is at fault, for perpetuating an atmosphere where it is deemed racist to acknowledge that birds of a feather often flock together, and that racial trends, whether criminal or cultural, are an intrinsic part of this multi-cultural society that we've created and it would be folly to ignore them, even worse to deny them.