[Closed] 'That eating plan!!!'

I did the "he who must not be named" diet for about a year and am now living pretty much 100% paleo/bulletproof

This suits me well, although I would like to be leaner, it just doesn't seem to be happening and I am stuck at about 15% body fat.

Of course it [i]could[/i] be argued that approx 15% BF is optimal (enough to have seen our ancestors through lean times, etc) - which is why a lot of people get "stuck" there - and that fighting this natural inclination is totally against the primal ideal.

That's about the lower limit of the iDiet for most people. As zilog says going lower may require forcing your body to do something it doens't really want to do - difficult to sustain and may not be good for you.

had 6 months on it and lost 1.5 stone. Since Aug my back has been playing up (nice spinal inflammation) and no surprise the combination of being more sedentary, feeling crap and thus eating more crap has put on best part of a stone.

going back on it next week now I've got some meds from doc and a plan of action to get the back working again. Hoping to shift 3/4 of a stone before xmas, when I'll put a bit back on again 🙂

I actually liked the food I was eating while on it, but feeling depressed about my back problems and not being able to exercise etc made me hit the crap food pretty hard.

I think there was a doc with various iDxxe friendly recipies in floating about which helped a lot

Ti pin man,
Is it [url= http://www.amazon.com/Racing-Weight-Lean-Peak-Performance/dp/1934030511 ]This one?[/url]

I've just cut out eating the shite, and monitored my intake, and dropped 6kg in the last 3 months. Now 78.5, i'd like to drop a little more for racing next season, so will look into that book!

How are people measuring their body fat?

We've got a set of fancy scales in the house, not sure how much i trust them though!

Could your back problems be related to your diet, Chomp. I've noted people in the tri club who adopt fad diets often end up injured and I don't think it's a coincidence.

just got back from a appointment with my cardiologist, the 1st thing he commented on, was how much weight i have lost.
he asked me how i had done it. i told him all about the idiet and what i was eating.
he said from what i was eating that i would be getting all i needed to maintain a healthy weight and lifestyle now.
i got weighed, and had my bp and cholesterol checked and everything was now ok.
praise for this eating plan from a cardiologist is all the encouragement i need to keep on doing it............ 8)

Great news!

Get in there not quite so big man. 😉

to me, weight loss will be down to cals in vs cals out. and each person has their own favourite way of getting there. mine is intermittent fasting. i prefer to go 16 hrs or so without food so that i can eat lovely big meals when i do. others prefer to nibble at a few smaller meals each day continuously. there are many ways to get he same results.
am i right in thinking that those on the idiet are still consuming less calories than 'maintenance', much the same as any diet?

im certainly not knocking it, it works! thats obvious, and congratulations to everyone thats seeing success. dont think i could eat those foods for ever tho, which is key to long lasting success.

am i right in thinking that those on the idiet are still consuming less calories than 'maintenance', much the same as any diet?

sadexpunk - Member
to me, weight loss will be down to cals in vs cals out.

It really isn't though!
As i, and a few others, have mentioned (back when there were several eating threads per day) a calorie is a thermodynamic unit relating to the amount of heat energy released (measured as the temperature increase in water) when something is burned to completion (ie ash).

Your body simply doesn't work that way.

Even taken that the calorie is a poor measure of food energy potential but using it as a convenient conversational description, "calories" eaten doesn't equal "calories" digested/absorbed then made available for energy production.
A whole endocrine/neurocrine network regulates the processes affecting how "calories" are used, and the efficiency of these processes depends on the availability of oxygen, vitmains/minerals and dietary co-factors as well as enzyme levels, biochemical status and physiological efficiency; all of which are affected by general health, eating patterns and physical training.

Until we consider ourselves at a level other than simple heat engines and move on from applying the principles of eighteenth century physics to the human body then there's little chance of really understanding how "we" function with respect to energy conversion, distribution and utilisation...........

I eat a healthy diet now as far as I am concerned. If you want to eat grains, that's up to you, I don't care!

I think my body is happy at 15% fat and that's more or less fine with me. I have decided to compete sailing next year so my weight is fine and I am lifting more weights now to get some strength and geneal conditioning.

The idave thing was the beginning of a journey for me and I am grateful to him for that. So much so that I don't feel too bad about the money that he apparently scammed from me.

My family and I have changed the way that we shop ( from the local farm now) cook (pretty much everything from scratch) and eat (more or less no sugar) for the better regardless of the diet doctrine tha you follow, that is a good thing..

As someone on here once stated, eat as much junk food as you like, just cook it all yourself!

oddjob - Member

The idave thing was the beginning of a journey for me...

I think that's the important point, I always thought of the "iDave diet" as a nudge in the general direction rather than a rigid list of eat and eat-nots 🙂

It works well as a strict diet if you are fat and needyo shed some weight. It only gets out far though and if you do some research, there is a lot of good advice out there ( assuming you ignore any advice to become a vegan)

oddjob - Member
It works well as a strict diet if you are fat........

I've often contemplated doing my own "supersize me" and putting on 10-15kg of fat just to see how well weight loss diets work but a bit too aware of the possible health risks to actually try it.

Just one of those "annoying" people who eat plenty but stay trim I guess, not having a sweet tooth helps mind you........

Okay, just an update everyone whom has emailed me so far should have a copy by now, if not let me know, cheers RJ

am i right in thinking that those on the idiet are still consuming less calories than 'maintenance', much the same as any diet?

Well not really. You can eat as much as you want on the iDiet, which is not the same as most diets. The principle is that WHAT you eat is more important than how much.

Just one of those "annoying" people who eat plenty but stay trim I guess, not having a sweet tooth helps mind you........

Seems to me that most people who can eat a lot and stay thin don't have a sweet tooth. I think that a 'sweet tooth' is a symptom of the particular metabolic profile that encourages people to gain weight.

Cheers RJ!!

My biggest problem is lack of routine, and a lack of lifestyle control. I'm a longhaul airline pilot, so have no set shift patterns or mealtimes, often miss nights out of bed, and sleep at strange times. I also suffer from a lack of willpower, especially in the middle of the night, flying back across the Atlantic!

IDave seems interesting. I like a list of Do's and Donts. I'll give it a go until Xmas and see how it goes. For the day off per week - is it really a completely free day, and a necessary part of the diet, or is it really just to keep you sane? Also, does it need to be the same day every week?

molgrips - Member
I think that a 'sweet tooth' is a symptom of the particular metabolic profile that encourages people to gain weight.

Yes, I think it's related to salivary amylase levels, (enzyme which breaks down starch to sugar in the mouth).

[b]Low salivary amylase and/or not chewing food[/b]
starches not broken down in mouth to sugar so you get less of a "sugar hit" from your food so still crave simple sugars. But, the unhydrolysed starch then gets converted to sugar in the gut (so has an insulin promoting effect), and as you've already eaten simple sugars for the "craving" you are in effect making your diet higher in sugar than you may think, insulin spikes; blah, blah, you know the rest....
[b]High salivary amylase and/or long chewing[/b]
More dietary starch is hydrolysed to sugar (ie glucose) in the mouth and absorbed directly via the oral epithelium giving an instant "sugar hit" body goes "aaaaah sugary goodness" but as you haven't had to eat anything inherently sweet to get the "hit" you never develop (or develop less) the psychosomatic link betweeen taste of sweetness and "sugar hit"

So in my view, low oral conversion of starch to glucose leads to developing a "sweet tooth" which may lead to insulin issues (ie spike/crash) - might even be a connection to breast vs bottle feeding as many milk formulae are higher GI than natural human milk (due to their composition rather than actual sugar content [i]per se[/i])

So kids fed on the teat who were taught to chew their food properly end up having less of a sweet tooth and fewer insulinaemic issues later in life ???

Increase in bottle fed babies and processed food fed infants together with the increase in "on the hoof" & "bite'n'swallow" eating amongst kids may be a major factor in the so-called "childhood obesity epidemic", so it's lifestyle as much as dietary content simply measured in calories and grammes that's important.......

simply_oli_y - yes thats the one. It deals with people like us who, mostly, arent looking to loose masses of weight but are looking to shed fat, not weight.

I would like to be leaner, but not necessarily lighter, partly for cycling and partly for climbing.

For the day off per week - is it really a completely free day, and a necessary part of the diet, or is it really just to keep you sane?

Yes, it's a vital part of the diet. Otherwise your metabolism adjusts to the new diet and reaches stasis ie you don't lose any weight.

Hilldodger - fascinating. Hadn't thought about that.

One might argue then in some cases for eating a small amount of simple sugars to promote satiety?

I noticed when strictly iDieting that I could eat tons and tons of compliant food and still feel ravenous - then one single biscuit or teaspoon of sugar in tea and I was fine. That small amount of sugar probably would not have much effect on insulin especially after a good meal of low GI food, but it would make one feel full and satisfied?

There might also be a role for low GI but sweet foods like chocolate, since they make me feel full but would have little effect on my insulin levels perhaps, after a meal.

I started doing it in May 2011 after creeping up to 12 1/2 stone - since august last year Ive been just under 10 1/2 stone and body fat around 8%.

Its now just how I eat - my biggest downfall is an amazingly sweet tooth so wednesday Ill have a flapjack and now I use the weekend as two days of eating what I want. Also without realising it two days a week Im kind of doing that fasting thing too as my calorific intake doesnt go over 1000 calories, so I guess that helps too along with commuting every day.

I cant actually imagine eating any other way now - I did 2 or 3 races this year with no carbs at all (water or high5 zero in the bottle) I can do 2 hours of hard (threshold) work on a turbo straight out of bed (climibng ventoux or racing bart bretjen on world cup courses!), Ive got a load more energy after reducing carbs, who's have though it!

am i right in thinking that those on the idiet are still consuming less calories than 'maintenance', much the same as any diet?

No. Hence the "sticking" at about 15% body fat, even though eating the same.

It works well as a strict diet if you are fat and needyo shed some weight.

If I eat whatever I like, I sit at a reasonably lean 70 to 75kg. Eating slow carb, I drop to a very lean 65 to 70kg.

I was doing well earlier in the year and shed c10kg nice and steadily without any real problems.

Then I went to see a doctor who told me I might have something grim, and I gave up my return to exercise and started mainlining junk food.

In the meantime, work has been very busy (60+ hours a week for c3 months) and Mrs North was seriously ill. None of this put me in the right place to pick it up again.

I put on nearly 15kg, so I'm heavier than when I started.

But..! I've recently found out I don't have the grim thing (as far as they can tell), so am free to exercise again (got back on the bike 4 weeks ago). Work has calmed down, so I can take time to eat better.

I'm ready to get right back into The Eating Plan That Dare Not Speak Its Name.

Bring it on.

Great! Now all you have to do is stick to it this time! The thing that worked for me was realising all the other massive health benefits that come with healthy eating [i]beyond[/i] the obvious fat-loss. Reading through a site like Marks Daily Apple will make you realise that losing weight is just a handy side effect! To be honest knowing now how what you eat affects your body/health, if I had bad news from the doc the last thing I would do is start eating junk food!! Obviously depends what the condition is, but all kinds of things can be helped by eating properly.

just sat reading this eating a huge portion of chickpea, chorizo, courgette, onion, tomato, celery, galic stew.
all guilt free......... 8)

emails still ignored, money still owed, not happy.

can't fault diet plan though.

humpff

The thing that worked for me was realising all the other massive health benefits that come with healthy eating beyond the obvious fat-loss.

That's why I do it, despite not needing to lose weight. My asthma's been loads better this year than previously.

SJ78.
Just write it off, I did.

HillDodger.
Good posts, thanks. You're a brave lad taking on the Cals in Vs Cals out crew. But I agree with you, FWIW.

Ton.
Thanks for the updates, glad you're enjoying as much of the benefits of being lighter, as you can. Long may you continue to do so.

🙂

EDIT:

Oh, and I still like Mr DeadlyDarcy's comment:
[i]Eat better, move around a bit[/i] or something along those there lines.

ourmaninthenorth - I've been in a similar position (however it turns out my back issues are grim, manageable but grim nonetheless. On the bright side though it's a fault of genes and not something I've done to it.

I've also been prescribed (along with some hefty NSAID's) lots of exercise, physio and yoga type stuff so I could end up healthier as a result of having a slightly ****ed up spine (at least that's the spin I'm putting on it anyway).

So far the this week has been good, and I've actually found getting back in the kitchen prepping/cooking meals etc to be quite therapeutic as the last couple of months dinner has usually consisted of getting something out of freezer and blasting it in the microwave.

It's also made the wife happier, as she gets to scoff the stuff I prepare rather than following my lead and nuking a packet meal.

so it's a lose/win/win kinda situation

Pea and ham soup this lunchtime.

chomp.... ankylosing spondylitis?

[i]Pea and ham soup this lunchtime.[/i]

Chicken and some green, pimento stuffed, olives. Here.

That's why I do it, despite not needing to lose weight. My asthma's been loads better this year than previously.

spot on Phil 🙂

as a fellow sufferer.... core work does wonders! the only time i get back pain now is when i push myself too hard at the gym or after a long day slumping at a desk.

dont want to end up like mum who's had half her back fused cos it was all crumbling away and disks slipping out all over the shop. my back, neck and sternum sound like one of those wooden fish you'd scrape a stick over in junior school music groups. last week i cracked my back and one bit popped so hard i blacked out and fell over 😯

And if you have crumbling discs, then look into what wheat is doing to you in general.
Robb Wolff and Dr William Davis may be able to talk you into giving the stuff up completely.

Not sure though if it's due to losing weight, or giving up wheat/dairy, or a bit of both.

My summer asthma trigger is pollen, so can't separate the weird summer weather from lack of wheat/dairy in my diet as yet. Time will tell.

Pea and ham soup this lunchtime.

I had meat and potato pie with chips and gravy, which is a [i]bit[/i] of a slow carb fail. Feel crappy and bloated now.

if I had bad news from the doc the last thing I would do is start eating junk food!! Obviously depends what the condition is, but all kinds of things can be helped by eating properly.

I was in a bad place as a result of what he suggested. I recognize that stress causes me to see out the serotonin hit of cheap sugars. But you're absolutely right - eating properly certainly helps and I'm in that place now.

I've also been prescribed (along with some hefty NSAID's) lots of exercise, physio and yoga type stuff so I could end up healthier as a result

Having been told that I can exercise again (though to avoid hardcore endurance stuff), I'm easing back in. Once, I used just to ride bikes. now I'm much more interested in all over conditioning, even if I don't develop the same levels of aerobic fitness I used to have.

Time to convert the garage into a gym..!

comfort eating is something I never thought I'd be doing, but I found a whole pack of choc digestives with a pint sized mug of tea works wonders for raising ones spirits 🙂

[i]I had meat and potato pie with chips and gravy, which is a bit of a slow carb fail[/i]

I had donner meat and chips last Sat eve. I then proceeded to rip the legs off the guys I cycle with, on Sundays. They caught me after my first attack. But after my second break I stayed away 8)

Just trying that eating plan first few days. Are butternut squash, carrot and parsnip in?

yes.

Sweet, butternut squash and swede made a tasty mash alternative for cottage pie 🙂

Sweet potato and sweetcorn are out tho.

butterbeans, swede and cauliflower mashed together to top a sheperds or cottage pie is ace too.
grill it to brown off..............nom nom nom!!