New cycling cafe opened up near me which is a good thing and I have started making it a regular stop on my route but they need to learn how to make an espresso - no crema, too watery. Do I make a fuss and explain what is wrong and offer some helpful hints (finer grind seems to be a quick fix)?
What would you do?
get a life 🙂
Yep, that
Ha! Trying to be a good natured citizen and help a fledgling business - they wont be getting my money unless it improves!
The thing that winds me up is that I personally like a lungo, nice and bitter and takes a couple more sips than an espresso, but getting a coffee shop to make one seems nigh on impossible!
Tell them if they don't know they won't change.
The worst "espresso" I ever had was made with scoop of nescafe and small amount of hot water. I never went back there.
I to am fed up of receiving watery black coffee passed off as espresso. No crema or viscosity. If it is served to me presented as the former, I refuse to pay, and order something else.
I suggest you do the same, it's not "making a fuss" it's about getting what you ordered.
I've had this in one of those soft-play centres. They marketed their "real coffee" and charged coffee shop prices, but it was always terrible. Like, hot water with grit in it.
During a chat with the owner I mentioned it. He became really defensive and showed me round his "really good" bean-to-cup coffee machine, complete with powdered milk 🙄
Oi mate your coffees crap! Sort it aahht..
Or words to that effect
Op - you can only try - as you say, they wont be getting your business if they dont sort it. who knows how many other folk do the british thing and grumble about in on t'interweb.
Maybe by letter?
Drink tea and stop being a coffee snob?
TripAdvisor sniping
my feeling is, if they're getting it so badly wrong you'll never get a good espresso from there.
My local "decent" bar will make me a ristretto, but if I'm somewhere else I just order a "café solo" and put up with hot brown water. Telling them how to make a ristretto is not going to work; too much is already wrong.
Molgrips wins. On proper paper with a letter head please, folded and sealed with wax.
my feeling is, if they're getting it so badly wrong you'll never get a good espresso from there.
^^ This. If you had to tell your garage what was wrong with your car and how to fix it, would you still go there?
Molgrips wins. On proper paper with a letter head please, folded and sealed with wax.
This but written with proper ink using a feather
If you don't like their reply, throw it in the woodburner.
🙂
bad espresso pet hate:
when your espresso is served in a charming little chunky cup, that hasn't been pre-heated, so your espresso is served cold.
shoes have been wee'd in for less.
I never realised how big a problem this was. Molgrips is on the right track but you need to grab their attention and let them know that you're not messing around. Spend the time cutting the letters out of magazines to stick to a plain piece of paper using a Pritt Stick. I suggest using rubber gloves to avoid leaving DNA behind plus it stops you getting sticky fingers.
Be blunt on what the issue is with their coffee making technique and give them a time scale to comply otherwise you'll be leaving a big brown log on their door step.
I get irritated being constantly asked if I want milk in my Americano. It wouldnt be an Americano if it had milk.
Suggestion box?
If they don't have one then suggest it 🙂
The line from Melbourne is serve bad coffee in the morning, gone by the afternoon.
I guess it's the British thing of not wanting to say anything. Generally taste it tell them it's crap and give them one more go. It does suppose you know what it should taste like....
Give up your job and either 1 work there or 2 start a new business training coffee makers.
Of course other customers might like it the way they make it so they might lose that business?!?!
It's more that most Brits don't know what a good espresso tastes like.
I am genuinely surprised when I get a good espresso in a coffee shop.
Sad fact is that most people don't care about the quality of their coffee (as shown on this thread). I doubt that they feel the same about their bike or their beer - they just don't know the difference yet.
I think coffee is where wine was 30+ years ago when everyone quite happily drank Blue Nun.
I used to work near a decent coffee shop, never a queue even in rush hour, 40m down the road costa would have a queue out the door and 10 people in to the street, even in winter. What can you do?
You could advise but I bet that they don't know anything could be better.
had this in quite a nice foodie pub we go to. Mentioned it to the staff who looked a bit blank. Wrote a balanced review on Tripadvisor whihc the boss got to see and got a nice thank you reply. They won't know unless you tell them!
TM
Pre Brexit are we allowed to drink coffee? Surely just tea only now as coffee is so French/Italian..... EUROPEAN!!!
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When I'm in Italy I quite like a morning cappuccino, but I don't like half a pint of warm milk with some nescafe in the bottom, so in the UK I ask for a macchiato (except in those places that only serve flavoured macchiato and won't sell it without the flavour) so I get a double espresso.
I don't take much interest in [i]crema[/i] TBH.
In the end the customer is right, suggest that you'd like it a bit stronger, and with crema and see what happens. If everyone else agrees then they'll either go out of business or change.
But, from observation most people whilst saying that they want strong crema finished coffee, then put half a gallon of lukewarm milk with vanilla syrup in it - they might as well drink Mellow Birds.
I'd definitely tell them. They're a bike shop first and foremost, the cafe is an add on, so its not their forte, as evidenced.
Tell them, it's not rocket science to make it half decent, I wouldn't be weighing grinds or be talking about TDS etc. but a tweak of the grinder isn't asking a lot.
Nothing winds me up more than the term "Fresh Coffee", fresh what? Freshly grown beans, freshly roasted, freshly ground, freshly brewed? It means nothing to say fresh coffee.
There is of course no guarantee that just because it isn't how you like it means it's not how it's meant to be .
Crema used to be great.
'It's frothy, man'.
Loved that bear.
At least they are not calling it an expresso 👿
Mackem - Member
I get irritated being constantly asked if I want milk in my Americano. It wouldnt be an Americano if it had milk.
I generally ask for a black coffee regardless of what the menu says (Americano is a stupid way to make a mug of black coffee...).
Then, around 60% of the time, I get asked if I would like milk in it.
There is of course no guarantee that just because it isn't how you like it means it's not how it's meant to be .
An espresso has some well defined properties. It's either well made or it isn't. If you brought a cake from the same cafe and it clearly wasn't cooked in the middle then you'd not claim it was as it was meant to be but just not how you like it!
expresso
Probably an accurate reflection of the time and attention taken in its perpetration 🙂
Rusty Spanner - MemberCrema used to be great.
'It's frothy, man'.
Loved that bear.
Err that was Cresta. Sorry.
I get irritated being constantly asked if I want milk in my Americano. It wouldnt be an Americano if it had milk.
I have a bit of milk in my Americano.
It's easier than saying 'a long coffee with a bit of cold milk please'.
If the option is there I'd rather have drip TBH.
Here's my coffee related rant
[rant]
A flat white is [u]not[/u] just a small latte!
Most places in the UK are now serving flat whites, nowhere seems able to get it right. In fact most places scold the milk regardless of what milky coffee they're making
[/rant]
"builders tea, no sugar".
Starbucks have drip coffee. They also dont' scald milk. Just sayin'
😉
Most cafe's ask if you want milk with your americano because most people do want milk with it.
Macken is totally right, but if most customers are ignorant then cafes just adapt to save service time rather than explaining the reasons it doesn't come with milk to every other customer all day long.
Do I make a fuss and explain what is wrong and offer some helpful hints
When you patronise a place you take it mean both ways, don't you?
when everyone quite happily drank Blue Nun.
I have never 'happily' drunk Blue Nun.
I would also like to go to the cafe where they tell the milk off.
I would also like to go to the cafe where they tell the milk off.
I've just been looking for a picture someone berating the milk machine, this particular cafe sounds quite heartless. 😛
As scalding takes milk to 80+ degrees, I'm a more than a little confused by this cold scalding malarkey. 😕
Unfortunately I realised the spelling error when it was too late to edit! My dad has been known to shout at his coffee machine though....
Has coffee replaced home HiFi as the bus-****ers' "Snobisme du jour"
Macken is totally right, but if most customers are ignorant then cafes just adapt to save service time rather than explaining the reasons it doesn't come with milk to every other customer all day long.
I agree, Macken is technically correct. An americano is a long espresso which I believe came about because of the Americans bastardising Italian coffee during WW2 (although I will happily, happily be proven wrong on this).
However, a lot of people like milk with their long coffee, me included. Catering for the masses as the customer is always right, even when they're obviously wrong.
A bit like Brexit...
does flat white = americano with milk?
Big changes in the last 10-15 years. 15 years ago most folks suffered instant in a bog standard cafe, you felt a bit posh if they had a filter machine with a vat of coffee that had stood on a hot plate for a couple of hours and you got super lucky if you found one that would do you a little cafetiere. There are now a growing number of us that know what we like and like what we know - must be a right pain for the bog standard cafe owner.
nickc - Member
Has coffee replaced home HiFi as the bus-****' "Snobisme du jour"
Maybe off the mark as a tea drinker (leaves not bag) but it's easy to make really decent coffee, so serving average or crap is not acceptable. It's a very British thing to just accept stuff and think asking for good is snobbery.
Also most of the locals here in Oz can't understand why brits live with such shit coffee, not much served in the UK would last a morning here.
Also most of the locals here in Oz can't understand why brits live with such shit coffee, not much served in the UK would last a morning here.
Yet 75 per cent of Australia's annual coffee consumption is instant.
Sorry I'm talking about those that drink real coffee
Ah so not most of the locals in Oz then.
it's easy to make really decent coffee
Assuming you know what decent coffee taste like, eh, Mike...
Most of the ones I know who have been to the UK, they describe the coffee selection as poor. Just what I have to go by and by the op's wishy washy what should I do I seem why. Here they would be shut in a few decent cities
Also I seemed to manage to make a decent cup with an espresso machines 😉 from what the snobs told me
This is not a first world problem, this is an STW first world problem....
This is not a first world problem, this is an STW first world problem....
I see a new meme. 😉
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[url= https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3691/13365630144_0d86bade14_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3691/13365630144_0d86bade14_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/mn5mc3 ]Life is too short to drink bad coffee[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/anasantos/ ]Ana Santos[/url], on Flickr
The worst "espresso" I ever had was made with scoop of nescafe and small amount of hot water. I never went back there.
We finished a ride, far later than planned, in rubbish weather, cold and miserable and went to the only cafe still open, a sort of 1950's style American Diner lookalike place with peeling faux leather seats.
Asked if they served cappuccino and the woman behind the till ripped open a sachet of Nescafe instant cappuccino and dumped a load of superheated water on top of it. Awful stuff although we were so cold that we had no choice.
but it's easy to make really decent coffee
and to be honest it's easy to get a decent cup of coffee in the UK...including espresso, but that's not what this thread has turned into. Is it?
😆
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What is crema ? I only drink bog standard white coffee!!
the light brown 'cream' that you get on top of espresso.
you only see it on 'proper' espresso, as it's been squeezed out of a unicorns' ar53.
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they describe the coffee selection as poor.
Oh those crazy Aussies and their poncy coffees, all you need is coffee, water and wee cup to put it in.
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mikewsmith - MemberAlso most of the locals here in Oz can't understand why brits live with such shit coffee, not much served in the UK would last a morning here.
When I visited Australia, I don't remember having 1 cup of coffee that was markedly different to that served all over the UK....some was good, some was shit.
It's different in different countries anyway - I've never been that bothered by German coffee, but they are quick to bemoan coffee in England because it's different.
And Turkish coffee is on a whole new level of 'mud'.
i really like coffee and drink loads, have my own machine but i`ve no sodding idea what all the different names mean or what they are supposed to look like. i can understand why most people dont either.
you tend to know if you are going to get a crap coffee as soon as you walk in a place. then you order appropriately.
i mean WTF is a ristretto or a flat white? there is a whole level of coffee nerdism out there i`m scared to enter.
I'm a coffee fan grind beans for my wee gaggia classic and there are some great cafes in Edinburgh and Glasgow but there is one that has a few in Edinburgh does the roasting etc great flat whites but by the time you get it its lukewarm tastes great but one gulp and your £2.50 down. Ask for it slightly hotter and the look you get like you've insulted this barista who's served an apprenticeship of making pretty design on top, going by trip advisor I'm not the only one put off by there attitude.
That'll be artisan roast then.
Barista = B Ark passenger.
Yes without mentioning any names you named that tune in one, so pretentious they are get my beans now from Mr Eion
I personally like a lungo, nice and bitter
Bitter? Lucky you, any old over roasted over extracted coffee will suffice then. 🙄
Am I the only person on here who doesn't like coffee , I can't stand the smell of it , the taste of it or anything flavoured by it and yet people I cycle with choose which cafe to stop at based on the standard of the coffee over the standard of the food .
I've only had one truly dreadful espresso recently. It was in a cycling related café on That London's Old Street.
Also most of the locals here in Oz can't understand why brits live with such shit coffee, not much served in the UK would last a morning here.
Coffee wasn't any better in Australia than anywhere else I've travelled, mostly ok some good much like the UK. It did however provide me with the worst cup of coffee I've ever bought though.
Coffee wasn't any better in Australia than anywhere else I've travelled
Agreed. Have had better coffee in many places than Australia. Apart from China, where it's bordering on impossible to find good coffee!