[Closed] Spec me a diesel estate. (Giving up on life content)

Mazda 6/626?
Toyota Avensis?
Vauxhall Vectra?

Google Ford Mondeo Injectors as a first point of call.
Hard to find modern , reliable , easy to fix uncomplicated Td's anymore.
I would say Octavia VRS 170 but probably too small .
V70 2.4 D5 from 2006 onwards appear to be up there with reliability.
Passat, good but elecy handbrake will probably fail at some point
A6 pay for the badge but well put together
C220 cdi , Has to be auto and the injector seals and / or injectors will fail.
Honda Accord 07- Facelift models look smart , but again not huge.
Forget Toyota Avensis , the one I test drove was a slug.

john_drummer
Toyota Avensis?

singletrackmind
Forget Toyota Avensis , the one I test drove was a slug.

Yeah, I drove a 2.2 D4D T3 a while back and it was uninspiring to say the least. Gearbox put me off the most though as it was like trying to communicate with the dead. I'd still consider one, but I'm not convinced modern Toyota build quality is any better than Kia etc

I've driven VRS diesels and they felt okay, but I think boot space would be the main issue, they seem too expensive for what they are too. I'll look into the Volvo. Accord could be on the list but very rare, my friends petrol one is nice and boot space seems good. A6 would be ideal but probably way out of my budget for a good one.

Legacy 2.0R? 160bhp, Will feel sluggish compared to any turbo subaru though.

martymac

Legacy 2.0R? 160bhp, Will feel sluggish compared to any turbo subaru though.

I had a 2.0 GLX na Legacy too. Power came in far too high up the rev range so constant shifting to get into the power band, lots of reving meant it was nearly as thirsty as the GT-B

Honda Accord - I am pretty sure the inector seal issue was earlier versions of the 2.2cdti and it was fixed in the mark 8 cars.

Yes they are boring, but you can remap them significantly - 170 and 190bhp remaps.

Check out the typeaccord forum.

Mine was comfortable, reliable, and economical, bought at auction and sold on after 6 months for a profit including the remap done to it.

These are the lads that did my remap

You could get the 3.0 Legacy as well, deep pockets for the fuel bill though

Quirrel

Honda Accord - I am pretty sure the inector seal issue was earlier versions of the 2.2cdti and it was fixed in the mark 8 cars.

Yes they are boring, but you can remap them significantly - 170 and 190bhp remaps.

It's definitely high up on the list.

You could get the 3.0 Legacy as well, deep pockets for the fuel bill though

Nah. I love them, but no. Variable valve timing makes them feel crap at low speeds, and you just need to thrash them to get going. Which compounds their drinking problem Also, the wife has never gotten on too well with my Subarus. I dunno why.

I hate the low down slug of torque you get with diesels tha gives you everything in the first 3k RPM then nothing after that. The only Diesel engine I've driven that has a more petrol engined power delivery characteristic, I.e. Smooth and progressive delivery through the entire Rev range, was a BMW 320d I had as a hire car. That gave a nice smooth power delivery right upto the 5 or 5.5k red line. It was lovely to drive.....apart from the rock hard suspension that made the surface of the M1 feel like a rock garden of a typical trail centre black route. And the deafening road noise being transmitted into the cabin that gave me Tinnitus for days after. Apart from that it was lovely to drive.

My bro has got an A6 with a CVT auto box which is also lovely to drive as when accelerating it holds engine revs constant and the CVT box smooths everything out for you.

So I'd say a BMW without the M pack or low profile tyres, or a car with a CVT box.

Octavia boot is huge, you tried one? it's cavernous.

Note that the current shape Honda Accord Tourer has a particularly small, badly shaped boot, probably the smallest capacity in it's class. Good car otherwise though. The previous shape Accord had a huge boot.

[img] [/img]

angeldust

The previous shape Accord had a huge boot.

I'd be looking at the older shaped one.

pictonroad

Octavia boot is huge, you tried one? it's cavernous.

I thought about buying one a few years ago, but back then I didn't have two kids, so boot space wasn't too much of a premium. I've assumed they were about the same size as an A4, ie silly small. Perhaps I'm wrong?. Back then I wasn't exactly overwhelmed by them, as they seemed more expensive and noisier than a similarly specced Passat, all diesel thrust with no real go, ropey brakes, tons of body roll and chronic understeer......but I guess that was then, my needs are quite different now.

Octavia is golf based. It does have a massive boot but the car is narrower than passat/a4/mondeo so getting three people is the back is a struggle. on the plus side its easier to park.

how much driving to you do a year? if you're not sold on diesel it really doesn't make sense unless your doing 15k miles per annum - you'll pay a premium for a given car in diesel compared to petrol.

I"d be looking at a mondeo - big, cheap , fast enough. or a mazda 6 which is the same as a mondeo but much nicer looking (to my eyes)

I bought an octavia last time, next time it will be a mazda 6.

Petrol might not be a difficult sell, have a look at the news stories from yesterday where political types are starting to thing the push to diesel is wrong for health reasons. A guess would be that in 2 or 3 years time the duty on it will rocket to discourage use and residuals are going to go through the floor. They will be harder to get rid of than herpes.

^ Doubtful.

You could just go for a Superb Estate -

Sandwich

Petrol might not be a difficult sell, have a look at the news stories from yesterday where political types are starting to thing the push to diesel is wrong for health reasons. A guess would be that in 2 or 3 years time the duty on it will rocket to discourage use and residuals are going to go through the floor. They will be harder to get rid of than herpes.

Who can say for sure though? I could see that happening but maybe not for 5 years or so. I'm in NI and diesel really is king here. Petrol cars are viewed with suspicion as high revving fuel guzzling money pits. There's also the consideration that a diesel might stop my ears from telling my brain to put my right foot down.

slackboy

I bought an octavia last time, next time it will be a mazda 6.

Is there a Mazda equivolent to the 2.2 tdci?

This is diesel and a good indicator that you have given up on life. Very capable, versatile, belongs to the VAG family for parts and quite dull.

[img] [/img]

Or a bigger variation of dull

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

TheArtistFormerlyKnownAsSTR

The part where I mentioned my budget...I don't think you saw it.

Haha - no, I didn't, sorry

Probably find one of these around your budget, but don't know how big the boot is - comes in 170 & 210 bhp flavours and lots of toys...

[img] [/img]

As much as I'd love to sell a kidney and buy a big Jag, RS Audi or AMG it's not going to happen any time soon unfortunately.

slackboy
how much driving to you do a year? if you're not sold on diesel it really doesn't make sense unless your doing 15k miles per annum - you'll pay a premium for a given car in diesel compared to petrol.

Never answered you earlier, I'd guess somehere between 10-15k a year. As an upper average or worst case scenario I reckoned on 12,500 but it could be quite a bit less.

heArtistFormerlyKnownAsSTR - Member

Probably find one of these around your budget,

That's lovely. But would I be replacing a highly strung, glitchy Subaru for a highly strung, unreliable Alfa? That looks like a real heart over head purchase. I'd guess without checking that there isn't a single one for sale in NI either.

I doubt a 2.0l or a 2.4l diesel engine is that highly strung - not sure about recent Alfa reliability though. Just trying to find you something that doesn't mean you've given up. That said, I'd consider a Mondeo ST though

Plenty of these around for under £6k - 2.2d, 163bhp...

[img] [/img]

I suggested this on another thread a couple of days ago.
MG ZT-T CDTi. You'll get a low-ish mileage facelift model for less than half your budget. Look for the CDTi rather than the CDT - 131bhp/300Nm. It's fairly easy to get 160+bhp with a remap/chip if you're that way inclined. Ignore the slightly chavvy image of the smaller MG hatchbacks and you'll find a superb car. It's very well built and has a slightly re-engineered BMW M47 engine for decent economy, reliability and parts availability.

Not quite the same but I recently bought the 2.5 V6 version and it's been a real eye opener. Very, very well put together, no squeaks or rattles despite being 13 years old, nice and comfy, plenty of "toys", loads of room (3 bikes in with back seats down, 2 with split rear seat down), and it actually drives really really well. I was expecting an intensely boring driving experience after my previous car (FD RX7) but it has been a very pleasant surprise indeed.

£6k might just about get you a Leggy diesel.
As you know there's plenty of family brake/suspension upgrades available...

I suggested this on another thread a couple of days ago.
MG ZT-T CDTi. You'll get a low-ish mileage facelift model for less than half your budget. Look for the CDTi rather than the CDT - 131bhp/300Nm. It's fairly easy to get 160+bhp with a remap/chip if you're that way inclined. Ignore the slightly chavvy image of the smaller MG hatchbacks and you'll find a superb car. It's very well built and has a slightly re-engineered BMW M47 engine for decent economy, reliability and parts availability.

Anyone any thoughts on Saab? Worth looking at or best avoided since they went belly up? I've always thought the 9-3 sportwagon was a good looking car, but that's about all I know of it.

What "theArtist" said.

I just bought the 1.9 JTDm 159 and it's great. Just returned from a 160m round trip with bike on e roof average z38mpg, normally hits 44.

A bit different from the norm, and has a lively "growl" despite being an oil burner. Mine was £6k at 75k miles all the toys full leather rails and tow bar etc. bonus is the inclusive fridge in the arm rest. The boot does have a lip but I can get a road bike and 26er straight in with wheels on and some minor jiggling mainly to get the saddle to clear the shape of the opening, my 29er is fine with the front wheel off.

[url= https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8680/16245671686_a54129e630_z.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8680/16245671686_a54129e630_z.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/kryton1957/16245671686/ ]Untitled[/url]

Why not think a little out of the box

Honda Frv 2.2 cdti ...its a Honda so will last forever and a day , it carriers 6 peeps and when not carrying everyone the seats fold ala Jazz ,plus the ex model has all the leather and toys

suburbanreuben
£6k might just about get you a Leggy diesel.
As you know there's plenty of family brake/suspension upgrades available...

I could stick my BC coil overs on it and some Brembos 😆 but I think the word Subaru has become synonymous with trouble in this house.

kryton57
What "theArtist" said.

I just bought the 1.9 JTDm 159 and it's great. Just returned from a 160m round trip with bike on e roof average z38mpg, normally hits 44.

I really like it Kryton, but I don't think there will be any for sale anywhere near me. I'd be concerned with reliability and parts availability too.

stevedoc
Why not think a little out of the box

Well, no reason steve but I really like how estate cars look. Always have. I don't really need an mpv, so I'm not seriously considering one. I had a look at the S-Max 2.2 tdci but they are big money at the minute.

So far I think my short list would be Mazda 6/ Mondeo. Accord. Alfa. Octavia/Superb and maybe Avensis. There's a Mondeo 2.2 near me so I'll go and take a look at that first. I still like the Accord and I'm intrigued by the Alfa but both are like rocking horse poo over here.

Re Saab - avoid 9-3 plagued with problems, 9-5 much better - note 1.9 diesel is
life limited at about 140k - inlet manifold swirl flaps wear out, if you can find a late 3.0 9-5 diesel it could be a good bet early ones have all blown up by now.

I really like it Kryton, but I don't think there will be any for sale anywhere near me. I'd be concerned with reliability and parts availability too

In real life modern Alfa's are no less reliable than other makes. But they do come with more "heart" than some and aren't as common. Parts ar readily available.

Im close to being in the same boat , I have a spec B leggy saloon , I do love it but doing around 200 miles a month in it ,it seems pointless it being sat on the drive, the wife hates it ,to big to grunty to thirsty ,so looking to down size , weve had Hondas most of our driving lives , she wont have another type R and the accord and crv are to big , and a Jazz to small for me hense why im looking at a Frv

I wouldn't touch a LegacyD so many bad reports or clutch fail and engine over heading problems , If I was to go Desiel , it would be Vag ,

I've got a 58 plate Mondeo estate Zetec tdci 140 and it's great. Drives nicely, averages about 52mpg, only had to change a tyre due to picking up a piece of metal in the year I've had it.
The boot is massive, I had a 2005 Volvo XC70 before and would pick the Ford every time. It's bigger inside, more economical and more reliable.

Octavias don't have a massive boot, they're a puffed up golf. The volume's good but the usability's affected a lot by the shape and the lip on the boot, so in practice it's not as good at bikes as it should be. (I've never used the boot of your model legacy but if it's like the more recent models, the octavia will feel a lot less useful) Still, it's not terrible and they're nice cars

Mondeo 2.2 ticks your boxes exactly tbh. I should say, mine is a mk3, you could afford an extremely nice mk3 ST, Ghia X or Tit X 2.2 but it probably makes sense to go newer. But here is a block of mk3 2.2 chat, since i know nothing about more recent cars.

They are big cars, I love the utility of mine and it's a nice place to spend time but discovering it's physically bigger than some car park spaces was pretty annoying. Still I think it's about of a size with your legacy? All it took was a decat and a remap to get mine to 180bhp and a little over 300lb/ft, pretty low numbers for the engine but it's old so we didn't go all in. And still does 50-55mpg in normal use with no thought to economy, 60mpg on a cruise. As standard the power delivery's pretty messy though, so since you're obviously a car dude I would recommend the remap even if just for driving pleasure. As standard, the low rev manners are pretty damn poor for an engine like this.

Mine is a Ghia X- which I think is basically the same as the Titanium X. It's basically what happens if an ST screws a leather sofa- little bit softer, more ground clearance, 17s instead of 18s, more toys. Very practical for mountain biking, I got it because it was cheap but with hindsight I think it works better for me than an ST. Handling wise, well I don't know what it was like new, it's a little bit soft now though. It's a momentum/rhythm car not a ragging car. But it goes where you point it, holds lines well etc. The ST is a little tauter but really, they're in the same performance envelope. Don't expect a sports car, I haven't driven your legacy but it doesn't hold a candle to the more recent spec b in corners. But within its remit it is very pleasing to drive

The brakes are pretty decent- worth a pad upgrade- but there's a bolt-on Focus asbo swap for the mk3. I haven't bothered though. I can get them a little too hot on occasion, but that's rare and I just take it as a sign that I should slow down, rather than a sign that I should get more brakes.

(and don't stress about injectors, it costs £150 for a brand new one, £50 for the kit to diagnose, replace and recode (as long as you have access to a laptop), and is a simple DIY job. (I think I can do it with my smartphone now but I've not tried that) And at your budget you would be buying a much younger car and shouldn't need to worry. Mine had 3 out of 4 die in short order, but at over 100000 miles. There's silly stories of people paying way over a grand on the internet, which just go to show there are gullible people on the internet.)

Ironically, if I could replace it tomorrow I'd buy a spec b legacy. but if I had 6 grand and I wasn't going to buy a legacy, I'd totally buy another mondeo. Or a Mazda 6 which is a pretty good tribute act with some advantages, but I couldn't find a good one when I was shopping. Or a Trafic and a rusty hot hatch

jimjam.

Yes, the mazda 6 got the 2.2 diesel in 163 and 185 flavours from 2009. its basically the same engine range as the mondeo, as at the time ford owned mazda.

http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/used-reviews/mazda/6/estate-2008/driving-performance/

12.5k per annum just about makes diesel worthwhile, I think

Subaru with a 3.0 Engine and aftermarket warranty? 😀 OK OK!-

Or a Audi A6 estate with either a 2.7TDI or 2.0TDI?

BTW the 2.0R engine can gain more than 160bhp with the factory Pak update and ignition rotate (turn?). The update was designed to cure a hesitancy issue on the R, it lifts power and cold start etc.

slackboy - Member

jimjam.

Yes, the mazda 6 got the 2.2 diesel in 163 and 185 flavours from 2009. its basically the same engine range as the mondeo, as at the time ford owned mazda.

Yo JJ, have a gander at [url= http://www.nicarfinder.co.uk/used-cars/Volkswagen-Passat/2005/CF153-26160/44462084/ ]this[/url]. Under budget so if you feel the need to upgrade the brakes you can (though i found them decent enough). Engine is the same as my old one, not [i]fast[/i] but overtaking is a breeze. Pretty crap round bends if you're horsing it but you won't be as you're a responsible parent now 😉 Best of the Passats imo. Engine is good for another 120k easy with a nice big flat boot. Cheap to chip if you want more power.

I've an Octavia now which is newer so better fuel economy and lights that don't make you think you've forgot to turn them on. Ride is a bit firmer round the bends but boot is worse, in size and shape, interior is cheap looking and road noise is amplified.

Mondeo is a good shout but the Mazda, although a good car felt wide/low on the inside (might not be an issue for you though). The older Accord is a monster of a car, like 50ft long with styling based on Thunderbird 2.

Went from a 900S hatch to an Octavia estate, was more useful boot space in the Skoda - seats down, it's massive, if you have the kids as well its still pretty good for a Golf shaped vehicle - I'd say it's as near dammit the same size as the 900S, which is nice and neat for town driving, more legroom than the 900S.

Going by the above, I would be hesitant about the 9-3 - can't imagine it's got any bigger boot than the Legacy you already have and the Octavia for that matter, it would - hopefully - be within budget though.

We're on about 5-6k miles / year and the petrol option was a no brainer really, hitting 10k it would still be with doing sums, but if you're ruling out likes of Skodas on budget or at least vfm points, not sure Volvo will get you a bargain!!

Humour aside - 'giving up on life'? Some of the very liveliest friends I have don't even own cars, yet they travel the world and live life very fully indeed. Arguably more than the fellow down our street who is a slave to his ****chback and the preening, cleaning and maintenance of same. It also sounds like a dick when it blarts past at 50 in a 30 zone. I think he gave up on life early... 😉

I've had mk2, mk4 and mk5 Passats. All solidly built but all requiring constant part replacement..I could write a book!
Have a Mazda 6 diesel '09. Drives superbly. Massive space in the boot (wheel base 6" wider than the mk5 Passat). Engine is fairly low compression for a diesel which means it drives more like a petrol.