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All the papers are covering it. It is after all big news......"Keir Starmer does something".
Or at least he's thinking about doing something. And he'll probably do something.
Obviously what voters want is for Starmer to set out a clear alternative to the Tories. The problem with that is that it makes him vulnerable to criticism from the Tories and the press.
The great thing about expelling members of your own party is that everyone can see Starmer doing something but there is no risk of him being criticised by either the Tories or the press.
I am not convinced people are not voting for Labour because they have concerns over Labour members being part of Socialist Appeal. I am probably more interested in politics than most voters and I had never even heard of that group!
Y'know it's only really this thread reminding me that Keir exists.
Same as any other specialist… training in one place, and eventually working in another, is entirely normal and advantageous for all. I don’t expect my ophthalmologist to be trained in Mytholmroyd, they probably qualified in Birmingham. Some specialist training and experience might be obtained further afield than even Birmingham. Specialist chefs coming from abroad doesn’t seem that odd, does it?
Jeezo that's a bit of a stretch. And yes it does seem odd they're trained overseas and not, as per you example actually just Halifax, it's making a curry, not a Hadron Collider. And the eye doctor also from just down the road in Bradford.
just Halifax, it’s making a curry, not a Hadron Collider. And the eye doctor also from just down the road in Bradford.
Who was it that kept posting about a free and independent Yorkshire in the Brexit thread? Perhaps they were right. We should fine employers that recruit from outside Yorkshire, and stop those outside staff from bringing their families here, or using the NHS without charge.
I am not convinced people are not voting for Labour because they have concerns over Labour members being part of Socialist Appeal. I am probably more interested in politics than most voters and I had never even heard of that group!
Are they not the rump of Militant? [ insert Monty Python ‘splitters’ img ]
All those groups listed in that Guardian piece (well the ones I’ve heard of) are led by the kind of people that most people “on the left” wouldn’t want to be associated with, and many clearly want another party to come about not to support Labour (eg. Williamson’s Crisis). Letting people be members of Labour and Crisis, but not, for example, Labour and the Green Party, makes no sense.
Who was it that kept posting about a free and independent Yorkshire in the Brexit thread? Perhaps they were right. We should fine employers that recruit from outside Yorkshire, and stop those outside staff from bringing their families here, or using the NHS without charge
I'm sure this is referencing something somewhere but to me that's just illegible word soup.
Wheres this "fine them" come from? Observing that educational facilities exist in the UK is not some code for "stop them using the NHS the bunch of freeloaders" so where did that come from too? It's not even code for stop anyone coming in at all.
I'm going to hazard a guess I'm only ankle deep in this topic and your balls deep so I'm missing whatever it is your talking about.
I'm also outside a service station waiting for this coffee to do its business. Could be a bit angsty whilst the core kicks into life ....
I’ll come back after we’ve both had at least two coffees.
Okay... I've had one... I'll give it go...
Wheres this “fine them” come from?
The "Immigration Skills Charge"... it's paid each year (with a bigger up front payment) as penalty for employing someone from outside the UK. There's also the "Certificate of Sponsorship" costs per an employee, and also you have to pay to become a sponsor (but that's per an organisation, not per an employee... but does make that first foreign worker the most expensive to take on).
not some code for “stop them using the NHS the bunch of freeloaders”
Not from you, no. Just pointing out the hurdles that we have deliberately put in place to to put off people from outside the UK coming here to work (this one is the "Immigration Health Surcharge")... you might call it a hostile environment. I was jokingly (although it's not funny really I'll admit) applying that to Yorkshire rather than the UK.
Look, it's great if people can be trained and employed locally... if that's what they want. On the Curry Chefs front, there have been lots of great initiatives to train in the UK. There was a tendency for the courses to be filled with EU people though (no, not taking training away from good old hard working Brits, but because that's who wanted the training). It'll be interesting to see who is taking up the training from now on.
This supposedly intelligent man cannot see his direction of travel, each time he takes it to the left.
At some point there will be no difference between Labour and the Tories other than a slightly more clappy NHS attitude.
But that will be it.
In fact there will be almost nothing to talk about soon. Starmer; sub-contractor of the Tories.
Thank you Kelvin appreciated
In all honesty I've just buried an old friend lost to Pancreatic Cancer so I'm going for a walk in the Lakes (well Wet Sleddale) and take a few weeks off the forum. I'm not sure I have room for politics, pandemics, and grief all in one go.
Be outside. Take care.
This supposedly intelligent man cannot see his direction of travel, each time he takes it to the left.
Which of the groups listed in that Guardian piece are in the "direction of travel"? Really interested to hear which of them represents to you the direction Labour should be heading in.
In fact there will be almost nothing to talk about soon.
Starmer is boring. Who'd want to talk about him? He's making Labour boring. At least he's making it easier for his successor to get attention when the time comes (clutching for straws and silver linings there, I'll admit).
I still wish he was PM. And still consider him utterly unsuitable to winning elections.
All those groups listed in that Guardian piece (well the ones I’ve heard of) are led by the kind of people that most people “on the left” wouldn’t want to be associated with
Such utter ignorance. You have no idea about 'the kind of people' in any of those organisations. I doubt you've even heard of them, or the myriad other small political organisations affiliated to Labour. They are by and large, middle class bleeding heart liberals, truth be told, in many small groups. The few actual 'Marxists' are mostly older Labour members, who have absolutely no power or influence in the party anyway. Labour Against The Witchhunt actually numbers quite a few Jewish people, so once again, Starmer will be expelling the 'wrong sort of Jews' again. This is totally about removing any form of dissent or alternative opinions, and dismantling any form of democracy within the party. At a time when Labour are still hemorrhaging members, support and potential voters, Starmer's best move is to expel and alienate even more members? Way to go.
Starmer; sub-contractor of the Tories
He really is nothing more, now. A corporate stooge, acting in the interests of wealth. This much is clear.
I still wish he was PM
If he were, how do you think he'd affect any significant and necessary change in our society?
Brexit means a shortage of cheap labour, and many sectors rely on such cheap labour to be able to survive.
So pay for workers in some low paid sectors is going to increase....
So pay for workers in some low paid sectors is going to increase….
Is it? How?
He's sweating blood to create Change UK Mk 2.
I was just looking into who is involved in groups like Labour Against the Witch Hunt, and I saw Jackie Walker is involved - I was pretty sure I remembered she had been found guilty of some pretty clear cut egregious anti-semitism. Sure enough there are references to her arguing that 'jews financed the slave trade' among other things, but then if you dig a little you find out:
'In the course of a complex and nuanced Facebook conversation Jackie Walker declared, ‘I will never back anti-Semitism but neither am I a Zionist’. The friends spoke about her combined Jewish-African heritage, the suffering involved in the slavery movement, and ‘the Holocaust’ as a debt owed to the Jews, to which Jackie responded:
I hope you feel the same towards the African holocaust? My ancestors were involved in both – on all sides… millions more Africans were killed in the African holocaust and their oppression continues to this day on a global scale in a way it doesn’t for Jews and many Jews, my ancestors too, were the chief financiers of the sugar and slave trade… so who are the victims and what does it mean . We are victims and perpetrators, to some extent by choice. And having been a victim does not give you a right to be a perpetrator.'
Weird how the fact that she herself is Jewish never seems to get mentioned eh?
And this was from a private conversation from which someone took a screenshot. And this is really enough to brand someone a racist and kick them out of their political party? What is even wrong about what she has said? The fact that Starmer is still hounding people like Jackie Walker just shows he is on the side of the oppressors, frankly.
This is totally about removing any form of dissent or alternative opinions, and dismantling any form of democracy within the party. At a time when Labour are still hemorrhaging members, support and potential voters, Starmer’s best move is to expel and alienate even more members? Way to go.
The labour party policy making structures make it essential. If you have a mass membership organisation where single interest pressure groups can wield extraordinary influence on what is the ultimate party policy then you have a recipe for opposition. Labour needs to appeal to voters, (unless it can get to 17 million members). What appeals to voters is different than what appeals to highly motivated people who join political parties.
Is it? How?
I'm sure you will have a complex reason why I'm wrong but when something in demand is in short supply normally the price goes up
If you have a mass membership organisation where single interest pressure groups can wield extraordinary influence on what is the ultimate party policy then you have a recipe for opposition
Please explain what 'influence' groups such as LatW, Socialist Appeal, Resist and Labour in Exile actually have, towards the greater membership? And isn't debate vital in establishing democracy anyway?
I’m sure you will have a complex reason why I’m wrong
It's not very complex at all. You just haven't thought it through very much, that's all.
when something in demand is in short supply normally the price goes up
Oh the goods themselves will, no question. But wages won't. Because there are too many people who have to take whatever they can get, in order to survive. Because the 'safety net' has ever growing holes...
Starmer is boring. Who’d want to talk about him? He’s making Labour boring. At least he’s making it easier for his successor to get attention when the time comes (clutching for straws and silver linings there, I’ll admit).
The problem is who can replace him that will be able to turn the corner for Labour as a viable opposition/ government
I still wish he was PM. And still consider him utterly unsuitable to winning elections.
Probably Starmer's curse, competent enough to do the job well, not competent enough to get it
All those groups listed in that Guardian piece (well the ones I’ve heard of) are led by the kind of people that most people “on the left” wouldn’t want to be associated with, and many clearly want another party to come about not to support Labour (eg. Williamson’s Crisis). Letting people be members of Labour and Crisis, but not, for example, Labour and the Green Party, makes no sense.
What makes no sense is to make a big song and dance about fighting your own membership. The groups listed hold very little if any power and could easily be ignored whilst Starmer focuses his energies on developing a viable opposition. The scary thing is that he might actually believe this action will improve Labour's fortunes.
Going by the polls down to (33/42) it seems that Keith is not really appealing to the voters. Plus he's been outflanked by the Tories over NHS pay, deary me. I'd be interested in any examples of single issue interest groups wielding extraordinary power over party policy as I might like to have a go at that.
Dismissing 52% of the population as you do says a lot more about you than that 52%
I'm a hang-wringing leftie woke snowflake and proud of it.
Starmer will continue to lag in the polls while we open up... freedom daaaay!!!
Depending on how next few months go re. covid he could get a boost or continue to lag
3years before the next election so plenty of time yet,
You have no idea about ‘the kind of people’ in any of those organisations.
I said "led by". I don't know who makes up their membership, I can only go by who set them up and puts their names to them.
The problem is who can replace him that will be able to turn the corner for Labour as a viable opposition/ government
THE big question.
I’m a hang-wringing leftie woke snowflake and proud of it.
You missed out snob
I said “led by”. I don’t know who makes up their membership, I can only go by who set them up and puts their names to them.
Again; you know nothing about them.
If you say so darling. Damn my empty head.
What makes no sense is to make a big song and dance about fighting your own membership.
Makes no sense to me either. But then I voted Labour twice at general elections with Corbyn as leader, I don't need or want to see any signalling that the party is ridding itself of anyone. I suppose groups set up and led by people already expelled from Labour (hell, some were also expelled from Militant back in the day... imagine that) might well not have a place in Labour. Sorting that out quietly would be preferable... if possible. Is it possible?
You could fill it with knowledge. It wouldn't take much effort, by all accounts...
Enough about me and my empty head. I'd like to see Labour relax rather than tighten its rules on joining and supporting other parties and movements more generally. I don't think the future is "Labour or not"... if there's to be any government without Conservatives in it any time soon. But Labour members being able to join and support those groups listed in that Guardian article, some set up by disgruntled ex-Labour people, yet risk being expelled for supporting candidates and campaigns linked to The Green Party and others, makes no sense at all to me.
Not really gonna comment on whether certain campaign groups should be expelled as it's of almost no interest to anyone, but what I would say is that at a time when much of the country is crying out for some competent opposition and some sign of what Starmer stands for, and after promising that they would stop navel gazing, what does he choose to do? It tells us everything we need to know about his priorities and his fitness to be leader. He's there to do nothing more than fight an internal factional war, and that's why he's tanking in the polls.
This is for binners, he’ll know what I mean 😀
https://twitter.com/elenicourea/status/1417060689827569666?s=21
Where’s Emily Thornberry when you need her? 😂
We almost broke out rule of not discussing politics on Saturday night. However, since we were only discussing fictional politics, it’s ok
We almost broke out rule of not discussing politics on Saturday night.
We seemed to be agreeing with each other though. Real life is bollocks. If you want proper escapism watch that UFO film 😀
I’m definitely getting on that
Starmer will continue to lag in the polls while we open up… freedom daaaay!!!
Depending on how next few months go re. covid he could get a boost or continue to lag
Surely that depends on what his position on Freedom Day is? Any idea on that, by the way? If he can’t take a stand on killing off thousands of vulnerable people, where exactly is his red line? Does it take a full-blown holocaust to get him off the fence?
If you want proper escapism watch that UFO film 😀
🤨
Surely that depends on what his position on Freedom Day is?
He's pretty sensible about it
So when he points it out to Johnson September, he'll get called captain hindsight , even though he's right
Surely that depends on what his position on Freedom Day is? Any idea on that, by the way? If he can’t take a stand on killing off thousands of vulnerable people, where exactly is his red line? Does it take a full-blown holocaust to get him off the fence?
To be fair to Starmer he has been across the airwaves saying it's too fast and masks should continue to be worn.
As for vulnerable people, as I understand it covid isn't going away and the best way to protect themselves is to get vaccinated and wear a ffp3 mask. The other mask designs are essentially useless as personal protection but offer protection from the wearer. I haven't heard anyone come up with a realistic plan that can save them from the risk of Covid. The delta variant is rewriting the rule book, the Edinburgh prof was interviewed on C4 news and didn't have an alternative.
Sorry not really on topic but this is one of the funniest Twitter threads I’ve ever read. For once this is truly deserving of a Binners monty python picture.
https://twitter.com/nalpraxis/status/1415688427635417092?s=21
On the plus side, Tony Blair emerged from his dungeon dimension to tell everyone that Boris Johnston was definitely right not to self-isolate, so at least he's restricting himself to supporting the Tories as opposed to outright opposing Labour.
On the plus side, Tony Blair emerged from his dungeon dimension
Cherie presumably ran out of puppies to eat.
Such a relief to be disagreeing with Blair again.
but this is one of the funniest Twitter threads I’ve ever read
can't tell if that's supposed to be satire or not TBH.
How to destroy a political party..
Looks like Kier could do with a few more billionaire puppet masters...
That Steve Bell cartoon sums it up so well. Support for Armrest is waning rapidly. I think even some of the most ardent Armresters on here are deserting the sinking ship, now it's obvious Armrest is a complete and utter failure. He's making Milliband and Kinnock look competent ffs.
I know Binners doesn't realise just how relevant Israel is to this particular political discussion, but the implications towards democracy and privacy are very serious indeed:
https://www.macrumors.com/2021/07/19/pegasus-spyware-imessage-targets-activists/
I wonder what sort of 'activists' this spyware would be used to target?
I think even some of the most ardent Armresters on here are deserting the sinking ship,
Who are they, I haven't noticed any?
And no, Israel is of no importance to the voters however much you would like to dream it was. Puppet masters eh...
Tories potentially offer 3% for NHS workers.
Crucially above what Starmer suggested at a minimum of 2.1%
The man loves own goals. What an absolute baffoon, and I'm not talking about Johnson.
I could see this coming a mile off.
He should have gone for the big guns and slapped a double digit increase on the table. Let the Tories argue about the lies of affording it - but he would have least have captured the sentiment of the nation.
Who are they, I haven’t noticed any?
Well there was definitely a pro Starmer (remember all the leader of a unity government nonsense?) push all the way through the end of Brexit until last year. Those voices have gone quiet if not critical.
And no, Israel is of no importance to the voters however much you would like to dream it was.
It should be, if Starmer was in any way relevant to voters I suppose. He received large amounts of funding (which he tried to keep secret) from people closely linked to pro-Israel/weapons industry lobby groups, and is carrying out a purge of the left who his funders despise, including kicking out Jewish people accused of being anti-Semitic (!).
The issue isn't so much about Israel as about integrity. BTW pointing this out isn't the same as claiming evil Jews control the world.
Tories potentially offer 3% for NHS workers.
I wonder what his position is going to be on the proposed hike in NI to 'pay for' social care? Instead of setting the agenda by addressing the reality of public spending and the funding of public services, he'll spend the rest of his dwindling time as leader arguing about percentage points on NI and income tax and prattling on about tackling the national debt whilst the voters look on completely confused as to whether he's for or against improving social care.
You missed out snob
Surely that’s implicit?
Who are they, I haven’t noticed any?
Very funny. 😀
And no, Israel is of no importance to the voters however much you would like to dream it was.
Sticking your fingers in your ears and just singing 'la la la' loudly, doesn't make it any less real. I'll forgive your ignorance regarding just how globally important Israel actually is (several aspects of your life are influenced by Israeli innovations and technology), but it's a good idea to inform and educate yourself. Israel is of massive inmportance to he Labour leadership; this is why Starmer pledged allegiance to Zionism, and why he will not be at all critical of the actions of the Israeli regime. Israel relies on the support and validation of the West, in order to survive. So ties with any political party that potentially could be in power in the UK, are vital.
Israel might not be important to many voters, but it sure as hell is important to Labour. Why, they've even gone and employed an ex-Israeli spy, to manage their social media:
Israel is also very important to the tories, for balance:
IE; Israel is important. Dismissing that fact just because you don't want to ackknowledge it, just proves your own blinkered delusion.
Puppet masters eh…
Yes, puppet masters. And?
Un-f******-believable! Who lets cash reserves run down to one month's payroll? Either Starmer's incompetence is way beyond what anyone imagined, or it's deliberate. Worst labour leader in history?
https://twitter.com/siennamarla/status/1417420588021436428?s=20
I wonder what his position is going to be on the proposed hike in NI to ‘pay for’ social care?
For sure.
There plenty of lines of attack here but he will mess it up completely.
Worst labour leader in history?
Reminds of Robert De Niro's speech in Casino when he catches the incompetent slot manager.
"Listen, if you didn't know you were being scammed you're too ****in' dumb to keep this job, if you did know, you were in on it. Either way, YOU'RE OUT! Get out. Go on, let's go."
Didn't Keith hand over a big chunk of LP funds without being asked to do so to the owners of the JC? Can he ask for it back?
So your response to
And no, Israel is of no importance to the voters however much you would like to dream it was.
Is
Sticking your fingers in your ears and just singing ‘la la la’ loudly, doesn’t make it any less real. I’ll forgive your ignorance regarding just how globally important Israel actually is (several aspects of your life are influenced by Israeli innovations and technology), but it’s a good idea to inform and educate yourself. Israel is of massive inmportance to he Labour leadership; this is why Starmer pledged allegiance to Zionism, and why he will not be at all critical of the actions of the Israeli regime. Israel relies on the support and validation of the West, in order to survive. So ties with any political party that potentially could be in power in the UK, are vital.
I am talking about the importance of Israel to the voters, it has nothing to do with me informing and educating myself thanks. I know rather a LOT about Israel thanks.
To the point I was actually making just go and talk to some voters and ask them how much of a bearing a parties stance/actions on Israel will have on their voting intentions. It will be about number 1,000 on the list of things they care about.
Puppet masters eh.
I am talking about the importance of Israel to the voters, it has nothing to do with me informing and educating myself thanks. I know rather a LOT about Israel thanks.
It's of very high importance to both Labour and the tories, and it will be of importance to a lot of voters; not least the nearly 3 million British Muslims who Starmer seems willing to alienate, as well as millions of other British people, by not condemning the Israeli apartheid towards Palestinians and Arabs. 3 million; that's a lot of votes. More than enough to swing an election. You just want to dismiss this, as you don't want to acknowledge facts. Because it's not convenient for your own (very poor) arguments. YOU might not think it's important, but it is. If you did, as you claim, know 'rather a LOT about Israel', you would actually know this...
Puppet masters eh
Yeah; puppet masters. And?
I've never known investors invest without expecting a return. That's why he always has that hunted look, he's not his own man.
For sure.
There plenty of lines of attack here but he will mess it up completely.
Social care needs to be paid for, what is alternative plan to pay for it?
does he have to wait for conference before he can put a new policy on the table?
Yeah; puppet masters. And?
I’ve never known investors invest without expecting a return. That’s why he always has that hunted look, he’s not his own man.
Keep the tropes coming
not least the nearly 3 million British Muslims who Starmer seems willing to alienate,
But the British Muslim population is not a single amorphous blob, there is a spectrum of views
The Israel/ Palestine issue is an intractable mess with no side sitting on the moral high ground. If they did it would be a lot simpler. The region's large powers are using it as the means of battling out and the nuances are lost in picking a side.
Social care needs to be paid for, what is alternative plan to pay for it?
That will be the challenge for Labour choosing which of many options is better than the choice of a regressive tax which will have the low paid contributing extra whilst wealthy pensioners who benefit the most will not. It hits the workers and not those benefiting from investments.
The last Labour manifesto stated funding would be from general taxation
As far as I can find out NI is part of general taxation
So Starmer might not have too many opportunities with this other than arguing it's our policy implemented badly....
The last Labour manifesto stated funding would be from general taxation
Really? Because it says "We’ll ask those who earn more than £80,000 a year to pay a little more income tax, while freezing National Insurance and income tax rates for everyone else".
Social care needs to be paid for
Depends what you mean by 'paid for'. We don't need to raise taxes to find the money, because that's not how govt finances work. We do however need to tax back the extra expenditure to control inflation, and that should be done in a progressive fashion where those who are most able and benefit the most pay more. Increasing NI is the worst of all worlds and Starmer should be shouting it from the rooftops. He won't though, he'll waffle on about responsible fiscal policy and leave everyone wondering what his actual opinion is, leaving Boris to be the champion of those who require care in old age.
While it's easy to try and smear people as using anti-semitic tropes, SKS did receive £50k from an executive committee member of BICOM, a pro-Israel lobby group which is closely tied to Conservative Friends of Israel. And he kept it secret until after he won the leadership election using a shady loophole in campaign finance rules.
But yes, he has other puppet masters too that aren't Israel lobbyists, mostly rich right-wing Blairites. He is an establishment man through and through, and he's doing his job perfectly.
lol.
You’ll note that the total donations from these eight wealthy individual supporters came to an astonishing £455,000. The financial backing Keir received from the organised labour movement paled into insignificance by comparison. UNISON contributed £31,400, while the rightwing unions Community and USDAW each donated £25,000, which came to a total of £81,400. By contrast, Rebecca Long-Bailey received £218,500 in donations from Unite and £52,700 from the CWU, which came to a total of £271,200. Her other major source of financial backing was Momentum. No wealthy businessmen rallied to her campaign.
It was also significant that Rebecca accepted all her donations as soon as they were received, whereas in the case of Keir’s major donations there was almost a month’s gap between receiving and accepting the money. For example, the £100,000 donation from Waheed Alli is listed as received on 24 February but was only accepted on 23 March and wasn’t registered until 9 April, before finally being published on 14 April. By which time, of course, the leadership election was long over and the information could have no effect on the result.
It is obvious that Keir and his advisers exploited parliamentary rules so that Labour Party members were prevented from knowing that his campaign was largely bankrolled by multi-millionaires with a history of opposing Corbyn from the right, and in some cases of backing political parties that stood against Labour.
https://medium.com/@pitt_bob/who-funded-keir-starmers-campaign-170a42b43fc0
But the British Muslim population is not a single amorphous blob, there is a spectrum of views
Sure, but at the 2017 general election, 85% of British Muslims voted Labour. So that's around 2.5 million voters. If Starmer loses a significant percentage of that support, as polls suggest due to increasing dissatisfaction with Starmer amongst British Muslims, he will lose a significant number of voters. Events in Palestine affect British Muslims. Ergo, they might have strong opinions regarding Israel, and if Starmer sides with Israel uncritically, as he has done, then he will lose the support of a lot of voters.
Keep the tropes coming
What 'tropes'? Please explain.
While it’s easy to try and smear people as using anti-semitic tropes
It's cowardly and weak. Pathetic.
puppet masters, eh
A bit of explication wouldn't go amiss here.
According to Alexei Sayle "the reason Keir Starmer looks like a Thunderbird puppet is because somebody's pulling his strings"
Mind you Alexei Sayle is both left-wing and Jewish, and everyone knows that left-wing Jews tend to be anti-Semitic.
puppet masters, eh
Who's a pretty boy then?
A bit of explication wouldn’t go amiss here.
I wouldn't hold your breath.
Mind you Alexei Sayle is both left-wing and Jewish, and everyone knows that left-wing Jews tend to be anti-Semitic
Noam Chomsky and Jon Lansman - both in the former group too.
Social care needs to be paid for, what is alternative plan to pay for it?
All Government funding is new money creation. The government / BoE are currency issuers. We are currency users.
Understand that.
We don't 'pay' for anything with taxation.
Money spent in the public sector by the government is matched (unnecessarily) by issuing bonds to the private sector. The money they use to buy the bonds is issued from the BoE originally.
This is the debt we hear people going on and on about. It's not a debt it's a record of government spending of money in circulation.
Q\E is also the new digital money that is used to buy back the bonds. Again issued GBP from the BoE.
There is no such thing as a debt, or constraint in spending when you are the currency issuer. The constraints as Daz points out are resources and labour.
Taxation is a way of removing money from circulation at a central government level.
Both political parties obfuscate the way spending and taxation work. They like to talk in terms of how do we pay for it - it's nonsense.
The Pandemic was a good example of how it was nonsense. Why do you have a debt that needs repayong when you are the sole issuer of your own currency?
It's bollocks.
iNews: Labour finances: Redundancies show that by inspiring nobody, Keir Starmer is plunging the party into crisis.
https://inews.co.uk/opinion/labour-finances-keir-starmer-party-redundancies-crisis-1112346
Typical nail on the head comments by Andrew Fisher.
Shit he might have to go now
Why wasn't there a labour frontbencher on newsnight last night?
They could have gone for the comedy line of "I agree with Dom, Boris has to go"
Instead nothing
Not necessarily. For some a slimmed down party, centralisation of control by the PLP, ad industry employed rather than rely on campaigning (most likely leftwing) members, reduced role for unions, greater role for private sponsorship, a safe space for well-financed self-appointed rightwing MPs. Don't forget the odd bods who finance him also finance tories, they'll be happy with that outcome. Rone we would benefit from regularly re-posting your summary on public finance, the LP has rejected MMT for NMMT.
Also, Leon Trotsky, Naomi Klein, Tony Greenstein, Jackie Walker, Ygael Gluckstein, Michael Kidron, vile anti-semites the lot of them.