[Closed] Shin splints

Brufen and lots of it was the only answer for me. Tried a pair of sorbothane insoles, didn't work, stopped running on hard stuff in the end which helped a bit.

Depends on the cause. Maybe try some calf stretches, but bend the knee a bit so the target the deeper muscle. Maybe also try some friction massage to the lumpy bumpy bits of muscle that attach to the tibia.

Rest and rest.

Then rest.

Thanks, the painful area seems to be along the bone at the front of her leg, she said it's like a sharp pain when she's running then a sore feeling after for a few hours. It's happening in both legs.

stop running

stop running with a heel-strike.
[img] [/img]
(sorry guys...)

She's probably doing too much, too soon, and / or has inappropriate footware.

To avoid them: Warm up properly. Cool down properly. Invest in some shoes with decent cushioning and support. If she over-pronates she'll be more susceptible to it.

To get rid: ibuprofen, rest. Ice might help.

stop running with a heel-strike.

Quite the opposite, I thought? It's smashing the balls of your feet repeatedly into the floor that causes it. (I may be misremembering though)

ahwiles - are you seriously suggesting that someone who has shin splints changes to forefoot running? You know - a technique that whilst it can help reduced impact in the hips, knees, and ankles increases the risk of shin splints.

You also assume that the OP's wife doesnt run like that naturally, as a lot of people do.

ahwiles - are you seriously suggesting that someone who has shin splints changes to forefoot running? You know - a technique that whilst it can help reduced impact in the hips, knees, and ankles increases the risk of shin splints.

eh? how does that work then? - if you land on your heel, you get a sudden, violent extension of the muscles in the shin. this doesn't happen with 'forefoot' running, so less likely to cause/aggravate shin-splints...

running fore-foot, the only thing the muscles in the front of the shin are doing, is lifting the weight of the foot.

running heel-strike, the muscles in the front of the shin have to support the whole body weight, in a shock-load.

i hope i don't need to draw a diagram.

You also assume that the OP's wife doesnt run like that naturally, as a lot of people do.

a safe assumption*, i bet you a packet of hob-nobs! 🙂

(*she's got shin pain)

Cougar - Member

"stop running with a heel-strike"

Quite the opposite, I thought? It's smashing the balls of your feet repeatedly into the floor that causes it. (I may be misremembering though)

if you think fore-foot running involves "smashing the balls of your feet ... into the floor" , then you don't understand fore-foot running. i'd describe it as 'gently placing'

As regular viewers will know, I'm prone to hyperbole. Point is, it's impact to the balls of your feet rather than your heels that causes shin splints. Or at least, is one of the causes.

I think, anyway. I'm half-remembering something I researched about five years ago, so could well be wrong.

are we talking about the 'foot-slap' impact? - where the front of the foot is slapped into the ground following a heel-strike?

(you can sometimes hear someone running with a slap-slap-slap-slap... noise)

i'm not a doctor, but i am very very clever.

[img] [/img]

As with ahwiles, I'm curious as to what proposed mechanism would increase the incidents of medial tibial stress by landing forefoot first?

I only had it when playing badminton several times a week a few years ago. Good footwear and less playing helped. I switched from Adidas court shoes to Asics with full gel insert. The Asics weren't as grippy around the court which i hated, but they were much easier on my shins. Ice afterwards exercise was a reasonable amount of relief before i got the correct footwear. All self diagnosed mind, never had it investigated

You know, if you know all about this then you could just try telling us.

I do hold my hand up when I'm not sure about something, I don't see why it needs an argument.

I used to get shin splints every time I built up a reasonable volume of running. Caused me to give it up for years. When I started up again 4 years ago the old pains started up again and then some so I analysed my running style, realised I was heel striking and running flat footed. Switched to forefoot striking. It took some time to build up my underused Achilles tendons but no shin splints and I was immediately 20% faster as my tendons were now storing energy as they were designed to do and I had more bounce in my stride. Later found out about barefoot running- wouldn't want to go that far but the principle, if my experience is anything to go by, I think is sound.

To the OP get your girlfriend to rest until cured then build up slowly with no heel strike.

To SBZ no one runs naturally with heel strike if they're barefoot or have thin soled shoes- its too damned painful.

"You know, if you know all about this then you could just try telling us. "

I am pretty sure he already did.

What muscles are there in front of the shin? And where is the pain from shin splints?

Lots of info here
http://www.runnersworld.co.uk/beating-injury/shinsplints---how-to-beat-them/234.html

That page is 11 years old.

11 years old, but still usefull.

these muscles (circled green):
[img][url= http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6084/6105787074_8b5e14dbee.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6084/6105787074_8b5e14dbee.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

are shock-loaded during heel strike running. in much the same way as the quadracep muscles are shock-loaded when you run down a steep hill*.

lots of people can run with a heel-strike, without hurting these muscles. good for them.

lots of people can't run like this without hurting these muscles. they may or may not want to do something about it, it's up to them really, they can of course do what they like.

but if you had to think of a way to hurt these muscles, heel-strike running would be a good way to start.

(*ever done a fell race? - and not been able to walk down stairs the next day / week? - it's the descents what done that to you)

I had shin splints years ago - probably from over-exuberant football training. Got progressively with all the other running I was doing. Ended up doing the following over a 12+ month period:

> 5-10 min walking pace warm-up at the start of each run
> break up every 10-15 mins running with 5 mins walking
> return home, put feet up and pack ankles/shins in ice (socks packed with cubes works fine)

Condition may well improve. Mine did, but not sufficient to say it was over. So that's when I had a special sole thingy made (to measure) for each foot. This reduced pain by about a further 50% so I then started cycling more and running less. After a few months I was perfectly fine. Have literally been able to run any time/distance (well, fitness permitting of course) since. I put it down to strengthening the problem area coupled with reducing the impact 'brittle-ness'.

Thanks everyone. She had her feet measured and a pair of asics that were reccomend to her, so I don't think it's down to the trainers as much. The heel strike seems to make sense as she runs in that motion. She has made an appointment to have her running analysed on a camera. They also suggested she didn't run till then. Thanks again.

fore-foot running isn't easy.

it's not about running on your toes - that's sprinting.

after each 'landing' your foot should be flat on the ground.

most people find this tricky to do at first, so just run on their toes, and attempt to run as far as they were doing in their good old heel-strike days.

this is murder on the calf muscles, in exactly the same way as heel-strike running is hard on the shin muscles.

so, Catflees, if your or girlfriend think fore-foot running might help. it's going to take time to learn. try 5mins and see how she feels the next day. if 5 is ok, try 10, and see how she feels the next day.

she'll still be rubbish at it because it's tricky, so, 10mins, twice a week, for a couple of weeks.

work up slowly from there.

or not, whatever.

hey, surrounded-by-zulus! - you owe me a packet of hob-nobs! 🙂

The video analysis should help. I think was told I was an over-pronator and that was contributing to the problem. Hence the custom soles worked pretty well. Think they cost £70/pair (about 7-8 years ago).

catflees - Member
She has made an appointment to have her running analysed on a camera.

i predict they'll tell her she needs new shoes, which will be £80, and probably some gell footbeds, which will be £40, and/or maybe some custom moulded orthotic inserts, which will be £100.

nobody ever went on one of those gait analysis things only to be told, 'you're fine!'

or 'your feet are getting weak, your shoes have too much support, take those orthotics out'

or, 'you've got a verucca, that's why you're running funny - go and get some cream'

the answer is always 'you need to give us about £100, and if we think we can ask for more, we will'

custom moulded orthotic inserts

Yep, that's what I had. Knew it was an 'ortho-something'. Well worth checking out.

Shin splints is horrible 🙁 Ice, physio, acupunture and rest helped mine. My physio gave me exercises too - both for strengthening my shins and calves. I also had my running analysed and switched to nike lunar glide+ which have more cushioning than my adidas (also try to run on soft surfaces where possible these days).

Ultimately what seemed to be the cause for me though was my psoas muscle had gone into spasm and had shortened on one side which then gave me a slight leg length imbalance - enough to cause shin splints when i had a high running mileage. Whenever it goes into spasm and i go for a run, i always end up with some sort of pain in my shin.

nobody ever went on one of those gait analysis things only to be told, 'you're fine!'

Worth doing more than one, see if they agree, perhaps?

i was told i definitely needed orthotics because my 'toes were too high'...

(wtf?)

i only went in to see if they had any wide-fit shoes...

(inov8's are bit narrow)

Worth doing more than one, see if they agree, perhaps?

absolutely, and they'll definitely agree that she definitely needs to spend about £100...

That page is 11 years old.

My legs are over 40 years old and they haven't changed that much, think they are still the same on the inside!

ahwiles - Member

nobody ever went on one of those gait analysis things only to be told, 'you're fine!'

I did! And I'd told them I was prepared to buy new trainers if that was the issue!

I seem to be a bit prone to shin splints, mainly after time off running, or doing too much. I've recently been using compression calf guards for a couple of hours after running, and they seem to help no end.

Shin splints is often a generic term for pain usually on the interior or posterior part of the lower leg. In my experience its mainly due to building mileage up too quickly and seldom disapears without rest. Unlike other injuries trying to run through it almost always ends in more damage and enforced layoff later, sometimes developing into a stress fracture.

Icing and Ibruprofen will help but unless you reduce your training then it will likely worsen.
I would recommend the above and return to running slowly and aim to run on soft surfaces as much as possible.
I cant quote any sources on this but from memory there is little evidence to show that stretching or leg strenghtening exercises produce much benefit although they are not bad things in themselves.

But those muscles are beside the tibia not in front of it and they sure as hell aren't shock loaded when you heel strike. There is more chance of them being shock loaded when you walk and i doubt many people forefoot walk.

havent read nay of the above but does she wear 'proper' running trainers?

i used to get really bad splints until i got my feet measured and then got £140 pair of asics, the end of my my splints!

[i]But those muscles are beside the tibia not in front of it and they sure as hell aren't shock loaded when you heel strike[/i]

When you heel strike their is passive plantarflexion of your foot (the good old foot slaping mentioned above). Even without the foot-slapping it would seem possible that you'll still get this eccentric loading as you try and control this rapid plantarflection as the foot rotates around the heel. This eccentric loading will be passed though Tibias anterior, which normally controls dorsiflexion but can be eccentrically loaded during rapid plantarflexion. The origin of the the muscle is the upper 2/3rds of the tibia..

The muscle is still loaded during walking, but as walking is an habitual activity your body has become accustomed to the stress.

Still interested on hearing your theory as to how forefoot landing increases tibial stress.

But those muscles are beside the tibia not in front of it

they're the muscles that raise your toes, they're the muscles you have to tense during a heel-strike.

hey, there's every chance i'm wrong, care to show me where the toe-raising muscles actually are?

they sure as hell aren't shock loaded when you heel strike.

try this: stand on tip toes - your calf muscle is tensed.

now stand on your heels (raise your toes) - the muscles shown above are tensed.

landing on your heel shock-loads these muscles.

But hey i might be wrong, what's your explanation?

oh god, i'm arguing on the internet, shoot me now.

It increases the forces that "slap" soleus onto the posterior aspect of the tibia.

Can't comment on any forefoot/heelstrike issues, however I suffered from shin splints ages ago at uni, and was taught a very simple stretch which cured it.

Stand with your weight on the outside of your feet, inclining the soles of your shoes about 30 degrees upwards for a minute or so before exercise.

Cheers, Rich

😆

ahwiles - Member

ahwiles - are you seriously suggesting that someone who has shin splints changes to forefoot running? You know - a technique that whilst it can help reduced impact in the hips, knees, and ankles increases the risk of shin splints.

eh? how does that work then? - if you land on your heel, you get a sudden, violent extension of the muscles in the shin. this doesn't happen with 'forefoot' running, so less likely to cause/aggravate shin-splints...

running fore-foot, the only thing the muscles in the front of the shin are doing, is lifting the weight of the foot.

I've had shin splints a couple of times, both times after changing to new running shoes.

The last time I was training for the Safaricom marathon. I'd only been told I was going out to run it about 3 months before the event so a combination of new shoes, overtraining due to lack of time, etc gave me shin splints. After about 10 days I was very impatient so went running, trying not to put weight on the injury by landing on my fore foot, as you describe.

Result? A lovely groin strain which meant I had a whole month of no training before the event, a marathon completed with industrial amounts of painkillers, and 3 months afterwards trying to get rid of the groin strain.

Without having any scientific evidence, I'd say if you get shin splints take a couple of weeks off, get rid of them and train carefully after that, otherwise you risk giving yourself other problems.