[Closed] roundabouts!

Should have drawn that picture badly on ms paint and used more caps. Very poor. 1/10.

this isn't as rant, i just want to know why it seems so hard to use a roundabout?

See that blue line?

See how it doesn't cross the green one?

WHY DOES NO-ONE ELSE?!

Bastards.

What are those little glowing things on the corners of the cars?

So why do so many people not seem to have a clue?

The answer is in the question...

what are those orange blobs?

Beat you to it JoB 😉

Ah, you two must drive BMWs.

How very dare you!

See that blue line?

See how it doesn't cross the green one?

WHY DOES NO-ONE ELSE?!

Bastards.

This +1

I cross this A1/A69 roundabout http://g.co/maps/h3taf every day.
It has very clearly painted lanes on it, with arrows and words.

Every day I see someone sweep clean across the lanes and then back again. Why??

i don't drive a BMW, i've just never seen those orange glowing things on a roundabout

Where is your green line now?
[img] [/img]

Is that Swindon perchance?

When I drive in Ibiza each year, the hardest bit is the local drivers stay on the outside of the roundabout, even if going all the way round!

Never sure whether to join them in this bad practice, as otherwise they often try to overtake on the roundabout and cut me off on exit.

Is that Swindon perchance?

or near a hellmouth?

What are those little glowing things on the corners of the cars?

ESP enhancers I think - but they NEVER BLOODY WORK!

I was following a brand new Yaris, right round 2 roundabouts this morning.
Not one single use of the glowing orange things.
Was thinking, that is weird, maybe they are not fitting indicator stalks to new cars?
Then we got onto the motorway slip road... sure enough [u]WHEN ITS COMPLETELY FARKING OBVIOUS TO ALL AROUND WHERE YOU'RE GOING AND THERE IS NOWHERE ELSE TO SODDING WELL GO[/u] the f^%$ing right indicator comes a-flashing...

Boils my piss, as they say.

Have to admit that on the roundabout above I don't usually signal right.

I know I probably should, but I'm on the inside lane of the roundabout, in a clearly painted right-only lane. Where else am I going to go?

I know I probably should, but I'm on the inside lane of the roundabout, in a clearly painted right-only lane. Where else am I going to go?

What about the people on the opposite side of the roundabout to you? They may not know you were originally in the right lane...

They are stopped at the lights anyway. And by the time I get to where they come on I am signalling left to come off the roundabout.

Where is your green line now?

There's one of those outside Hatton Cross station near Heathrow. Actually not as bad as they look. You just treat them a seperate roundabouts.

I know I probably should, but I'm on the inside lane of the roundabout, in a clearly painted right-only lane. Where else am I going to go?

You know where you are going, but does the traffic around you? Do the pedestrians (granted, there shouldn't be any on your example) know what you're doing? Does the traffic waiting in other joining road? Is that roundabout ALWAYS traffic light controlled? Most of the others for Ncl/A1 aren't.

It's good practice. It's the safe thing to do. It's how drivers are taught. You'd probably get a minor in your driving test if you didn't.

GrahamS, so on a roundabout with no lights, nobody needs to know you're turning RIGHT and not coming off the roundabout?

Last person I heard say that was my mother-in-law.

I have to concentrate hard NOT to indicate. It's just a natural thing as part of driving.

WRT that original diagram:

That's not right, surely? (Well, it is, I checked, but,)

Take a look at the two green exit arrows; they're saying you can go straight from the right-hand lane of the roundabout to the left-hand lane of the exit road? God help you there if there's two lanes of traffic.

[i] God help you there if there's two lanes of traffic.[/i]

I think you're supposed to actually look where you're going. (crazy, I know!)

It's just a natural thing as part of driving

A friend recently passed his bike test and was told NOT to indicate if there was no traffic around though - apparently it shows that you are aware of other road users.

Sounds silly to me and I can't quite believe it is correct either.

I think you're supposed to actually look where you're going.

You're what???

pffft are none of you AWESOME? i bunnyhop roundabouts in my skoda

A friend recently passed his bike test and was told NOT to indicate if there was no traffic around though - apparently it shows that you are aware of other road users.

You know where you are going, but does the traffic around you?

They should - there is only one way for me to go and the lane is clearly painted.

Does the traffic waiting in other joining road?

I'm coming on from the A69 (to the left of that image) and heading off on the A1(s) out the bottom of the image. The other joining roads are held at lights.

Thing is, if I did actually signal right till my exit then I might confuse cars behind me when the extra lane appears to the inside as we pass the first joining road. (at the end of the hatching about 3o'clock).

Every day I see someone move into that inside lane (which should mean they are going all the way around) then get to the Al(S) exit and sweep across two lanes to get left lane on the exit (!) then usually move back to the right lane once they are on the slip.

Is that roundabout ALWAYS traffic light controlled?

Yep (rather pointlessly - it never used to be).

GrahamS, so on a roundabout with no lights, nobody needs to know you're turning RIGHT and not coming off the roundabout?

No I [i]usually[/i] signal right on roundabouts. Just not this one.

It does strike me as a little redundant to signal right when you're in the inside lane of a roundabout. I kinda think that should be assumed unless you signal left, but I suppose it shows you've actively thought about it.

One day, I shall visit this wondrous place, and marvel at it's beauty:

My old driving instructor used to say, "indicating when there's nobody else around is like talking to yourself. It's the first sign of madness."

There's no point indicating if there's no-one to see it; however, for the regular test you're (generally?) taught to always use it so that you've less chance of forgetting.

My old driving instructor used to say, "indicating when there's nobody else around is like talking to yourself. It's the first sign of madness."

I actually tried what my friend told me just after we had discussed it and then found myself in exactly the above situation and decided it was a stupid rule.

Elf: I like that even the animated cars don't understand it. Watch the confused red car at 8 seconds in.

Heh! The red car buggers off, never to be seen again. All just a bit too much for it, obviously. 😆

If I indicate, but there's nobody around to see it, do they make any light?

We have interesting roundabouts here where the lane markings are in a spiral not a circle - so you go into whatever lane you are supposed to for the exit you want and if you stay within lines you will end up going off at the right exit

think this will show it
http://g.co/maps/a5ueb

We have interesting roundabouts her where the lane markings are in a spiral not a circle - so you go into whatever lane you are supposed to for the exit you want and if you stay within lines you will end up going off at the right exit

[i]No I usually signal right on roundabouts. Just not this one.[/i]

Beg your pardon then.

Yeah this one is a spiral too TJ.

I do the green line, but nearly everyday I see someone take the red "racing" line:
[img] [/img]
(Apologies for MS Paint art)

So I justify not signalling right by saying that folk might think I'm taking the red line.

I used to drive Beemers you know. Though I don't now, you know. The last newbeemer I collected from the garage was accompanied by my mate (then mate, not now, we fell out, but that’s another story, maybe later, when I've got a tea and some biccies, dunnno', I’ll fill you in, I'll see how I feel) So, upon collection garagebloke handing over the keys (you know the pushbuttontypes) So keyfob in hand he’s pressing and the orange things are flashing showing the alarms set/unset and I’m laughing as my mate (you know him, the one above, keep up) is sitting in his porkerBoxterSroofdownstereoon is sitting there pretending the flashy things are in time with the music. Well, garageblokes having fun, me I want to just get into the car an booogeroff, and the orange flashythings stop flashing. Garagebloke turns to me and says “them’s the indicators, but you’ll be driving too fast for anyone to see them right” At that point my mate (yes him) pop’s up with “he drives like your granddad” I stood there about to bust laughing and garagebloke points to my mate (yeah you know him better than me by now) and says “see you bought the ghay version sonny” I howl, mates storms off in a huff, garagebloke giggles and continues to show me around the car.
That is all.

You'd probably get a minor in your driving test if you didn't.

No, that'd be a serious fault, even a dangerous one if it lead to someone else reacting to it in a way that put either person at risk, eg they assumed you were going straight on and pulled out infront of you when you caried on round. I failed my first test when the indicator self canceled before I'd crossed a give way line joining a DC!

Indicating late is a minor.

WRT that original diagram:

That's not right, surely? (Well, it is, I checked, but,)

Take a look at the two green exit arrows; they're saying you can go straight from the right-hand lane of the roundabout to the left-hand lane of the exit road? God help you there if there's two lanes of traffic.

You are always supposed to pull off into the left hand lane, the right hand lane is ofr overtaking (i.e. if there is already somethign in the left lane). You should be pulling into the left lane some time just after the last exit if it's clear. Aiming for the right nad lane and not indicting runs the risk of someone pulling onto the roundabout at the last entry and T-boneing you.

On a interesting note, you can fail your test for indicating right if you're taking the 2nd exit and there is no straight ahead, you should treat it as a straight ahead!

Just taken my MC test so spent 6 hours being told off by a loud northen biker bloke for doing all the things I'd picked up driving a car, including slowing down to turn right at lights when the filter arrow is lit you should cary on without slowing unececeraly!

You are always supposed to pull off into the left hand lane, the right hand lane is ofr overtaking

Whit??? Surely not.

In fact I failed my first test for pulling off into the left lane (having joined the roundabout in the right), which is why it bugs me when other people do it.

In an ideal world, you'd be in the left lane on the roundabout before you got there.

These here helical roundabout jobbies are the future, anyway. There's [url= http://g.co/maps/ahngu ]one near me[/url], it's just a shame that most people ignore the paint and try and kill me daily anyway, much as per Graham's diagram.

[img] [/img]

End of thread perchance?

as well as strange orange flashing lights in that highway code diagram it looks like a car approaching the roundabout is braking presumably expecting to have to stop - now i'm old and do that but impression i have is that majority accelerate into a roundabout expecting traffic on the roundabout to slow only performing an emergency stop if encountering a truck doing the same thing

antigee: A (police) friend of mine once opined that if you have to drop below 3rd to take a roundabout then you've "failed" 😀

Just arguing with the wife the other day about indicating. I don't drive very often and always indicate whenever I'm turning anywhere. She drives every day and indicates when she feels she needs to, but doesn't see any connection between that and other drivers not indicating when they should.

Like most things to do wth driving we have protocols because people don't have perfect judgment, and yet many drivers think they're above them.

It has very clearly painted lanes on it, with arrows and words.

Now the nobbers know where they are supposed to be but ignore it to overtake traffic (mostly going SA but use RH lane to beat the queue)

Nothing is more satisfying than seeing some tool try this and get blocked out, so that they either have to go right or just sit there indicating to get back in.

Nothing is more satisfying than seeing some tool try this and get blocked out

[i]Like most things to do wth driving we have protocols because people don't have perfect judgment, and yet many drivers think they're above them.[/i]

True, but I think there's something in not indicating if it's not of benefit to others or if it's a risk to yourself.

Certainly on a bicycle I'd rarely indicate left, as it's often an invite for someone to move into a space that isn't really there.

True, but I think there's something in not indicating if it's not of benefit to others or a a risk to yourself.

Yesssssss.... justified! 😀

Certainly on a bicycle I'd rarely indicate left, as it's often an invite for someone to move into a space that isn't really there.

Major to minor junction; I was told (on the MC) to indicate left, and stay in the center of your lane untill the junction (i.e. do what a car would do) so that thye dont have space to do anythign stupid.

Minor to major, pull into the edge at the give way line to allow right turners to pull up next to you. But thats just politeness as they can't go anywhere untill theres room to turn left anyway.

[i]Major to minor junction; I was told (on the MC) to indicate left, and stay in the center of your lane untill the junction (i.e. do what a car would do) so that thye dont have space to do anythign stupid.[/i]

That still leaves the problem of cars coming the opposite way on major intending to turn right into minor.
Car sees you indicate left, thinks - 'Ah I can turn right now as bicycle is turning left', but fails to take into account that the bike will be taking up quite a bit of the minor that the car is now trying to occupy. Safer simply not to let them have the option of entertaining the thought in the first place imo.

indicating splits the camps doesnt it!

my advanced instructor told me to indicate only when it was of benefit to others, both car and pedestrian. I believe the thinking was it becomes habit and not a reaction to whats going on around you.

Cougar - Member
In an ideal world, you'd be in the left lane on the roundabout before you got there.

These here helical roundabout jobbies are the future, anyway. There's one near me, it's just a shame that most people ignore the paint and try and kill me daily anyway, much as per Graham's diagram.

The Whitebirk roundabout has improved since being widened & traffic lights installed etc.

The problem one is at the junction of the A678/Whitebirk Rd/Burnley Rd, just off the botton L/H of the picture. A678 has 2 lanes, inner lane marked with left turn arrows for going up Whitebirk Rd, outer lane with straight on arrows for going up Burnley Rd.

Easy to understand you'd think. But no, i've lost count of the numbers of drivers that take the left hand lane & go straight on at the roundabout to go up Burnley Rd.

I believe the thinking was it becomes habit and not a reaction to whats going on around you.

I was certainly taught to have a think before indicating.

e.g. someone coming up on your right when you need to overtake then don't start indicating until they have passed, otherwise they might think you haven't seen them and have a panic.

Sadly the more common approach seems to be [i]Signal-Begin Manoeuvre-Mirror[/i].

Dolcered - Member
indicating splits the camps doesnt it!

my advanced instructor told me to indicate only when it was of benefit to others, both car and pedestrian

Exactly that 😀

It's one of those subjects that I tend to cover in detail over several sessions, signals are part of the information phase of the system (of car control) and need to be considered at every phase 😀

In other words you should always consider using a signal and in doing so think about why and if that information could be misconstrued (don't get me started on head lamp flashing!)

For example: you intend to take the second of two junctions close on the left and there is a car pulling out of the first, don't indicate left before the first one, the car may pull out.

On this basis I always teach you should signal when:

1. .. it would benefit another road user
2. ..you are changing direction or speed and need to make your intentions clear
3. ..to do so would comply with the Highway Code
4. ..to do so as part of a systematic approach of dealing with an unpredicatable environment
5.. it leaves nothing to chance
6. ..it takes account of the 'critical man' (i.e. someone looking out of a window who say's "look at that police car it didn't indicate at that junction")

Signalling 'indiscriminantly' can be as bad as 'not signalling at all'

Mirror indicate manoeuvre for every vehicle all the time.

The problem one is at the junction of the A678/Whitebirk Rd/Burnley Rd, just off the botton L/H of the picture.

Yep - I travel that twice a day usually. You're not quite right though, I don't think; it's actually three lanes by the time you get to the roundabout, two onto the roundabout and one that either takes you left up Whitebirk Drive [i]or onto the first lane of the roundabout [/i](see http://g.co/maps/wh5hh ).

Where I come unstuck is, the middle / right lane feeds into two lanes on the roundabout, round it, and off onto the M65. Pretty much daily, someone will get onto the roundabout from the middle lane and swing across into the right hand lane (from the vantage point [url= http://g.co/maps/8346d ]here[/url] to where the silver car in front is), causing me to have to brake / accelerate / change lanes to avoid a collision. Sounding the horn invariably makes not a jot of difference.

Mirror indicate manoeuvre for every vehicle all the time.

So you're dismissing the notion that signals can sometimes be unhelpful or easily misconstrued?

So you're dismissing the notion that signals can sometimes be unhelpful or easily misconstrued?

No, He's saying that swerveing blindly into the next lane is a bad idea.

The mirror bit is looking the mirror/arround you, decided if the manouver you want to complete is safe, then signal your intentions. Your post implies that either you mirror, signal, manouver without thinking or you don't signal, please clarify why you think thats right?

Cougar: yep, basically the opposite side of the problem I see. Seems some folk just completely ignore the painted lanes for some reason.

I sometimes wonder what would be required: flashing electronic coloured catseyes maybe with a big sign saying "Road A: Follow Green, Road B: Follow Red" or perhaps bollards that pop up between the lanes to "discourage" random lane changes.

Your post implies that either you mirror, signal, manouver without thinking or you don't signal, please clarify why you think thats right?

Does it? Sorry. That wasn't my intent.

I was advocating [i]more[/i] thinking. Some drivers seem to just [i]Mirror-Signal[/i] as one action (or even [i]Signal-Mirror[/i] as I said) rather than looking in the [i]Mirror[/i] and deciding the point at which it is best to start the [i]Signal[/i], and then when to start the [i]Manoeuvre[/i]*

*Thank fox for spellcheckers.

The point was that just blindly signalling can be just as dangerous as not signalling.

(by the way, I'm not proclaiming to be a driving expert. Far from it. I'm relatively new to driving and only have a basic car license. But other drivers still have me scratching my head most days).

True, but I think there's something in not indicating if it's not of benefit to others or if it's a risk to yourself.

Just to clarify, as others have pointed out there are situations where indicating [i]at the wrong time[/i] can confuse other people so obviously you need to take account of that. OTOH decising whether to indicate at all after weighing up all the factors is fine if you're aware of all the factors which I'd say people rarely are.

So what's your verdict on spiral roundabouts then MrSalmon?

Should you still be indicating right when the new lanes start appearing at your right, leaving you in the middle lane (e.g. [url= http://g.co/maps/abmg4 ]here[/url]) or might that just confuse drivers behind you?

I think if I was going to indicate right on this roundabout then I'd probably cancel it at that point anyway, then start indicating left as soon as I was past the last exit before mine.

Tandemjeremy no you know it is actually maneouvre, signal with middle finger?

Oh and what about all the wa**** who indicate left ALL the way around a roundabout BUFOONS!! there are too many people on the roads who need re-assessments!

Should you still be indicating right when the new lanes start appearing at your right, leaving you in the middle lane (e.g. here) or might that just confuse drivers behind you?

I was told to indicate right untill you need to indicate left.

There's a roundabout in Darlington on one of the town center test routes where you have to be in the left hand lane with the right indicator on in order to turn left imediately after leaving the roundabout (which is technicaly the 2nd exit, but they still tell you to put the right hand indicator on which I got told off for doing on another darlington raoundabout!). Apparently if you get that route the examiner will tell you the exact instructions rather than let you get lost!

you have to be in the left hand lane with the right indicator on in order to turn left imediately after leaving the roundabout (which is technicaly the 2nd exit

Huuuh??? Google Maps link?

On an unmarked roundabout, if I'm going straight on, I look in my mirrors to see if someone is behind/beside me and then take the shortest route across the roundabout using both "lanes"

The "racing line" if you must.

Is there a problem doing this?

What I mean is yo always indicate correctly even if you think you are the only vehicle on the road. You don't decide not to indicate because there is no one to see.

Of course inappropriate signalling is wrong - but not signalling is wrong as well

Munqe-chick - Member

Tandemjeremy no you know it is actually maneouvre, signal with middle finger?

I once gave a plain police car the finger 😳 I was riding without lights as well. I got rather a bollocking

I think if I was going to indicate right on this roundabout then I'd probably cancel it at that point anyway, then start indicating left as soon as I was past the last exit before mine.

Basically this, but I'd probably keep indicating right until that point and then switch to left.

It's all bound up I suppose in how well people use the lanes generally and what people will read into the fact that you're in a particular lane. I guess the reality is though that the lane you're in doesn't really mean anything, or at least you can't assume that it does.

I guess the reality is though that the lane you're in doesn't really mean anything, or at least you can't assume that it does.

Ironically if everyone did actually use the lanes on those spiral roundabouts properly then their lane would convey ALL the information required and no signals would be needed at all* - but obviously this would never happen.

(*except maybe in unusual circumstances like a cyclist going all the way round in the outside lane)

[img] [/img]
/p>

God! I had to drive over that twice a day for three weeks. Craziness.
Acceleration is a good tool.

I really like those roundabouts where the left lane is for the first exit only, like them there spiral roundabouts above. Makes it so simple.
Problems arise with getting in the correct lane when you don't know the road, and the lane markings are painted on the ground, underneath queuing traffic.

Yeah they are fond of those in Newcastle.
Especially the ones where the left lane never actually joins the roundabout at all and just skirts near it.