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[url= http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/7933990.stm ]bastards[/url]
I hope they rot in hell, the people responsible for this I mean
Dear God, I really hope we're not about to return to times of trouble like we've seen before.
Forget all the politics and what have you, for a moment. It's just so senseless.
Why?
For f*** sake. Any so called republican is disgraced by this. If the IRA had any honour they would be dealing with scum like this instead of knocking off banks and flogging counterfeit goods.
My thoughts are with the families
it must stop and soon, just when the place started to get normal.
Not again. WTF.
Looks like they were lured into a trap
i watched the news on sunday morning in disbeleave, a 1000 memorys of 3 tours hitting me like a train, and now this, i didnt think i would see it again in the news , the people of N.I are strong and mostly decent , they will over come this outrage, typical way they do / did there dirty work im afraid, R.I.P lads.
I wonder how long the politicians can talk around this one?
At risk of kicking off the usual arguments, and without being an apologist for anything (I'm disgusted and saddened by the events of the last few days):
[i]I wonder how long the politicians can talk around this one?[/i]
Hopefully for as long as necessary. Talking is after all the solution. It's the only thing that has worked so far.
[i]Any so called republican is disgraced by this.[/i]
The majority of republicans (and what do you mean 'so called'?) will be disgusted. Why should they be disgraced?
[i]If the IRA had any honour they would be dealing with scum like this instead of knocking off banks and flogging counterfeit goods. [/i]
You know that this (probably) wasn't the IRA right? It was (probably) the Real IRA, who are entirely separate?
One of the problems with the NI situation is that the rest of the UK has very, very little knowledge of the background and history that led to the Troubles. Unfortunately it's not as black and white as The Sun would like to make out.
You know that this (probably) wasn't the IRA right? It was (probably) the Real IRA, who are entirely separate?
Would have thought the provisional IRA would pretty much know who had split from them to form the Real IRA and would therefore be able to 'deal with it'
True. But then an inter-republican 'civil war' wouldn't be pretty.
The only true way forward is for the power/support base for these cowards to be utterly removed, and the only way that can be done is by continuing the progress that has already been made.
There is no appetite in NI for going back to the dark days. This is a blip. A sad, disgusting, terrible blip, but a blip nonetheless.
"[i]One of the problems with the NI situation is that the rest of the UK has very, very little knowledge of the background and history that led to the Troubles[/i]"
However the only way is forward, away from the past. I was in Manchester when the IRA blew it up attempting to kill thousands. I live near Warrington where those oh so brave freedom fighters blew up two little innocent boys. However no matter how unpalatable, a line must be drawn and both sides agree to move on. There is NO other option.
It seems to me that someone has a vested interest in the troubles kicking off again.
Coyote - very well said.
We had the bomb disposal squad in at work the other week and he was saying that it was kicking off big time across there and has been bad for a long time but there has been a big cover up going on.
He was saying that all the weapons being used are the same as those that were prevalent prior to the 'peace process.'
There is still a lot of crap going on over there but knee capping's and the likes don't get headlines. They have been booby-trapping the bombs and are/were desperate to kill an operative to grab a headline and as he said, the press are daft enough to give them maximum exposure to help them on their way.
Would anyone care to offer an explanation as to why there has been an escalation in violence ? I know that things have been bubbling under for a while, special forces being deployed before last weeks killings etc, so it seems evident that there has been some clue that things were likely to kick off.
Any coherent answers rather than the usual sectarian mud slinging would be appreciated. For all those living over there, who usually accuse us of not knowing, or not understanding, this is an opportunity to enlighten us.
Trailmonkey - one of the by-products of the Troubles was the racketeering (guns and bombs don't buy themselves), hence the massive involvement on both sides in the taxis, prostitution, drugs etc. Now the guns and bombs aren't (generally) being bought any more you're left with large organised crime 'empires', with all the nastiness that usually brings.
It's been argued that one of the aims of the increase in violence may be to actually bring the British troops back and therefore distract media/ Govt attention from the racketeering.
Plus, there'll always unfortunately be people like the Real IRA who will never be satisfied until there's a united Ireland, are frustrated because they know they're never going to get it and vent that frustration with acts like those of this weekend.
Plus, there'll always unfortunately be people like the Real IRA who will never be satisfied until there's a united Ireland, are frustrated because they know they're never going to get it and vent that frustration with acts like those of this weekend.
Ok, so has something changed within the Peace Process that has suddenly frustrated the Republicans ? Surely all sides new at the outset what was likely/unlikely to be achieved ?
[i]Ok, so has something changed within the Peace Process that has suddenly frustrated the Republicans ?[/i]
In a nutshell, yes. It worked. They were hoping it wouldn't, but it looks like it will.
Oh, and let's please not confuse the word 'republican' with mindless terrorist. The mindless terrorists are republicans, but most republicans are disgusted by their actions.
In a nutshell, yes. It worked. They were hoping it wouldn't, but it looks like it will.
It would seem that it hasn't. Still a fair way to go.
Oh, and let's please not confuse the word 'republican' with mindless terrorist. The mindless terrorists are republicans, but most republicans are disgusted by their actions.
Fair point.
Me thinks these people were waiting for Iraq to die down abit before they restarted their campaign. After all, they didnt want to leave a bad taste in the mouths of their American contributors who believe in all that 'homeland/free from the barbarian English like Independence day' bollox again.
Essentially they are criminals who used to have some form of political motive but as above they have descended into being criminal gangs- enforcing,racketteering,drug dealing prostitution etc
Sadly killing squaddies and coppers sends a message to the communities they "serve" - this means extort money form and exploit etc- so there reign of fear can continue.
Violence only leads to violence we must resits and put faith in the peace process whilst using the law to prevent and prosecute these criminals.
trailmonkey,
I have lived in the Greater Belfast area all my life. What is going on now is that the IRA people that broke away are unhappy with the peace process and the Sinn Feinn strategy to deliver a united Ireland.
The only way they see fit to deal with "British occupation" is to murder anyone who is part of the British establishment or anyone who works to support them in any way (ie pizza delivery drivers) this was normal throughout the worst of the troubles as anyone working in construction or supply to the Army/RUC was a "legitimate target"
The disaffected terrorists have been trying to kill for quite sometime, unfortunately now they have succeeded.
What is different about now is that the politicians are united in condemnation however, I do worry if this campaign escalates and the tit for tat starts up again.
The Shinners are having a difficult job keeping the Republicans in favour of the peace process.
[url= http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/david_aaronovitch/article5877219.ece ]How they've missed the pleasure of hating[/url]
Well said.
I heard Adams speaking on the news yesterday and it was the first time I've been convinced by him as truly committed to the peace process. I have friends over there who were enjoying the fruits of the peace, hate to see it go backwards.
JoeBones, thanks for that. Could you please just eloborate on this for me ?
What is going on now is that the IRA people that broke away are unhappy with the peace process and the Sinn Feinn strategy to deliver a united Ireland.
What if anything has changed within the political process to precipitate a return to violence ? Surely it was obvious from the begining that their aims would only ever achieve a limited amount of success ?
trailmonkey, the hardliners (Real/Cont IRA see the current political arrangements as "giving in" to the British.
They are opposed to Stormont and want all British Rule out of Ireland
Sounds like the two splinter groups that have carried out these recent attacks are trying to out do each other in an effort to be top dog.
[url= http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7934750.stm ]This report[/url] gives a pretty good insight and explanation of the motives behind the recent killings.
Terrible events and the last thing the majority of NI people want.
They have lifted an 18yr old for this
Which doesn't surprise me in the slightest, an 18 year old would have little memory of how bad things were during 'the troubles' and could be easily brain washed into believing that a Police officer is a "legitimate target".