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i do understand that moose at no point did i suggest our air force was carpet bombing the entirety of Syria especially not with b52 bombers, chewkw is just cross with me as i told him not to think like a zombie maggot
as you say we have sold weapons to groups who have become Daesh, but we have sold alot more to russia who have armed assad with them. i wrote a post referring to this yesterday as it seemed cruel to me to arm both sides of a conflict where the majority of casualties are civilian
I get that. But what is done is done. The circle jerk that is some threads on here and what is the current state of UK politics is going to change that. What we do to move forward is where the conversation needs to be.
jonah tonto - Memberi do understand that moose at no point did i suggest our air force was carpet bombing the entirety of Syria especially not with b52 bombers, chewkw is just cross with me as i told him not to think like a zombie maggot
😆 I am not crossed btw or just put it another way you have used the term nicely. 😛
Now please use that term more often when you are addressing politicians, bureaucrats, people that you think deserve the terms ZM ...
How do we move forward? Open discussions with Daesh and negotiate a settlement? Have an all out war with them and hope nothing else springs up to take their place? If they are indeed not Islamic nor a State, do we try to knock the wind out of their sails and set up, fund, and support an official Islamic State?
No-one seems to be coming up with [u]any[/u] sort of plan for the future, never mind a credible one.
Well rene59, my plan isn't the best, but I hate bullies so it involves considerable shoe-pie for them.
The world has evolved, I think we will be at 'war' in some form or another for a great many years yet. Which makes me sad for humanity. But there is a serious amount of hate in the world.
The white house is reporting tonight that Russian troops are operational in Syria - so we better get used to military action.
moose - MemberI get that. But what is done is done. The circle jerk that is some threads on here and what is the current state of UK politics is going to change that. What we do to move forward is where the conversation needs to be.
I still remember very clearly that I was the only one on STW that supported Dear Leaders in that region simply because they could contain their population.
However, everyone started to call for Freedooommmm! Freedom for the people there and down with Dear Leaders or Assad etc. The situation snowball domino into the entire region and now you get mass exodus.
Ya, they get their freedom now but see what have happened to the people? Ya, those kept calling for freedom ... ya, you just murdered them.
Ya, I saw that coming and now you have to feed the entire population.
Oh ya ... wait, that's not the end coz there will be many more coming. Many. The situation will not stop now. Bear in mind, they all speak "Arabic" and you have no way to distinguish one from the others.
Luckily Jordan is still intact but Jordan falls you will need to feed the entire population of middle east ...
😯
p/s: My Taiwanese friend once told me if China wanted to get back Taiwan all China needed to do was to let Taiwan ruled China and Taiwan would be doomed ...
Bloody hell LHS posted something that I agree with (I think).
Don't get used to it! 😉
[i]no one leaves home unless
home is the mouth of a shark
you only run for the border
when you see the whole city running as well
your neighbors running faster than you
breath bloody in their throats
the boy you went to school with
who kissed you dizzy behind the old tin factory
is holding a gun bigger than his body
you only leave home
when home won’t let you stay.
no one leaves home unless home chases you
fire under feet
hot blood in your belly
it’s not something you ever thought of doing
until the blade burnt threats into
your neck
and even then you carried the anthem under
your breath
only tearing up your passport in an airport toilets
sobbing as each mouthful of paper
made it clear that you wouldn’t be going back.
you have to understand,
that no one puts their children in a boat
unless the water is safer than the land
no one burns their palms
under trains
beneath carriages
no one spends days and nights in the stomach of a truck
feeding on newspaper unless the miles travelled
means something more than journey.
no one crawls under fences
no one wants to be beaten
pitied
no one chooses refugee camps
or strip searches where your
body is left aching
or prison,
because prison is safer
than a city of fire
and one prison guard
in the night
is better than a truckload
of men who look like your father
no one could take it
no one could stomach it
no one skin would be tough enough
the
go home blacks
refugees
dirty immigrants
asylum seekers
sucking our country dry
****s with their hands out
they smell strange
savage
messed up their country and now they want
to mess ours up
how do the words
the dirty looks
roll off your backs
maybe because the blow is softer
than a limb torn off
or the words are more tender
than fourteen men between
your legs
or the insults are easier
to swallow
than rubble
than bone
than your child body
in pieces.
i want to go home,
but home is the mouth of a shark
home is the barrel of the gun
and no one would leave home
unless home chased you to the shore
unless home told you
to quicken your legs
leave your clothes behind
crawl through the desert
wade through the oceans
drown
save
be hunger
beg
forget pride
your survival is more important
no one leaves home until home is a sweaty voice in your ear
saying-
leave,
run away from me now
i dont know what i’ve become
but i know that anywhere
is safer than here[/i]
i first saw the initial article on Wednesday afternoon and was shocked and saddened by the tragedy that has unfolded...like the OP i wonder what it is that i can do to help...first thing you can do is sign the petition here:
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105991
there are already more than 360,000 names on there so it is now going to parliament for debate but it shouldn't stop there as the more names that go on in support of the petition the better to truly reflect on public opinion in the UK.
while i accept something needs to be done to address the situation at source, that's a long term plan that isn't going to help those who need help right now
more needs to be done to help those trying to escape the bloodshed in Syria
if Germany can accept 800,000 refugees with open arms i don't see why the UK cant offer something of a comparable nature
yes we have our own problems in the UK that also need addressing but when you compare the two there isn't much of a comparison really IMO
even Sweden, France and Italy are doing their fair share and beyond in some cases....even the Greek who are financially on their arses are dong their bit
however i don't see the problem just being one for Europe to solely address....its one for all the other countries to take responsibility for
i'm shocked and disgusted by the lack of action from the surrounding Arab countries such as Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain etc....oil rich countries who could and should do more
with regards to addressing the issues at source...the majority of this stems from meddling in political affairs by the west...the UK to some extent but mainly the USA and its foreign policy.
its insistence to go to "war" under false pretences of making the world a better place has in fact done the opposite...the US and UK went to war over some "alleged" claim that Iraq had WMD's and could deploy them within 45 minutes started things off in the region, they then from a distance arm the insurgents in Libya to overthrow their government leading to chaos, they then try the same in Syria but it didn't work there and instead the insurgents they so helpfully armed to the teeth got ideas of their own and formed their own caliphate in the region taking most of what's left of Iraq and are driving out the people form Syria, which leads us where we are today.
those that stay behind get butchered by ISIS...if you were in that situation i would blame you for wanting to escape either
i'm not going to blame this solely on the UK government but it has had a significant part to play in the events that lead to this...but most of the blame should go on the US as they have been the one key denominator in all of this and even now they stay very much silent on what is currently happening with the refugee crisis.
the US makes the mess and Europe cleans up after it
as for the image of that poor child...his death could have been avoidable but his family were trying to escape to a better life for a reason...sadly that didn't happen and they've paid the ultimate price
Abdullah Kurdi now has to return to Syria to bury his dead wife and 2 dead sons...no parent should ever have to go through that
he'll be doing this with the whole world watching on and i would hope that our thoughts and prayers are with him and his family at this time, and with all those who have suffered a similar fate.
Crikey ... now everyone is privileged scum.
Obviously I never said that all privileged people are scum, but whatever floats your boat fella.
We are all privileged, it was the scum element of our privileged population I was clearly referring too, like the person who simply stated 'We should let them all drown'
Not sure why I have bothered to explain this 😐
Listening peoples opinions on the Radio2 phone-in on this subject now. Jesus wept, I despair at how callous some people come across. I know it is my bad for doing so.
I'm so sad because of all this. Feel totally helpless and worse still completely hopeless and not expecting it to end. 🙁
I think the best suggestion was that of a 'world-wide' / UN type response to this, the media/political pressure seems to be directed at the destination countries and the transit routes. This is a humanitarian crisis and needs solving by humanity overall, I think it is adding to the problem focusing on where these poor people currently are and where they are trying to go.
RM.
^^ thats a very good article
BBC reports that he has now buried his family...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-34150364
the last bit of the video is hard to watch
[url= http://globalnews.ca/news/2201568/in-photos-world-mourns-drowned-syrian-boy-aylan-kurdi/ ]Sleep sweet prince, you are safe now[/url]
I'm firmly in the humanitarian camp on this subject but find it hard understand the surge of outrage over a photo of a dead child, when the internet is full of people including children beheaded and blown to bits by muslim fanatics or those who oppose them and theres also been regular stories of migrant fatalities by the hundreds for several years do we think they're just numbers?
do we think they're just numbers?
Yes. Various studies have shown that, contrary to what you might think, as the body count goes up people tend to be less emotionally affected by the tragedy. You hear that another 50 people have drowned, you turn the page. You see one dead toddler, with a name and a grieving father, and the impact is much greater.
I don't think it's that people are callous (apart from Daily Mail readers of course), it's that it's hard to process numbers - humans are better at connecting with individual stories.
but find it hard understand the surge of outrage over a photo of a dead child.....been regular stories of migrant fatalities by the hundreds for several years do we think they're just numbers?
My advice, don't question it, embrace it. You will never understand or explain 100% what it takes to kick-start action, it is always too late and happens after too many have suffered but it should be celebrated that the "surge" is happening.
gonzy - Member
there are already more than 360,000 names on there so it is now going to parliament for debate but it shouldn't stop there as the more names that go on in support of the petition the better to truly reflect on public opinion in the UK.
There are about 58 million people in the UK if I can recall so let's assume we have 58 million.
360,000 is not even 1% of the UK population so are you suggesting that in a democracy the minority rules over the majority?
I like Politburo me. 😛
scandal42 - Member
Crikey ... now everyone is privileged scum.Obviously I never said that all privileged people are scum, but whatever floats your boat fella.
We are all privileged, it was the scum element of our privileged population I was clearly referring too, like the person who simply stated 'We should let them all drown'
Not sure why I have bothered to explain this
😆 Deep down you know something is not right innit!