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We have just moved to a new propery and our internet company can't instal broadband for another 10 days so we don't have Internet connection at home. It would be extremely useful if we did have internet at home asap for my wife's job but we'll survive.
Now then. Last night I was messing about on the computer and discovered that somebody close by has a wireless internet going on that isn't password protected.
If I knew who it was I'd go and introduce myself and let them know and ask if I could blag 10 days of maybe a couple of hours per day of their internet. I'd even offer to give them some cash for the useage.
I was just wondering however (I'm a real technophobe with computers and the black art of wireless internet), if I log on to their wireless, will they know that a) somebody else is using their wireless b) who that someone is (might not be such a problem - I can then introduce us etc, c) is it safe for my wife to do her work on it? It's very personal stuff about patients etc.
Thanks
connect, download illegal filth and see which door the police kick in. You have then found your network source, go round and introduce yourself 🙂
[i]is it safe for my wife to do her work on it? It's very personal stuff about patients etc.[/i]
does she work over a vpn?
re: the other questions - it is theft and people have been 'done' for it.
why not just knock on a few doors, introduce yourself, explain the situation and go from there.
or buy a pay as you go 3g usb dongle and put a tenners worth of bandwidth on that?
a: yes
b: maybe
c: no
get a 3G dongle if its that critical.
If they haven't figured out how to put on a password, then I am pretty sure they won't notice or know what you are doing 😈
[i]they won't notice or know what you are doing[/i]
but all the local teenagers who are also using it to avoid parental filters on their home boxes might...
Just ask your next door neighbour if you can share theirs for the next 10 days?
My neighbours share mine (long term)...
Sadly it is theft - which always seem a really stupid law. If people don't protect their wifi then it should be tough. Or if it's such a crime why can't I insist my neighbour prevents their nasty wifi signal coming into my house.
Saldy the law doesn't take my stance and can prosecute.
However, if they're stupid enough to leave a wifi unprotected, they're probably also too stupid to be logging, or able to identify, another user on the link.
If the link is a low speed one then they may notice a performance change and report it to their ISP - and they will be able to trace you via your IP.....
If they haven't figured out how to put on a password, then I am pretty sure they won't notice or know what you are doing
+1 one but they maybe using the mac addresses to authenticate. It's still technically theft though. If they check there router, they can see what mac addresses are connecting, they won't necessarily know how that mac addy belongs to but could cut it off. As above if your wife use VPN over broadband, then she should be secure.
TBH I'd expect it to be one of your immediate neighbours, we only see the two networks either side of us & I imagine there whole street behind us (10M's) all have Wifi.
c, no.
And if she has to think about it then she shouldn't be working with that sort of material.
A: No - if they're not clued-up enough to secure their network then they're very unlikely to notice someone else is connecting to it.
B: No - see above.
C: Not really. You're able to connect to it, and so can anyone else. Definitely not secure.
DrRS**** - Member
Sadly it is theft - which always seem a really stupid law. If people don't protect their wifi then it should be tough. Or if it's such a crime why can't I insist my neighbour prevents their nasty wifi signal coming into my house.
So do you also believe if some-one leaves there house open or keys in the car, it's fair game and the new 'owner' shouldn't be prosecuted?
i did it for a week and a half til we got ours connected. as noted above, they won't notice.
Unlikely that you'll be traced by your IP as it's more likely that their router will be using NAT & DHCP so your computer will just look like one of theirs sitting behind their router. From the outbound point of view, the entire connection will only have one public facing ip address (the one already there).
edit - but yes it is possible they're just using MAC filtering rather than encryption. I've been using that level of protection for years & I'm a bit of a geek so would likely notice if someone was using my connection.
z1ppy - MemberSo do you also believe if some-one leaves there house open or keys in the car, it's fair game and shouldn't be prosecuted?
quite obviously specious analogies. it's more like someone holding a massive umbrella while it's raining. if there's spare space under the umbrella and they don't even notice you're there, what's the harm? 🙂
theflatboy - it's more like everyone dipping into a river and taking what water they want - most of the time no-one notices but if enough people do it the river runs dry...
where the harm? They've paid for a service and you get it for free? Your umbrella analogy is just as specious...
wwaswas - Membertheflatboy - it's more like everyone dipping into a river and taking what water they want - most of the time no-one notices but if enough people do it the river runs dry...
also a good one, though i wouldn't say it's more like that than my proverbial umbrella!
z1ppy - Memberwhere the harm? They've paid for a service and you get it for free? Your umbrella analogy is just as specious...
it's not, you know. in your examples you're effectively talking about someone stealing something physical from someone and leaving them without it. the umbrella, and in fact river, analogy do not interfere with the likely use of someone too stupid to sort their network security. such "borrowing" is unlikely to affect them in the short term.
just knock on a neighbours door and ask to log in for a couple of weeks whilst oyu get your connection sorted, offer them multiple tins of quality street and beer.... it might be cheaper to buy a dongle considering the cost of quality street when its not christmas.
Assuming you don't download a lot of data, I'd consider it open season. If you plan on watching TV over it I'd think you're a bit mean.
it's not, you know. in your examples you're effectively talking about someone stealing something physical from someone and leaving them without it
In the eyes of the law it the same thing shirely, so your talking technicalities, which too are meaningless & not in anyway a defence.
TBH I couldn't care less, but technically it's theft, which can and has been prosecuted (though it doubtful anyone would know).
So do you also believe if some-one leaves there house open or keys in the car, it's fair game and the new 'owner' shouldn't be prosecuted?
My neighbour's cat often wanders through my garden. If the cat takes a dump on my lawn, does that mean I've stolen the turd?
I don't think they can trace you off using someone elses wireless. I'm thinking about warrants that I have actioned for indecent images, if you have an unlocked, unsecure wi-fi and someone else uses it and downloads indecent images you can't trace them.
People are talking about it being "theft", has this been tested in a court then? As yes technically throwing your mattress into the neighbours skip without their permission is theft but reality is would you be prosecuted?? Just a thought, not trying to be antagonistic.
Personally if you are doing personal stuff then I wouldn't use someone elses wireless
yeah i guess it is on a technicality - i'm playing devil's advocate to be fair, though i have done it myself. interestingly the neighbour from whom i borrowed had a netgear setup on the default settings, but i though changing the passwords and security would be going a bit far. 😆
Munqe-chick - MemberPeople are talking about it being "theft", has this been tested in a court then?
i believe it has, such a decision rings a bell. god knows how they established who was doing it, presumably was ridiculously blatant. 😕
such "borrowing" is unlikely to affect them in the short term
Unless of course like most low usage users (which somebody with no security is likely to be) they have a BW limit.
yes it is possible they're just using MAC filtering rather than encryption. I've been using that level of protection for years & I'm a bit of a geek so would likely notice if someone was using my connection
Cool - where is it you live? <fires up wifi sniffing and MAC spoofing SW>
People are talking about it being "theft", has this been tested in a court then?
Thought so, as it was a big news item locally a while back, but seemingly now I search it out, he was 'only' cautioned.
Offense from the article (below): [i]dishonestly obtaining electronic communications services with intent to avoid payment[/i]
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/hereford/worcs/6565079.stm
& yes sitting outside ppl's home with a laptop is kinda blatant...
How about tethering to a smart phone and use the 3G?
yeah that's the weakness of MAC filtering but frankly I'll take the risk to save a bit of hassle!
well not exactly hard to set up wpa2
a) probably not
b) unlikely due to a, they'd need outside help
c) you'd want to be on a VPN if it's sensitive stuff.
You need to be careful with unsecured wi-fi, dishonest folks will use it to obtain all that data you are putting through their box and use it for their own ends.
Seeing as everyone's got wi-fi nowadays, use it as an excuse to meet the neighbours and borrow theirs for a bit (I doubt they'd mind for a few days).
Seems Wi-Fi is the 21st century's 'cup of sugar'.
There's a wireless network down our road called 'F*** Off Students' but without the swear filter avoidance. I assume the students tried piggy backing the network at some point.
Frodo - Member
How about tethering to a smart phone and use the 3G?
+1
When we moved house, Talk Talk couldn't get us online for 6 weeks. Morons.
Anyway, we just used my HTC Desire as a wi-fi hotspot. Worked really well. if you or your other half have a smartphone, perhaps you can just do this?
some good names here;
[url= http://www.smosh.com/PC/smosh-pit/photos/22-awesomely-named-wireless-networks ]http://www.smosh.com/PC/smosh-pit/photos/22-awesomely-named-wireless-networks[/url]
"wecanhearyouhavingsex" is quite good
some names may be nsfw.
It is illegal to connect to someone elses WiFi, as above it is classed as theft.
Now what they might be doing is offering a "free wireless hotspot" in return for all your passwords and credit card details that you enter through that hotspot. 😉
I've (occasionally) used our neighbours unsecured wifi over the past few years. No-one has ever noticed. 🙂
I say occasionally, because I've got my own connection and sometimes can't be bothered to go and switch it on - the iPad automatically connects to the neighbour's one.
My one is free from Sky, their's is free.. what's the difference? 8)
Why not try a bit of quid pro quo - offer to secure their connection for a few days lend?
Chances are though this will mean you'll get every PC query they have for ever more, so personally I'd use it and keep quiet 🙂
My one is free from Sky, their's is free.. what's the difference?
Isn't that like saying, my neighbour pays the same council tax, so I have as much right to use his bin/council services.
Erm, I can spot the word "the" being common in the 2 sentences. Apart from that...
When we moved house, Talk Talk couldn't get us online for 6 weeks. Morons.
3 months and counting for plusnet/BT!
If the link is a low speed one then they may notice a performance change and report it to their ISP - and they will be able to trace you via your IP.....
FAIL!
I've not had a chance to read [i]all[/i] of the replies but thank you all anyway.
I might just behave and leave it well alone. My thieving days are long since gone.
My wife has been on long term sick following surgery but is being bombarded with questions and problems from her work and as she is about to go back, she's been trying to get a headstart on the mountain of work that is waiting for her. Other than this, she doesn't ever do any work at home via the Internet (in reference to somebody implying she should know about Internet security. She's an ace Ward Manager but a rubbish IT bod.).
Thanks again everybody.
That's the last of my work internet access used for today.
If the link is a low speed one then they may notice a performance change and report it to their ISP - and they will be able to trace you via your IP.....
FAIL!
If everything's IPV6 enabled then anything IPV6 going over the link would most likely have part of your MAC addy as part of the address. OK the ISP wouldn't be able to trace, but there would be a telltale sign.
Might set up my spare wifi box (the DSL bit broke) as an open accesspoint for a laugh, just so see who connects.
+1 what others have said about theft.
And it's also in breach of the Computer Misuse Act 1990.
[url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_piggybacking#United_Kingdom ]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_piggybacking#United_Kingdom[/url]
Theft of WiFi hasn't been tested in court ...give it a go 😉 I would tell her work if they want to get internet installed go ahead otherwise go stuff themselves!!!
If everything's IPV6 enabled then anything IPV6 going over the link would most likely have part of your MAC addy as part of the address. OK the ISP wouldn't be able to trace, but there would be a telltale sign.
Surely to trace back to you they'd need to get a warrant to go round every computer within range of the wireless and check to see if the details match? Can't see that one happening!
I don't secure my wireless, so if you live in HP19 come knock on my door 🙂
Only my two immediate neighbours can 'see' it, and we all are on unlimited Virgin - so I ain't worried, and all laptops fully secured.
Maybe they do know what they are doing and are logging all data to get passwords :p
If you have signed up for BTFon and they are too then you can use theirs I guess - as long as you have started to pay: https://www.bt.com/wifi/secure/index.do?s_cid=con_FURL_btfon
[i]If everything's IPV6 enabled then anything IPV6 going over the link would most likely have part of your MAC addy as part of the address[/i]
Yeah, there'll be lots of IPV6 traffic going over it. 😉
And of course, if you really felt paranoid you could easily alter your MAC address before connecting.
my network is called 'stoptryingtostealmywifiyou****s'
but spelt right
and the password is well rude and offensive
Theft of WiFi hasn't been tested in court ..
Yes, it has. s125 of Communications Act. First conviction in 2005. http://www.bailii.org/uk/other/journals/Script-ed/2009/6_2_SCRIPT-ed_355.html at 3.1.
Very rarely prosecuted, though. If I were in the OP's position I would just do it.
You could of course find a neighbour who has BT Fon: http://www.btfon.com/
speaking of funny network names. someone in our office tethers his phone and his network is called 'Pretty fly for a wi-fi'
made me chuckle
If everything's IPV6 enabled then anything IPV6 going over the link would most likely have part of your MAC addy as part of the address. OK the ISP wouldn't be able to trace, but there would be a telltale sign.
Yeah because the ISP will know their customers MAC address. They are also are going to go to the hassle of tracing who's connected to customers connection. It's just not going to happen on top of that MAC is not an IP trace. The point of the fail is that IP tracing would only show up which customer had that IP.