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If my numbers came up, I wouldn’t even bother with notice periods or any of that shit, the worse that can happen is 1. you don’t get paid. Who cares? and 2. They’d give you a bad reference. Again, who cares?
I wonder if they could sue you for breach of contract, especially if they could prove materiel loss which would probably be difficult but not impossible.
Personally I would go in late every day and be annoying (or more annoying than usual) ignore my managers etc until they walked me off the premises. Probably quicker than working my notice with less chance of being sued. Although following on from that logic, quite a few of the people I indirectly work with could already be lottery winners and are yet to be escorted offsite, so my cunning plan could backfire.
If my numbers came up, then I would switch our businesses to not for profit and have them run for the benefit of the local community.
I wouldn't be doing a lot hands on, just the Chairman of the trust.
It would be more beneficial to employ people rather than do the work myself.
I wonder if they could sue you for breach of conract, especially if they could prove materiel loss which would probably be difficult but not impossible.
Personally I would go in late every day and be annoying (or more annoying than usual) ignore my managers etc until they walked me off the premises. Probably quicker than working my notice with less chance of being sued. Although following on from that logic, quite a few of the people I indirectly work with could a;lready be lottory winners.
I don't think any employer would want a dis-interested lottery winner working for them.
Proving any significant material loss is almost impossible. Even if they did, it wouldn't be more than a few thousand.
We have neighbours who earn a lot more then we do, have quite expensive holidays, run a completely unnecessary car, always seen with new clothes and shoes, have spent a fortune on interior decor, 800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen, massive TV, all sorts of lifestyle gadgets etc; constantly needing to take out loans.
I’m amazed anyone would go to that level of detail telling their neighbours their spending/shopping habits and financial position.
800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen
Are you a stalker?
On reflection I think that it was that for me it triggered some deep seated fears about the life choices I've made.
I'm very much in the "play the hand that I've been dealt" school of thought.
For various reasons I've never settled down with someone and had kids, and because of that I've never had to take on large amounts of debt to pay for somewhere to live and support a family. I share the costs of a car, and get around mostly by bike and public transport.
I'm quite happy, but am aware that this puts me out of sync with a lot of the world. I stopped actively dating purely because of the discrepancy between the expectations of the women I was meeting online(Ooh a doctor!) and the reality. Also the dating pool is really thin around here and at the end of the day it's a numbers game.
My friend telling me this was a bit of a shock, and if I'm honest, I think he was looking for a bit of validation by telling me, and it just made me reassess my life choices.
I have recently made a change in regards to this. I get paid quite a bit over the odds for what I do and I was saving quite a decent amount, bought a house with it and a bunch of nice other toys and generally sustained quite a carefree lifestyle. My work was making me utterly miserable in some respects though and my mental health was really starting to suffer - to the point where I was just too tired and unmotivated to do anything about it like I dunno find a new job.
I spoke to my work after much back and forth, time off with stress etc, and it was decided I would do just 3 days per week - not compressed, just at 60% pay. I am *very* privileged in that this still works out as a very liveable amount, though I have had to cut back on luxuries to save and have to think about purchases more. I didn't think too much before about dropping a few hundo on something cool I wanted whereas now I would have to be careful with that and save for things.
However, the quality of life increase is phenomenal. The house is cleaner all the time, I am more motivated for exercise or whatever, and I am doing some learning in my free time and getting all my neglected life admin in order. I am in good form today because I know I essentially only have one more day of work this week and it is not tomorrow. The company is also pretty happy with it too, as things are not looking so great financially as they did in the pandemic and other staff are having some hours cut.
Only issue is that I still don't super like my job - although it is much easier to handle mentally. I don't want to get too used to working 3 days a week because when I do find a new one that's 5 it will feel brutal for a while.
Three days a week is brilliant. I look back and wonder how I fitted everything else in round full time 45+ hrs a week working. Obviously not everyone can do it though. Even if a decent number of hours is required 3x12 or 4x10 hr days is hugely better than 5x8. There must be many organisations that could do that sort of thing.
800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen
That's actually an investment, and a quality of life improvement... a bit like good shoes, a good matress, a good office chair etc. It might cost more but it's so much nicer and will last so much longer.
I wouldn't buy cheap bed clothes again, not that I will need to, any decade soon, and I'm not a higher rate tax payer.
800 thread count Egyptian cotton bed linen
It's a bit like a really good duck down quilt.
Once you have had one, you would never have anything else.
The GF often says "we're too poor to buy cheap".
As such we will often not buy the cheapest option.
But then we generally buy what we need and not just because we want.
I’m amazed anyone would go to that level of detail telling their neighbours their spending/shopping habits and financial position.
It’s not hard to work out. Their behaviour betrayed them. Point is they maintained their lifestyle and spending levels in spite of having to borrow money. Me, I’d pay my debts off before having expensive holidays and buying lots of new stuff etc. Especially if someone had been nice enough to help me avoid an expensive bank loan. Different ethics.
It’s not hard to work out.
the thread count of their bed sheets? Must be some bladdy good binoculars, not to mention the high vantage point, you have.
"Must be some bladdy good binoculars, not to mention the high vantage point, you have."
In fairness it could be from going through their bin. Not direct surveillance.
Especially if someone had been nice enough to help me avoid an expensive bank loan. Different ethics.
I don't know how much of it is different ethics vs different priorities. Were you hurting for not having the money? Had you expressed that you'd like then to pay it back in a given timeframe? Presumably they did pay it back.
We need a bit of C-Jay in this thread for understanding of Happiness - very chilled, spoken word starts at 3min in.
And perhaps this,
In fairness it could be from going through their bin. Not direct surveillance.
I laughed 🙂
I went down to 4.5 days when my kids were at nursery age. Has been amazing to spend time with them growing up. They are now art school and i get a few hours on my own pootling about.
If i could afford it i would go down to 4 days
I suppose being not being overly enthusiastic about paid work has its drawbacks: a staycation, cold left-over pizza and cold water for lunch, ageing 26" Decathlon mountain bike, Lidl helmet.
If I need to do paid work I will, till then... .
Especially if someone had been nice enough to help me avoid an expensive bank loan.
I don’t know how much of it is different ethics vs different priorities. Were you hurting for not having the money? Had you expressed that you’d like then to pay it back in a given timeframe? Presumably they did pay it back.
When the works were first proposed, they agreed 100%, as it was very necessary. Then, when it actually came to needing to book the work in, they started pleading poverty. So we offered to cover the costs, and they could pay us back later. We proposed a timescale, but they said this would be very hard for them to fulfil, so we agreed to extend that period. Some time later, the works having been done, they then said they'd need more time to pay. So we agreed again. And then we noticed their conspicuous consumption (it didn't involve furtively going through bins or looking through bins). They had three foreign holidays in that time. And they bought a motor scooter (which has sat unused outside ever since). Had we waited until they could 'afford' to pay for the works, the price would have gone up by a significant amount. So we did them a massive favour. Whilst they continued with their affluent lifestyle. I think if your 'priorities' are all about spending money on yourself, whilst owing money to others, then that does fall into pretty selfish behaviour imo. It's not something we'd even dream of doing. I was raised to pay my debts asap, or better still, not have any. If I couldn't afford something, I wouldn't have it, simple as that. Some obviously want to have their cake and eat it.
Some people prefer to live within their means, have less stress, have to work less, retire earlier, have a more comfortable life. This seems to be an increasingly alien concept to many.
Sorry for the thread distraction, but.... @brownperson.... Why didn't you have a contract written up and signed by them? With interest and/or penalty for delayed payment?
Some people prefer to live within their means, have less stress, have to work less, retire earlier, have a more comfortable life.
Absolutely.
Fulfilling Wants vs fulfilling Needs.
Sorry for the thread distraction, but…. @brownperson…. Why didn’t you have a contract written up and signed by them? With interest and/or penalty for delayed payment?
In hindsight, that might have been more prudent. They effectively had an interest free loan, to help subsidise their lifestyle. But they're actually really nice people, and in their defence, I just don't think they actually realise how selfish they are. Such is entitlement and privilege. I'm just happy to have been raised better.
The GF often says “we’re too poor to buy cheap”.
As such we will often not buy the cheapest option.
I missed this earlier. This is wisdom. This is how I tried to live when I was a man of lesser means. A decent pair of shoes is better than multiple pairs of crap ones. As a result, I had better stuff for longer, and actually spent less over time.
Fair play..... You're far too nice.
Hindsight and all that, eh....
Ignorance on their part doesn't is no defence. Hope you got your cash back in full.
No it was all good in the end. As my wife said; we earned a lot of 'karma points'. They're banked for ongoing positive relations. They did appreciate it; it's just they have no self-awareness in that regard.
Some time later, the works having been done, they then said they’d need more time to pay.
Yeah, fair enough. I'd be a little out too if it looked like people were making frivolous purchases whilst claiming they couldn't afford to pay me back as agreed.
Some people are just spenders and no matter how hard they try money burns a hole in their pocket. So glad I was taught “pay yourself first.”
Interesting topic and very timely for me. I earn a fair chunk and considering dropping to 3 days 24hrs in the coming year. I would still be very well off but would have more time now. Alternative is carry on full time work and throw money into savings/pension to enable a full retirement earlier. Recent health issues for my wife suggest I should do the former but we are still trying to work out what is best. Thread is interesting reading.
Everyone’s different.
I enjoy work and for the foreseeable future I wouldn’t want to be without it.
Brutally, it’s fun. Sometimes type 2 fun, but fun.
Others will not have that outlook, and they shouldn’t.
You’re meant to enjoy life if you can.
A decent pair of shoes is better than multiple pairs of crap ones.
I learned this lesson the hard way... I was buying faux leather shoes for business wear from TXmaxx or whatever... they are uncomfortable, and they scuff up quick and drop to bits in months...
I was probably getting through 3 sets a year @£40 a pop, so £120 a year on shoes that are never very good.
One decent pair of leather shoes @£120 will easily last you 2 years+, more if you look after them properly.
If you are really crafty, you can often pick up Clarks shoes discounted on the website with huge reductions.. not the trendiest but good shoes, for example:
https://www.clarks.com/en-gb/clarkdale-easy/26174931-p
I wouldn't wear them with turned up short jeans!!!, but for £65 it will be a good shoe/chelsea boot.
@mattyfez - Goodyear welted shoes will cost 2-3 times that, but they’ll last you a lifetime.
Going though some of that Sam Vimes bollocks:
When I couldn't afford a washine machine I hand washed using Génie which used less detergent, water and electricty than the washing machine now does. I raided bins and went to the market as it was closing to pick up the abandoned fruit and veg, I did buy in bulk. Bangernomics is cheaper, but requires buying some tools and finding the time. As for furniture I had a matress, which I assume even rich people change from time to time. Boots for years were the ones thrown away by Welsh Water. They weren't worn out but needed decontaminating. Clothes came from jumble sales.
The rich aren't richer because they live economically, they're richer because for years I paid them rent, paid a proportion of everything I consumed to them in profits and dividends on the products, and they pay a fraction of the tax poor people pay as a proportion of their income.
As I've got richer (all relative of course), I've stopped paying rent which is the single biggest saving I've ever made. I've also become one of those people who get a part of the profits on the stuff other often poor people consume. And I/we sqander on stuff because I can, because like the rich I have more money than I need to just stay alive.
Edit: consider what rich people spend their money on. Castles? well the top rate stamp duty is only 15% which is less than the VAT on a phone which it's hard to live without in the modern world. Art? 5.5% VAT on imported art if it's still at pre-Brexit levels. Buy a forest? The sales of timber will be tax free.
Around 25 years ago,when i was 40,we sold our business,house,furniture,etc,and set off with a caravan. We were tired of the constant money go round and the hours spent running the business.
No real plan and we ended up in France during summer and Spain in winter.
It was surprising how many other people we met doing the same,and they got a bit of income doing casual work. Living in the caravan meant a lot less personal possessions,no tv so no marketing and a lot more conversations with interesting people we met on campsites.
Due to Brexit this is virtually impossible now within Europe unless you want to try and flout the law.
Now i am back to being in the UK,in a house buying sofas,carpets and cushions.It's bloody boring !
Governments and big businesses have us nicely lined up on a conveyer belt unable to jump off. You stay on that conveyor until you quietly drop off the end.
Edit: consider what rich people spend their money on. Castles? well the top rate stamp duty is only 15% which is less than the VAT on a phone which it’s hard to live without in the modern world.
I don't necessarily disagree, but I don't think it's reasonable to compare stamp duty to VAT. I can't think of anything else that requires you to pay tax every time it changes hands.
A car in France.
If you are really crafty, you can often pick up Clarks shoes discounted on the website with huge reductions.. not the trendiest but good shoes, for example:
Clarks are actually 'on trend' these days. Lots of younger people buying them.
The rich aren’t richer because they live economically, they’re richer because for years I paid them rent, paid a proportion of everything I consumed to them in profits and dividends on the products, and they pay a fraction of the tax poor people pay as a proportion of their income.
And so it has been forever, really. No reason this cycle can't be broken though; state owned industries, proper social housing, higher taxation on wealth. Of course the rich won't like that, but in a proper democracy they wouldn't have much choice. Imagine a world though in which you don't have to try to get rich, because there's more than adequate support and provision for everything in life. For everyone.
Imagine a world though in which you don’t have to try to get rich, because there’s more than adequate support and provision for everything in life.
George Orwell's got that covered.
George Orwell’s got that covered.
Orwell always was a socialist.
He wasn't writing about the dangers of socialism.
He wasn’t writing about the dangers of socialism.
I know that, but the problem is that not everyone is content with being a socialist