[Closed] Mechanical Objects with Character/Soul?

Aye, had similar with motorbikes. Ridiculous really.

Read "I Know you got Soul" by Jeremy Clarkson

Even if you don't like his ramblings, you can't fail to like the book if you've an ounce of engineering blood in your system. As you might have guessed, it's all about some of mankinds greatest invnetions, over the years, many of them not petrol powered either! I was hooked, couldn't put it down, read it in an afternoon...

Don't most stw'rs love/have female names for their bikes???

Thing is I know its a rubbish car and always has been

Eh???!??!?!?!??!?! You are usually raving about it! Not that I'm selling my P1800 or anything 😳

Same with wooden boats. I always feel a bit sad when I see them hauled up and rotting in estuaries. Bad luck to burn them, so the sailors leave them to rot.
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I know exacly what you mean. My Ducati Monster was like that and I miss it. Not the best, or the fastest, or the coolest, but it had [i]something[/i] that made me love it.... 🙂

I found our petrol mower in a ditch and rusting when out with the dog. Took it home and loved it to life again, hardly looks new but I feel the greatest sensation when I fire it up and it chokes into roaring life.

Eh???!??!?!?!??!?! You are usually raving about it!

I love it, its great, doesn't mean that a granny in a 1.0 nissan micra couldn't beat it round a track though!

For me, things that aren't alive get soul/character based on your experiences with them which is why I always find it odd that people talk about brands/bikes that have soul/character when they're just something that you can get your wallet out and buy.

For me, a bottom range big brand bike that you've used for years and have experienced all sorts of things/places on has far more soul or character than something like a new Jones which is soulless until used.

my 106 gti is like that, it's too small, too awkward to work on, too keen to fall apart.

but it's been off the road waiting for bits for 3 weeks now and I've been driving diesel golfs (mk4 and mk5) and I got into the wee peugeot last night and started it and moved it down the drive way and I was gutted that I wouldn't be driving it today.

rol on next week

Rd 350 lc. I loved that bike but I also hated it. When it went it flew but it blew up on a regular basis. Bloody thing put the rod through the side of the barrel.

Bad luck to burn them, so the sailors leave them to rot.

Never heard that one before!

Did any one see the top gear with the british sports? When they turned up at tvr and all the moulds were just rotting outside, i felt heartbroken.

That car from Christine!

For me, a bottom range big brand bike that you've used for years and have experienced all sorts of things/places on has far more soul or character than something like a new Jones which is soulless until used.

I had a CG125 for ages, it was new, shiny, and get me to all those places a 17yr old needs to go, still never had soul though?

Did any one see the top gear with the british sports? When they turned up at tvr and all the [b]cars[/b] [s]moulds[/s] were [s]just rotting outside, i felt heart[/s]broken.

fixed it for you :p

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igmc

Did any one see the top gear with the british sports? When they turned up at tvr and all the moulds were just rotting outside, i felt heartbroken.

Yes, it's very sad to see. I hate to see things break, sink, broken. Madness, I know, but somehow most things generally have some sort of emotional response linked to them, moreso things that are long-serving or linked to experiences. My fun car is not really financially viable, rotting in the driveway, wasting me money and too expensive to insure but I can't bring myself to sell her on, even though that would mean I had more space to build another!

thisisnotaspoon - Member

I had a CG125 for ages, it was new, shiny, and get me to all those places a 17yr old needs to go, still never had soul though?

Doesn't sound like you were experiencing things while on it though - it was just a tool to get you from a to b. That's different.

It's YOU that has the soul.. not the car...

PeterPoddy - Member
I know exacly what you mean. My Ducati Monster was like that and I miss it. Not the best, or the fastest, or the coolest, but it had something that made me love it....

molgrips - Member

It's YOU that has the soul.. not the car...

that's the point of clarkson's book - he looks at the history of things like the hoover dam - the Ak47 - to explain why we have emotional reaction to inanimate objects.

Copy & pasted from the watch one....

I like my watch it's mechanical, I think it's amazing that its all cogs and gears and no battery. I could buy a cheaper more accurate Casio but I don't want one.

I like my boat it's wooden and needs varnishing/paining/repairing every year I could buy a GRP boat it would be better I suppose but I don't want one.

I liked (it died) my Mercian bike it was steel and handmade and wobbled like jelly at 40mph. I could buy an alloy Giant it would be better I suppose however I don't want to. I want another Mercian

I like my old Land Rover, the radiator needs topping up before each drive, it's slow but I like it. I could buy a Nissan but I don't want to.

naaa, reckon its more primal than that,

What have the;

midget
motorbikes
monster
mowers

got in common?

Noisy,
Smelly
Look good (or at least interesting enough to mention)
Tactile
They begin with M

EDIT: I was replying to the 'marketing' relpy, I reckon tiger probaly hit the nail on the head too.

I am not a bike fan but the Monster is lovely IMO.

Anything REALLY useful that does a job brilliantly has a bit of soul IMO - my petrol strimmer and mower, my bike multitool, my Halfords Professional toolkit (!) a few cars that I've had for ages without issues (not always fast - just useful), a couple of bikes and even the odd kitchen device/implement. Just love well designed and well made stuff that works well and keeps on doing so for years and years.

Almost forgot the boat engine - gets left on a pontoon mooring for months on end - all it "asks" for is a service every two years and a bit of two stroke oil yet it starts first time every time and runs soooo smoothly. Nothing special - just a Mercury 2 stroke 60 but it sounds nice and makes the boat go pretty well (the boat weighs naff all). Amazing bit of engineering IMO that gets far harsher treatment than many car engines.

Kawasaki ZX9RC1, raw brutal power - later bikes owned with more cc/power just didn't have the same effect. It took me through some fantastic times plus got me through 3 years of commuting into central London without missing a beat.

And Nokia 6310i :-), still getting over it.

My old XR400 just fun and could see off some much better bits of kit. There was always the fear of stalling it because when it was hot you couldn't get it started for love nor money.

Why wont motorbikes start hot?

Always puzzled me that one.

Objects with value not measured in cash. Through use, its secrets are revealed and the object gives up it's full meaning. The character is that of it's makers.

I was sad when my last car was crushed. It had, until the end, been totally reliable. How could you not love that?

that's the point of clarkson's book

ARGH NOOOO!

My bikes are common bikes from well known manufacturers. I love them - because they ride bloody brilliantly. I don't care if they get scratched or dented, but I do care if they stop working perfectly. They put a massive smile on my face when I ride them because of what they DO, not what they ARE.

I've always liked revolvers from a sheer functionality/design aesthetics perspective.

The family I lived with in Banff for a while had a load of classic single action colts from the frontier days along with modern Smith & Wessons.

I felt a certain affinity for an old machine at my old job, six chuck vertical lathe all fed by cams on a hydraulic ram, not a digital encoder or microchip in sight, you had to learn its noises to know when something needed adjusting, not like cnc's today that break down when you cough next to them. Does that make me a second generation luddite?

I had a CG125 for ages, it was new, shiny, and get me to all those places a 17yr old needs to go, still never had soul though?

Now, see, I had a CG125 too. It cost me £160 and a bit extra to MoT. It was slooooow, noisy, vibrated like a jackhammer, was very uncomfortable, it handled like poo and had tyres like wood, with about as much grip. And as for brakes? You're havin' a laff, right?
But it DID have soul!
I used to call it 'The Rocket' and once I gave Mrs PP a lift home on the back of it, she spent the entire time in fits of laughter because it was sooooooooo crap. I once lost the back end on a wet roundabout (wooden tyres!) and thought right up until I was flat on my back that I could save the slide! I just lay there laughing as a bloke in a transit stared at me, got up, and kicked it into life and rode off.

Clubber's right. It's the experience.

But sometimes, it's the machine that makes the experience, like my Monster. The noise it made from the airbox? Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh yes! I used to just sit looking at it. It's the only bike I've ever given a name to as well....

oooh -twice today I get to post this
The noise it made was sublime 🙂

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Rebuild the engine. Learn more about its workings. Skin your knuckles, curse the designers who made things so hard to get to and adjust. Fire it up for the first time and smile the biggest smile.

I sold this to my brother in a moment of madness. He sold it a couple of months later for twice what he paid me.

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This has character and soul by the steam shovel load!

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Every time I look at it, every time I fire it up and every time I ride it I love it more and more.
I've ridden motorcycles since the age of 10 and nothing comes close to the experience of riding this.
The smell, the sound, the feel. Everything, it's brilliant!

mcmoonter, I have one of those engines sitting in the corner of my garage. Interested?...

Everything, it's brilliant!

Apart from the brakes that is 🙂

grim168 - Member

Rd 350 lc. I loved that bike but I also hated it. When it went it flew but it blew up on a regular basis. Bloody thing put the rod through the side of the barrel.

Same here. Great bike, but it ended up snapping it's crank on the local bypass at 70mph with my wife (then gf) on the back. Years of riding 2 strokes gave me lightning fast clutch hand reactions! Mind you, after I rebuilt the engine it started first kick.

Whilst I agree it's your experiences with something that give it soul, when it comes to motorbikes very few (modern certainly) Japanese bikes have soul, whereas Italian ones do for sure. Not too sure about modern Triumphs....

So let me get this straight - something has soul if it's crap, right?

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this for me. I spend more time taking it apart, putting it together, trying to get it running etc.

Zedsdead - Member
mcmoonter, I have one of those engines sitting in the corner of my garage. Interested?...

Zedsdead - That engine was a bit special. 1400cc, stage three 'head.
If you've got something 60's and Cooperish my mate Simon might be interested.
http://www.theminiworks.co.uk/

Lobbydosser - Do you keep that in your kitchen?

you won't believe this but

Austin Maxi, long time ago, £300 with a years MOT, could get a DT175mx in back to go to Wales, commuted for a year from Maidenhead to Twickenham, odd trip to Wales, never serviced it, just topped oil. Anway after a completely trouble free year I sold it for £30 scrap, bloke with a lorry/crane turned up - chains through windows, lifted and off he went. Strangely enough about a month later, mountain biking in the shrubbery, went past a council estate and a bloke shouted 'bargain, bargain', there was my maxi, lights off, dinged to buggery etc, acro props across floor and holding roof up and this bloke was waving a demolition derby trophy - he'd won it and £50 ...................

[quote Lobbydosser - Do you keep that in your kitchen?

No the guy I bought it from kept it in his spare room. (Along with his other one)

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"Apart from the brakes that is"

Hah! That my dear boy, is a pair of Norton roadholders with twin leading shoe. Re-lined and works very well indeed.

As well as most of the bike the engine is also highly modified and tuned and with me riding will give you a good run for your money.

mcmoonter, I'm not sure exactly what it is but I wrote down the numbers on it. Definitely an alloy gearbox on the bottom of it...

When I get home I'll do a bit of research and let you know.

As well as most of the bike the engine is also highly modified and tuned and with me riding will give you a good run for your money.

to a very large extent, that'll depend what I throw my leg over 🙂

If you give me chance to find a frame for the TZ700 motor currently hiding in a tea chest, I somehow doubt it 🙂

Why wont motorbikes start hot?

Automatic choke, I expect. Makes the mixture too rich.

We could build you a frame for that TZ700 if your serious....

Interested?....

No with the XR it was a number of things, the bowl of the carb was right next to the pipe and the fuel would evaporate before you could get it into the cylinderwhen really hot. Same as the old DR 350. Flat slide carb would fix it but expensive and another can of worms. Some people would wrap the pipe in heat shield, or lean it over till fuel was pissing out of the breathers and thenm kick it to death 😀

An old Bridgeport Interact with an old Heidenhain control. Tried to pursuade them not to but they sold it while I was away on hols. For a couple of hundred £'s. Tempremental old beast but I knew how to make it work.

anything I ever had that had character or soul, including two VW Beetles, ended up costing me so much money that I began to resent the rusting pile of crap

How many of us actually had 350LC's then?
Oh, and CG125's? In fact I was thinking about CG125's the other day. They are the AK47 of the motorbike world. Reliable, pretty unbreakable and cheap copies of 'em are made all over the place!

W reg 350 LC here, blue and white with belly pan, mine for a year in 85. It had something, a wicked fat powerband for a start, but not much charm.

The Velocette Venom with Clubman gearbox that I also had on the other hand was soulfully marvellous ...terrible clutch, Lucas 'The Prince of Darkness' dynamo driven 6v lights and a top whack about 80 mph - though hard to tell with the Smiths speedo flagellating wildly! But when in tune and on a dry road I was Geoff Duke, grinding out the fishtail pipe on every right hander, Dunlop TT100s scrabbling for grip. I never got off it and walked away without looking back admiringly.

Two silver and red RD250Es and and black and red ( and blue frame) 350LC. Fair few Jap 4strokes since and just bought an Aprilia Tuono - V twin goodness. If I saw an RD or LC at the right price..... Hmmmmmm I just might ...

molgrips - Member

So let me get this straight - something has soul if it's crap, right?

yes, exactly!

well, sort of.

not crap as such, but flawed. like my old mini that would only start if i pressed the accelerator at just the right moment after turning the ignition. or the tv that would only work if i slapped it in just the right place.

something that only works because you know how it likes to be slapped.

Mini's (as a group) have soul because we all have a memory associated with them - your first car, your friends first car, the first time you drove alone, the first time yor friend drove somewhere without a parent or driving instructor, etc.

[i]my[/i] mini had a soul because only i could make her start. my dad used to try, but his timing was always off. he had to back her off the drive before he could get his audi out of the garage - but he didn't know how she liked it - so she wouldn't start, so he'd wake me up 2 hours before i had to go to college, so i'd get up, and fire her up first time in my pants, and then take her for a noisy thrash to staverton and back (in my pants) - cos i knew she'd complain later if i started her cold and stopped her before she had time to warm up.

even my dad loved her - he said she smelled just like his first car, and he wanted to make her happy.

my mini was an unreliable rusty heap of shit, i got my first xxxx xxb* in her, and i loved both of them.

happy days.

(*comet hally bop overhead)

"It had something, a wicked fat powerband for a start," That's a first for more or less all 2 stroke Yamahas. I had an RD250, an RD400 and an LC350, and they didnt have a 'fat powerband' between 'em. Still loved them all though.

Anything steam powered.

We could build you a frame for that TZ700 if your serious....

Interested?....

I once [maybe still] harboured a desire to build the thing into a bike but the practicalities [mainly financial] of doing it are overwhelming
It doesn't have any carbs or a radiator & I'd have to get some exhausts manufactured - I do have a big box of spares though, cylinders, pistons, gears etc.
Besides it's an ugly brute 🙂

Over the winter I'm going to strip it, photograph it & rebuild it before banging it on eBay
I reckon it'll go to either Japan or the US for a tidy sum

Coffin tank RD400 😀

Anything steam powered.

Ohh yes!
I had a short ride on the footplate of a smallish tank engine last year. Loads of levers and wheels to fiddle with, intense heat, [i]that smell[/i], noise and rumble-clunkyness.
Now that thing was virtually alive. It breathed and cuffed and rattled.
The driver only tapped the throttle to get it going, must have been no more than 5% open, and when he hit a straight bit he just tapped it open a tad more and with each 'chuff' it felt you went 20 tards down the line. The tourque was incredible, I've never felt anything like it. The driver reckoned it would fairly easily out-pull a diesel shunter. Wonderful.... 🙂

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Triumph triple engines, mmmmmmm.

"I once [maybe still] harboured a desire to build the thing into a bike but the practicalities [mainly financial] of doing it are overwhelming
It doesn't have any carbs or a radiator & I'd have to get some exhausts manufactured - I do have a big box of spares though, cylinders, pistons, gears etc.
Besides it's an ugly brute

Over the winter I'm going to strip it, photograph it & rebuild it before banging it on eBay
I reckon it'll go to either Japan or the US for a tidy sum"

We can also make up exhuasts from sheet. A radiator we can do too. Carbs we can get hold of.

Go on, you know you want to. The frame we build would handle way better too....

If you don't want to do it then I could be interested in the motor without a rebuild. What's the history behind it?

If you don't want to do it then I could be interested in the motor without a rebuild. What's the history behind it?

My brother tells me it came from Mal Carter's place in Halifax when he shut up shop in the early eighties, other than that, ?? - it's obviously a 73 or 74

not really sure what it's worth - I'll need to do some research but I certainly haven't got the time or money to build it into a bike or to have someone do it for me 🙂
I'll stick to trying to get my Seeley G50 ready for next season, racing again at 52 ???? - that's going to cost me enough

uplink, we have been involved with things like the G50 and all I can say is that you'll have a hell of a lot of fun!

Personally, I love old clasics and I hate to see them sitting somewhere getting polished and never used.
Me? I use mine as much as I can. My mate rides a Kwacker 1100 and rides the ragged ass off it, and I do my best to keep up. Funnily enough we always end up at the planned stop at about the same time. I push it, lean it and rag as far as I can. You know why? Because it's fun! If you want to sell that lump let me know, I'll make darn good use of it.

Might even give you a go once I've built it..... 😀