She's on Question Time right now, defending her expenses claims.
I'd like to know how she defends having her security detail (Highly trained gents who have spent a lot of time in Herefordshire and other interesting spots) pushing her shopping trolley around my local Sainsburys. How she thinks that having these poor chaps (decent men, to a T) asking me to move my car so the arrogant **** can park hers.
No, **** off. I've parked there legally, now you do your shopping yourself you troughing, caravan driving, fake smiling, pathetic excuse for a politician.
(And don't even get me started on Labour MPs trying to get me moved out of my favourite table in my favourite local curry house!)
don't even get me started on Labour MPs trying to get me moved out of my favourite table in my favourite local curry house
It sounds like a conspiracy to me Captain - I reckon you're a marked man.
Well, obviously , Ernie! 😀
own her with a copy of the Guardian*
*with a copy of the Socialist Worker rolled up inside
Has there been discussion on here on the idea of a "Green List"?
If MP's are serious about showing rectitude and probity over expenses they should be willing to submit themselves to scrutiny over their expenses claims. They should be transparent about removing all obstacles to FoI enquiries on the subject. Furthermore they should agree (with the "help" of the electorate they represent) on a set of criteria on what constitute "reasonable" claims.
As a result there would be a list of incumbent MPs who are "green", another list who are "amber" and a third list of those who made "honest mistakes" or "accounting errors". This wouldn't preclude anyone from standing for re-election but it might assist the lumpen proletariat in their decisions at the ballot box.
I normally steer clear of political threads on here but this latest round of conceit and hubris really enrages me.
I think I'll write to my MP....
As a result there would be a list of incumbent MPs who are "green", another list who are "amber" and a third list of those who made "honest mistakes" or "accounting errors". This wouldn't preclude anyone from standing for re-election but it might assist the lumpen proletariat in their decisions at the ballot box.
Good thinking.
write to your MP?
what on earth for?
do you not think that posting on an internet forum about mountain biking and Kylie is democracy enough?
do you not think that posting on an internet forum about mountain biking and Kylie is democracy enough?
😀
Yes. Sorry.
(tugs forelock)
Stuartie-c is your MP Gordon Brown too?
do you not think that posting on an internet forum about mountain biking and Kylie is democracy enough?
Kylie?
[b]NEVER! NEVER! NEVER![/b]
A&A is where it's at, when will you lovers of the aged Antipodean faghag realise this? 😉
I suspect that there might a reasonable amount of MPs on your green list stuartie_c. Unfortunately none of them are making the headlines at the moment. Take Jeremy Corbyn for example, he hasn't claimed anything in the seven years to 2007-8 for the additional costs allowance. But that's hardly headline grabbing news is it ?
Stuartie-c is your MP Gordon Brown too?
No, I've got Willie Rennie (Lib Dem). I think I WILL actually write that letter. Can we mobilise the STW troops to do the same?
What patronising hogwash might we get in reply?
Thank God the Tories are beyond reproach in this matters as they are in all things
Ernie - I'd be delighted to see lots of green-list MPs as it might restore my faith in this democracy. My naively optimistic vision is a future parliament where everyone is on the green list and there are new, unambiguous rules in place to regulate expenses.
Junkyard, they're not. They are far from it, in fact. At least, however, Cameron has actually done something about it.
This green list idea is a good one. I like it a lot.
This proposal knows no party boundaries - Labour, Tory, Lib-Dem, other - any politician who is taking the piss will have to face the [s]inqusition[/s] music.
Cameron has actually done something about it.
Yes, but like with all the other politicians only after they got caught with their pants down.
I think it would be best to vote BNP as their MP's havent claimed any expenses whatsoever . . . hang on a mo that will be because there arent any BNP MP's . . . err forget that
😆
El-bent - How exactly would Cameron have known what claims Tory MPs had submitted to the House of Commons Fees Office [i]before[/i] the story broke ?
what we should do is what a group on radio 5 live proposed....
namely to go down to the MP's second home and to request access to do a inventory of all the items claimed for the second home to ensure that they were still there
its brilliant in its simplicity and should have a TV camera crew there to record the moment, don't care what party just alternate
... so why have you replaced your Laura Ashley coffee table with one from Ikea?.... you can already feel the moment
El-bent - How exactly would Cameron have known what claims Tory MPs had submitted to the House of Commons Fees Office before the story broke ?
easy, they have been signing them off for the last 6 months ready for publication
Take Jeremy Corbyn for example, he hasn't claimed anything in the seven years to 2007-8 for the additional costs allowance. But that's hardly headline grabbing news is it ?
Not surprising that, though, is it? He's the MP for Islington North, which is an Inner London constituency, which means he is not entitled to claim it!
http://www.parliament.uk/about_commons/hocallowances/hocallowances06.cfm
At least, however, Cameron has actually done something about it.
Oh the irony of the "do nothing" scum finally "doing something".
stuartie_c, I like your green list.
Here's a nice compare and contrast -
Margret Moran MP for Luton South
Claim for second home (in Southampton)
Additional Costs £22,343
Kelvin Hopkins MP for Luton North
No claim for second home.
Additional Costs £1,242
They both live in the same road.
At least she hasn't tried claiming for her caravan as a second home.
What we need is a big wall, a big gun and a big bag of bullets.
don't even get me started on Labour MPs trying to get me moved out of my favourite table in my favourite local curry house!
Sorry, that's one aspirational step too far. [b]No one[/b] has a favourite table in a curry house.
Hmmm my local Mp <spit> is Nicholas Soames who barely turns up to Parliament let alone have anything to do with voting oiks
In fairness, he's probably having problems squeezing out of the front door on his house.
What we need is a big wall, a big gun and a big bag of bullets.
The Palace of Westminster has a big wall, I've a No.4 Mk1 (T) sat in my gun cabinet and I reckon I've enough .303 to deal with the worst culprits.
Just give me the nod (and the necessary documentation to make taking up this honorable duty legal) and I'll be there within a few hours.
Given the fact it is in fact a constitutional crisis, I would say a date for a General Election should be set straight away, and it be made clear that the electorate expect any MP up for re-election to be prepared to answer publically for their expense claims to their local constituency. (thats all of them, not just their local party).
Should sort the wheat from the chaff.
Incidentally, while we're on about the constitution how about an Abstain box on the ballot paper? I reckon if you had one currently there'd only be about 3 people get re-elected.
I reckon if you had one currently there'd only be about 3 people get re-elected.
Unfortunately if no one votes then the bugger who currently holds the seat remains in it for another term.
But most of these claims are transparent.
As in invisible and can't be seen as opposed to can be seen by all.
I had some dealings with Jeremy Corbyn when I lived in Islington and I discovered he used to channel a significant portion of his salary into the local party. As far as they go, I thought he was pretty straight (joke). No, what I mean is he was a good bloke.
I'd also be interested to see a list of claims that were rejected by the regulators. The Bill Butler one still strikes me as a shining example of these MP's mindset.
[url= http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/may/14/mps-expenses-jackstraw ]In the end, one has to confront the following serious question. What aspect of the restoration of trust in politics would be in the media's interest?[/url]
I think this is interesting. Martin Kettle in the Grauniad.
And this is not a "constitutional crisis" in any meaningful sense. It is a spasm of outrage. It is likely to lead to a minor fascist resurgence in the local elections while we're all on our high horses, but we are a long way off threatening the constitution at this point. 🙂
I am seriously considering standing as an independent in the next election and I think a lot more people should try it as well.
I am not bound to any party, I have no specific leanings to either Tory (sorry Captain), Labour (not really sorry DD) or LibDem (errrrr...) but I am happy to work with them if they have a policy that both fits with what my local area wants and needs, and which I personally have no issues with.
If the whole of Parliment was made up of non-party independents, then I think the whole process of making laws would be better. No party political stuff, just proper debate to convince people that the law is right, just and worthwhile implementing.
How do you think political parties develop?
"proper debate to convince people that the law is right, just and worthwhile implementing."
Politics isn't really about law being right (just), though, is it? Legislation is just a tool for political change.
sootyandjim said
Unfortunately if no one votes then the bugger who currently holds the seat remains in it for another term.
Thats the point of having an abstention vote obviously. Its not that no one has voted, it is that they have rejected the candidates on offer. As things stand at the moment I'm prepared to guarantee you that Abstain would win most seats at the current European and Local elections.
BigDummy - said
And this is not a "constitutional crisis" in any meaningful sense
In what way is a considerable contingent of the governing house being shown to be corrupt, with the attendant public outrage, and the systemic inability to act upon it not a constituional crisis? Point 1 we don't have a written constituion, thus enabling the thieving bastards to duck, dive and make up archaic rules as they go. Point 2 Do you honestly believe this will just die down and go away? (Might I guess from that, that you are close to GB by any chance?)
I reckon this country is actually nearer to open revolution against the system than at any time in my life, which is a loooong time, and the key issue is that unlike the miners strike and the poll tax thing, this is cross class, cross party and unifying the great unwashed in a way I've never seen before.
Pshaw, hardly. There will never be revolution in England - things have been much worse in the last 300 years than they are now and yet it never took place. Compare that to almost everywhere else in Europe.
"In what way is a considerable contingent of the governing house being shown to be corrupt, with the attendant public outrage, and the systemic inability to act upon it not a constituional crisis?"
Because it's not a dispute over power/authority/legitimacy between different parts of the state that ought to be brokered by the constitution (or, perhaps, law) but isn't, either because the constitution isn't clear or is being ignored.
I reckon this country is actually nearer to open revolution against the system......
A little far fetched methinks.
As long as the general public have their flat-screen TV's and a shiny new car paid on tick outside they'll do nothing to upset the apple cart.
If you shove enough microphones under people's noses and ask enough leading questions its easy to whip up a hysteria, but once Saturday rolls around and Britain's Got Talentless or some such tripe is on people soon forget.
Can you really see Mr and Mrs Smith of Dudley forgoing their weekly trip to the supermarket in order to take part in a civil disturbance?
G, you're clearly very worked up about this in a way I'm not, but what we're seeing is simply not the precursor to a change in the way we are governed as far as I can see. The local elections on June 4th will go ahead. People will vote, votes will be counted. Because of all the angry nonsense about politicians being "all the same" being spouted, the BNP will do rather well, as will the Liberal Democrats.
The general election will go ahead in about a year's time. It will be held in exactly the same way as every general election in your lifetime. Labour will take a massive pasting, for a wide range of reasons including but not limited to the expenses fuss. The conservatives will form a majority government, but there will be large gains for the Liberal Democrats, and a surprising number of independents and fascists will be returned. The Queen will invite the leader of the largest party in the commons to form a government, which he will do.
At some time between now and then, the speaker will have been forced out, there will be a widespread consultation on MPs salaries and expenses and Cameron and Clegg will form a united front and will succeed in forcing Brown to accept their proposals, which will be rather hair-shirted. The incoming government will swiftly pass legislation creating an independent body to review MPs remuneration and parliamentary privilege, and will ahve to appoint someone genuinely heavyweight to lead it. (they will at least ask Martin Bell if he is not in parliament).
There will simply not be any constitutional change, and it will die down. This is my sense of it, anyway. We may all rise up, march on Westminster and burn parliament, but I'm really not seeing it at the moment.
We may be differing on what we mean by "constitutional crisis". What I am seeing, and what I've described above isn't one, as far as I'm concerned. EDIT: I am happy to adopt konabunny's definition of a "constitutional crisis".
I am nothing whatever to do with the prime minister's office or the government. I am an irritated labour member, but that is as close as I get. 🙂
Do you remember the Poll tax riots?
If not you will find that it did actually force a stornger government to climb down and change direction. The reason that happened is because there was a wide spread sense of injustice over the policy, not just a few "oiks" getting stroppy in Trafalagar Square. The ground swell over this one is far greater than it ever was with the Poll Tax. The difference here is that a policy change will not cut it. You really have got an issue, where its almost impossible to resolve the matter satisfactorily under the current system. Parliamentry Privilige makes it very difficult to take action against an MP, and once people figure out that they are pretty much going to get away with it the level of outrage will grow, especially at a time when everyone else is losing jobs, and belt tightening. Apart from GB demanding all MP's expose their expense records, and then going to the polls once that information is out I can't see how anything else will do.
Right now you are looking at the possibility of some pretty strange election results, which may well leave us with the BNP or perhaps worse UKIP representing us in Europe. How much of a crisis do you need before you call it one?
PS: The GB jibe was tongue in cheek BD, never personal, hope that was obvious.
caravan driving
[pedant] you can't drive a caravan, unless it's in the desert and it's a lot of camels in a line[/pedant]
