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Totally disagree - but accept it will be diffrent for everyone.Most periods of extended exercise / really stressing my body that I have undertaken during my life have resulted in weight gain
Stress (in the life collapsing around you sense) can have very weird effects on people's weight - some shed weight and others gain weight (a response to hormones, AFAIK).
But, continuous heavy exercise* also creates a similar stress response. I used to ride c170 miles a week just commuting, and I never lost any weight. It clearly wasn't the 2 hours of riding a day (which would leave me shattered and not enjoying the weekend or evening rides), but it was my diet (which involved a lot of simple carbs). At best the exercise allowed me to maintain weight, but it didn't force automatic weight loss.
I climbed off the bike a year ago through illness (there's a surprise) and my weight ballooned.
*I'm also of the view that this caused my heart problems.
[i]Exercise should be about getting out there and feeling good about life.[/i]
Very well put, I like this.
[i]Solo, Yeti and I have been doing protein shots - brainfood, if you like. [/i]
Well, at least its working for you.
😉
DD - you need to lay off the shots... with posts like that you'll end the thread.
Stress (in the life collapsing around you sense) can have very weird effects on people's weight
Sorry - didn't mean stress as we tend to use in a work / lifestyle sense...
Stress, as in constantly subjecting your body to a physically demanding regimen, day in / day out.
The main examples I have experienced have been on expeditions - 6 weeks, in the wild, 100-120 lbs rucksacks, under canvas the whole time, all weathers, all food having to be packed in by re-supply relays.
Places huge demands on the body, which I'm pleased to say has always adapted relatively quickly...
...but, has always upped the overall body weight quite considerably
I would never have thought myself so "weak", but periods of under-exercising (or in other words, being a lazy arse) coincide with periods of eating shitty food.
Coincidence? I don't think so.
OK, back to the calories...
If calories in < calories out = GOOD
Then what sort of a daily deficit is good, without feeling utterly shit / hungry / exhausted etc?
Glitcheroo
[i]OK, back to the calories...
If calories in < calories out = GOOD
Then what sort of a daily deficit is good, without feeling utterly shit / hungry / exhausted etc?
[/i]
Molgrips.
You're good at explaining this.
Damn, no wonder there are so many fat bastards out there.
There is no "secret" to losing weight, its simple.
There is one thing you [i]need[/i] to know, your total daily energy expenditure* (TDEE), eat less than this and you [i]will[/i] lose weight.
Get yourself a calorie counting app like Myfitnesspal (probably the best one)
3500 calories = 1 lbs of fat, aim for 500 calories less than your TDEE per day and you will lose roughly 1 lb a week, any more than this and you risk losing muscle too.
You will need to eat a healthy well balanced diet so your body gets the macro and micro nutrients it needs. Low calorie high fibre foods are a must (lots of vegetables, salad etc) you can eat more of them so you will feel full for longer.
Also no simple carbs, only brown grains.
* Plently of websites with calculators to work this out for you.
Also no simple carbs, only brown grains.
So, it's not [i]that[/i] simple then is it?
SW.
While I disagree with you on a few things.
I am curious to know how Joe Bloggs ascertians their 'TDEE'
I'm not a science boffin.
But to know how many calories you are [i]burning[/i], don't you need to know something about your VO2s, etc ?.
I'm not a science boffin.
But to know how many calories you are burning, don't you need to know something about your VO2s, etc ?.
Online calculators will be more than accurate enough for Joe Bloggs. They obviously work on averages but most of us aren't that different despite what we'd like to think.
I am curious to know how Joe Bloggs ascertians their 'TDEE'
Yep - calorie estimnates for specific exercise is one thing - how much burnt for general up and down the stairs "living & breathing" stuff is a bit trickier...
http://scoobysworkshop.com/accurate-calorie-calculator/
Use that, be honest about your exercise/daily activities.
If you know your body fat percentage use the Cunningham research model as its the most up to date.
Edit: Or you can just keep guessing, dismissing any info from people who try and help you, and continue to be a fat bastard.
rkk01 - how much do you weigh... my guess is you BMR will be about 1800.
SW.
Calories from Protein and calories from carbohydrate.
Dealt with in the same way within the Human body ?.
About 14st 10-12, aiming for 14st 7
ETA the myfitnesspal app gives a goal calorie intake of 1890 per day - but presumably that represents a target net of exercise / exercise fuel 😉
Yesterday:
Calories in = 2464
Calories out = -593 (specific exercise, not just gen calorie burn...)
Net = 1871
Goal = 1890
Today - cycle to work day, so calories expended through exercise will be more like 1500
Someone's got ants* in their pants.
*complex carbs
I'd guess at 2000 for your BMR add 10% for moving around. Add another load for your exercise then knock off 15% for weight loss and the fact that you will eat more than you realise.
You could try and make it more complicated, but it won't make things much different. I don't beleive in over-complicating things and it's got me pretty lean.
Solo, you don't need to think about cutting carbs until you get to roughly 10% body fat. Until then don't worry about macro nutrient ratios, just include a lean protein (chicken, fish etc) and some complexed carbs with every meal. A fish oil or flax seed supplement would be beneficial to get your healthy fats, or a cook with olive oil, drizzle it on your salad, you get the idea.
Honestly think that if you genuinely tried riding every other day as i'm suggesting and didn't lose any weight, then you needed to ride more
Much as I would love to ramble through the hills every day, I have this thing called a job, and another called a family - they both require a fair bit of my attention.
I'm sure you've heard about my long distance commuting experiment a few years back, but it seems relevant. I was working in Bristol so I decided to cycle there from Cardiff. I managed it usually between two and four times a week for about three months (the duration of the job). I ate normally except for plenty of carb supplements to fuel the large amount of riding - using the 1g/kg/h formula, minus a bit for moderation. I rode thousands of miles and gained about 2kg.
Also, I have met quite a few people who are somewhat overweight rather than obese, and decide to get thin by hitting the gym. They got fitter, stronger and felt better, but didn't lose weight. It's fairly common from what I hear.
I don't think there's any point in separating diet and exercise when it comes to health. They are both very important, and both need to support each other to achieve your aim. By that I mean if you want to get faster you need to train and eat to support that; if you want to lose weight then you need to change what you eat and exercise to support that.
Skywalker - I'm very sceptical that the average calculators are much use, to be honest. I don't think the average Joe Bloggs is the most common Joe Bloggs - the mean is not helpful here. Just look at the enormous diversity of body types we see irrespective of diet. Plenty of tremendously skinny people who eat like crap and don't exercise, and plenty of people who do a lot of exercise and are still 10kg overweight. There's a chart at the end of that article I linked to showing the massive variation in people's genetic ability to oxidise fat - so much so that it showed obese couch potatoes with the same fat burning ability as pro cyclists.
Also, I have met quite a few people who are somewhat overweight rather than obese, and decide to get thin by hitting the gym. They got fitter, stronger and felt better, but didn't lose weight. It's fairly common from what I hear.
That's because a lot of people are under the impression that if they exercise they can eat as much as they want, which is pretty dumb.
You can always out eat your TDEE, in which case you will obviously not lose weight, you will put it on.
I think that many people who start exercising more, 'believe' they're not eating more.
Skywalker - I'm very sceptical that the average calculators are much use, to be honest. I don't think the average Joe Bloggs is the most common Joe Bloggs - the mean is not helpful here. Just look at the enormous diversity of body types we see irrespective of diet. Plenty of tremendously skinny people who eat like crap and don't exercise, and plenty of people who do a lot of exercise and are still 10kg overweight. There's a chart at the end of that article I linked to showing the massive variation in people's genetic ability to oxidise fat - so much so that it showed obese couch potatoes with the same fat burning ability as pro cyclists.
Figuring out if you are an ectomorph, mesomorph or endomorph isn't exactly difficult!
The calculators are pretty accurate, especially the ones that take your body fat percentage into consideration like the Cunningham research model.
Its pretty simple. Use it, eat the amount it says, if it works then fine, if not make adjustments.
Its definitely better than guessing that's for sure.
[i]Solo, you don't need to think about cutting carbs until you get to roughly 10% body fat. Until then don't worry about macro nutrient ratios, just include a lean protein (chicken, fish etc) and some complexed carbs with every meal. A fish oil or flax seed supplement would be beneficial to get your healthy fats, or a cook with olive oil, drizzle it on your salad, you get the idea[/i]
Whatever.
I'm not debating that with you.
You've jumped straight to Carbs, blah, blah.
You posted:
[i]aim for 500 calories less than your TDEE per day and you will lose
roughly 1 lb a week,[/i]
I'm simply asking about Calories and their source and whether there is a difference, in your opinion.
Once we establish that not all sources of calories are handled the same.
Then we might reflect on how useful the advise of running a calorie deficit is, esp, wrt sustainability.
Or, maybe not.
😉
[i]That's because a lot of people are under the impression that if they exercise they can eat as much as they want, which is pretty dumb.[/i]
TSY to the forum... Oh !, hang on.
Also, I have met quite a few people who are somewhat overweight rather than obese, and decide to get thin by hitting the gym. They got fitter, stronger and felt better, but didn't lose weight. It's fairly common from what I hear.
Pretty much my body's response to increased exercise. I do need to "diet" to loose weight. Exercise alone stimulates appetitie and I nealry always gain weight. Will be fitter, stronger, trimmer etc, but will be heavier.
Have been in the gym this year (less riding) - face and waist thinner, but not really lost much weight (half stone)
What does amaze me is the amount of time people spend in the gym - but without expending effort...
Either that, or I'm the only one exercising to the point of can't walk / breathe / talk... Is it undiginified to be soaked in sweat at the gym? Is that not the idea?
All the gym girlies spend hours in there and don't seem to break a sweat. Many of the blokes as well - pedalling away at cadence 60-80, but resistance 3-5
The numbers used for calories burned for various exercises etc. on myfitnesspal seem to pretty much correlate with the weight loss I'm seeing
ie for every 3500 calories in credit, I'm losing around a lb
When I first started logging everything I [like most I would think] under estimated what I was taking in
I now know roughly where I am each day and also the wider picture
My food diary from yesterday - there were 1856 added calories, accrued from exercise
I could have probably done with eating a bit more but I wasn't hungry
[img] 
[/img]
i think i'd die if i ate that ammount. by Friday.
OP: Are you doing any kind of resistance training? If we ate the same calories every year after the age of 40 or so, we would put on a couple of pounds a year in fat! Resistance traing stops your muscles depleting, keeping your metabolism where it should be.
Jota180 - whats your height, weight, age and how much exercise are you doing if you don't mind me asking?
Then we might reflect on how useful the advise of running a calorie deficit is
Works for me, might not work for you... unlucky
jota180, I wouldn't be able to crawl from my bed to the fridge on that!
Jota180 - whats your height, weight, age and how much exercise are you doing if you don't mind me asking?
From another thread ....... I'm 6' BTW
53 - currently 85kg [recently down from 89.5]Monday - 5 mile run/jog 9minute miles, 20 mile road ride 16mph
Tuesday - 5 mile run/jog 9minute miles, 20 mile road ride 16mph
Wednesday - 5 mile run/jog 9minute miles, 20 mile road ride 16mph
Thursday - 5 mile run/jog 9minute miles, 20 mile road ride 16mph
Friday - 5 mile run/jog 9minute miles, 20 mile road ride 16mph
Saturday - 60 mile road ride 16mph
Sunday - 30 mile road ride 16mphAll the runs are pre-breakfast, all the rides are pre lunch
Solo - humour me... how is your diet working at helping you to become as lean as you'd like to be?
Call me stupid and disagree with me all you like, but you're struggling to achieve your goals, right?
Exactly what I was thinking TSY.
Whats your body fat percentage Solo 🙂
Careful Skywalker... you'll get lambasted because you exercise too much... because you don't fit with his Paleo principles... because you're stupid etc etc.
Surely life is too short to diet and completely stop yourself eating things you like? I like food and if I had to overly restrict myself then whats the point?
I'm slowly loosing weight, not that I ever was that over weight, but for me the things that have made the difference are:
1. Doing more exercise (odd really isnt it that its worked?!?) Running is better for beer belly loss than biking.
2. Cutting out cakes and chocolates that are always at work.
3. Cutting down on alcohol. I've not actually done this on purpose, but as I have been exercising more I have been missing it less, some weeks I dont even drink now.
4. Trying not to eat main meals after 8pm.
5. Instead of eating biscuits/chocolate etc when getting the nibbles, eating fruit instead.
5. Eating a little bit of everything ie still having MCDonalds when I want one.
Diets are proven not to work.
Oh and if you want really quick methods of weight loss I can recommend a good dose of Pneumonia, or a good few bouts of D&V
1. Doing more exercise (odd really isnt it that its worked?!?) Running is better for beer belly loss than biking.
Running is more intense, ie you burn more calories doing it, it doesn't make it better though. The more intense the exercise, the more likely you are to lose lean body mass as well as fat.
Diets are proven not to work.
You're right, diets don't work, changing your lifestyle does, that means eating less then your TDEE and exercising.
Its fine eating all the things you like that are of no nutritional value, but its healthier not to and replacing it with nutritionally dense foods.
Surely life is too short to diet and completely stop yourself eating things you like? I like food and if I had to overly restrict myself then whats the point?
I agree, in my case I'm sacrificing a month of cake to drop a stone, after that, I'll be going easy on it
Surely life is too short to diet and completely stop yourself eating things you like?
You could just as well say life's to short not to go after your goals. In my case, that would be being a fast racer.
You're right, diets don't work, changing your lifestyle does
Unsustainable crash diets are proven not to work. But the word 'diet' could mean anything in reality. Not eating (or going easy on) fast carbs wouldn't be considered a diet for instance, just good advice.
Yeah good point.
[i]Solo - humour me... how is your diet working at helping you to become as lean as you'd like to be?
Call me stupid and disagree with me all you like, but you're struggling to achieve your goals, right?
[/i]
I'm getting on very well thanks.
And I do so with a lot less time exercising
So whos the fool ?.
😉
[i]Exactly what I was thinking TSY.
Whats your body fat percentage Solo
[/i]
Beats thinking about calories and answering my question.
Of course, you know you're wrong.
But since when is that a crime ?.
Anyway.
TSY, according to SW, you're Dumb...
😉
[i]That's because a lot of people are under the impression that if they exercise they can eat as much as they want, which is pretty dumb.[/i]
[i]because you don't fit with his Paleo principles[/i]
You and this Paleo thing.
Again, taking missing the point to new levels.
"I agree, in my case I'm sacrificing a month of cake to drop a stone, after that, I'll be going easy on it"
But surely thats not going to work? Just cut down on cake and still enjoy it and take 2 months to loose the weight. If you cut out cake for a month, I reckon you will find it hard not to eat the same amount as before and put your stone back on.
"You could just as well say life's to short not to go after your goals. In my case, that would be being a fast racer."
Thats different though isnt it, to become a fast racer you need to alter diet and in many ways become unhealthy, but healthy for racing a bike quickly.
I'm getting on very well thanks.
Getting on well enough not to tell us your BF% 😆
And I do so with a lot less time exercising
Since whens that a good thing?
Beats thinking about calories and answering my question.
Of course, you know you're wrong.
But since when is that a crime ?.
Wrong about what exactly?
Solo - you silly (paleo) sausage...
When have I ever said people can eat as much as they want?
If someone enjoys exercising... why are they a fool?
Why are you so reluctant to share with me your thoughts on Paleo? I'll ask you again... what in your opinion is the essential text on the Paleo diet? I'll order it now, I'm interested.
Glad to hear that you've shifted your stubborn stomach fat 🙂