[Closed] ISIS threatening Europe.

Has the scrawled writing on bits of old card dynamically changed the threat level?

I always preferred square taper.

In Syria and Iraq yes definitely. In Rome that's not quite so easy, certainly not for holding up a piece of cardboard. Hopefully the new powers this government will bring in including surveillance will help to keep us safer here in the UK. No guaranty though against this poisonous ideology. It's going to be a long and difficult campaign. BTW the interview last night on Newsnight with Emma Sky ex special advisor to the US military in Iraq was fascinating, going to buy her book today.

Couple of photos from Bradford I've posted before

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Pfft! Amateurs! if they'd have cut letters out of old newspapers like this then we'd all be really justifiably scared to death. Everyone knows thats thats how serial killers and proper nutters operate. You can even get an online template to do it for you, so there really is no excuse...

[img] [/img]

As they can't even cut cardboard straight, I don't see them as a major threat. 🙄

Is it now time to fully mobilise all available force, go in hard, and just kill them all?

No, but it is time to stop reading the tabloids.

what we need is some multi billion pound nuclear subs stuffed with ICBMs, we'll be safe as houses then

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<tannoy>
Hora and picture of nuclear bomb to forum please....Hora to the forum.
Thank you
</tannoy>

ISIS threatening Europe

Plenty of what the media refers to as 'disaffected' youth out there. The truth is alot more simple- boy doesn't listen at school, does petty drugs and ends up in prison through every fault of his own. In prison he realises that he can instantly win respect by converting to a hard version of Islam. Suddenly hes a soldier of god and can pretend the drugs/slackness that he created wasn't his fault but Britain who held him down.

Plenty of those out there.

Hopefully the new powers this government will bring in including surveillance will help to keep us safer here in the UK

Naaah... are you somehow unfamiliar with how this works? Those new laws will be used for monitoring environmental activists, surpressing lawful protest, and for councils to prosecute people for putting their recycling in the wrong bin

Naaah... are you somehow unfamiliar with how this works? Those new laws will be used for monitoring environmental activists, surpressing lawful protest, and for councils to prosecute people for putting their recycling in the wrong bin

Exactly, suppressing the fifth column. It all starts with people who don't put their recycling in the right bin, next thing you know they've joined the communist party and are trying to undermine the very freedoms our forefathers died for....

My god!! Has Hora just said something plausible? Also the social inadequates, who can't get a girlfriend, and fancy themselves as brave mujahideen warriors that the Burka-clad laydeeez of Brixton and Stoke will be throwing themselves at in Syria

hora - Member
ISIS threatening Europe
and any attack(s) will be carried out by homegrown terrorists again.
Plenty of what the media refers to as 'disaffected' youth out there. The truth is alot more simple- boy doesn't listen at school, does petty drugs and ends up in prison through every fault of his own. In prison he realises that he can instantly win respect by converting to a hard version of Islam. Suddenly hes a soldier of god and can pretend the drugs/slackness that he created wasn't his fault but Britain who held him down.

Plenty of those out there.

they should round up the protesters supporting ISIS and bus them over so they can join their brothers in the great fight against the horrors of the west. I'm sure they'll pop up on liveleak sooner or later

Our homegrown terrorists are typically disaffected, relative loners and more often than not, middle class. Should we nuke Waitrose and the local parks?

"Is it now time to fully mobilise all available force, go in hard, and just kill them all?"

What ****ing planet are you on? Oh yeah, planet troll.

planet muppet more like 🙂

I suppose it probably is trolling but there are people stupid enough to believe that this is like fighting an enemy army where you can locate them and fight them in a conventional manner - going in hard and killing them all. I suppose it appeals to the internet hardmen too.

Even if you ignore the point that the real risk is almost certainly with people who are UK citizens or at an absolute minimum will have lived here for some time.

Even if you ignore the point that the real risk is almost certainly with people who are UK citizens or at an absolute minimum will have lived here for some time.

That's way too subtle for our Tabloid readers (Woppit et al) to comprehend, much easier to just say all bad people are foreigners with beards and live far away and must have bombs dropped on them.

What I struggle with is the need to lookout for fellow muslims who are apparently being attacked by the West. The situation is horrible as its Shia v Sunni with the West on the sidelines unsure of exactly what to do. John Kerry scared me with his vitriol speech against Assad.

Now the thinking seems to be empower the 'nice' sounding Syrian rebels to get rid of the loony elements and they'll beat Assad and run a rosey-stable Syria.

As Ramada etc is showing in the news this week. Just when the Western politicians think ISIS is being beaten- it flips everything round again.

Anyway thats my opinion.

We really have gone through the looking glass when you consider that Iraq is now full of Iranian militias. But this is now apparently a good thing, as they're on 'our' side.

We should stay well out of it, as we should have done in the first place, and let them get on with it

people stupid enough to believe that this is like fighting an enemy army where you can locate them and fight them in a conventional manner

I agree, which is why I support enhanced powers for the intelligence and security services. However, anybody caught misusing these powers should not pass go or collect £200.

Saves having videos of American/etc soldiers being lynched on youtube as Obama rides the wave to the end of his term... Still, it is jolly nice of Iran to provide them and I'm sure it's an entirely selfless act.

And that is one solution wrecker but I think it's misguided - there's a limit to what they can actually do I reckon - look at the Boston bombings - 'self radicalised' (great term - would love to know who came up with that) people doing bad things. Putting more effort into stopping that scenario may not be as sexy but it'd almost certainly be a lot more effective.

Can they not just install some kind of system where the internet gets shut down when beardy, shouty people use Google?

Mind you, that'd be the last we'd hear of Brian Blessed. Theres always a catch, isn't there?

I'd bet that it wouldn't nemesis. The security services operate as much here as they do abroad, the "self-radicalised" are a massive priority.
Whilst an education/community outreach system is vital (and hora is right, prisons are a hotbed of recruitment), we need the ability to watch and capture the most determined of folks (who will also be the most dangerous). I truly believe that it's essential, some don't and that's fine.

Why haven't ISIS seen fit to attack Israel?

And who has been supplying their weapons and ammo?

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Mr Woppit
Is it now time to fully mobilise all available force, go in hard, and just kill them all?

And how exactly are you going to work out who to kill??

Oh Christ! Here we go.....

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I predict that after 3 pages we'll all all be trying to work out how we'd arrived at it all being Jimmy Savilles fault.....

Why haven't ISIS seen fit to attack Israel?

One front too many, and the Israelis tend not to **** about.

Next.

Although here's a picture of Israel next to some others. So I guess they are all in cahoots under strict orders from Elizabeth.
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Interesting take binners...

This [url= http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/18/the-terrorists-fighting-us-now-we-just-finished-training-them/ ]Washington Post Article[/url] would seem to suggest that the growth of ISIS, like Al-Qaeda before them was largely down to Western intelligence services:

Abu Saleh, who is originally from a town close to Benghazi, said [b]he and a group of other Libyans received training and support in their country from French, British, and American military and intelligence personnel — before they joined the Al Nusra Front or the Islamic State[/b]. Western and Arab military sources interviewed for this article, confirmed Abu Saleh’s account that “training” and “equipment” were given to rebels in Libya during the fight against the Gadhafi regime.

But this is now apparently a good thing, as they're on 'our' side.

That's what we said about Bin Laden when he was fighting the Russians!

And how exactly are you going to work out who to kill??

I believe all the bad people have dark skin and beards.

There is little evidence of non-European ISIS fighters infiltrating Europe in the manner that is being depicted in the press. Claims that terrorists are coming to Europe disguised as refugees are often used by far-right and anti-immigration parties in their rhetoric against more humane policies towards the increasing number of genuine refugees fleeing the Middle East.

A far more effective ISIS strategy would be to cultivate an army of home-grown soldiers living within the European Union borders who are radicalized online or on the battlefield.

At least 5,000 E.U. citizens are either fighting alongside jihadist groups in Syria and Iraq right now, or have travelled to those countries and returned home.

In world war two the average age of the combat was soldier was twenty six, in vietnam he was nineteen, N-N-N-N Nineteen.

Maybe we should just send a crack team of Woppit, Rupert Murdoch and Katy Hopkins in to deal with it.

Jive Bunny - we know all this 'my enemies enemy is my friend' nonsense and where its got us. Its hardly a conspiracy.

My point is that they're all shouty, beardy, explodey, mentalists, so we should leave them all to have their great big game of 'I'm more Islamic than you, so there!!', maybe sell all sides (conventional, non ICBM) arms, so at least its profitable, then when they've all beheaded each other, stroll back in and nick all the oil.

Its a win/win

Well played Binners

Our homegrown terrorists are typically disaffected, relative loners and more often than not, middle class. Should we nuke Waitrose and the local parks?

Solo riders to be shot on sight?

So the Politicians and Mainstream Media demonize this year's hottest new enemy, whilst failing to tell you they trained and armed them in the 1st place... no conspiracy there then

Selective memory that just happens to be profitable perhaps?

jivehoneyjive - Member
So the Politicians and Mainstream Media demonize this year's hottest new enemy, whilst failing to tell you they trained and armed them in the 1st place... no conspiracy there then
Selective memory that just happens to be profitable perhaps?

If they were trained by politicians and the media then we really are in trouble!!!

So the Politicians and Mainstream Media demonize this year's hottest new enemy, whilst failing to tell you they trained and armed them in the 1st place... no conspiracy there then

Not really, seeing as that's been in the press all over the place, and we all know we did in Afghanistan too.

So the Politicians and Mainstream Media demonize this year's hottest new enemy, whilst failing to tell you they trained and armed them in the 1st place... no conspiracy there then

I know you think that its all a massive conspiracy, involving the CIA, Mossad, and probably Cyril Smith, but it really isn't. This has all been common knowledge for years. Which you'd know if you got you're actual news from normal sources,staffed by sane people, instead of David Icke, and some bloke sat in a bunker in Idaho, eating squirrels 🙄

I'm often struck by the parallels between Islamic fundamentalism and Nazism. The difference was that Nazism glorified the existing religion and didn't require people to grow beards, dress up in funny nighties and abuse their wives.

This thread lacks pyramidal infographic conveyed "evidence" and talk of the illuminati

Which you'd know if you got you're actual news from normal sources,staffed by sane people

Like the Washington Post you mean?

@piemonster, one interesting thing about your map is it shows Gaza in Egypt and West Bank in Jordan as it was before the war after which those countries agreed the land should stay with Israel.

Currently ISIS is more interested in killing other Muslims but will undoubtedly try and attack Israel at some stage, their supporters / returning Jihadists have attacked Jews in Denmark, Belgium and France at the first opportunity.

OMG...in the second picture...FREE GAZZA! Is the Geordie chappie in trouble again!???

binners - Member
... a massive conspiracy, involving the CIA, Mossad, and probably Cyril Smith,

Oooh! Sooooo close to bringing in Saville. A bonus point for making it relevant to politics though.

What's Savile got to do with the Middle East?

Bunch of loons on here and no mistake...

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https://www.savilleconsulting.com/international/middle-east-and-asia/Saudi-Arabia

I daren't click on the link in case GCHQ rendition me to Millom but I think it closes the loop, THE LOOP OF DEATH!

Where are their human rights? 😈

If they reach Israel then that will be the start of nuclear war.

jivehoneyjive - Member

..

Bunch of loons on here and no mistake

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I quite like loons, although I think their sound is overused in horror films

Couple of photos from Bradford I've posted before
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[img] [/img]
/p>

For balance, I have lived in Bradford for 4.5 years and not seem much in the way of trouble. The young lads from [i]some [/i] ****stani families have a stinking attitude, drive around in their cars 'n smoke da reefer then shout at people. There's a huge disaffected youth here, with a very mixed up sense of where they belong.

But who was it that punched me in the face in a darkened street? A gang of little [s]shite [/s]white boys.

There's gits everywhere, Bradford and Chelsea.

The devisive rhetoric coming from the government, lack of investment and the legacy of social isolation left by the exploitative mill owners who shipped loads of foreign workers over here to undermine the pay demands of the local workers, and then dumped and abandoned them - they're at the heart of the problem.

Yet further proof of the lie of the free unregulated market creating the best conditions, yet further proof of the need for social cohesion, investment in society, the end to the mud-slinging rightwing newspapers bullshit and the need for good wages and unions.

It's all a bit "rubber dinghy rapids bro"

Yet further proof of the lie of the free unregulated market creating the best conditions, yet further proof of the need for social cohesion, investment in society, the end to the mud-slinging rightwing newspapers bullshit and the need for good wages and unions.

Steady on there, that's all sounding a bit left wing. We all know that market forces are best, it's just we haven't had enough market forces yet. I prescribe a strong dose of even more austerity targeted at those who have least, give it 5 years and just you see, that will soon solve all of society's problems.

Eeerm,

You got me bang to rights. 🙂

@gofaster I appreciate what you say and you taking the time to post it, plus I don't disagree with most of it but the legacy of mill owners is going back a bit and if folk are willing to travel from Eastern Europe to the UK for work it wouldn't kill someone to move from Bradford either. No amount of Unionisation is going to help with the fundamental issues you mention (IMO of course). I think there is a big issue with second generation immigrants (of all types), the parents understand why they came and how much better it is here but the kids don't and a portion suffer an identity crises and decide it's "all the West's fault"

Is it now time to fully mobilise all available force, go in hard, and just kill them all?

How are you managing to sit at your desk and post with the raging boner you got from writing that?

For balance, I have lived in Bradford for 4.5 years and not seem much in the way of trouble. The young lads from some ****stani families have a stinking attitude, drive around in their cars 'n smoke da reefer then shout at people. There's a huge disaffected youth here, with a very mixed up sense of where they belong.

But who was it that punched me in the face in a darkened street? A gang of little shite white boys.

There's gits everywhere, Bradford and Chelsea.

The devisive rhetoric coming from the government, lack of investment and the legacy of social isolation left by the exploitative mill owners who shipped loads of foreign workers over here to undermine the pay demands of the local workers, and then dumped and abandoned them - they're at the heart of the problem.

Yet further proof of the lie of the free unregulated market creating the best conditions, yet further proof of the need for social cohesion, investment in society, the end to the mud-slinging rightwing newspapers bullshit and the need for good wages and unions.

:applauds:

It is interesting though how a lot of the people going over there seem to be well-educated etc. I work a lot in Asian areas and from what I've seen/heard a lot of the young people are very much caught between the essentially quite dull conservative Islamic culture of their parents which frowns on music and art and frivolity, and the western culture of going out and getting pissed and pulling girls etc.

They don't really feel part of either, and ISIS gives them a bit (or indeed a lot) of excitement and that feeling of being part of something, and having a cause/purpose - however shitty you might think that purpose is.

and any attack(s) will be carried out by homegrown terrorists again.
Plenty of what the media refers to as 'disaffected' youth out there. The truth is alot more simple- boy doesn't listen at school, does petty drugs and ends up in prison through every fault of his own. In prison he realises that he can instantly win respect by converting to a hard version of Islam. Suddenly hes a soldier of god and can pretend the drugs/slackness that he created wasn't his fault but Britain who held him down.

Plenty of those out there.

To be fair on Hora, that's actually a pretty spot on picture of the types of people that are open to being radicalized. Extremism of any sort is quite often a reaction to your own insecurities and a good way to place blame outside of your own locus of control.

ISIS need to be destroyed, we need UN support though and that won't happen until there has been a significant attack on the West, China or Russia.

We need to create jobs, improve womens rights and generally create lives worth living in countries such as Iraq, Sudan, Somalia etc if we are ever truly going to tackle issues surrounding terrorism. That will involve aid/development money which will be at the behest of most ukippers on here.

It is, and I'm sure that's true of many, but significant numbers have been well-educated, never in trouble with the law, not previously shown any signs of radical views etc

I'd still place a bet that if you put their lives under a microscope you might find similar but less obvious issues.

You are right of course, not every case is going to be the same - I do however think that it is a running theme.

Why haven't ISIS seen fit to attack Israel?

To quote Yamamoto "I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."

Israel don't mess about and Isis don't have the capacity to fight them.

But talk of attacking NATO states is by contrast a wise strategy?

Still a bit odd that the basis of ISIS' ideology comes from close allies and happy go lucky choppers off of hands and heads Saudi Arabia.

We really have gone through the looking glass when you consider that Iraq is now full of Iranian militias. But this is now apparently a good thing, as they're on 'our' side.

Well they are now. Might not last long, though.

I see the Saudis are hiring 18 more executioners to keep up with demand.

@grum can't say I am an expert in psychology but I do wonder whether academically bright people can blank out the human impact of the brutality as they have been convinced of the "text book rationalisation". I am not sure well educated people represent any kind of majority in ISIS but it's certainly true that a good education doesn't preclude you from becoming involved. The VICE news videos I posted of the Islamic classes for young women being run in the UK show how calmly people are bring told that killing people is justified.

Is James Murdoch still on the board of VICE news?

Saudi Prince Al-Waleed Bin Talal has sold his share in Newscorp, but does he still have ties to Carlyle Group?

jivehoneyjive - Member

But talk of attacking NATO states is by contrast a wise strategy?

Talking of attacking the west is probably a pretty good strategy if you're ISIS. Actually doing it, or as more than just a PR stunt, probably not so much.

If they reach Israel then that will be the start of nuclear war.

No it won't. Why would they need nukes?

Israel would smash them with conventional forces.

I've just remembered...

SITE intelligence in the original article have close ties to the RAND Corporation

But talk of attacking NATO states is by contrast a wise strategy?

Because our failures in Afghanistan, Iraq, Ukraine ad nauseum have shown NATO to be a lame duck.

The west doesn't have the stomach for war, Israel does. The only people in that region as motivated to fight as ISIS besides a few disparate kurds etc are the IDF/Israeli people in general.

If Europe is attacked, we will launch a few airstrikes, maybe a few special forces operations, some talking heads will waffle on TV and then we will carry on as normal until the next time we are bombed or something bonkers happens like Turkey falling to a hard Islamist coup.

Is that why the US provides such extensive military aid to Israel?

gobuchul - Member

If they reach Israel then that will be the start of nuclear war.

No it won't. Why would they need nukes?

Israel would smash them with conventional forces.

Problem is if they can reach Israel then all known nutters around that world that hate Israel will join forces including some middle eastern govts trying to be seen as "whiter than white".

This can be seen like the scenario of Dear Leader Mao who in order to remain in power did the same during the cultural revolution by joining forces with the extreme.

In middle east that is not that difficult really if the objective is to get rid of Israel. Therefore, if Iran starts to join in then Israel nuke them but Russia will come to their aid by nuking Israel and Merica and EU will come to the aid of Israel by nuking Russia. Russia will retaliate by nuking those that are nuking them ... then ****stan and India join in the party by then a stray nuke reach China where China retaliate and North Korean join in the party by nuking some of their neighbours like South Korean and Japan ... then South Africa kicks off big time as they too are threaten by the advance ISIS affiliated ... etc.

Then we have a nuclear party and the world becomes a better place to live with half the population gone. I like!

When dust settle we have new world map! Woohoo!

Yes, Israel would smash them with conventional forces. I wonder if they can start pumping sea water into all the tunnels would the ground collapse? Gassing the tunnels might be a bit dangerous.

😛

ISIS victories are primarily based on;

1) fighting people who don't want to fight, ie the Iraqi army
2) suicide bombers dislodging any pockets of resistance.

The Shia militia want to fight that's why they've been sent in to Ramadi after the army ran away. The IDF are ready willing and able to fight to defend Israel. Suicide bombers in trucks etc are not so effective against anti-tank weapons or airstrikes.

Continue to arm Israel to the teeth and let them sort out the Middle East problem.

ISIS/ISIL or whatever they are this week are scum, let them go to war with a U.S. backed Israel and see how that works, Israel don't play by the same 'gently does it' rules of engagement that the UK does.

When dust settle we have new world map!

Awesome 😕

deviant - Member

Israel don't play by the same 'gently does it' rules of engagement that the UK does.

Aye, we have that awkward thing about not massacring civilians, it holds us back.

Indeed, if only we could

mobilise all available force, go in hard, and just kill them all?

We need to draw them out to sea where we can then sink them.