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We've not been self sufficient in food since the industrial revolution.
It's better than it was prior to WWII but we're still nowhere near it.
10% fall in £/$ adds 2p (max ?) to a litre of fuel, hardly earth shattering and dwarfed by the fall in oil price anyway
The oil price has been rising since the middle of January.
On balance a weaker £ represents an easing of policy and is the same effect as lower interest rates. That is positive on balance but also has negative effects too. No free lunches in economics.
True, but in general a trade deficit is a bad thing isn't it.
Not necessarily. Depends on where we have a competitive advantage eg, we run a trade surplus in services
Therea are winners and losers, the same as there always are, but here a few things I* think are good:-
*FTSE 100 up significantly
*Govt cost of borrowing has come down significantly
*Bank of england base interest rate about to be reduced, certainly the prospect of a rise has now been kicked into the long grass.
*Business who export are now significantly better off
*Talk of corporation tax being reduced significantly
*if you had the foresight to move some money into USD or yen , then you'll have done alright
* I won my £50 bet that leave would win
* you may disagree, and I respect your right to disagree.
The real problem is farming and manufacturing all burn through a lot of diesel, petrol and oil based products (plastic's, PVC's, rubber, paints etc).. oil is rising and pound is falling = you loose.
Oil is currently around 49$ a barrel and brent (north sea oil) is typically around 55$ to break even and higher (this is recovery & refinery) so Scottish oil is little saviour (hence why most majors are mothballing the north sea until it reached 70$ again.
sadly P-Jay has nailed it.
Not sure that's true. Any evidence to support that we could be self sufficient in food?
I believe we could, we just aren't and we couldn't with existing number of farms / farmers etc. - we still have huge areas of potentially farmable land that's uninhabited.
Of course we could all go Vegan, we could probably go self sufficient now, but what about current Vegan - they'd have to live exclusively from plants that have died of all old age to remain special. 😉
Cameron gone.
Seen who's lined up to replace him? 😕
sadly P-Jay has nailed it.
Is this his second job?...
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You are quite right that many politcal parties will do anything remotely democratic like asking the people what they think.
Which would be OK if the public had the foggiest idea.
FTSE 100 up significantly
in sterling but not dollar terms - and FTSE250 is still well down.
Some seem to think we'll be heading for the glory days of the British Empire again, they mostly seem to be non-professional types....
Yes, but we produce (some of) our oil, which is going to make the north sea slightly more competitive, and make our oil and gas industry competitive (as an industry we export a lot of expertise as well as just the black stuff).
Except that the Brexit effect on economic outlook just pushed down the price of oil a bit more.
Is this his second job?...
Ha ha, no, clearly - I thought we'd vote remain with a 60% majority.
I'm just a drippy IT salesman now, but I used to be in Finance and worked for RBS, I was also part of the Graduate Training scheme and my area was basically explaining simple real-world economics to grads.
And genuinely in 2006 I wrote a sort of essay I needed for a promotion into the training dept. full time, I predicted the 'Great Recession' by 2 years, the 3 people who read it disagreed with me.
To be clear I don't think my tale of woe above will happen, we will remain in some sort of financial partnership with the EU, something akin to the EEA whereby we pay in a smaller amount every year for membership, without rebate or EU funded economic redevelopment projects, we'll still have free movement of workers between the UK and EU as it's a minimum requirement for entry.
I believe our membership fees will be equal to, or more than the net payment we make now - but instead of the % that currently comes back at economic development projects, being spent on such - it 'll will go to the treasury to reduce the deficit as per current thinking and quietly reduce tax liability of corporates and wealthy individuals - it won't go to the NHS, and it certainly won't go on ANY development projects not in the South East of England to improve London's ability to suck more out of the rest of us, like HS2.
We'll lose all voting power in the EU, no more MEPs, we can lobby them of course, but at least some of our future economic health will be decided on by a truly unelected by us body.
It's a much worse deal for most of the population of the UK, but ironically both sides can sell it as a win, so it’ll likely be popular.
Except that the Brexit effect on economic outlook just pushed down the price of oil a bit more.
I'm (begrudgingly, hopefully, naively) pinning my hopes on the markets picking up when we have a new Prime Minister and a plan. Right now the markets are circling the drain because we're a ship cast adrift without a rudder, at least once we've got the steering sorted hopefully things will get back to normal.
I don't think we'll do well in the negotiations, we'll be back to "in Europe, but as a special case", there'll still be free movement and a free market. If we do well we might be able to stop the repatriation of profits (Starbucks, Google, et. al.) but that's best case. So mostly things will be back to normal, just with a year or two of recession.
Over 400million people will be better off.
Surely it must dawn on the politicians that if we do leave the EU, the very best deal that can be reached will involve the same level of migration, the same monies being paid to the EU, the same level of access to markets, the same rights for workers, but absolutely no voting power within the European Parliament?
In that case, the best we can do is to simply not enact Article 50 and explain to the voters that they - we - were duped by the leave campaign's "dishonesty on an industrial scale"?
I mean, it's pragmatic, it's sensible and it saves the economy, banking sector and avoids Scottish independence. However, our politicians opine that leaving is part of a democratic process that needs to be respected, when deciding on a new Prime Minister and a new government which in itself will not be ratified by popular mandate and thus democracy be damned.
Talk of corporation tax being reduced significantly
This might be a good thing for businesses, but when facing a recession how is cutting tax receipts going to help public services? Is it really going to generate investment with all this shit hanging over our heads?
This might be a good thing for businesses, but when facing a recession how is cutting tax receipts going to help public services?
Tories. Modus operandi.
We'll all end up being shafted by big business and we'll have to pick up the tab for it somehow. My guess is that public services will be cut even further, but that we'll still find tens of billions to fund new Trident subs.
Tax cuts on corps and increasing debt in the short-medium term is effectively part of Keynesian economics isn't it? Ie the right thing to do, spend when times are shit to bolster business and growth. Anything that helps growth needs to be encouraged, public investment (eg in the sciences and technology) that helps growth should also be looked at - but not public investment that does nothing to boost the long term outlook of the economy.
So of course, the north is going to get shafted because they are effectively next to useless when it comes to science and technology. All of the engineering and science is in Cambridge and Oxfordshire.
Oh well, personally I hope Sunderland etc end up like potato famine Ireland.
Surely it must dawn on the politicians that if we do leave the EU, (etc.)
Surely it must dawn on you that they don't give a flying fart about all that compared to the effect on their own careers? Hence you now have the ardent Remainers in Tory ranks all gung-ho Leave because they see "party unity" as the road to re-election and their own comfy seat.
it's made the Leavers suddenly realise what idiots they've been, and why a turkey should never vote for Christmas.
Really? My money is on them continuing blaming immigrants/foreigners/the EU, the disabled and those bloody do-gooders.
Surely it must dawn on you that they don't give a flying fart about all that compared to the effect on their own careers?
I was trying to apply logic and reason to the situation, I know full well from the way that both campaigns were conducted that the order of priorities were careers, misleading the electorate, pandering to the Daily Heil/Faily Express/The Scum and the common good of the nation - in that order.
For our part, all we can do is to pester our elected representatives in parliament to let them know our thoughts and to remind them that we'll never, ever forget.
Gove's been humiliated.
errrm, that's it.
In that case, the best we can do is to simply not enact Article 50 and explain to the voters that they - we - were duped by the leave campaign's "dishonesty on an industrial scale"?
ample scope to do that I reckon - the leave campaign focused on so many non-issues.
Tax cuts on corps and increasing debt in the short-medium term is effectively part of Keynesian economics isn't it? Ie the right thing to do, spend when times are shit to bolster business and growth.
but are you not suppossed to save up in the good times so that you have money to invest, whereas our debt is huge.
For the Tories, it's great.
It's the new [i]"... because the mess Labour left us"[/i] catch all excuse.
They can cut back the state, privatise the NHS, schools and cut benefits then when everyone complains blame Brexit.
"The public have made a clear decision! We have a mandate to <insert political ideal not necessarily related to Brexit> and deliver what the public want".
Our company has had record revenues since Brexit.
10% fall in £/$ adds 2p (max ?) to a litre of fuel, hardly earth shattering and dwarfed by the fall in oil price anyway
i thought the reason diesel has been cheaper over the past few months was due to the euro's fall against the pound, and most diesel refineries being in europe, vs the petrol ones we have here?
Great news for British firms who manufacturer and export.
Bad news for those who import or foreign firms who import into the UK.
Mortgage deals getting better as per an early thread on STW.
Cameron, Gideon and others out.
Remain campainger and architect of the massive recession Bliar feeling some heat this week.
There will be a woman PM soon. She could be a new Thatcher (that could be good or bad).
Remain voters (the ones who are scared of change/better the devil you know complain that wealthy offspring and middle class off spring may find it harder to get a job in a fancy European city).
I have a positive outlook on life. Maybe some people should chill out and stop the negativity now.
There will be a woman PM soon.
thats really quite irrelavant
tinas, relying on what we can grow locally would be utterly dismal. No out of season soft fruit or veg, minimal meat (just upland lamb really, arable would have to be devoted to cereals and veg). One of the great benefits of international trade is the diversity of food we can enjoy. Not that there's anything wrong with eating local stuff per se.
the makers of those very small St George flags that stick on car windows have more orders than they know what to do with?
irrelevant
Surely it must dawn on the politicians that if we do leave the EU, the very best deal that can be reached will involve the same level of migration, the same monies being paid to the EU, the same level of access to markets, the same rights for workers, but absolutely no voting power within the European Parliament?
Maybe thats not the very best deal then ! There is a scenario with a collapsing eurozone/EU where no deal is the best deal, we refocus away from the stangnant / shrinking EU (accelerating the exiting trend of a decling trade share with the EU) and we stop making any contributions to the EU budget..
Our voting power in the Parliament is negligible and it doesn't make any laws anyway.. I certainly don't ive a t.ss about so-called influence.
You are quite right that many political parties will do anything remotely democratic like asking the people what they think.
The country now recognizes the benefits of a representative parliamentary decision-making democracy over blunt yes/no voting by the populace. Hard way to learn this lesson, but so be it.
My shares have soared and I'll get more European travel for work because the [url= http://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-vote-sets-off-race-to-seat-ema/ ]EMA will be relocating out of London[/url].
P-Jay nails it - Same net contribution, less influence, but we now have control.
No more politicians from Etonia?
Less whining hopefully from now on.
Cameron can never look smug again.
P-Jay nails it - Same net contribution, less influence, but we now have the mirage of control.
FTFY
#littleengland
#fakecontrol
My mother in law (who voted leave) just rang. "You must be loving these low interest rates" says she (I run a business with a fair amount of debt).
The BOE might squeeze them down the teeny bit they have left, to try to paper over the first cracks, but I'd rather they didn't need to and still have customers, if it's all the same.
I conclude - if you live in the bizarre made-up world many of these people seem to inhabit then the economic utopia outside the EU that they voted for is already with us. There's good news everywhere you look.
Strangely as I have said elsewhere on STW as a remain voter I am already looking at my (and my kids) fiscal position improving, probably not what the working poor were hoping for - cut in corporation tax great news saved my business at least £10k next year - cut in interest rates and reduced house prices is great for my kids as first time buyers with good jobs - we could be viewed as the "haves" but in reality we have worked *ing hard and done without holidays and shiny bollocks to get here - frankly the upper and lower levels who voted out can crack on and continue whining about phantom immigration and Polish people stealing their jobs - the truth is these people at both ends are not part of the process they were simply used by Back out Boris and F off Farage- the simple fact is the prosperous will continue to prosper
Amazing how fast you can shift from the left to the right - now that's a ****ing protest vote.
About right. I'll be OK out of this whatever happens. Millions won't but a lot of them seem to be the leave voters so maybe I shouldn't care.
Oldmanmtb you now it's feasible people have long memories about the UK fishing industry decimation, see EU/it's policies, multi billion bailouts required both by current and future members and 'harmonisation' as not for them..but hey carry on with your blinkered redtop view that all the majority care about is 'immigration'. I didn't vote out because of immigration. It was cumulative reasons. Also I'm also English, British. I don't see myself as 'European' you probably would call me alittle Englander for that. It is possible to have an opposing viewpoint to you and not be belittled by BBC/press and social media narrow minded reporting.
As for 'Farage/Boris.
The remain camp had the 2008 duo, Gideon and Cameron. Enough said.
Oldmanmtb you now it's feasible people have long memories about the UK fishing industry decimation, see EU/it's policies
You mean the same fisheries run by idiots that would have decimated themselves in the long term through over fishing?
You can't even coherently defend your position, and then you create a new "I'm not racist" meme - "I'm not racist but I consider myself English not European".
Hora I really would like to see the working poor improve their lot, they might have done a spectacular protest vote but I would bet 3-5 years down the line they are in a worse position and the prosperous are better off. Protest is nothing without power - it's just words- why do you think Boris and Farage stepped away? They are many things but not stupid they both have a better grasp of the reality of trying to turn this thing around than the poor sods who voted for them. The very people that a lot of exit voters supported could not give a shit about them - talk about being mugged it's utterly disgraceful