Sigh.
I feel like moving to scotland
I guess my move to Switzerland is on hold sadly 😉
Finland for me
I feel like moving to the garage
I feel like chicken tonight.
If we can just renegotiate the England / Scotland border to somewhere around Birmingham...
Federal UK might help...
If we can just renegotiate the England / Scotland border to somewhere around Birmingham...
+1
"Northernland" has a certain ring to it, but we're excluding Cheshire straight off. That'll be our Lesotho.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
"Northernland" has a certain ring to it, but we're excluding Cheshire straight off. That'll be our Lesotho.
Rain City has a certain ring to it.
If we can just renegotiate the England / Scotland border to somewhere around Birmingham...
A big wall is an infrastructure project that could unite us all 😀
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
Rain City has a certain ring to it.
That's the great thing about Northernland. We get a Government that represents Scottish/Northern interests and you still get to feel superior.
So, a win-win. 😀
Pigface - Member
Finland for me
Findus for me.
The south can keep Cheshire and Harrogate, but in exchange the north gets Cornwall, which I think would be reet nice with all the Londoners kicked out and people actually living in the homes.
but in exchange the north gets Cornwall
Might have to move most of the Cornish out though. Now [u]that's[/u] a major infrastructure project. 😀
I think I'll be looking at 'relocating' when I'm at Tweedlove in a few weeks..
If you thought a Labour victory was going to turn britain into some kind of Swedish sytle utopia then 😯
They had 13 years last time an didn't get us close.
No, don't be stupid.
I just don't like the thought that the majority of people don't give a shit about others.
Of course it's not true, that's the frustrating part. Most 'ordinary' people are left leaning, but somehow they get duped to vote for the party that ends up benefiting the rich few.
I live in Kent, but I've already pledged allegiance to Scotland.
If only Scotland were 750 miles to the southwest and midge free...
Of course it's not true, that's the frustrating part. Most 'ordinary' people are left leaning, but somehow they get duped to vote for the party that ends up benefiting the rich few.
Word
Those who publicly want to heal the world secretly want to rule it.
Wot?
Most 'ordinary' people are left leaning
That's nonsense. Most ordinary people have a mix of views which are left, right, totalitarian and liberal. As a country we're centre left, as are all our mainstream parties.
I quite fancy Ireland myself. Or Canadia.
I suddenly feel like moving to Sweden.
Oooh - will this help our immigration figures?
Seriously considering moving back to Scotland, possibly even the US. Seems certain now that another Scottish referendum will happen and get a yes. I was against it but I didn't bank on the English being so stupid again.
I don't know why people thinkg Labour do anything other than pay lip service to their principles whilst looking after the rich.
I feel like chicken tonight.
😀 😀 😀
If only Scotland were 750 miles to the southwest and midge free...
and full of Cornish and Devonians, ie exactly like Devon and Cornwall 🙂
Most 'ordinary' people are left leaning, but somehow they get duped to vote for the party that ends up benefiting the rich few.
I suspect many take the view that although they are left leaning, Labour are a bunch of incompetant fools with very little difference between them and the Tory's following their New Labour lurch to the centre.
So if they are going to be governed by a bunch of idiots then its probably a better having a bunch of idiots who will piss less of our money up the wall.
I think this country is crying out for a competant, compelling, left of centre party that will offer a real choice. Less of the "don't worry the rich will pay" [s]retoric[/s] bullshit spouted by the current Labour party and more of a "If we all pay more into the public sector then we will all get more out of it and this will be a nicer, happier place to live".
The differences between Scandinavia and here are much more fundamental than just a more lefty approach to tax and spending. For example their tax regime could probably be called less progressive than ours, low earners certainly pay a higher percentage than we do and their tax free threshold is lower, VAT is also higher and there isn't a zero rating.
That's nonsense. Most ordinary people have a mix of views which are left, right, totalitarian and liberal. As a country we're centre left, as are all our mainstream parties.
Well said @5thElefant. We have a Conservative government which supports the NHS and a budget of £140bn a year of Welfare (even if that's £12bn less than we currently spend). That's left of centre politics globally.
badnewz - Member
Those who publicly want to heal the world secretly want to rule it.
Benign dictatorship.
@jlfetch, you have summed up my my own views perfectly
The differences between Scandinavia and here are much more fundamental than just a more lefty approach to tax and spending. For example their tax regime could probably be called less progressive than ours, low earners certainly pay a higher percentage than we do and their tax free threshold is lower, VAT is also higher and there isn't a zero rating.
Scandinavia is changing, unfortunately, dragged down to the lowest common denominator of neo-liberalism. But until now there has been a fundamental difference in their assumptions regarding the role of individuals and society, with people giving up a lot of what we imagine to be "freedoms" in return for security.
Sweden or Finland or even Findus aren't perfect but you can feel safe and secure there. Decent housing is affordable, you can see a doctor without waiting 3 weeks for an appointment. 2 things which you can't say about here.
Some ignorant comments about Cheshire. It doesn't just consist of rich and pampered places like Prestbury and Alderley Edge. Have you even been to places like Winsford?
I live in Cheshire in a 2-up 2 down house and have never voted Conservative in my life.
I suddenly feel like moving to Sweden.
Only country where the clouds are interesting.
you can see a doctor without waiting 3 weeks for an appointment
Utter claptrap.
Housing is a big issue here but we have the most accessable healthcare system in the world.
Sorry jfletch that is what happened 2 weeks ago when I wanted to make an appointment. First one available was in 3 weeks, no my case wasn't bad enough to go to A+E. No other alternatives.
Hey I didn't know you were involved in the conversation I had with the receptionist oh that right you weren't there, idiot.
ONS looks at posting history, increases estimate of UK productivity.
Sorry jfletch that is what happened 2 weeks ago when I wanted to make an appointment. First one available was in 3 weeks, no my case wasn't bad enough to go to A+E. No other alternatives.
That can't be right - you could have gone in the evening, or on a weekend. I know that's true, because Dave said so!
Good Stranglers reference. If anyone needs help with setting up home , red tape etc I can help with the Swedish move if you bring over Branston Pickle and good bacon.
No, don't be stupid.I just don't like the thought that the majority of people don't give a shit about others.
Nihilism and misanthropy is great, you should try it.
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I live in Cheshire in a 2-up 2 down house and have never voted Conservative in my life.
You're an increasingly endangered species!
I think this country is crying out for a competant, compelling, left of centre party that will offer a real choice. Less of the "don't worry the rich will pay" retoric bullshit spouted by the current Labour party and more of a "If we all pay more into the public sector then we will all get more out of it and this will be a nicer, happier place to live".
IMO, Labour went too left. The electorate voted for whoever vaguely resembled Blair. Labour have to out Blair, Cameron.
I think this country is crying out for a competant, compelling, left of centre party that will offer a real choice. Less of the "don't worry the rich will pay" retoric bullshit spouted by the current Labour party and more of a "If we all pay more into the public sector then we will all get more out of it and this will be a nicer, happier place to live".
IMO, Labour went too left. The electorate voted for whoever vaguely resembled Blair. Labour have to out Blair, Cameron.
If this circled can't be squared, there will need to be a realignment on the Left - Ernie will be over the moon.
I just don't like the thought that the majority of people don't give a shit about others.
There's no need to 'like the thought', as it's almost certainly not true.
Molgrips, totally agree with your earlier point. Result of this vote demonstrates the majority are ignorantly looking out for themselves and not caring about their fellow man...really sad...
Before its picked up, not majority literally, but enough to do the damage...
Sorry jfletch that is what happened 2 weeks ago when I wanted to make an appointment. First one available was in 3 weeks, no my case wasn't bad enough to go to A+E. No other alternatives.Hey I didn't know you were involved in the conversation I had with the receptionist oh that right you weren't there, idiot.
Sounds shitty.
But there is always another alternative. Your GP will have an on call doctor who will see you that day if you need it.
I'm not saying the system is perfect, it's not, there aren't enough GPs. But what we have is a hell of a lot better than the alternative and accessability is one of its strenghts. You will always find cases like yours in any system.
But what we have is a hell of a lot better than the alternative
That sort of depends what the alternative is, n'est-ce pas?
Pigface - Member
Sweden or Finland or even Findus aren't perfect but you can feel safe and secure there. Decent housing is affordable, you can see a doctor without waiting 3 weeks for an appointment. 2 things which you can't say about here.
Can't speak about Sweden but I can about Finland.
- Housing is affordable in places far from the main settlements. Should you move to Helsinki, Turku, Tampere or Espoo, it's expensive. It's also difficult to secure banking services from Finnish banks as an new immigrant.
- Getting a GP appointment can take a month. Seeing a specialist needs a GP referral. The doctors are poorly trained and prescribe paracetamol for nearly every malady... or so it seems!
Finland has been very good at marketing itself as a utopia.
jfletch you didn't say that you said what I said was claptrap.
I have a really sore shoulder due to a dislocation, it was very painful and I wanted to speak to the doc about possible referral. No point going to A+E there was nothing they can do and would be a waste of that resource. So what should I do?
I gritted my teeth took ibuprofen and saw him last week he did refer me so job done.
As a country we're centre left, as are all our mainstream parties.
What?
IMO, Labour went too left.
[i]What?[/i]
As a country we're centre left, as are all our mainstream parties.
Serious question - are you dyslexic? Because not knowing your left and right is a sign of that...
IMO, Labour went too left.
Are you smoking crack?
I have a really sore shoulder due to a dislocation, it was very painful and I wanted to speak to the doc about possible referral. No point going to A+E there was nothing they can do and would be a waste of that resource. So what should I do?
Be honest with yourself and be forceful with the receptionist.
Is it genuinely so sore that a visit to a pharmasist isn't enough till you get a scheduled appointment? No, go see a pharmasist. Yes, explain that to the receptionist and you will go on the on call list for that day, the doctor may refer you there and then or want to see you and give you an on call appointment.
Are you smoking crack?
No, that's what a lot in the Labour camp think as well.
Have you been following Swedish politics recently mol?
Be careful what you wish for.
The Scandi Utopian model that is bandied around is a far cry from the reality.
I like Scandinavia but their left leaning governments might do more harm than good to their tiny population. Finland may be a bit on the right because they have Russia at their doorstep while the rest of the Scandinavian countries are slowly creating social troubles for themselves.
What teamhurtmore says +1...
teamhurtmore - MemberHave you been following Swedish politics recently mol?
Be careful what you wish for.
I was talking to my CEO who lives in Sweden and he said the rise of what is practically Nazism is scary at the moment, some of the Danish members of the group however liked the curbing of immigration which is being proposed. It is crazy in lots of places around the world not just here.
Indeed, when a certain dodgy politician started spouting stuff about the Nordic model and it's wonder, you knew it was time for some proper scrutiny. 😉
jp-t853 - Member
I was talking to my CEO who lives in Sweden and he said the rise of what is practically Nazism is scary at the moment, some of the Danish members of the group however liked the curbing of immigration which is being proposed. It is crazy in lots of places around the world not just here.
The rise of the extreme right wing is due to the left leaning governments/parties hammering the population with certain views that are not natural. i.e. open door mass migration will cause tension whether you like it or not.
Well my year in Finland had none of the problems you say HansRey, flat was cheap as chips no sauna which the land lord kept apologising for.
Health care no problem, brilliant dentist as well.
The Scandi Utopian model that is bandied around is a far cry from the reality.
Possibly, but Scandinavia is a lot closer to Utopia than we are.
Sweden is suffering a racist backlash from a small group of nutters incensed by the relatively enormous numbers of refugees admitted recently.
The rise of the extreme right wing is due to the left leaning governments/parties [b]hammering the population with certain views that are not natural[/b]. i.e. open door mass migration will cause tension whether you like it or not.
Nobody is being "hammered", and I don't see what is "not natural" about helping people in need.
DrJ - MemberThe Scandi Utopian model that is bandied around is a far cry from the reality.Possibly, but Scandinavia is a lot closer to Utopia than we are.
Sweden is suffering a racist backlash from a small group of nutters incensed by the relatively enormous numbers of refugees admitted recently.
They are not nutters but a real reality check ... what's their population again? How many per family you say? They will be a minority in 3 generations. Fact!
We have 5 million in N. Borneo and we are nearing minority in 2 generations now and another generation we will definitely be minority.
DrJ - Member
Nobody is being "hammered", and I don't see what is "not natural" about helping people in need.
Well, do as they like as they Will become minority. Fact! Ya, go twist and turn your arguments as much as you like and in 3 generations ... I hope this thread will not be resurrected because ... "I told you soooo ...!"
[b]
Trying to help the entire world is not natural.[/b]
Well said @5thElefant. We have a Conservative government which supports the NHS and a budget of £140bn a year of Welfare (even if that's £12bn less than we currently spend). That's left of centre politics globally.
Its certainly an efficient way of transferring public funds into the pockets of private enterprise, more of which will now be happening, leaving less to be actually spent on the public.
Its certainly an efficient way of transferring public funds into the pockets of private enterprise
All 6% of the NHS budget.
Called my Dr's at 10:30 today, I have an appointment at 15:30 today. Bloody awful 🙄
Pigface - MemberSweden or Finland or even Findus aren't perfect but you can feel safe and secure there. Decent housing is affordable, you can see a doctor without waiting 3 weeks for an appointment. 2 things which you can't say about here.
I feel safe and secure where I live, after all the UK enjoys a murder rate roughly equal to Sweden (1.1 murders per 100k people in UK, 1.0 in Sweden) but less than half of Finland with 2.3.
Sexual Assaults are far more frequent in Sweden than the UK, Finland offers a slightly better chance of making it home without being groped, but we're still talking about 21 and 28 assaults per 100k people, hardly the last days of Rome.
You're more likely to be assaulted in Sweden than you are in England and Wales, which is remarkable given the state of our High Streets at the weekend. You're also more likely to be burgled in Sweden than you are in the UK, you're more like to have your Car stolen in Finland or Sweden - hardly a Scandinavian utopia.
As for a GP, I can usually see one the same day if I'm really ill, or in a few days if it's just something I want to chat about or sometime minor.
If I call up and say my Daughter is ill (she'll not 1 till June) they always say I can come down straight away and they'll see her - and whilst I know it cam be frustrating waiting in A&E for hours with a simple fracture, cut or ingrowing toenail - let me assure you, if you turn up in the back of an Ambo pissing blood and dropping bits of bone around the place you can be in the door and into theatre inside 30 mins, I know, I've done it, it was the most impressive bit of team work I've ever seen - given a bit of practice I'd bet money on a bunch of A&E nurses over a F1 team changing tyres any day.
Anyway, back on point, if the NHS goes, we go with it - but we don't know where, we love the UK.
Wow which bit of "aren't perfect" do you not understand P-Jay 😆
P-Jay - MemberAnyway, back on point, if the NHS goes, we go with it - but we don't know where, we love the UK.
NHS will Not disappear perhaps scale down but emergency will still be dealt with if common sense prevails.
As stated Sweden is not utopia the bacon is abysmal . However , the things that really matter to me as 33 year old father of one , Sweden is fantastic for. Jobs ,houses , nature , the value placed in children and family life, equality,medical care, free education. Plus the appalling old boys network that still runs British society doesn't exist here. I was trying to explain to someone the concept of people in the uk moving to get their children into a good school . Her reply was 'why are there bad schools?"
Top Banana I say.
I just don't like the thought that the majority of people don't give a shit about others.Of course it's not true, that's the frustrating part. Most 'ordinary' people are left leaning, but somehow they get duped to vote for the party that ends up benefiting the rich few.
You could say its shows that most people aren't daft and know (however much it frustrates them) that money has to be earned, bills have to be paid and that we only get out what we put in. Gordon Brown spending sprees are only fun while they last and the hangovers are long and painful. There are still too many people in this country that think the world owes them a living. They now have another five years to wake up.
Pigface - MemberWow which bit of "aren't perfect" do you not understand P-Jay
Just the bit afterwards where you described Finland and Sweden as doing better than the UK on Crime (assuming you want to feel safe and secure from crime and not exterrestrials or something) and Healthcare when they're not
Perhaps you should have written "Sweden and Finland aren't perfect, AND they're slightly more dangerous places to live, and the healthcare isn't as good, but I assume I could afford a nicer house there as I think housing is cheaper than the UK relative to incomes" 😉
But is it? Have you checked, or have you assumed? It's not all Meatballs and Flat Pack Furniture you know 😉
Well I have lived in both and enjoyed them very much.
I didn't mention "crime" that is your assumption. Why have you brought crime into it. I said secure which isn't crime unless you are going to tell me different.
What proof do you have that Sweden and Finland are more dangerous than the UK, provide the evidence for you assertions please.
Pigface - MemberSorry jfletch that is what happened 2 weeks ago when I wanted to make an appointment. First one available was in 3 weeks, no my case wasn't bad enough to go to A+E. No other alternatives.
Hey I didn't know you were involved in the conversation I had with the receptionist oh that right you weren't there, idiot.
Maybe if you weren't so rude you'd get seen quicker.
I got an appointment with my GP straight away the last time I needed one.
I was then seen promptly at the hospital, had another quick visit to the docs before receiving excellent treatment back at the hospital with the physiotherapist.
The standard of care provided by the (STW won't like this!) privately run NHS hospital was second to none. 🙂
Actually I did recently use some expensive private healthcare.
The only way it bettered the service provided by the NHS was free parking.
But then I am friendly, nice and polite. 😀
Er ok sbob what ever you say 🙄