I don't want to go all Daily Mail

Sounds like driving may not be for you.

TBF I suffer from dickheads that have no idea how big their car is, in my case they come flying down the road with a wing mirror to spare either side and get all butthurt when I don't move over to let them through. Usually it's fine as they just use the pavement instead.

Sounds like driving may not be for you.

I'm good thanks, held driving licences in 4 countries, have an HGV licence from the army and have driven Land Rovers length of Africa and South America.

The issue is was trying to describe is that it is very difficult to see potholes and the edge of the road crumbling on a country lane, when being blinded and simultaneously having that same SUV that is blinding you drive 4ft out from their side of the road forcing you over into the verge.

See it all the time, people think they need a SUV for better visibility, then proceed to constantly be the worst drivers.

I’m good thanks, held driving licences in 4 countries, have an HGV licence from the army and have driven Land Rovers length of Africa and South America.

So your issue is clearly that you think you are far, far superior to all of us mere mortals then?

Nothing like that at all. Purely observational, see every type of vehicle driving towards me on commute to work, 90% of which is country lanes, everything from combines, large tractors, 4x4 etc, I can guarantee if the vehicle is at least a 2 metres out from their side of the road and scared to get there tyres dirty it will be an SUV, the superiority complex seems to come from thinking you need a fashion vehicle and to look down on others, and constantly always expecting others to be the ones to give way as you barge your way through, normally wouldn't bother me, but the state of our rural roads is terrible after this winter, some parts have been constantly flooded for months on end.

The issue is was trying to describe is that it is very difficult to see potholes and the edge of the road crumbling on a country lane, when being blinded and simultaneously having that same SUV that is blinding you drive 4ft out from their side of the road forcing you over into the verge.

Agree with this entirely... on small roads the vehicle coming the other way having a combination of high and blinding lights, needing more road space, yet being driven as if it was a diddy hot hatch with seemingly no sense of road position... I'd say the result is "an annoyance" at the very least... and increasingly common.

Purely observational, see every type of vehicle driving towards me on commute to work,

To be fair this does happen a lot, even people driving around parked cars. They'll drive on the wrong side of the road towards oncoming traffic then expect the other person to give way to them. It happens to me whether I'm in a car or on my bike. It's not anything to do with them being short people who don't know where their nearside wheel is though, that is complete bollocks. It's more to do with either really shit driving or trying to intimidate you into moving over and giving way to them.

I'll never forget the time when some berk in a Jaguar was driving straight towards me on the wrong side of the road, overtaking parked cars, whilst I was cycling into town one lunchtime. He was accelerating up to at least 45-50mph in a 30, and there was just enough space  for me between him and the kerb. It was a cold December day so I had my thickest sealskinz gloves on, I held my space and just popped my right hand out as he got close enough to see. His wing mirror then slapped my hand and went sailing about 20ft into the air and smashed to smitherines on the road. Didn't half give my hand a sting even through gloves but it was worth it. I then heard that sound of car reversing really quickly,.

I suppose the combination of being shorter and the raised ride height/high window line on SUVs would make it a little harder to see where the nearside kerb is for a shorter person. Shouldn't be a problem if the mirrors/seat heights are correctly adjusted though.

^^^^ All this stuff about short people is nonsense – anyone who knows how large their car is can easily judge where the kerb is, irrespective of their height.

I swear car designers don’t drive their test cars in real world conditions, or see what their car is like from the perspective of other drivers…screens instead of buttons and **** lighting just proves my theory.

+1 for noticing other car drivers not moving over far enough on smaller roads, been like it for a few years now. Toasters* (*left the auto correct in as it’s funny).

*screens instead of buttons*

1,000,000% – how on earth anyone can cope with a Tesla is beyond me. Hateful vehicles inside and out.

I think it's jus that they're brighter. There's no sensible "65W" limit to them.

And the sharp cut offs + SUV heights mean that when you do drip under their dipped beam it feels like you're absolutely blinded as they go from looking like DRL's to fliping lazer beams.

LED lights have a shorter visible “throw” on the road

Photons (of a given energy) are photons (of a given energy), They don't get absorbed by air any quicker or slower  unless you pick some that match the absorption spectra of O2/N2/H2O (which is outside the visible spectrum).

LED's do tend to have a sharper cut-off, but that because they're new.  The OH's fiesta has a sharp cut off too, but it's halogen.  That just means there's less light spilling out above the beam being thrown down the road.

I can see the logic in the throw argument, they just have a higher efficacy, as witnessed by brighter street lights with less light pollution. I think you're both making the same point.

Forgot to dip my feeble main beam on a section of road this evening(flame away), nobody seemed to notice.
Less than a year old Van but Halogens.

The issue is was trying to describe is that it is very difficult to see potholes and the edge of the road crumbling on a country lane

If you continue to drive when you cannot see then as I said, maybe driving is not for you.  If you cannot see then stop, wait for oncoming car to pass and then continue when you can see.

I live rurally where there is no lighting and have the same issues on crumbling roads, potholes covered in water etc,. but yet I haven't had any punctures.

If there are bright lights and roads that are too narrow for two cars to pass each other at speed then drive accordingly...

LED lights have a shorter visible “throw” on the road – which is why you see so many with their full beams on on 30-40mph roads. It’s definitely a fairly new phenomenon. I can happily drive at 70 with a dipped beam in my 2011

Absolute nonsense. As someone who used to drive various vehicles at high speed, LED is much clearer with a better cast than any halogen I’ve driven.

So your issue is clearly that you think you are far, far superior to all of us mere mortals then?

Tbf, the majority of STW drivers are possessed of limitless, superhuman driving skills and physiological attributes. Most STWers can rally a RWD car on summer tyres on compacted snow and outperform factory ABS systems when crash (sic) braking on ice. Similarly the average STWer can maintain 70mph plus average speeds on twisting rural lanes at night using only sidelights thanks to superior vision and reactions.

Most have at some vague point in the past, been trained in fast road driving by Stirling Moss, the SAS, Lewis Hamilton or a combination of all three. And road behaviour which for less-skilled drivers would be lethally dangerous is, for most STW petrol-heads, 'spirited driving' or 'making progress'.

I factor this in whenever any sort of driving or driving-related thread occurs and am rarely disappointed.

Did I ever mention how Google Map estimated journey-durations are invariably 50% or more slower than my actual journey time? I often average more than 70mph for a journey without breaking the National Speed Limit at any point. Skillz innit.

In this case, can I just say, as someone who has driven various vehicles in a 'spirited' fashion for my entire life - no exaggeration! - that modern lights are unnecessarily bright and I frequently turn mine off to hone my driving skills at night. If you need lights to drive in the dark, you should consider surrendering your licence or confine your driving to daylight hours. Just saying, etc, YMMV.

“V. 2 Osram LED Nightbreakers”

Are they TUV compliant? Didn’t know there was an LED Nightbreaker. Certainly not MOT compliant here.

@jamesoz

Ja! Looking on the Osram compatibility page and it seems it's just EU countries where they're eligible.

I think it's partly driven by LEDs being self levelling, which means the driver has no control to dip them further if they're getting flashed a lot. There's no need to have dipped beams at the max allowed height when driving around town, for example. Not that I imagine many if any people would ever change that willingly

In my experience it’s largely Teslas, Minis and cars that probably shouldn’t have LEDs in the standard housing which are the biggest culprit.

MOT failiure to put LED bulbs in a non LED "festoon" or whatever they are called.

Ive said since day 1 supid twinkly DLRs are pointless and hateful. The "light bar" fashion even worse.

The newesrt Audi headlights that are supposed to be able to leave a "black box" over areas the car decides are pedestrians, cyclists and other vehicle rear windows. A great idea but i woudlnt want to have to pay to replace one!

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1031621_audi-demonstrates-effects-of-matrix-led-headlights-video

^ @Olly, Mercedes, BMW and I am sure a load of other manufacturers do that already so not sure why its a big announcement. My Mercedes GLC (four years old) has them. They also adjust the throw pattern automatically (using GPS) when approaching junctions, corners, roundabouts etc. 99% of the time they are absolutely amazing but the sensor to adjust the light pattern around oncoming/following traffic can get confused in heavier rain so I have to switch off the auto lights.

Edit - I have just seen that the article was written in 2015...

There has just been an OTA update giving newer Teslas (post 2021 I think) matrix headlights, so will be interesting to see if that reduces glare that Teslas often seem guilty of producing.

I think matrix headlamps is still not legal in the US, so later cars had the hardware, but were not enabled for the US market.

Not all SUV drivers are selfish dickheads, but all selfish dickheads appear to want to drive one.

I think matrix headlamps is still not legal in the US

They aren't, massive market in people activating them off their own backs.

Every time you get an OTA update or a service, they switch them back off.

FWIW, lots of manufacturers looking at smarter lights, low power settings in certain areas/certain scenarios to reduce glare, smarter matrix settings etc.

LED lights have a shorter visible “throw” on the road 

No, they don't. They meet the same requirements as HID/halogen/filament/candle in a jar lights.

Unless of course they've been set up by a muppet. Or damaged

Steeply angled lenses make it hard to get it right too, there's much less tolerance to dirt/damage on the glass, or build tolerances.

“ MOT failiure to put LED bulbs in a non LED “festoon” or whatever they are called”

Yes it is, but that relies on it being spotted or not being swapped to halogen for the test.

If there are bright lights and roads that are too narrow for two cars to pass each other at speed then drive accordingly…

Great. Of course, in this scenario, you only control one of the two cars.

All the SUV moaners....go find me a new big estate car from Ford, Toyota, Honda, Volvo, etc. They don't exist. Mondeo estate ? Nope. Avensis estate ? Nope. Accord estate ? Nope. V70 ? Nope.

So many are basically forced into an SUV because most mainstream car manufacturers have decided that's what is being made available.
(And I'm not having an Audi or BMW as they're all driven by waaaankers, and Mercs are waaaay to spendy).

No one is "forced" to buy a new car. Plenty of great examples of used estates and compact MPVs out there. But the vehicles aren't the problem... being set up and driven in a way that blinds oncoming traffic and forcing them off the road is. All drivers have a responsibility for their vehicles and how they drive them. Buy a bigger car with higher brighter lights that are more sensitive to set up and use issues... then it's your responsibility to ensure you're not blinding drivers, allowing them room, and travelling at appropriate speeds on smaller roads.

Octavia still do an estate don't they? Or superb if you want really really big.

So many are basically forced into an SUV because most mainstream car manufacturers have decided that’s what is being made available.

Whilst true for newer cars this wasnt the case for the buyers for the last few years. Whilst the suv are more profitable if no one had brought them they would have had to give up on the idea.

"find me an estate car from Ford, Toyota, Honda, Volvo, etc. They don’t exist"

https://www.toyota.co.uk/new-cars/corolla-touring-sports/build

https://www.parkers.co.uk/ford/focus/estate/review/practicality/

VW, Skoda, Seat, Vauxhall, BMW, Audi, Peugeot, King, MG...there are literally hundreds of the things!

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?advertising-location=at_cars&body-type=Estate&moreOptions=visible&postcode=m437qz&radius=1500&sort=relevance&year-from=new&page=8

“ MOT failiure to put LED bulbs in a non LED “festoon” or whatever they are called”

Is it? It certainly never used to be but does fall foul of Construction and Use Regs. That one's a police stop.

Matrix heads are amazing to drive at night. Much better for the your view and the driver coming the opposite way. Although I appreciate they are not common and pricey. But definitely the best solution. Much better than auto dipping lights.

Also as mentioned before, driving a really low car is a major PITA now. I avoid driving my Elise at night for long drives.

^Humblebrag

Great. Of course, in this scenario, you only control one of the two cars.

Correct.  So you slow right down when another car is coming and even stop the car you are in control of completely to avoid driving off the side of the road.  We are talking about rural narrow roads here where traffic is very light so it is an exception to have to do this.

I have been driving on these sorts of roads in winter/dark for over 20 years and have never got a puncture from driving off the edge of the road so getting 4 punctures is a few months is frankly down to shit driving and nothing else.

Can we talk about the people who don't bother to dip their full beam for walkers / cyclists / runners at night on dark roads?

1. It's pretty bloody inconsiderate to ruin someone's night vision on a country lane.

2. When you blind them they're more likely to stumble or fall in front of your car.

3. When it's narrow, dipping your lights is the ONLY indication that you've seem them. If you don't want a convenient rock thrown at your car as a reminder that there's pedestrian in the road, dip your beams.

I once gave a ‘hand signal’ to a driver who didn’t dip their lights. They took the trouble to drive back down the road and demand to know why I was waving my finger at them.
CBA to dip their lights, plenty of time for a confrontation.
Oddly they apologised and drove off quickly.
These days on a bike I guess I could return fire with a 20000 lumin trail light instead.

Speaking of which, riding around with 1000 lumin lid light around traffic is a good way of getting flattened.

@squirrelking

Retrofitted LED headlights are not road legal in the UK, and will fail an MOT. This has been the case since 2021, when the MOT inspection manual was updated (previously it was a grey area).

It is now permitted if the entire lamp unit is replaced.

Flaperon

Full Member

Can we talk about the people who don’t bother to dip their full beam for walkers / cyclists / runners at night on dark roads?

1. It’s pretty bloody inconsiderate to ruin someone’s night vision on a country lane.

2. When you blind them they’re more likely to stumble or fall in front of your car.

3. When it’s narrow, dipping your lights is the ONLY indication that you’ve seem them. If you don’t want a convenient rock thrown at your car as a reminder that there’s pedestrian in the road, dip your beams.