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[quote=epicyclo ]You realise that the continued chant of SNP Bad doesn't work anymore?
Well only because he's either preaching to the choir or to those with their fingers in their ears.
I reckon that gamekeepers really enjoy their job.
They must do, they don't seem to get paid much.
I imagine they do, if you like working outside and are from those areas it is probably a pretty dreamy job. A lot of estate workers are born into it anyway and live it from a young age, probably hard to do anything else for many of them.
But I do like a day somewhere quiet, torturing fish/enjoying the 'sport'/insert own prejudice here.
I don't eat everything I catch.
Yes me too, though I'm pretty terrible at it, I think my trout dinners worked out at £45 each last year. I'm not one to fish for pellet pigs in a put and take fishery either, no appeal at all. Catching mackerel and cooking straight away on a fire on a west coast beach or catching a couple of pan sized brown trout on a loch in the middle of nowhere to cook back at the tent I do find satisfying though. Mmm mackerel.
I don't think it is totally hypocritical to do that but also object to fox hunting though, I don't think fishing is any more cruel than any other method any predator uses to obtain another animal to consume. However shooting something you aren't going to eat just for the thrill of the kill and the ritual and ceremony of fox hunting etc just seems wrong and pointless to me.
As grumpy says, the SNP are voting in Westminster for stricter laws than they have created in Scotland. It's just another example of the awkward squad. I do think it's interesting every newspaper / website story I've seen shows a picture of people in red jackets on horseback whereas this amendment is about shooting foxes. You rarely see foxes in France as the locals shoot most of them.
@ jamba - I've read that the current law in Scotland was set out by Lab / LibDem and the SNP are working on changing it. Which possibly makes the vote in Parliament relevant to Scottish issues, moving the goalpost or whatever, then definitely demolishes your first argument.
the ritual and ceremony of fox hunting etc
I suspect that for a lot of people this is the main problem. They won't have put a lot of thought into it and because of the pomp and the fact that it's mainly a toffs sport means they're against it.
whatnobeer - Member
...and the fact that it's mainly a toffs sport means they're against it.
I think you'll find the folk who don't like psychopath killing games are equally repulsed by a bunch of chavs hanging around a dog fight.
Looks like it's been canned.
Looks like it's been canned.
For the moment. Still, it was a useful distraction from the Tories' latest attack on the poor.
The problem with the "SNP Bad" arguments isn't that the SNP aren't bad - they're far from perfect. The problem is that it shows a total lack of imagination - it's far easier to attack someone else's principles instead of having some of your own. And when it's Labour doing it - the Labour Party who are abstaining on the welfare bill - it's just hypocritical.
Think all this was designed to show up the SNP for who they actually are, and what they think they stand for and to put that on a public stage. Now everyone knows their lack of integrity they'll be easily managed in the future.
As for the Hunting, I've done a bit BITD with the Ashborne lot. Stabled horses for a couple and went exercising the Hounds quite a lot. You lot do realise just How they exercise Hounds don't you?
Hmmm, yes thats right.. You let them run free in a pack in a few acres of fields. You can guess which fields are chosen to let them run free in, and the inevitable consequences.
Just thought I'd point that out for the hard of conscience.
not quite with you bb - you accusing them of using atrocious behaviour as a means of making apalling behaviour more acceptable ?
Don't forget it's also binned because Dave can't rely on the support of all of his party.
You're right bikebouy the SNP has been shown up as the voice of decency in the country as they smacked down the Tories atempt to soppurt a bloodsport the vast majority of the country object to
Personally I don't care really what mechanism was used to prevent the relaxing of the hunting sanctions, just glad it happened.
The only irony that sits strangely with me - as I understand it this amendment was going to make the law in England and Wales in line with the law as it stands already in Scotland. The law the Scottish parliament is able to amend there too if it so wished. Surely by making this stand Sturgeon is rather honour bound to return to Scotland and amend the Scottish law to bring it in line with the English and Welsh equivalent?
Or.... she could get the Scottish Tourist board to market the highlands as a fox hunting utopia and the toffs would all flock north of the border to gallop around in their red jackets
Kerching!
Surely by making this stand Sturgeon is rather honour bound to return to Scotland and amend the Scottish law to bring it in line with the English and Welsh equivalent?
Yes, hopefully they'll get on that pretty sharpish.
Sturgeon is in Scotland already though - she's not a Westminster MP.
Sturgeon is in Scotland already though - she's not a Westminster MP.
I know.
[pedant] actually yesterday when all this happened she was in London; marketing Scotland as a business location base. That's why I said return to Scotland because she is not actually physically in Scotland at the moment [/pedant]
I think there was enough public opposition to repealing the ban that the SNP can say with some legitimacy that they were right to say they would vote No. That's what an opposition party does - they oppose stuff they don't believe in
Cameron can bump his gums all he likes, it was an unpopular policy anyway. Secretly he's probably glad its been kicked into the long grass.
What's hilarious about this is remember how before the election the Tories kept saying that a vote for Labour would let the SNP dictate government policy? There were posters and everything.
richmtb - MemberI think there was enough public opposition to repealing the ban that the SNP can say with some legitimacy that they were right to say they would vote No.
Yup. At the end of the day an MP's job is to represent the people; here it's straightforward to argue that the SNP represented the will of the British people, and that ironically the tory party weren't representing the will of the english people that elected them. It won't always be like this, I suspect.
The will of the government is not the will of the people- though a lot of governments forget this. Trouble is, it's pretty open to partisan representation. The story to many people will still be "undemocratic SNP overrule majority government"
looks like the SNP managed a couple of things yesterday.
A) They gave Dave a reality check - reminding him his majority is wafer thin, so he can forget the giddyness of the last few weeks, and choose his battles more carefully. Something which definitely neeeded to happen, because....
The labour party is a complete and utter waste of space. The SNP reminded everyone of that too, as if we needed reminding. To all intents and purposes, they are now the official opposition. While the irrellevent Islingtonites navel gaze for a few years. Looks like they've figured that out, and acted on it. Good!
I'm sure that the Tories and their right wing friends will be apoplectic at them for having the temerity to excercise the democratic mandate that sent them to Westminster in the first place. And will be full speed ahead to try and put a stop to it
Err, my thoughts ^^ related to the Tories using this amendment as a foil to bring out the SNP stance and make that public, and make the public aware of the SNP's stance on future amendments to [i]anything[/i]... I think it worked, worked quite well. I think the Tories chose a typically touchy subject which JoePublic has a specific opinion on (either way) rather than a topic/subject that JoePublic is ambivalent about.
As for SNP's "power" or perceived "power" well only the next year will show that won't it. But at least JoePublic now knows where the SNP stand, or intend to stand on pretty much [i]anything[u] the Tories try to put through.
There will be only so many roadblocks put in the way before they get bulldozed over.
[quote=bencooper ]What's hilarious about this is remember how before the election the Tories kept saying that a vote for Labour would let the SNP dictate government policy? There were posters and everything.
Yeah, I think it's hilarious the SNP supporters think they're dictating policy by blocking something there was a free vote on.
don't understand the big deal about it TBH
aracer - Member
Yeah, I think it's hilarious the SNP supporters think they're dictating policy by blocking something there was a free vote on.
I think the SNP folk are more realistic than that.
But most of us up here are enjoying seeing Cameron getting a poke in the eye. 🙂