Formula 1 2025 – WILL CONTAIN SPOILERS

Hoping Williams can move forward a bit next season. Good driver line up and some decent investment. They just need to stop throwing the cars into the wall.

I’d love to see Norris or Hamilton win the WDC.

I'm going with Ferrari being the best car and Leclerc pipping Hamilton to the Championship and Norris coming 3rd. I'd prefer Norris or Hamilton but I just think its time for Leclerc to step up.

Or Hamilton having another up and down year and retiring at the end. Alonso seems happy just driving round in circles, but I don't think Hamilton will carry on if he's not got a chance of winning.

Really though, its anyone but Verstappen for me. He's a top driver and deserves to hold WDC's but his four in a row have flattered him IMO.

There's a rumour (Brazilian F1 media) that Mercedes and Williams are trying to sort a deal where Antonelli drives for Williams and Sainz fills the empty Mercedes seat...

I think constructors is Ferraris to loose with the drivers they now have. I'd put Norris as favourite for drivers, in the absence of RB pulling something out of the bag to get their car back to its former glory.

There’s a rumour (Brazilian F1 media) that Mercedes and Williams are trying to sort a deal where Antonelli drives for Williams and Sainz fills the empty Mercedes seat…

I'd like to see that for Sainz.

Red Bull should have taken Sainz.

He's better than Lawson, Tsunoda and Perez. The Verstappens will have blocked that move though.

Sainz is supposed to be driving the Williams today - they have been allowed to use an unused 'filming day' so he could get 200km of seat time

RB pulling something out of the bag

Thanks to their lowly WCC position they'll have a load of extra wind tunnel/CFD time to use than they've had for the past few years so, if they've still got the engineering talent post Newey, their car development could be strong.

Thanks to their lowly WCC position they’ll have a load of extra wind tunnel/CFD time

Ah but, we've yet to see how much they (over) spunked on sandwiches thus year so hopefully they'll be reigned in a bit.

I'm going with the constructors' title being a toss-up between McLaren and Ferrari and both teams having fierce intra-team battles. Red Bull have lost key technical staff and I expect them to struggle to catch up to the top two. I hope I'm wrong, but I think Lawson will struggle if the car is as difficult as this year's one so I expect Verstappen to easily beat him and maybe challenge for the drivers' title if the Ferrari and McLaren drivers take points off each other. Lawson to be demoted back to RB and replaced by Tsunoda mid-season. Same with Merc, Russell should easily beat a rookie but they will need a much more consistent car to challenge for titles. Newey won't have any input into next year's AM so they'll be treading water until 2026. Williams should improve greatly, having two top drivers should lift the team massively. My wild prediction is that they'll jump to the front of the midfield teams. Sauber, Haas, Renault, and RB will all have rookie drivers and that will be enough for Williams to jump ahead.

Santander now confirmed as a Williams partner for 2025 - so very unlikely that Brazilian rumour up there ^ will happen

Hmmm.  Although Charles is familiar with he car team and Lewis isn’t, he’s a bit more unreliable / toys out he pram than Lewis.  I’d put them even odds for the WDC standing with Lewis to pip Charles.

I’m looking forward to it. Assuming no one find a silver bullet over the winter and we only have incremental car improvements as it’s the last year of the current regulations I think a lot will depend on can Norris put a whole season together. How long will it take Hamilton to get used to the new car and steering wheel. Will Max get though a race without an incident if he hasn’t got th fastest car.

RB to change their team name for next year. Exciting stuff.

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/why-red-bulls-second-f1-team-is-fixing-its-rushed-team-name/

Saw that earlier and IMO the quote marks need to go over “fixing”, not “rushed”. Shame they ditched “Torro Rosso”. “Racing Bulls” sounds like absolute ****flannel. Although the only remotely interesting thing about the team these days is their intermittent duty as the other half of the revolving door at Red Bull, so who cares.

"Racing Bulls" is one vowel away from being accurate

Waste of money - everyone will still call them VCARB.

Waste of money – everyone will still call them VCARB.

I still call them Minardi

I hope I’m wrong, but I think Lawson will struggle if the car is as difficult as this year’s one so I expect Verstappen to easily beat him and maybe challenge for the drivers’ title if the Ferrari and McLaren drivers take points off each other. Lawson to be demoted back to RB and replaced by Tsunoda mid-season

Agreed. There's nothing to make me think this wouldn't go the same way as Kyvat/Gasly/Albon.

If Kimi Antonelli does go to Merc and does well, it will be incredible. Straight from placing 6th in F2 to a Merc works seat. Even Max did a couple of seasons at TR before RB.

Edit, wrong thread.

Lewis will give it a go in the Ferrari till 26, if they don’t nail the new regs, then he’ll pack in. Assuming he doesn’t get turbo screwed by their strategists…

Thanks to their lowly WCC position they’ll have a load of extra wind tunnel/CFD time to use than they’ve had for the past few years

A cynic might think Perez’s poor performance may have been with one eye on future wind tunnel access, as the work done next year will give them a leg up for 26? Stranger things have happened. *gives Flav the side eye…

Hopefully we’ll see the 2nd half of this season Redbull rather than the first, to make it interesting.

dream would be for Max’ teammate to be ahead at the halfway point due to consistency of not crashing into any and everyone

Assuming he doesn’t get turbo screwed by their strategists…

I don’t see how that’s possible when their only strategist just left and is driving for Williams 🙂

Testing at Abu Dhabi...

Sainz with a 1.23.63. Which would've placed him ahead of Albon, but still out in Q1 I think (just). Antonelli behind Russell by .084. Apparently he's recovering from illness. Tsunoda in an RB with 1:24.68 - Perez Quali was 1:23.2

nickcFull Member
Testing at Abu Dhabi…

Sainz with a 1.23.63. Which would’ve placed him ahead of Albon, but still out in Q1 I think (just). Antonelli behind Russell by .084. Apparently he’s recovering from illness. Tsunoda in an RB with 1:24.68 – Perez Quali was 1:23.2

Interesting, do you know what conditions were like compared to the quali?

The other thing is what compounds they were running. Still encouraging for Sainz & Kimi

Tsunoda and Sainz will have to have been using next seasons proposed tyres so we don't know how the compounds compare to this years.

Only the new F1 drivers can use this seasons tyres.

My predictions for next year, is Max will be champion again.

You'll have one team fully behind one driver, whereas the McLaren & Ferrari drivers will take points off each other. (like 1986)

Hopefully its 8 different winners in the first 8 races, and that keeps the title open throughout the season.

There’s a rumour (Brazilian F1 media) that...

There's also a rumour that Bottas is going to RB which is just as bollox.

Lewis gets no 8 WDC and does a Rosberg?

I’ve got a side bet going on the fact Lewis won’t retire until he’s 44.

McLaren & Ferrari drivers will take points off each other. (like 1986)

Neither of those teams was doing that in the 1986 that I saw 🙂

New renders have been released for the 2026 cars - I don't think the dull blue colour is doing them justice though. Looks like they scaled back the wheel covers - which pleases me! Hopefully we'll see glowing brakes again. And another simple thing for me - I hate the lack of rear wing end fences on the current car. These are back for 2026 - not massive, but back!...

https://www.racefans.net/2024/12/12/fia-reveals-new-images-showing-changes-to-plan-for-2026-f1-cars/

the-muffin-manFull Member
New renders have been released for the 2026 cars

Looks wise, I think it's decent TBH and the weight/size is a step in the right direction.

Not sure if I'm interpreting the images correctly but the floor looks flatter than the previous renders I saw, so hopefully less reliance on ground effect.

I just hope it's not another couple of years with one team completely dominating and also that the PUs aren't as bad as the teams have been hinting.

Yep - the floor is a lot simpler for 2026 to try and cut down on porpoising and the need to run the cars so low.

I just hope it’s not another couple of years with one team completely dominating

I hate to say it, but any major rule change tends to see one team doing a better job than the rest and getting a step ahead of the field. It'd be nice if that didn't happen this time, but I'm kinda resigned to it. But if it does happen I really really hope that team is Williams.

Pointless mudguards seem to have gone as well...

I know it's not F1 but tickets have just been released for the return of European Le Mans Series s to Silverstone - £35 for a weekend ticket is a bit of a bargain in these times!...

https://www.silverstone.co.uk/events/european-le-mans-series

Pointless mudguards seem to have gone as well…

The new floor regulations are supposed to help with spray as well. Because they aren't as aggressive and the rear diffuser is smaller 'hopefully' less spray will be kicked up.

the-muffin-manFull Member
I know it’s not F1 but tickets have just been released for the return of European Le Mans Series s to Silverstone – £35 for a weekend ticket is a bit of a bargain in these times!…

https://www.silverstone.co.uk/events/european-le-mans-series/blockquote >
LMP2 is very 'meh' though. OTOH its €60 for a weekend of Hypercars at Spa. Admittedly logistics are a bit harder

 

Yep – the floor is a lot simpler for 2026 to try and cut down on porpoising and the need to run the cars so low.

I agree but I suspect the reality the floor edges will get very complex again upto the limit of the rules once teams have done there work

Brutal!... 🙂

https://www.racefans.net/2024/12/13/10-startling-statistics-from-perezs-worst-season-at-red-bull-yet/

Yeah, those are some brutal stats. Perez always seemed like a decent driver, McLaren signed him because he had potential and he was impressive in a second rate car at whatever Jordan was called when he was there. At Red Bull before this year, he seemed a bit like Bottas - good enough that he might do a Rosberg and win the championship if the stars aligned and the team leader had some bad luck. He started this year looking like his old self and then just collapsed. Ricciardo was disappointing at McLaren, but he just looked a bit average rather than like he just didn't belong on the grid anymore. At least Zac Brown had the balls to just bite the bullet and pay him off instead of the dithering that we've seen from Red Bull. Why they didn't put Tsunoda in the car for the final few races just to see how he would go eludes me, he's fast on a good day and no worse than Perez on a bad day.

Perez brings a large bag of cash and sponsors, and probably isn't anywhere near as bad as those stats look in reality.

It's worth revisting what Albon said about Max's preferred setup and how that makes it hard for the second driver.

With Max being as imperious as he is, is it not better for Redbull that Perez is, to be kind, underperforming? They get all the glory of the WDC, but then as they can only manage third in the WCC, they get more time to develop in the wind tunnel for Max.

i assume WCC prize money is largely irrelevant to them, given their backing?

It’s worth revisting what Albon said about Max’s preferred setup and how that makes it hard for the second driver.

The problem is that Red Bull didn't design a car around "Max's preferred setup." They looked at wind tunnel and track data about what makes a car faster. Max is better able to adapt to difficult cars so the engineers kept pushing to the limits that he could manage. Perez and Ricciardo couldn't drive the cars that the engineers said should be fast. Verstappen and Norris could.  It's not "preferred setup", it's engineering data about downforce, car balance, etc.

With Max being as imperious as he is, is it not better for Redbull that Perez is, to be kind, underperforming?

No, they need to have a car capable of winning the constructor's championship. If they can't build a competitive car, top drivers will go to other teams.

i assume WCC prize money is largely irrelevant to them, given their backing?

billionaires don't stay billionaires by not caring about tens of millions.

If they can’t build a competitive car, top drivers will go to other teams.

you’ve said yourself that they can and do, it just takes a great driver to drive it?

billionaires don’t stay billionaires by not caring about tens of millions.

ROI comes from fizzy drink sales

thols2

The problem is that Red Bull didn’t design a car around “Max’s preferred setup.” They looked at wind tunnel and track data about what makes a car faster. Max is better able to adapt to difficult cars so the engineers kept pushing to the limits that he could manage. Perez and Ricciardo couldn’t drive the cars that the engineers said should be fast. Verstappen and Norris could.  It’s not “preferred setup”, it’s engineering data about downforce, car balance, etc.

Oh okay. Albon must be wrong then ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

i assume WCC prize money is largely irrelevant to them, given their backing?

The employees are paid bonuses based on the constructors championship position. So they may mind a little!

you’ve said yourself that they can and do, it just takes a great driver to drive it?

No, the Red Bull started the year as a very competitive car, it finished the year third best. Once McLaren introduced their flexiwing upgrade, Red Bull were just in damage control, it's just that Max already had a huge lead in the drivers' championship. If Max (or Senna or Shumacher or Alonso or Hamilton at their peaks) had this year's McLaren and a compliant second driver, they would have won both championships. The Red Bull was flattered by Max and they will struggle to retain him if next year's car is as difficult.

Max is better able to adapt to difficult cars so the engineers kept pushing to the limits that he could manage

But that's ridiculous. There's no difference between winning by 40 seconds and winning by 4 seconds.

If the car had been more driveable by Perez [/others that are not MV] he might have scored more points for the team and RB may even have won the driver's championship.

Tunnel vision.