MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
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I'm looking at buying either a diesel Ford Focus 1.8 TDCI or a VW Golf 1.9 TDI of some description. I have a budget of about £7k and it must be 55 plate or more recent and less than 70,000 miles on the clock. I know I'm going to get a lot more kit in an equivalent priced Focus compared to the Golf, but as a car loan will make up £6k of the purchase price, would I be better off choosing the Golf as it will lose less of it's value over the loan period, and offset some of the interest on the loan. I also have to consider insurance as I'm a first time driver (albeit a little older at 33). Which car would be your choice?
Golf, absolutely no question! 2.0tdi would be the preferred choice though.
You'll get a newer, better specced focus, but I'd still go for the golf based on desirability for resale
They're both good cars, VWs aren't as good as their reputation. Fords are a lot better than theirs.
Focus, had both, think the focus is more practical, more room in the back for bikes and stuff.
Had my (petrol) focus for five years/60k miles, all it's needed are 4 tyres, a steering pump pipe and some oil.
Only issue with focus is that the early washer jets aren't well sealed and allow water to drip down and collect around the spark plugs.. Just something to look out for.. Think the diesels have an engine cover that prevents this.
Golf but I'm biased. MIL has had a few Focuses which I've driven, no where near as nice as the Golf but still a good car but prices plummet on them.
As an aside,I hang onto my cars so depreciation isn't a problem....good job,cos I own a Fiat.
I thought you said focus on GOLF :-(.
Anyway, I have a load of golf balls if anyone is interested. MaxFli, Noddle ICe etc. New.
Mail me special STW rate 🙂
as mentioned above, your quite close to VW 2.0tdi for that sort of money, not that there is anything wrong with the 1.9tdi.
On my 2nd 1.9tdi, first did over 200k before I traded it, this one is on 90k and feels like it will beat my old one for milage 😉
Bear in mind Passats and Jettas are often cheaper and better specced, cos everyone thinks of Golf first in VW and they view Passats as repmobiles.
I test drove all three although I had a higher budget so that put me in 2-3 year old range, but that was 18 months ago. For me the Focus was dreary inside and poorly specced (no cruise), and the main advantage I assumed of handling wasn't an issue for my sorry motorway-bound self.
I wanted to like the focus and save myself some cash but seeing as I can spend nearly 2 hours a day in a car I wanted something I wanted to be in.
Bought an A3 1.9 tdi sport quattro in the end. Was much better kept than the equivalent golfs I looked at and a much better spec. Goes round corners too which the mk4 golf really doesn't.
£7000 will get you a lot of [url= http://www.autotrader.co.uk/search/used/cars/ford/focus/postcode/bd176qd/radius/20/price-to/7000/sort/priceasc/fuel-type/diesel/maximum-mileage/up_to_60000_miles/maximum-age/up_to_5_years_old/page/3 ]Focus[/url]
or not quite so much choice of [url= http://www.autotrader.co.uk/search/used/cars/volkswagen/golf/postcode/bd176qd/radius/20/sort/priceasc/fuel-type/diesel/maximum-mileage/up_to_60000_miles/price-to/7000 ]Golf[/url]
After all's said & done, though, the proof is in the test-driving. You might hate the Golf & love the Focus, or vice-versa
Both of those have rough old tractor engines - Focus is a very old-tech unit (go for a 1.6 or 2.0 diesel instead!), the VW 1.9 is better but still noisy, gruff and has a stupidly narrow powerband.
£7k gets you in a Civic with the class-leading 2.2 CTDI engine, plus way more boot space, seats that fold properly flat (and flip up, cinema-style, if you want too) and even the basic SE models are better specced than most Golfs you come across.
adamant it has to be a Focus or Golf?
no Skoda Fabia, Honda Civic, Volvo c30 (1.6d is very efficient) in the mix?
*Only issue with focus is that the early washer jets aren't well sealed and allow water to drip down and collect around the spark plugs.. Just something to look out for.. Think the diesels have an engine cover that prevents this.*
nah, they just got rid of the spark plugs, much easier.
£7k gets you in a Civic with the class-leading 2.2 CTDI engine
Yeah right it's bloody awful engine.
Like others have said look at the 2.0TDi Golf if you can.
2.2 CDTI is fantastic. Well it was in the car I test drove. Strong as hell, pulled like a train throughout the rev range. 0-60 in 8.4 seconds and 50mpg - what's not to like?
50mpg on a diesel is it 1990s again?
My mum drives a Focus. That is all...
Out the 2 it would be the Focus as the Golf does absolutely nothing for me, they appear to be very dull unless you get the real sporty ones; seem to be largely driven by old folk or young families (nothing wrong with either) and that just doesn't inspire me to want to drive or own one.
I've driven a few and they have been nice to drive but I just wouldn't want to own one, I believe they are way overpriced and dull...
60 in 8.4 seconds and 50mpg - what's not to like?
A) Its not gonna do both of those at once.....
B) Show me the mpg figures please!
D) Stick a 2.2l turbocharged PETROL engine in it and watch the oil burner go backwards in the mirror.....
Drac what on earth is that based on... Honda have a good reputation for building engines
cba googling extensively.. but parkers said this about the 2.2 CDTI
The sole diesel is the quiet and refined 2.2-litre i-CTDi which is one of the best diesel engines around
about the 1.8l
The new 1.8-litre i-VTEC engine made its debut in the Civic and it's a remarkable unit, delivering high performance for its size with the fuel consumption of a much smaller engine. It can sprint from 0-62mph in 8.9 seconds and is a lovely to exploit as it revs freely but remains refined even when pushed hard
http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/reviews/honda/civic-hatchback-2006.aspx?page=2
Drac what on earth is that based on..
Driving one speaking to people who owned one.
He's bein arsey,the Honda engine is a class apart from the VW lump 1.9,or 2 litre. I don't like that spoiler thingy on the rear window,tho.
Mondeo 2.2 TDCI ST - available for 7k easily
That 2.2 Honda unit is the same one in Vauxhalls as well.
Ok I can be arsed googling
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http://www.autotrader.co.uk/articles/2010/08/cars/audi/britains-most-reliable-cars-named
Honda has been named as the most reliable manufacturer for the fifth year running, with the top seven spots being dominated by Japanese manufacturers.
http://www.gizmag.com/the-100-most-reliable-cars-of-the-last-decade-in-order/5657/
6. Honda Civic - Solid build quality and good engines are just part of the appeal, the Civic is one of the most spacious small cars around. Great value.
http://www.fccuk.org/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=481065
Yep,over 15 million VTEC's produced and not one failure.
Unbelievable engines!
http://www.carsuk.net/top-10-most-reliable-cars/
The Honda Civic has been voted the most reliable car in the UK in a survey of 840,000 cars operated by UK fleet and lease companies.
Out the 2 it would be the Focus as the Golf does absolutely nothing for me, they appear to be very dull unless you get the real sporty ones
See, in my eyes its completely the opposite.
Does it have to be a Golf or a Focus? As the girls above are bitching about, the Civic should be worth a look. My brother and sister in law have just got a (rubbish apparently) 2.2 CDTI for about £7k and love it. Doesn't the Mazda 3 get mentioned sometimes? A3s must fall into your requirements (just) do they? Seat Leon.
Or to blow all the above out the water, mk2 Octy vRS. Mines an estate, cost sub £7k, 06 plate, 60k on the clock from a main dealer.
Or another option. The Astra. Nicer to look at IMHO from the inside and outside than the Focus, more kit etc. Mate had a 2L SRI estate that ticks all your boxes and cost him a couple of grand less than your budget.
I would (and did) pick the Focus. Couldn't stand to pay £1,500 more for the same spec'd Golf. You will get better resale on the Golf, but that difference will depreciate so depends how long you're keeping it. £8k, 27K, 07 plate Focus 2.0tdci Ghia, 18 months ago. Goes well, drives & handles well. 50mpg plus if i'm kind to it.
I'm sure the Golf is decent too, just overpriced.
the focus 1.8tdi engine is nowhere near as good as the 2l tdi. we've just got rid of one. got an octavia vrs as a replacement. bigger much more powerfull engine but a piece more economical.
VW's are costly to fix, been there and didn't like it. Next car is a focus.
Ok I can be arsed googling
Google all you want I still found it an awful engine, not nice at all I found it sluggish and dull compared the Golf and in fact not even as good as my old Pug Diesel Turbo. I mentioned nothing of reliability which seems to be you point.
I had this debate 3 years ago, got the Focus
1. better reviews
2. more fun to drive
3. after 3 years they've lost a lot of value already. Yes it can still depreciate but most has already happened
4. The Golf was a lot more expensive. Yes you get a better price when you sell it but you've already paid that additional amount up front
5. Had no probs with the Focus - perfectly reliable
my 2 cents,
had 08 golf for company car for 6 months - nice car, though basic and small. no problems and felt solidly built.
Got 58 plate focus as long term company car (1.8 tdci zetec) - higher spec, better to drive / faster & bigger boot. City mpg is [i]just[/i] over 30, motorway at 70/80mph gets you up to 50mpg.
The bad news about the focus, clutch failed after year one. a colleague with exact same model/vintage car had same problem 2 months later. not sure if it's a bad batch or if there is a problem with the 1.8 tdci. In the last 2 months, the clutch has started to slip at 90mph again. Definitely on it's way out - 2 clutches in 25000 miles. The central locking is making a funny clunk at the passenger side lock. The drivers electric window vibrates as it reaches the top randomly.
I always say I prefer the focus as long as I am not paying the fuel bill / servicing / repair costs.
If it was my money, I might not feel the same... tough one.
Going for the new 2011 plate focus to replace the existing one next month.
Got a Focus 1.8tdci paid the same for it as my previous car Audi A4 estate 1.9TDI. Focus had 50k on the clock and now with 90 feels worse than the audi did with 250k on it. Acutally feels worse than the Audi did when I got it with 120k on it. The Focus goes from A to B but its just not that well thought out and not that much cheaper to run than the Audi. Fuel economy is worse on the Focus, running costs were less but not that much less. I was using the local garage rather than a main dealer.
To go back to my post, there isn'tmuch between them really. If it was my money, I wouldn't get either. Go for older Audi/BMW etc.
I have had both a Golf and a Civic - both diesel. Focus feels naff in comparison to both, but no denying they are easy and cheap to run. Out of the three I'd go for the Civic. Golf feels nice but servicing costs seem high and there is more room in the Civic. Civic was always better on fuel and accelerated more like a petrol.
Hmmm, thanks everyone for your input. Clear as mud then. After a couple of recommendations for the Civic (which I have always loved the look of) I have realised it is actually well within budget, furthermore the 1.8 VTEC will actually be just as economical as a diesel focus, taking fuel prices and anticipated mileage into account. The insurance difference between group 6 and 9 is negligible as well. Does anyone own a new shape 1.8 VTEC Civic, and what are your views?
Have had one as a courtesy car - not as torquey but quieter at idle and slow speeds, and a really pleasant drive. Similar outright performance if needed (for overtakes, etc) but the petrol just needs more revs for it.
Usual consensus on the civinfo site (which is worth a look if you're thinking of buying) is that the total running costs of the 1.8 petrol and 2.2 diesel are actually pretty similar. Everyone seems to want diesels these days (even those not doing anything like the mileage to justify them) so secondhand petrols are great value.
Had a Golf 1.9tdi for two years sold it to get a Mondeo 2.0TDCI. My dad had the old shape focus estate 1.8TDCI 115bhp. The Focus is better in every respect than the Golf. Better torque spread, better mpg just as reliable if not better. The handling of the Focus is light years ahead of the Golf. Obviously the badge isn't as good on the Focus.
1.8 VTEC petrol just as economical as a diesel Focus. You have your VTEC coloured glasses on! Not a chance, look at 30mpg max for the VTEC on a good day with the wind behind you and no other traffic on the road. You can't really compare the newer TDCI to the old TDDI they are Night and Day really
7 grand on a car ...are you mad ..you could buy a bike for that.... 😆
new shape Focus is not as good as the older Focus.
Vw hold their money better.
Civic wins every time 😀
A) Its not gonna do both of those at once.....B) Show me the mpg figures please!
D) Stick a 2.2l turbocharged PETROL engine in it and watch the oil burner go backwards in the mirror....
Like stating the obvious do we? 🙄
My point was that not many cars are capable of that kind of economy AND that kind of performance.
50mpg on a diesel is it 1990s again?
No, it's 2006 which is when that came out 🙂 The combined figure is 55mpg I think, but people don't often get that afaik. I wasn't saying it was the most economical, I was saying it was a nice blend of economy and power.
Hmmm, thanks everyone for your input. Clear as mud then
What did you expect? They are all good cars, most cars are, you just have to test drive them and get the one you like. Don't expect us to say 'this one's the best' and that be that! Might as well as what 5" travel MTB is best.
Btw I don't find VW servicing expensive. Costs me £150 or so to get my Passat serviced, £300 for cambelt. But then I do have a nice dealer.
Had those choices for cars. In the end went Civic, The focuc didnt feel solid, the Golf did, but once I tried the Civic with that dashboard the others were dull to be behind. I have a 1.8ES 06, it's a great car the engine is great and economical overall. It's a safe drive around the country lanes of Carmarthenshire.
Wife has a VW and dont find the servicing that bad, there's more VW specialists around.
Yeah I wanted the Civic, but the Passat was on special offer and a lot cheaper. Glad I did now, better for caravan towing, but I still heart Civics.
Mates got the civic diesel EX model. Really well specced inside. It's pretty nippy, gets excellent mpg too. Still noisy from cold start though, and I just don't like the power delivery with derv cars.
Simple really...If you like driving get the Focus, If you are image concious, get the Golf.
focus for me, you'll get newer one with far more toys on for that money!
the price of golfs is laughable!
I love VAG TDI's
They are a great compromise of performance and economy
I had a golf 2.0TDI for 3 years 04 to 07 as a company car, did 90k miles in it trouble free.
I now own an octavia 2.0tdi and a seat 1.9tdi. Both remaped, both kicking out 50bhp over factory spec and still average over 50mpg in both.
Never had any major problems with any of them in over 100K miles of motoring.
Also, although they sound like tractors at tickover the mapped engines are very responsive and just as good fun as any petrol I have driven when making 'progress' down country roads such as A458 into wales the other week 🙂
focus for me, you'll get newer one with far more toys on for that money!
Not my experience. Coudn't get a Focus with crusie control without paying through the nose.
Still noisy from cold start though, and I just don't like the power delivery with derv cars
The Civic diesel was one of the best engines I've ever driven. Loads of power from down low and it kept on pulling to the red line.
BTW what is the boot like in the Civic ? could you lob a bike in the back?
good for its class due to non-multilink rear suspension. seats down, yes. Seats up, no (but thats the same with the others as well)
Lad at work has a type r and with the seats down his bike slots straight in
Got a 56 plate 2.2 es , love it
Great engine, plenty power when it's loaded to the rafters
Towbar fitted , 3 bikes all the kit and loads of room
You can fit bikes in the back no probs
Parts are a bit pricey but some careful shopping will resolve that
Dealer here is ace , first name terms with clients who come back
My mates on his 5th Honda ( over 12yrs) he loves em
Only negatives , ride quality a bit harsh
Crap in snow ( cured by winter Tyres tho )
I've driven the vtec petrol a few times and it's a nice engine
Just look for a solid service history from a good dealer and you'll be safe
Plus the interior is genius , so simple and easy to use
Makes audi's etc look fussy
The dash is a winner for me , like digital dash's , had a yaris too 😉
Hth
BTW what is the boot like in the Civic ? could you lob a bike in the back?
Not long enough front-to-back to get bikes in whole (but short of a full-size estate, not much else will) but plenty of room for bikes with front wheels off. Seats fold properly flat in one motion too. Have got 3 people and bikes in there OK before too.
Seats up, I've got my road bike in the back (had to take both wheels off obviously, and drop the saddle) when I needed to park on the road overnight for work.
For general carrying stuff, it's great - very wide, low lip, 485 litres including the big square chunk of space under the boot floor. The flip-up seats are great for carrying things that are awkward - plants, TVs, etc.
Not my experience. Coudn't get a Focus with crusie control without paying through the nose.
Think you need the Ghia for cruise. Can be had for reasonable money though. Maybe you were unlucky?
Well I walked into the Ford dealer with 13g in mind, and with 1-3 year old cars you needed the top spec, titanium is it.. to get crusie. Whcih meant paying for leather and everything else. Thousands of quid to get a cheap option.
Still would be going for a secondhand Mondeo ST TDCi, same sort of money you are spending with more space and a more powerful yet economical engine.
+1 for Quirrel.
Still would be going for a secondhand Mondeo ST TDCi, same sort of money you are spending with more space and a more powerful yet economical engine.
We already have a bigger car though, in a Saab 9-3. I know I'd get more space, but we are looking for a car that is slightly more compact, but still big enough to accommodate our two year old.
Why do you want it more compact?
Some people don't want two big cars. When we had our Mondeo (ST TDCI coincidentally), we could have got another Mondeo as a cheap second car but wanted something small. Got a Polo.
Why do you want it more compact?
Spurious reasons at best. I'm a new driver and our drive only takes one car and parking on the roadside is at a premium.
I picked up a Ford Focus 1.6 TDCi Ghia estate in 2008 for £5500. Done 60,000 miles and have had absolutely no problems with it.
Gets 60mpg average and has room for at least three bikes plus kit.
The estates are only 10cm longer than the hatchback so it's very easy to drive.
Insurance is £700 with 21 year old female with one years licence and me added as a named driver. Quote was £1100 without having me as a named driver!??
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Molgrips, maybe it's changed but my 07 plate 2.0 ghia tdci is standard & has cruise (and auto wipers, auto lights etc).
My 55 Ghia has cruise, auto wipers, auto lights, heated windscreen, electric rear windows etc.
The only reason I bought a Ghia was for the cruise and the comfort suspension.
Salesman might have been wrong I suppose - it has been known 🙂
Anyway I wasn't that keen on the car for what I wanted.
Forgot the Focus, go for the Golf, you wont regret it.