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he was the only one with the ability to have changed the outcome
Not 100% sure on this, although I agree this is the most contributing factor.
Kimi also seemed to misjudge the width of his new wider 2017 car when he started moving to the right to make the 1st corner a bit easier to take.
"Vettel losing risk game". Sums it up in 4 words!
Brundle talks sense once again.
+1 - and this from his article too...
Verstappen couldn't get out of the throttle or the way quickly enough, and he's in a race down to the first corner he wants to win. If you jump on the brakes every time a car pulls alongside away from the start, just in case something might happen, then you are not a racing driver.
It was a racing incident, these things happen
In years gone by self preservation stopped incidents like these. Making a mistake or belligerent driving on track carry far less risk than they ever have.
I am not saying the drivers should be less safe, just that there needs to be other checks and balances. As other poster have said, use of the black flag and penalties for infringements that really hit the teams/drivers in the pocket. This would of course need to be WC points as silly things like actual money would not even register for the big teams and drivers.
F1 really does not have long to get its house in order. I for one would be as happy to see autonomous cars as a purely engineering showcase. Really we are not that far from it now.
Kimi also seemed to misjudge the width of his new wider 2017 car when he started moving to the right to make the 1st corner a bit easier to take.
Kimi's movement was tiny compared to Vettel's, and Seb had acres of space to his right. The overarching problem was that neither of them knew they were three abreast, so I'd still point the finger at Seb as his was by far the more aggressive move, dangerous in dry conditions, let alone what they had Sunday.
I for one would be as happy to see autonomous cars as a purely engineering showcase. Really we are not that far from it now.
How do you mean, autonomous? Like, no regs?
pondo - MemberI for one would be as happy to see autonomous cars as a purely engineering showcase. Really we are not that far from it now.
How do you mean, autonomous? Like, no regs?
No I mean no driver. like the thing all the car manufacturers are trying to make for the road at the moment.
Ah, ok - interesting! Racing cars with potentially no sense of self-preservation - how aggressive can you be and still finish the race! 🙂 Like the idea but it's the human element that makes racing for me. 🙂
[quote=dooosuk ]Kimi also seemed to misjudge the width of his new wider 2017 car when he started moving to the right to make the 1st corner a bit easier to take.
Sure, but there was nothing he could have done which would have resulted in a different outcome (apart from make a much worse start and not be there). Vettel's trajectory left less than 2 cars width between him and the wall, even if Kimi had been brushing the wall and they'd all slotted in together with overlapping wheels. It's not like they just touched.
I've just realised something regarding comments about Vettel being in front of Max - well yes he was when the collision happened, because Max [b]had[/b] braked.
Brundle article to save searching http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/11042927/brundle-vettel-losing-risk-game
but there was nothing he could have done which would have resulted in a different outcome
If he'd held his line the initial contact may not have happened and then who's to say whether Vettel's move would have resulted in the same outcome.
I agree Vettel's move was the main contributor; just surprised that the fingers are only pointing and SV and MV when the first contact may have been avoided if Kimi hadn't misjudged the width of his car when moving right.
Ricardo was also slowing relative to other cars.
Max may have braked or may have run out of boost - you need to see the telemetry.
However you may be right. He's not known for not keeping his foot in but nor is Vettel.
[quote=dooosuk ]If he'd held his line the initial contact may not have happened and then who's to say whether Vettel's move would have resulted in the same outcome.
I don't think there's any question that there would still have been a collision - check Vettel's track position and the direction he is heading before he has hit anything and clearly there isn't going to be space on his left for two cars. I suppose you could just about argue that Max might have successfully braked his way out of it if Kimi had been further left, and the crash might not have been bad enough to take any of them out but it's hard to see how there could have been no contact at all.
I for one would be as happy to see autonomous cars as a purely engineering showcase. Really we are not that far from it now.
"Not that far from it" as in it already exists and it's called RoboRace? (Well, they've run the first public race, the championship hasn't started yet.)
And one of them wiped itself out against the barriers, just like the pros 🙂
what Vettel did was just as bad as Grosjean at the start of the 2012 Belgian GP so deserves a ban.
Back to the inicident, I think DC got it right in the commentary on the spot. What vettel did was legitimate but high risk and was the catalyst for taking four cars out of the race.
Personally I think the violent sideways lunge is a dick move, people have very nearly been put into pit walls on main straights at the thick end of 300k by drivers like Schumacher doing it and, while it's pretty hard to use the rule book to stop it, it relies too much on everything being as the swerving driver optimistically expects it to be, and it's too often too close to a massive incident.
It seems pretty optimistic to think that doing it on a track that no-one's raced in the wet before, trying to close out one of the best wet drivers, with another eighteen drivers right behind you (actually seventeen, which was Vettel's mistake), would have a high chance of going well.
I'm just happy Vettel gifted Hamilton around 40 points in a race he was favourite to win and Mercedes were struggling.
It was even a bonus he managed to take out Kimi as well so Ferrari lost out to Mercedes big-time in the constructors' championship too. Karma.
Three of them quite rightly going for it to be first round turn 1. Two of them with nowhere to go without giving up early. One with acres of space. Vettel was a dick, and I'm delighted for him.
Really interesting insight into oil burning and managing engine damage cycles here:
It sheds a little light on Mercedes' ability to turn up the wick during qualifying!
How is it introduced? Feed from sump to intake manifold? Slack rings?
How is it introduced?
That's what I'd like to know. I assume it must be through crankcase ventilation into the intake because you'd need to be able to control it in order to turn it up or down for qualifying, etc. Also, I think they were using a supplementary oil tank which was suspected of having a different oil (i.e. one designed to be burnt as fuel), so they must have had some way of feeding that oil into the system when required and then controlling how much was burned.
[url= https://drivetribe.com/p/f1-concern-over-f1-engines-burning-AlqP8ipBTayr9251BDyNiA?iid=AijwXoAESrm2vLC2OPyR2Q ]Explanation of oil burning control here.[/url]
New title sponsor for Red Bull for 2018
[url= http://classic.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/132012 ]Linky[/url]
Good news! 🙂
It'll be interesting to see how he does, I hope he does well!
Ooof that's gotta hurt. He's just not delivered though.
Looking forward to see what Gasly can do.
It appears to have been confirmed by TR
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/41397848
The 21-year-old Frenchman, who won the GP2 series last year, will replace Daniil Kvyat "for the next Grands Prix", Toro Rosso said in a statement.
Hmmm, 'Grands Prix'- plural!!
One expects Gasly will stay, and that Kvyat will surely not come back.The hot tip is Japanese Nobuharu Matsushita. The Formula Two race-winner is a protege of Honda, whose engines Toro Rosso will have next year.
Has Nobuharu Matshushita got his super licence yet?
Another possible ramification- Nobuharu Matshushita's name might get shortened to 'MAT'- which is my name- win! 🙂
I do feel a bit sorry for Kvyat, who has looked utterly lost since losing his Red Bull seat to Verstappen last year. It's not the first time that TR have played around with driver choices mid-season, but I expect Kvyat will be driving sportscars or Indy next year.
BTW, anyone remember the season when you had to be named Seb to drive for Red Bull/Toro Rosso?
I do feel a bit sorry for Kvyat
He should get a reasonable settlement given he's only just signed a new contract (or did I just dream that?)
No, he really did sign a new contract recently.
Will he be driving an Aston Martin at Le Mans next year?
Will he be driving an Aston Martin at Le Mans next year?
Fixed that for you.
Will he be [s]driving[/s] crashing an Aston Martin at Le Mans next year?
[quote=PJM1974 ]I do feel a bit sorry for Kvyat
Yeah - but the F1 driver market is ruthless, and TBH he's not proved himself to be any better than Palmer who nobody seems to be shedding any tears over. There are only 20 seats available and plenty of drivers knocking on the door who might have the potential to be a star. I think it's quite clear after the number of races he's had that whilst Kvyat might be a competent driver he's not WC material.
Another possible ramification- Nobuharu Matshushita's name might get shortened to 'MAT'- which is my name- win!
Or NOB (which isn't my name!)
might get shortened to 'MAT'- which is my name
AWESOME!
BTW, anyone remember the season when you had to be named Seb to drive for Red Bull/Toro Rosso?
Indeed! Buemi, Vettel and Bordaís wasn't it?
AWESOME
*Nick likes this*
BTW, anyone remember the season when you had to be named Seb to drive for Red Bull/Toro Rosso?
During the TDF the commentator (I can't remember who) came out with the line "Froome's got more domestiques called Mikel with him than anyone else has domestiques" which I thought was pretty funny.
(Kwiatkowski, Landa & Nieve)
Hammy emulating John Surtees?
Hmm, I assume you're referring to this:
[img] 
[/img]
Usually just a new product launch he's promoting when he posts pic like that.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gasly-feels-sorry-for-kvyat-958520/
Gasly feels sorry for Kvyat over mid-season switch
Filing this quote under 'Chinny Reckon'
I am pretty sure we will see him back on the grid at some point, [b]maybe[/b]."
And this under 'oooof'