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Even Barnier has no idea what may and co want
He also said that the EU would not be finalising its guidelines for the talks on the future relationship until the EU summit in March. That gave the UK time to “clarify its position”, he said. He said the EU was still waiting for the UK to decide its official position. In the meantime, he would not be giving a “running commentary” on developments in British politics, he said.
And from the Torygraph
"The EU’s chief negotiator Michel Barnier has ruled out special arrangements for financial firms, while specific proposals for mutual recognition drafted by City bosses have also been knocked back by Brussels in recent weeks."
Which I think rather contradicts THMs assertions that May is making any progress on financial services. It is of course the obvious position to anyone who understands even a little of how the EU actually works. You know - the four freedoms are indivisible
But then assertions from tories that actually say nothing and are obvious non starters are nothing new
No it doesn’t but you do have to understand financial services to know that.
The FCA warnings yesterday give another hint on why the doomsday scenario presented those “who-want-to-remain-and-are-prepared-to-lie-to-achieve-their-goal-of-ignoring-a-democratic-result” are unlikely. Make nice lattes though.
The EU may like to present a hard face but they also know that they lose too especially in fin services and will also compromise. Listening to Newsnight podcast now and sensible point about Barnier’s little porky pie yesterday.
Interesting interview on farming today about frictionless trade and agricultural imports.
sell, sell now, the farmers are ****ed.
The fca doesn't sound that positive;
The head of the U.K. Financial Conduct Authority added urgency to Brexit negotiations by saying European governments must reach a transitional agreement for financial services by the end of March to avoid the risks presented by EU departure.
Financial contracts between the U.K. and E.U. worth up to a notional 26 trillion pounds ($36.4 trillion) -- particularly those related to derivatives and insurance -- may no longer be “serviceable” should an agreement not be in place, FCA Chief Executive Officer Andrew Bailey said Monday in a speech. He warned the effects would be felt in the EU as much as they would in the U.K.
Indeed it isn’t positive. So creating unnecessary noise (both sides) is silly.
Draghi joined in to yesterday with some sense
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12px;"> That says absolutely bloody nothing</span>
It is as meaningless as the "bespoke deal" or "preparing for".
Of course people are trying to prepare but a)without good information they will be wasting a lot of resources on contingencies and also the plan they come up with may be a load of balls.
Anna Soubry firing the starting gun the Tory Civil War? I bloody well hope so. This farcical situation has looked unsustainable for god knows how long now, and is doing this country immeasurable damage. Its high time to call out the foaming-at-the-mouth, idealogical nut-jobs who've been calling the shots for two long.
She's right to call them zealots. Thats exactly what they are. And they need putting back in their box before they get to do irreparable harm
Don’t forget the nut jobs are getting noisy because they know that compromises are coming. An extreme version of Brexshit is becoming less likely not more. Hence the noise.
Hopefully so Hurty. Thats what the attacks on the civil service, the media, the judiciary, and pretty much everyone but themselves is about.
They're apportioning blame for that before it happens, because they know they were selling an undeliverable 'cake and eat it' fantasy.
What worries me is that their labelling of everyone who doesn't believe in their unhinged Empire 2.0 is a traitor/enemy of the people. And Mays cowardice in allowing them to get away with it is unforgivable
The language of the Brexiteers is becoming increasingly nasty, xenophobic and authoritarian. Rees Mogg in particular is a self-serving twonk who doesn't seem to care less about the repercussions of undermining democratic institutions, as long as it serves his ends
So a back-bencher calls for the sacking of the foreign secretary. That's going to happen then. Should give a clue as to where the balance of power lies...
I think it's too late to put them back in.
Every time moggy & co pop up with a fantastical unicorn heavy Brexit promise, the hard core brexies froth a bit more.
It makes Mays job of satisfying them ever harder.
And when DExEU comes up with some numbers admitting that Brexit is a terrible deal for the country, out come the remoaner civil servant conspiracy theories. Which feeds back into the frothing brexies....
All to serve the egos of a few populist nuts who would rather double down on lies than admit they are wrong
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12px;">All to serve the egos of a few populist nuts who would rather double down on lies than admit they are wrong</span>
Some are populists nuts. Others just have a deep hatred for the EU for whatever reason (Gove is an example of this) and some others fancy taking advantage of the situation to push through their agendas.
Its going to be a very small number of people who end up really pleased with the outcome. Whether because we remain too tightly bound to Europe or not enough.
Question is whats going to happen to all those voters who thought it would signal a change in their favour?
Riots of course.
"Question is whats going to happen to all those voters who thought it would signal a change in their favour?"
Because Brexit is easier and cheaper to implement than remedying forty years of wealth inequality and lack of investment by a party which has absolutely no interest in doing anything to disturb the steady flow of cash upwards.
Good news! The (inner) cabinet are meeting today to start discussing what the UK's "opening pitch" will be as regards our future relationship with the EU.
[size=24]TODAY[/size]
But, of course, they've already made it very clear what that want to replace EU membership with… we've voted for it, and everything. Just don't let "them" know what it is, or it'll be harder to get what we want in the negotiations.
Riots of course.
That's a european thing. Tutting. Lots of tutting.
Farage proposed riots I seem to remember.
Sounds about right for Brexies / the far right.
We don't need to worry about the Retreaters taking to the streets.
Pre and post referendum exactly zero of the ****ers have been bothered to get their stupid fat arses off the sofa.
I'm not proposing them, just predicting them.
Of course, the "opposition" have also been very clear on what they want to replace EU membership with… people voted for them with full knowledge of that as well…
https://www.ft.com/content/618dbbc4-0740-11e8-9650-9c0ad2d7c5b5
[img] https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DVWYuDOX0AATRiL?format=jpg [/img]
Both Labour and the Tories want a FTA with Europe. Neither view current options as being suitable for our needs - although lots of internal debate within both parties re the sticking points eg FoM, ECJ, transition arrangements and length - so both look for a “bespoke” deal.
Hence the noise. In the meantime we crawl towards a deal. Ironically amusing to see Barnier talking about the inevitable trade disruptions. For someone who represents several countries who are losers too from this, he seems remarkably relaxed
Neither view current options as being suitable for our needs
That neatly masks the fact that some people in both parties think that current options segregate us from our neighbouring market too much, and other people in both parties think that these same options keep us too closely bound to our neighbouring market. The "agreement" is that nothing has been agreed… nothing is clear. There is no plan for "the people" to agree with… but apparently we have.
Are we "crawling towards a deal" that has been explained to the electorate, or is that taking this "democracy" nonsense a bit too far?
Not sure why you find the concept of negotiations so challenging kelvin
yes of course it’s true on both sides there are differences about where the final lines should be drawn. Cue some expression including Sherlock Holmes
Oh, you are funny.
Block him and move on, Kelvin. Just like the brexiteers, the more he realises fewer people are listening to him, the more a caricature of himself he becomes.
Currently crawling away from a deal
Recent comments completely undermine the commitments given earlier regarding NI so right now its most likely a transition deal even will not happen
Kelvin - zokes has good advice.
Then you miss-understand again kelvin. No humour there, intended or otherwise.
Behind Barniers bluffing, they knowc exactly what we want and vice versa. They also know (1) they can’t deliver it for internal reasons and (2) they can’t allow the Uk to go to a hard Brexshit. So they have a dilemma. Notice how they jumped when TM hinted at HBrex last year?
Hence they fudged NI etc to move on. They need a deal too
now we can fart around pretending that the vote didn’t happen and/or we didn’t mess it up or we can get in with negotiating hard to ensure that we don’t end up with a hard Brexshit it’s not a tough choice
May seems to get that even if those who can’t accept the Democratic result can’t
Great visualisation on changes in social media since the referendum
https://cronycle.com/insights/brexit-2018-jan-edition
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Manfred Weber, leader of the centre-right European People’s party ( the grouping the tories used to be in before the loons started piling on the pressure) He is also a staunch ally of Merkel
"I hear a lot of things which London don’t want, but for the moment I have no idea what they want. No idea, no clarification about their orientation, about what they want to achieve.
I’m appealing to London: We cannot achieve anything with such a state of mind. The British government needs to come out with concrete proposals very soon, time is running and we need an orientation, what they want to achieve."
</div>
So its obvious that May and go do not know where they want to end up and thus neither do the EU side contrary to what Davies and THM have said
May and her frenemies have told us exactly what they want to replace EU membership with… her/our intentions are clear… and we're backing her 100%! Rule Britannia!
My vote for a candidate from a party other than hers is also a ringing endorsement and overwhelming mandate for the clear plan she has set out before us.
The referendum was an overwhelming mandate for the alternative future relationship with Europe that Cameron laid before us when he called on us to choose our path. Such clarity! Such vision!
Negotiatimg for what, though? Has it been explained? Or agreed? Or (heaven forbid) voted on?
An interesting take on the present situation in the Tory party by Rafael Behr
I've just about given up reading anything from the Guardian… but that's a very well observed piece.
Dr
1. See v
2. Yes
3. No, that’s why we are negotiating
4. Not yet
anyone with access to the internet can access various sources that lay out (1) what we want - essentially 5 things - and under what conditions - 6-7 conditions depending on what you source. Then you can cross checks all these factors against the off-the-shelf solutions that could be chosen - to see the shortcomings and trade offs involved with each. From there you can see why we want a new - some might say bespoke - FTA that maximises the 5 and minimises the 6-7
i have posted various links in the past
So most of the claims made here and elsewhere are simply untrue. The info is there for anyone to see. So those who persist with untrue narrative are either too lazy to check or happy to deliberately state things that are untrue. Given that the intention is to overturn a democratic process, it seems grossly unfair to include this subset in the group known as remainers. That is very rude on genuine remainers.
Well link a few then, THM, or spell it out yourself. If not I'll assume you can't because there is no list of five things or 6-7 anywhere I've looked. I'm interested, go on, demonstrate that you can be informative and helpful.
You can assume what you like Ed. No skin off my nose.
In post brexit Britain, you don't rule britannia, britannia rule you. *
*unless you have non dom status
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Have Philip Hammond and Jacob Rees-Mogg read your lists?
Perhaps the confusion is that TM is telling the EU to google it