Read more. Or talk to someone in the industry
I read loads already. But if you want to point me in the direction of something that says British lorry drivers will no longer be able to drive in the EU post brexit I'll read that as well. In the meantime read monkfingers link which is a worst case no deal brexit.
The farce continues
Barnier's sounding pretty cool on an extension, the bullshiiters Johnson & Mogg (& Jenkyns on newsnight) still saying the EU will blink at the last minute....
Labour have gone deep deep underground, happy to let the Tories expose themselves as the most incompetent government in living memory....
Worth also noting that Dublin have already built extra warehousing & inspection points at their port, Calais & Cherbourg have bought up extra land for lorry parking & hiring 1000s of border staff, Rotterdam have installed a new computer system and employed new staff- they are limited for space.
Chris grayling has paid millions for non existent ferries & organised some lorries to drive around an old airfield.
I'm not sure that lorry protests if we don't leave will be the problem, the government is only able to issue 5%? Of the necessary permits for UK lorry drivers to enter the EU , if we do leave without a deal
I think we may be in trouble..!
…British lorry drivers will no longer be able to drive in the EU post brexit…
No one has said that will not happen, just that the rules will be quite different, as they are for other nonEU drivers.
In the meantime read monkfingers link which is a worst case no deal brexit.
If we have a "deal", we carry on as if in the EU 'till the end of transition. Once we are not acting as if in the EU, drivers will be limited by number, and face new limits as regards deliveries within the EU.
if you want to point me in the direction of something that says British lorry drivers will no longer be able to drive in the EU post brexit I’ll read that as well.
The "3 Blokes in a Pub" videos on YouTube might be a good place to start. IIRC their very first episode talks extensively with an international lorry driver about the challenges he's likely to face (if it's not the first, it's one of the early ones).
Once we are not acting as if in the EU, drivers will be limited by number, and face new limits as regards deliveries within the EU.
A link to this information would be genuinely appreciated. 👍
It's a while since I watched it so this might not cover everything you're asking exactly, I don't remember. But it's worth a watch in any case.
"Ciaran Donovan is LBC's famous "White Van man", the guy who took on Jacob Rees-Mogg live on air. He's driven over a million miles around Europe, crossed every border. There's not much about logistics, cargo, shipping and just-in-time deliveries he doesn't know."
Have you actually read the link?
UK drivers only allowed to drive without int license till end of 2019.
Trailers need to be registered etc...
Quite a lot of changes and extra costs.
taxi25 - same as mrmonkfinger posted: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/ecmt-international-road-haulage-permits
Probably all an exaggeration...
. Once we are not acting as if in the EU, drivers will be limited by number, and face new limits as regards deliveries within the EU.
Thanks for this, it got me reading even more. And your quite right, if agreements aren't reached post no deal brexit there would be extremely severe consequences for British transport companies.
Dug this link out which isn't to long and explains quite a bit.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/135HLKU4m3lPwNUMM8aluiHc-yNxvlZRz/view?usp=drivesdk
New wheels and a Kona Paddy Wagon would be my choice. Its a super bike.
@taxi25 I expect there will be agreements, come what may, eventually, but even then our drivers will not have the access they currently have… it's like everything else… we'll probably end up with better than any nonEU and nonEEA third country… but that will never give UK workers all the opportunities and rights they currently enjoy… people still don't understand what we're dropping out of…
I think we should perhaps spend the next week talking about bikes and rides only… @TiRed has the right idea…
Newsnight throwing up some scary stats about EU trading UK companies.
Turns out in event of No Deal the EU wide trusted trader scheme doesn't apply,- EU said this last year, so cornerstone of brexiteers 'no deal will be fine' schtick is lies.
And the alternative version we could use, only 5% of EU trading UK companies have agreed.
Those lorry drivers are going to be out of work!
Stop being so down on things, it's all awesome....
Apologies for the wall of text, but to my mind this seems remarkably prescient as to what is actually probably going to happen next:
Phil Wilson MP for Sedgefield
I wanted to update you on Brexit and the latest events in Parliament.
Last week was another chaotic week in Parliament and with only 11 days until we are destined to leave the EU we are still no closer to resolving the Brexit conundrum.
On Tuesday the Prime Minister’s deal was rejected by the House of Commons for a second time and on Wednesday the Commons rejected a no-deal Brexit under any circumstances. On Thursday, the Commons supported an extension to Article 50 and to delay the date we leave the EU, which is currently set for 29th March. Under the Prime Minister’s plan, if her Brexit deal was passed by the Commons this week, she would seek a short technical extension until the end of June, however if it were rejected, she would seek a longer extension.
Yesterday afternoon, the Speaker of the House of Commons, John Bercow, threw an almighty spanner in the works by refusing to allow the Prime Minister to bring her Brexit deal back to the Commons for a third Meaningful Vote unless she has made a ‘substantial change’.
I can see only one simple ‘substantial change’ the Prime Minister can make and that is to adopt the compromise amendment I will be tabling alongside my Labour colleague, Peter Kyle MP. Under our amendment, MPs would agree to facilitate the passage of the Prime Minister’s deal through Parliament and into law provided it is returned to the British people for their final say.
Under our amendment, the legislation would be in place and legally binding at the time of the referendum, so if the country voted to support the deal, it would be implemented automatically without any need to return to Parliament. This would rule out the possibility of a so-called ‘never-endum’ and I hope would give you the confidence that if you go to the polls, however you vote, you will not be asked to do so again a third, fourth or fifth time because the decision would be final.
Since the UK voted to leave the EU in 2016, it has become clear there is no single definition of what Brexit means. Instead, it means many different things to many different people.
There are discussions of different types of Brexit, such as a ‘no-deal’ Brexit, a Canada-Plus Brexit or a Norway-style Brexit. To some, it is a ‘hard’ Brexit, to others, a ‘soft’ Brexit. However, there is only one Brexit and that is the Brexit deal negotiated by the Prime Minister. Her deal defines Brexit.
I strongly believe that you should now have the right to compare how the Brexit negotiated by the Prime Minister, in whatever form it takes, matches up with the Brexit you were promised in 2016. This is not an attempt to overturn or re-run the 2016 EU referendum but an opportunity for you to have the final say on whether you wish to go ahead with Brexit now we know what Brexit looks like.
If you support the Prime Minister’s deal, then you can vote for it. Otherwise, you should have the option to reject it and remain in the EU. You might wish to vote as you did in the 2016 EU referendum, but you should also have the chance to change your mind, not only from Leave to Remain, but also from Remain to Leave.
I know many people are sick of Brexit and just MPs to ‘get on with it’. Our amendment would allow us to do so and finally draw a line under the Withdrawal process. Either the Prime Minister’s deal would have the backing of the people and we can move onto negotiating our future relationship with the EU or we will remain in the European Union. Whatever the decision, we will be able to move on from the present division and uncertainty around Brexit and move towards healing our country.
I believe this is the best way forward because whatever form the Prime Minister’s deal takes the final say shouldn’t be given exclusively to MPs, but to you.
I see seosahm's front cover and raise him a "You'll be crushed".
Parliament's failure to take a decision
'Take' a decision? Telling language from number ten.
If there is another referendum (I'm beginning to lose hope) it best only be a two option one (either cancel brexit vs no deal exit, or cancel brexit vs May's deal), if they make it a three option cancel/no deal/May deal thing then it's just going to be a mess, even with carry-over votes it's always likely to be murky as to whether there was a clear mandate.
@seosamh77, and for anyone else needing a bit of light relief, #HannanIrishHistory which started trending after yet another Hannan gaffe yesterday, has some blinding stuff. 😀
(Though, unlike Dan, you’d probably need to know a bit of Irish history to appreciate a lot of it.)
At thus point I have to agree with Phil Wilson.
But would it get through parliment?
I really don’t think “we “ would win another vote.
The amount of who I consider intelligent people that have seen what a cock up it is but are still Leave has shocked me.
Oh and by the way it is most definitely about the money.
Whatever the decision, we will be able to move on from the present division and uncertainty around Brexit and move towards healing our country.
No we won't
Whatever happens now the country has been bitterly divided.
I honestly can't see what would fix that.
Anyway, it sounds like May needs to make a decision on exactly what she wants by the 25th at the very latest) or the country falls into legal limbo (if I'm reading it right , IANAL)
https://www.hansardsociety.org.uk/blog/changing-eu-exit-day-by-statutory-instrument
The money thing makes no sense to me what so ever. Leavers seem to see it as an extortionate amount to pay for nothing in return. The stupidity of this is unbelievable. Its a bit like deciding to stop setting up your stall at the car boot sale because the the £10 fee was too much despite the fact you make £100 from selling all your goods. Instead you set it up for free outside the area and pay nothing but only make £20 because nobody comes. Not only that you have failed to notice that you set it up in some dodgy area and spend your whole time trying to stomp scumbags nicking your stuff as you have no protection.
Makes me so angry!
And you had to hire a car for the day which cost £30.
But by god you've made your own decisions about it.
Can anyone photoshop that Times picture of May onto the top of the cliff edge at Dover?
Where does the June 30th date come from? Has she just picked the least advisable date (just the other side of MEP elections), to appease the "keener" members of her cabinet and party that are suspicious of any approach that might make sense? Or is it just excitable journos picking their favourite bonkers rumours from the "keener" Tories they seem to be too chummy with?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/03/18/quest-brexit-has-killed-britain/
Somehow, pretty much every other newspaper in the world is managing to say what none of the UK press will publish...
Where does the June 30th date come from?
She's obviously clocked that I'm off on a cross channel ferry a few days after that, and wishes to unleash merry hell on my holiday.
^^^ great article.
"Where does the June 30th"
She is just wanting to ruin my honeymoon as well as my future. I wish her a lifetime infestation of bedbugs in every place she tries to sleep.
"She’s obviously clocked that I’m off on a cross channel ferry a few days after that, and wishes to unleash merry hell on my holiday."
Me too , off to watch Le Tour hopefully, in Epernay and Reims.
Where does the June 30th date come from? Has she just picked the least advisable date (just the other side of MEP elections), to appease the “keener” members of her cabinet and party that are suspicious of any approach that might make sense?
In one respect, the Maybots default phrase 'nothing has changed' is absolutely true. She is still a hostage to the hard right headbangers in the ERg and the religious bigots of the DUP. Everything she does has to be filtered through the prism of their reaction to it. These people are zealots, who have no interest whatsoever in this country beyond their own narrow self-interest
May should request a 2 year extension, we should contest EU elections, but those nutters would go into meltdown if she even suggested that, so she can't
Our entire countries future is being dictated by a core of about 60 of the most unhinged fundamentalists on the planet
Great, innit?
Another day of chaos beckons. I can only assume the remainer wing of the cabinet are keeping their powder dry after yesterday's dummies out of the pram by Leadsom et al. Seems to me that whilst on the surface a short delay makes a no deal in June more likely, it also improves the chances of either the Kyle-Wilson 2nd vote amendment succeeding or May giving Corbyn his customs union.
Aside from that though, I'm still highly amused at the irony of the people voting for brexit on the grounds that their politicians are useless and don't listen to them, only for the politicians to then go and confirm that by not enacting their decision as a result of their incompetence and intransigence. Whichever way this now turns out, the bridges are burned and there is trouble ahead.
If you move a cliff edge, but still stay on the same course, marching remorselessly towards it, its still a cliff edge!
Surely the quilters should be happy if we stay. They can moan about it forever more. "We wuz robbed" .
Imagine them having to say how great every **** up after Brexit is.
Our politicians have had to so some work for a change and have been found not to be up to the job.
I see a lot of them running off once we leave.
If you move a cliff edge
I'm still fairly relaxed that a no deal isn't going to happen. There is a huge majority in the commons against it. At some point that majority will assert itself and May will have to abandon attempts to hold her party together and accept the inevitable.
I'm have to say though that half of me almost wants a no deal to happen out of morbid curiosity as to what will happen. If it doesn't, we'll never know if project fear was correct. You could almost argue that it needs to happen just to settle the issue of whether we're better or worse off in the EU.
I have holiday booked off from work last two weeks in june. I am not booking flights anywhere until we know what is happening. Fortunatly I can have a good holiday in Scotland
I really hope the E.U. sort this out for us & only grant an extension for either a GE or R2
The Tory Brexiteers are still pedalling the “EU will blink at the last minute” line. I hope they don’t.
I’m still fairly relaxed that a no deal isn’t going to happen. There is a huge majority in the commons against it. At some point that majority will assert itself and May will have to abandon attempts to hold her party together and accept the inevitable.
Daz - I do love your hopelessly misplaced optimism. Its sort of sweet. No Deal is the default position. It doesn't really matter whether the majority of MPs are against it. For them to actually stop it would require a degree of competence and putting the interests of country before party
Seen any evidence of that over the last few years? From either party? I think that given the above required criteria that No Deal is an absolute nailed on certainty
I think the no deal cliff edge is very real, even if it does move to June.
May has caved in to the ERG on a short extension.
Every time she appeases them, they come back expecting more concessions.
The majority of MPs might be trying to avoid a cliff edge, but the ERG want their hard Brexit & the PM is their puppet.
The ERG want a short ext to force an actual cliff edge.
On Mar29 we have the possibility of an extension- second time round, no chance.
Euro elections before the end of June so, assuming we don't participate, Remain is no longer an option (can't be members without MEPs)? That would leave Deal/No-deal as the only alternatives.
What process is followed when new countries accede mid-term?
I really hope the E.U. sort this out for us & only grant an extension for either a GE or R2
I don't think they will be that specific, just the usual line of needing to have some defined reason to amend the end date. If the eu start explicitly telling the UK when to hold elections or referenda it is just ammunition for the sovereignty argument.
And of course they don't have to give a simple yes/no response to May's request - they can offer what they like as a negotiating gambit.
Absolutely bang on! A short extension greatly increases the certainty of a No Deal Brexit in June. Once again the ERG are pulling all the strings. They've been after this for decades, they're more than happy to wait a few more months.
May continues to march to their drum, decked out in her orange sash and bowler hat
Do you think the erg will **** may off so much she will eventually do anything to **** them back?
Surely the cliff edge isn't no deal, it's revoke article 50.
Did May choose the 30th June as then she can say she has been PM a month longer than Gorden Brown ?
Gorden Brown ?
Never a frown...
Euro elections before the end of June so, assuming we don’t participate,
I would have thought part of an extension agreement by the EU would be that we have to participate in EU elections.
I believe the E.U. has stated it is possible to extend past the E.U. elections without partaking in them. We would have to agree to not disrupt ongoing issues & we roll over our current MEPs.
So another ride on the gravy train for the workshy euro hating oxygen thieves? Great.
I believe the E.U. has stated it is possible to extend past the E.U. elections without partaking in them. We would have to agree to not disrupt ongoing issues & we roll over our current MEPs.
If we don't contest the elections then we must have left before the next session of the EU parliament commences, hence the date. Any later than that and we'd have to contest the elections, and seeing as we're being such a bunch of ****s, they don't want us there
David Davis is on Five Live at the moment, blaming all this chaos on remainers, and talking about the whole process as if he never had anything to do with it.
The bloke is an absolutely *ing shameless * of the highest order! And as the quote from his own aide accurately noted 'as thick as mince'
Emma Barnett is presently quoting all his mind-bendingly complacent, flippant, patronising and arrogant remarks back at him
Playing chess is like making love to a beautiful woman…
Oh, stalemate.
Playing chess is like making love to a beautiful woman…
You think you know how to play after watching loads of pawn but when you start playing the game for real you can’t remember any of the moves?
Surely the cliff edge isn’t no deal, it’s revoke article 50.
Once we have failed to honour our treaty commitments, that ensure there is a democratic parliament to oversee decisions made at the EU level, by refusing to hold elections to choose our MEPs… the rulings as regards recinding A50 notification are mute… we're in a new situation… I would strongly suspect a future ruling would say that the EU could reject our attempts to remain, or extract a high cost for it… more leverage lost by the UK gov… a clear option thrown away… (?)
Under the Prime Minister’s plan, if her Brexit deal was passed by the Commons this week, she would seek a short technical extension until the end of June, however if it were rejected, she would seek a longer extension.
The lying reaches new heights. Last week her claim was as above. This week it's only a short delay leading to May's deal, or no deal. Nothing that woman says is worth the paper it's printed on.
Leavers seem to see it as an extortionate amount to pay for nothing in return.
I got my annual tax overview yesterday. The average salary in the UK is £35K. By my calculations, for someone on such a salary their EU contributions is a couple of pence shy of a quid a week.
Where there is harmony May will bring discord.
Where there is truth May may will bring error.
Where there is faith May will bring doubt and where there is hope May will bring despair.
I was counting down the days:
Ten
Nine...
Then I saw this opinion https://ukhumanrightsblog.com/2019/03/19/no-deal-brexit-may-be-unlawful-a-view-from-rose-slowe/?fbclid=IwAR1-Sws4GJsq7QLceIOMelVSh2nignTlffstEBRXF33DcHVrQaCen7YpDek
It looks like Parliament has to actually pass a law to terminate our membership, not just let it lapse on the 29th.
EDIT:
or maybe we cease to be a member (as far as the EU is concerned), but without an Act to terminate we still have all our obligations to the EU and subject to its laws etc.
So does that mean the billionaires funding Brexitmania will be subject to the new EU tax evasion laws on 1st April? 🙂
The very opposite if taking back control.
They (the gov) know this already… hence my question about the politics of asking for a date that makes no practical sense for anyone other than the "keen" members of the cabinet and Conservative party, who want a date because it is unworkable and for no other reason…
Anyway … PMQs is more "nothing has changed" … and openly saying that parliament should have no say and no input … May is an autocrat … she needs removing.
Maybot has had a firmware upgrade but it's still v 1.05a with the looks of PMQs.
Meanwhile, in the Washington Post,
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/03/18/quest-brexit-has-killed-britain
May is an autocrat
Pessimus Prime?
So basically, from what little sense this makes, it looks like we're heading for a hard/no deal brexit, just a bit later than originally thought.
Due to when the EU legislation has to go through, either she gets her deal through parliament by the 12th April or No Deal economic armageddon it is
Meanwhile, in the Washington Post,
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/03/18/quest-brexit-has-killed-britain/blockquote >
Quoted in another WP article: “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”
So basically, from what little sense this makes, it looks like we’re heading for a hard/no deal brexit, just a bit later than originally thought.
I doubt it because there are the numbers to stop it, however now MPs are forced to either back May's deal or come up with another course of action. It forces a resolution to this phase, which is necessary.
May says she won't allow any other "course of action". Discussing anything other than her way is "navel gazing". It's her deal or no deal…
May is politically closer to the hardliners than the moderates
I dunno if anyone was watching newsnight on the day that the IndyGroup formed but they interviewed Anna Soubry and she talked about her conversation with TMay; the gist of their conversation was that she wants hard border controls for people and is not prepared to compromise on this more than anything else, it's her personal red line.
Which explains the way she acted with the vans with the go-home messages and the windrush deportations.
She will crash us out. her options are her deal or we crash out.
however now MPs are forced to either back May’s deal or come up with another course of action. It forces a resolution to this phase, which is necessary
Weren't they told this at the last 2 votes?
If anyone non-ERG has any sense they will table a vote quick to request a longer extension than May 25th
what are the opposition doing.....
The only way we will get another course of action is to get rid of may. She is the roadblock here
I'm not sure that we have covered this, but I feel it is worth sharing...
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-47634365
Apparently Theresa should have listened to Trump's advice...
Oh great… Radio4… Labour front bencher saying that even May's proposed delay is too long, and "Labour" are against a longer delay, and that "the people" just want it done. Of course, that means neither of their stated (ha ha) aims can be achieved in that time (new deal or public vote on deal).
Surely if any of the other EU members reject the extension request, then its no deal or rescind A50...