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I do think that a lot of 65 to 85 year old blokes in this country have been hankering after a war that they were to young to participate in.
Some truth in this I think. Watch Farage's Twitter, there's lots of "here's me hanging out with some jolly veterans", basking in the reflections of someone else's heroism basically (I don't believe he ever did any military service himself). It's aimed at somebody.
You can't tell from that. If all they did was move cheap drinking from the Off licence to their pub, their share price could go up without a net contribution to the UK economy.
Lost me there
Surely not.
Displacement not growth? No.
Oh well.
teamhurtmore - MemberLost me there
I think what he is saying is that 'spoons serves only as a primordial pit for people to devolve back into, and that if they all burnt down the world would be a better place.
ETA: sbob does not condone arson.
Cameron promised the Referendum as 1) he's a democrat 2) he thought he's win - same reasons for Scottish Indy Ref as EU Ref
Well that's rather disappointing. I was pinning my hopes on the UK's future on exporting luxury yachts given that WTO tariffs won't be a problem for them.
@aracer why not go through the WTO tariff list and have a look. Average tariff is 3% and many countries don't bother with vast swathes of the tariffs - they just use zero. Tariffs (in general) are highest on food to protect farmers in poor countries. We would be free to agree low tariffs with selected producers especially in products that we don't produce. On the specific yacht example I wonder how Sunseeker / Princess UK vs EU vs non-EU business breaks down ?
@tmh a decent portion of people I know working on "no deal" options are looking at closing or selling their European business as its not really worth continuing with. Others will just transfer bookings to existing offices
IGM =-
Davies has been saying that all along. He is either a liar knowing it to be humbug or simply deluded. There is not even going to be a serious negotiation. There is not enough time now to have a comprehensive negotiation and we don't have the expertise to do it.
On the specific yacht example I wonder how Sunseeker / Princess UK vs EU vs non-EU business breaks down ?
Remind me is Monaco on the EU?
Sky News has learnt that David Davis told a gathering of bosses at Chevening House that the UK would enjoy a comprehensive free trade agreement with the European Union after Brexit.
Did they also learn that today is Friday?
Jambas, not sure where you people work: all major U.K. Banks have announced plans and locations * if they loose passporting rights as have all major GIBs working in London.
* some remoaners even lie that they have already acted which is BS obviously
Well, if a pub'n'grub chain grows in value, yet lots of non-chain pubs and cafes are closing… oh, never mind.Lost me there
poor people to get pissed more often in what appears to be a socially acceptable environment
I know it is simply frightful that they are let out of the house, it would be much better if they stayed at home with their Carling.
Some truth in this I think.
Obviously not very hard or you are dimmer than a Brexit voter.
My apologies all. I thought Davies had been saying that was what he was trying to get but no deal was an option, and (as reported) he's now changed to that is what we will get (i.e. he'll compromise on other things but he will get that).
I may well have read too much into it.
Going back to the original question. I'm not a UK resident so had no vote in this but if i could then I'm out
nothing that has happened in the last year has changed my mind
yes the tories are fubarring the whole process but as a resident of Europe in a country that is not in the EU and never will be I cannot for the life of me see the attraction. All divorces are messy. Just get on with it. No-one outside of the UK actually gives a sh1t anymore and is really bored.
Obviously not very hard or you are dimmer than a Brexit voter.
Classy.
where do you live darrell and why out?
Don't beat yourself up IGM there is so much remoaning noise around that it's often hard to see the wood from the trees 😉
Plenty of people outside the UK should give a sh1t. If not they are being very foolish
@darrell the EU and member states do give a sh.t as they need our money. The whole Brexit Bill is a smokescreen to divert the conversation away from "wtf are we going to do when the second largest budget contributor leaves"
1) pay more
or
2) get less
EU's solution as I linked to previously seems to be to invent new Europe wide taxes to the tunes of €12-15bn pa and call them "environmental" or "tax avoidance" measures
As for "getting on with it" thats exactly what the UK is trying to do. What the EU is trying to do is keep us effectively in as long as possible so as to keep receiving our money
People outside the UK are bored with the posturing and blustering and perceived self-importance of the UK.
whether it's important or not to business or politics is irrelevant to the vast majority of people
I am English by birth but have lived in Norway for 10 years. We are part of the EEA but absolutely will never fully join the EU.
where do you live darrell and why out?
@matt you do see that its only poor countries who are trying to join ? Rich countries just want a trading relationship with no ecj and no budget contribution. As above Norway and Switzerland have made it clear they'll never join
No one's pretending Brexit won't damage the EU (it's another reason it's stupid, why damage your neighbours?) but 10s of thousands of well paid finance jobs - the people who actually net contribute, a good proportion of the UK's brain drainers, and a few car factories will sweeten the pill though.
People outside the UK are bored with the posturing and blustering and perceived self-importance of the UK.
Perhaps. We have been reluctant Europeans after all. But they should also consider why
whether it's important or not to business or politics is irrelevant to the vast majority of people
😯
darrell I recall the Norwegian PM saying they have to abide by the rules without any say in making them and advising the UK to vote Remain.
Anyway, good for you that you are out of this cluster****.
THM - Not beating myself up, but I am curious about this.
Up front point to note - it may just be poor reporting.
However the way these things change is by subtle changes of language - "we will try to get" becomes "we will get" or "there will be". The option of no deal gets left out.
And that appears to be what has been reported. As to what actually happened...
Big changes never look big at the time. They are a slow drift in a direction. A small change here a clarification there.
Is this the start of the climb down, compromise and fudge you've been predicting I wonder?
Rich countries just want a trading relationship with no ecj and no budget contribution. As above Normway and Switzerland have made it clear they'll never join
That doesn't follow in so many senses. Sentence one is untrue and sentence two doesn't support sentence one either:anyway
Yes IGM, it's a negotiation. Excuse me if I have mentioned this before. 😉
(& Norway's sovereign wealth fund is how much per head ....? that's gotta help!)
IGM - its just the deluded and dim Davies saying what he thinks his audience want to hear and reported on a europhobic tv channel
@matt Norway is a very interesting example. In a Referendum the people voted NO against Government advice to join the EEC. The Government didn't like that so signed the country up to the EEA and large budget contributions anyway. How very anti-democratic, how very EU
@matt Norway is a very interesting example. In a Referendum the people voted NO against Government advice to join the EEC. The Government didn't like that so signed the country up to the EEA and large budget contributions anyway. How very anti-democratic, how very EU
My Norwegian colleague tells me the reason they voted No was that they felt the EU was too rightwing and globalist.
teamhurtmore - Member
Yes IGM, it's a negotiation. Excuse me if I have mentioned this before.
Well to be fair you've also suggested it isn't 😉
And it's news to me that Davies thinks it's a negotiation 😉 😉
You decide 😉
Edit for x-post
When?
When you've said the EU don't negotiate for example.
I'm sure that was you.
Oh I see - yes fair point albeit a different nuance.
We ARE in a negotiation process BUT the EU are past masters in avoiding/delaying ACTUAL negotiation
So negotiating in name if not in substance 😉
Word play apart the subtle compromises are already evident apart from for those who remoan inflexible in their interpretation of events
When you've said the EU don't negotiate for example.
I've heard plenty of people say this - that Greek geezer for one - but also severla civil service types on LBC.
oldnpastitMy Norwegian colleague tells me the reason they voted No was that they felt the EU was too rightwing and globalist.
Was it not also to do with killing whales? The EU / global waling organisation wanted them to stop. I thought this was something the norwegians felt was unwarranted interference. They would not be allowed in the EU until they stopped killing whales
hypocrisy :
maybe the are ripe for frexit and grexit ?
By the way, anyone a Telegraph subscriber?
What's Boris actually said now?
TG - doubt it. Merely unsurprising.
BoJo today
He says: "And yes - once we have settled our accounts, we will take back control of roughly £350 million per week. It would be a fine thing as many of us have pointed out if a lot of that money went on the NHS, provided we use that cash injection to modernise and make the most of new technology...
Bold claim, given there wasn't £350m in the first place. Sounds like farmers subsidies ain't getting any of it then Boris.
Macron has no problem with protectionism and limiting FOM
Meanwhile our foreign secretary doing his best to undermine the negotiations & Mays position
TurnerGuy - Member
hypocrisy :maybe the are ripe for frexit and grexit
Yeah coz LePen tried that & failed (despite all that money from putin)
& Farages definitely not Nazi, buddies AFD (also supported by Putin on RT) have failed to deny Merkel's popularity.
Can't believe how desperate Brexies still are for the EU to fail!
Average tariff is 3% and many countries don't bother with vast swathes of the tariffs - they just use zero. Tariffs (in general) are highest on food to protect farmers in poor countries. We would be free to agree low tariffs with selected producers especially in products that we don't produce.
so if that ^
a decent portion of people I know working on "no deal" options are looking at closing or selling their European business as its not really worth continuing with. Others will just transfer bookings to existing offices
why that ^ ?
Jambas has got it wrong. The transfers he described may not be possible after Brexit. I have been working on this very topic over past two weeks.
Kimbers:outweighed by the number of remoaners who want the negotiations to fail. Brexshiteers have not control over whether the EU fails, but remoaners have a direct impact on the success of the process of Brexshit.
Kimbers:outweighed by the number of remoaners who want the negotiations to fail. Brexshiteers have not control over whether the EU fails, but remoaners have a direct impact on the success of the process of Brexshit.
You need to work out what success looks like first, current definition is best of a bad lot. What people who prefer remain want is for the UK to remain. It is still an option that is there and viable - I think we can mostly agree that it is a option people can keep fighting for.
As you are so fond of telling us though all the moaning achieves nothing so quite why your worried about it I'm not sure.
What people who prefer remain want is for the UK to remain
True. But there were not enough of them when it mattered were there. Inconvenient truths and all that
You keep fighting - from afar - the rest can keep getting on with preparing appropriately
Success is clear if challenging: a bespoke FTA than maximises access to the single market. The uncertainty is how compromises will be addressed behind that. The goal is very clear though. Unless you are a rabid or a remoaner
Success is clear if challenging: a bespoke FTA than maximises access to the single market
"maximises access" is anything but clear. Of course this is the point, you'll be able to sing the praises of Mummy May whatever bit of a mess she produces.