[Closed] EU Referendum - are you in or out?

molgrips - Member
This time next year, Rodney...

😆 Good quote that from Only Fools and Horses ... 😆

Well what I would say Brexy boys is that I'm all right, in fact on a personal basis I'm doing better than pre-Brexit* and who knows there may be a link - but you've wrecked the country in so many ways, so do not underestimate the hatred I have for you and my pettiness when it comes to getting my own back.

Enjoy your day.

*go on tell me Brexit hasn't happened yet 😈

Am I missing something? (serious question)

I worked for Corus, common feeling was that Port Talbot was a dead man walking. I worked downstream but one of the big issues was cheap steel shipped in from China.

In the brave new world, British steel will be subject to tariffs to gain access to the continent, the TGV for instance runs on rails made in York.

One issue is how Tata see Imujden and whether they see any point in a plant outside the EU.

Can Port Talbot compete, maybe but! Coke is imported, Steel Ore is imported. so those are going up, labour is being devalued but the process is no where near as labour intensive as it once was. There will be no return to world of the past.

Will the Cornish tin mines reopen, maybe but again it relies on the pound being very weak and someone investing money.

And do we really want heavy industry?

It was an environmental disaster.

igm - Member
... so do not underestimate the hatred I have for you and my pettiness when it comes to getting my own back.

Enjoy your day.

Very dramatic, very good ... 😆

Not revealing any more details ... very sneaky that.

I'm not asking for a detailed business plan or even what it is you plan to manufacture, import, export and service.

I'm just interested to hear what aspect of leaving the EU has created this new opportunity for you?

We absolutely should call their bluff and go WTO and let them know it publicall

I assume you know that going WTO isn't as easy as everyone seems to thinks it is.

And do we really want heavy industry?

It was an environmental disaster.

Interesting point, do you drive a car? Do you buy stuff shipped by container ship from China?

Is it right that you export your pollution? Which a lot of the environmental improvement in the UK really is.

so out of the EU will we no longer have their 75% tarrif on chinese steel?

domestically steel purchasers would chose that over welsh stuff?

GrahamS - Member

Not revealing any more details ... very sneaky that.

I'm not asking for a detailed business plan or even what it is you plan to manufacture, import, export and service.

I'm just interested to hear what aspect of leaving the EU has created this new opportunity for you?

Less competition for me.

Curiouser still.

So are you assuming that the government will fail to get a Free Trade Agreement with the EU to reduce that competition?

Aren't you worried that one of the new trade agreements with non-EU countries might just replace whatever competition you think you have from the EU at the moment?

Angela Merkel has dealt an instant blow to Theresa May's plan for Brexit by rejecting the PM's plan for trade talks to take place at the same time as Article 50 secession negotiations.

Britain will be put into the slow lane for discussions about any future trade deal with the EU following an intervention by the German Chancellor, who intervened just hours after the UK invoked Article 50.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-article-50-angela-merkel-rejects-theresa-may-parallel-talks-a7656506.html

did May really think she was going to get this? Deluded or what.

Of course the UK must be "out" before and trade talks.

GrahamS - Member

Less competition for me.

Curiouser still.

So are you assuming that the government will fail to get a Free Trade Agreement with the EU to reduce that competition?

Aren't you worried that one of the new trade agreements with non-EU countries might just replace whatever competition you think you have from the EU at the moment?

domestically steel purchasers would chose that over welsh stuff?

IF you are building a shed (warehouse) the steel skin doesn't have to be special just cheap. The structural steelwork, as long as it meets the relevant codes...

D&B contractors will by the nature of the game rip a spec apart to save money.

Remember people … some are glad when things go wrong for others … so no point pointing out to them that their political aims damage the lives of others … they love it. Don't engage, unless it amuses you to do so. Nothing to be gained from it.

So chewkw to summarise: you are saying that leaving the EU has created an opportunity for you in the niche manufacture / import / export / service market by removing your competition.

But your opportunity is unaffected by having a Free Trade Agreement with the EU and trade with non-EU countries poses no threat.

Well I can see why you'd be pleased by the result on a personal level at least, but it does sound like you are in a pretty unusual position!

Remember people … some are glad when things go wrong for others … so no point pointing out to them that their political aims damage the lives of others … they love it. Don't engage, unless it amuses you to do so. Nothing to be gained from it.

My Brexit-voting boss came up to me today and made a point of saying she was celebrating today. Our organisation was formally and openly Remain and we stand to lose significantly from Brexit at a time when we're already in serious commercial difficulties irrespective of Brexit. She's that stupid that she's gloating about voting against her employer's official policy at a vulnerable time...

How such small-minded people have managed to get so much influence is deeply depressing. I suspect it's a nihilistic expression of 'I'm losing and so therefore must everyone else....'

Not a concern for me either way tbh.

Ha.

Bingo.

You're in it for your own selfish personal gain.

Explains a lot & even more about the way you pitch your arguments.

All deflection & proposition with little substance.

Why? To hide your own very selfish hopes & aspirations.

Charming.

Which a lot of the environmental improvement in the UK really is.

Yep.

GrahamS - Member
Well I can see why you'd be pleased by the result on a personal level at least, but it does sound like you are in a pretty unusual position

mrlebowski - Member
Ha. Bingo. You're in it for your own selfish personal gain.

Explains a lot & even more about the way you pitch your arguments.

All deflection & proposition with little substance.

Why? To hide your own very selfish hopes & aspirations.

Charming.

It's not normal chewkw.

Trust me.

It's really, really not.

In fact, your glee in these dubious qualities is either

A. Designed to enrage - good luck with that. As, if that is the case, you have my pity but nothing more.

B. Fantastically deluded, in which case you need help & you still have my pity....& nothing more.

C. Embarrassed by your own personal greed, but lack the EQ to deal with it.

d he is a troll winding you up.

TJ.

See A.

😉

Damn - where are my reading glasses?

How such small-minded people have managed to get so much influence is deeply depressing. I suspect it's a nihilistic expression of 'I'm losing and so therefore must everyone else....'

What do you expect from a nation of anti-intellectual, curtain twitching, pecksniffian, violently sexually repressed - deviants?

Rational thought? Really?

Bit racist that, isn't it Tom? 😉

chewkw - Member
I am very adaptable.

Interestingly that's one thing you come across as not being. Amongst others.

The EU are hoping they can blackmail

No, just calling in debts, but the UK media will dress it up as blackmail, the EU commissioners will read the gutter press bile and dig their heels in so hard the rope will break before you move them.

How much does Europe really need anything to do with a little island that is intent on creating unfair advantage? Not much.

Rather than being part of a protected block with high living standards, good health care, high education standards and a relatively low disparity between rich and poor, Britain has decided to jump in with the free market lowest-common-denominator race to the bottom. Because if you look for places where the poorest people have the highest quality of life you'll find most of them in the EU.

It really does amuse me how far detached from reality the leavers are. I loved Merkels slap down of May over trade deals.

May has almost no bargaining chips here. The EU can survive without the UK quite easily and playing hardball is in many ways to the EUs advantage

Come on you leavers - give me one reason why the EU will give the UK any concessions?

I'll give you two why they won't, TJ: fiscal dumping, social dumping.

[i] molgrips - Member
Are any of you remainers planning to emigrate?
By the time I'll be in a position to, I won't be able to. Thanks to Brexit. You have slammed that particular door on me and my family.[/i]

Reminds us of how bitterly you complained about how the EU was forcing your fellow countrymen to leave their homes and country, just so you and your family could stay and enjoy living in the UK and EU.

Seemingly, remainers want everyone to care about them and their ideals for society.
While not caring a hoot, for those for who the EU wasn't working.

Ironing, anyone?

Remainers participated in a democratic process and by doing so implicitly agreed to accept the result of the vote.

Oh,hang on....

I love how May talks about making the UK some kind of great progressive utopia. Seriously? Why didn't you do any of this stuff BEFORE the referendum? If you really gave a shit you'd have been investing in the country all along.

Remarkably, May has chosen cooperation against terrorists as a bargaining chip

How low can we go?

Imagine a PM smart enough to say “Your citizens are secure with us and we’re with you on security and defense. Now, about trade …”

Imagine.

Remainers participated in a democratic process and by doing so implicitly agreed to accept the result of the vote.

Haven't we done this? To sum up, advisory, and we didn't vote on single market membership or total lack of parliamentary scrutiny.

Seemingly, remainers want everyone to care about them and their ideals for society.
While not caring a hoot, for those for who the EU wasn't working.

Utter bullshit.

Plenty of examples in this thread of people who can circumvent, or even benefit from, the changes ahead as we leave the EU, but dead against us leaving because of the effects on others. Go ahead and argue that "remainers" are wrong that leaving the EU will hurt those worse off the worst, but to suggest those arguing that we are wrong to leave don't care about these issues, and those people, simply doesn't stack up.

Remainers participated in a democratic process and by doing so implicitly agreed to accept the result of the vote.

We were obliged to participate. Had we not we would still have the result imposed.

& I never agreed to give up my FOM rights, or those of my child. The right to freely travel live work and study in the world's most prosperous free trade area and the crucible of western civilisation. Thousands of years of culture to share in, landscapes from the Scandi tundra, the Alps, the deserts of Spain and more.

Whereas you (presumably) voted to do that to us, specifically against my consent. You voted to take something from me and my child.

It's stupid, it's personal because it's something you did directly to me, and we're not about to get over it.

Angry? **** yes.

While not caring a hoot, for those for who the EU wasn't working.

Not true. I have tradesmen friends who voted leave because of the effect of immigrant labour on their incomes. I think they made a mistake in the big picture, but understand their feeling.

But what's sad is damage to the economy will cancel out any benefit from labour shortages. They're not going to get what they want.

I see no upside here Just damage.

Is it right that you export your pollution? Which a lot of the environmental improvement in the UK really is.

It's almost as if environment regulation works better when it is agreed between, and applies across, as many countries as possible. Perhaps we can start with Europe? Do it as a trading block perhaps? Prevent a race to the bottom between members states as they seek to carve out a competitive edges by reducing cost by dumping environmental protections. We could even include a commitment on environmental protection in trade deals the trading block makes with third countries, using the scale of the trading block to help improve the environment in those countries that want to more easily sell their exports to us.

Just an idea.

What a brilliant future. Scotland and Ulster leave the UK. That just leaves England and Wales.

A nasty, xenophobic little backwater.

Compare that to the EU immediately offering EU Citizenship to any UK resident who wants it. Open, cooperative and generous still.

"Fog in the channel. Continent cut off." 🙄

[i] mattjg - Member
I never agreed to give up my FOM rights, or those of my child. The right to freely travel live work and study in the world's most prosperous free trade area and the crucible of western civilisation. Thousands of years of culture to share in, landscapes from the Scandi tundra, the Alps, the deserts of Spain and more.[/i]

Excellent!

You're saying that those for whom the EU wasn't working, those forced from their homes, family, country. Were wrong and selfish to vote leave.
While your justification to remain is your chosen lifestyle.

Wow!

I'm thinking of the restrictions placed on my child's future, by others, for no benefit to anyone.

Pardon me for the selfishness.

It's not about policy, it's personal. I never voted to take anything from anyone.

Playlist: Ryan Adams Starting to Hurt https://open.spotify.com/track/0w2GcdrBdiIz7JZMCgLGVe

You're saying that those for whom the EU wasn't working, those forced from their homes, family, country. Were wrong and selfish to vote leave.

And these mythical leave voters would be.....?!!

Even for a brexie that's a fair chunk of made up nonsense !

[quote="solo"]You're saying that those for whom the EU wasn't working, those forced from their homes, family, country.

One example of people in this position? Just one little fact to back it up?

Solo's just trolling. I should have known better.