Flyingleaps the poster publishers who brought you
'Strong And Stable My Arse' have just come up with another.
'Things Can Only Get Bitter'
https://www.flyingleaps.co.uk/
May has backed us (unintentionally I think) into a corner with her “no deal is better than a bad deal” line
Whilst technically true its hard to find a deal worse than no deal.
but any centrist Labour Party would be making mincemeat out of this shambles
No they wouldnt. There was a reason Blair handed over power. Unlike you he actually has political skills and knew he had ran the course and its best to go out on top.
Personally I am not a fan of Corbyn. I wish there was a better Labour option. However the key choice there is "Labour" not "New Labour" and not "****ing centrist".
Those idiots are the major reason we are in the shit.
Firstly most of them dont understand the overton window. If you head rightwards (or leftwards") to chase the centre then the "centre" moves with it. You end up making hard right politics normal to a stage where sensible policies are claimed to be far left. Wait long enough and you end up with USA style politics where your choice is hard right everything or just hard right economics.
Secondly, although overlaps with the previous, the only way to get good press with the hard right is to generally meet their owners wishes. Just look at how Cameron was portrayed as the master PR genius until he actually went against them.
Thirdly by ignoring the core voters they gave fertile ground to the ****ing UKIP liars who actually pretended to care about them.
Fourthly by their absolute ideological nuttery and hatred of Corbyn they gave the Maybot and the rest of the hard right plenty of ammo.
I know you are an ideological extremist but you really need to look beyond the myth of "centrist" and understand that they, and I assume by your worship of the position, you are pretty extreme.
I say that as someone who in theory should be a "centrist" but the difference seems to be I know I am a minority unlike most "centrists" who confuse being the swing voters with actually be a minority.
I want Labour to be Labour and the Tories to be Tories and the Libdems to come up with some decent arguments and the Greens to give up some of the nuttery so I could vote for them. Sadly those this is undermined by FPTP but thats another failure for the Libdems.
Have I installed the killfile? Or not?
Am I just ignoring him?
He’ll never know..........
#ivetakenbackcontrol
A centrist Labour Party could capitalise on that to a huge degree.
Just how exactly? WIth their pro-remain centrist agenda? Like the Liberal Democrats I suppose, how are they doing these days? People voted for this bloody thing because of centrist neo-liberal elites, on both labour and tory sides, ignoring them. So what evidence is there now that they would vote for a centrist labour party offering more of the same, with the same tired leadership candidates who couldn't beat a clapped out 70s Bennite with a bunch of unreformed marxists behind him?
Just how exactly?
Magic of course!
Backed up with a few inane screenshots showing the finger on the pulse.
The sad thing is the brexit elites have managed to figure out the flaws far before the "centrists" and despite not giving a shit are willing to lie to pretend they do. As such we are all screwed until the "centrists" admit to this and stop trying to make everyone dance to their inane tune.
The "centrists" aren't running either main party right now… and how's that turning out for us? All going great? If so, then sidelining them is obviously the right course to take. Not going so great? Hmmm…
Neither party seems to be interested in protecting our rights as workers, or to help business succeed. And, yes, ending FoM is removing rights from workers. Leaving the Single Market and Customs Union is putting hurdles up for business. Neither party is standing up for workers, or business. Retired people moaning about polish workers having a local shop they can buy a few reminders of their old country from… those people are being very well represented by both parties. Lucky them.
Well if the centrists hadn't all lost their shit when it turned out the minority party ina coalition wasn't in charge we might have moved forward from the 2 party flip flop we are still enjoying - I mean who can forgive that!!
An oscillation around the middle ground ain't a bad way to do things
I'm referring to the politicans, not the voters. Hence me referring to those running the two main parties. And as you point out… those are the only ones who are likely to be in charge of the country.
At the moment it's the people returning the politicians, though some might want to change that.
Plenty of seats where whoever stands for the right party … they are returned. We covered that.
The “centrists” aren’t running either main party right now
The maybot, under the current definition, would count as a "centrist" (which shows how ****ed the definition is). She is, like most of her kind, dancing to the hardliners whim. This is the flaw of the centrists. They play along with whoever shouts the loudest. The more noise the more they shift.
On the Labour front although I would hope they would actually try to support the leadership and try to influence them sadly with most of the ideological centrist extremists its pretty clear they mostly want to wipe out the current leadership and drag the labour party rightwards which maybe as a short term strategy might work again but will give us a massive backlash. Given the current leadership arent complete idiots though that gives them no reasons to play along.
There was an article a while back where one of Blairs inner circle was talking about how their politics had got around the confrontational aspect and found the mythical third way. Admittedly this might have the benefit of hindsight but I couldnt help but think it was pretending there wasnt opposing views and claiming everyone agreed wasnt a tad delusional.
So the problem with "centrists" is that they cede control over policy to those that aren't? But also that they won't support those that aren't? Well, that's clear.
Well, that’s clear.
Nope. Try again.
If it helps the problem is they dont generally comprehend they are ideologically bound and so cant handle moving beyond their own red lines. So they will go more and more extreme one direction without thinking maybe they would benefit from moving just one degree the other way. Instead they will go one hundred degrees rightwards. I use rightwards in this case since in theory it could go the other way in the UK it is dancing to the hard right press barons demands.
Ah, so, in the UK, it's just that those you think are "centrist" aren't left enough for you. Isn't tribalism great! Isn't it serving our country well right now…
…anyway… supporting Brexit, and especially ending FoM, is dancing to the hard right press barons' demands.
"dissonance
The maybot, under the current definition, would count as a “centrist” "
Well that's a huge part of the problem isn't it, the people who decide where the centre is seem to be the largely right wing press. Even the BBC said after May's first, downright freaky Tory conference with its xenophobia and "citizens of nowhere" rhetoric that she'd "parked her bus in the centre ground". It used to be said that to win you should move to the centre but then you don't get to do what you wanted to do, it's way smarter to just make sure everyone thinks the centre is waaaaaaaay over here.
It's genius really. Instead of stealing the ball, steal the entire pitch.
Ah, so, in the UK, it’s just that those you think are “centrist” aren’t left enough for you.
Try again. It really shouldnt be that hard.
We should have a decent left wing party and a decent right wing party and then a centrist and so on parties.
The problem is many of the "centrists" dont seem to comprehend they are a minority. We cant have the Labour party (or the Conservatives although that hasnt been pushed so much) dancing to our whims. If it was PR and not FPTP or AV then we would count more. However as it doesnt we dont.
We shouldnt have a system based around chasing the swing voters since that is inherently flawed not least into confusing "swing" with "centrist".
and especially ending FoM, is dancing to the hard right press barons’ demands.
Not really. If you actually check up on what the hard right is saying they are actually in favour of free movement of people. Its just that is a handy trigger that their press cheerleaders use.
centerists? ? the real centre is way over there to the left. Corbyns "marxist" policies are actually main stream european social democrat. Labour "moderates" are actually right of centre. Tory "moderates" are right wing, May and co are hard right by any rational political definitions
Well Yvette Cooper has been doing a damn sight better job of holding the government to account over Brexit than the useless, beardy allotment-dweller
Yvette Cooper is making sure her 17% in the leadership battle increases.
The centrists had their shot and blew it not fighting the argument over debt and deficit bullshit.
Because of that we've ended up with this file Tory austerity.
You know the thing that Alasdair Campbell forgets about whilst he's squealing for a second referendum.
Culpable.
People voted for this bloody thing because of centrist neo-liberal elites, on both labour and tory sides, ignoring them.
Who exactly would they be? I think there's been precious little "centrism" in UK politics for decades.
I saw that clip last night zippy. It is scary how someone in a position of influencing millions of voters on the issue, is so badly informed on the issue of WTO rules. That clip is a shocker.
I'm currently talking to Farage's office and the lady in there is totally clueless.
When I told her about the 30% tax on chocolate she said " that's worse than the eu" and then advised me to talk to my mep.
"If you had to distil into one personage the British people’s gibbering historical deference to terrible ideas advanced by low-to-middlebrow post-feudal shitlords who openly detest them, this plastic aristocrat would be it."
No prizes for guessing who Martina Hyde in the Graun was tearing apart here.
Made me smile though
Someone claiming that the "hard right" are in favour of FoM is my highlight from this week's Lexit defending bullshit. Well done @dissonance, you have chosen your handle well.
One family history that's worth some contemplation…
https://twitter.com/guitarmoog/status/1088960821126987776?s=21
Thanks for sharing that Kelvin. Got very dusty here reading it and the following comments. It is very pertinent to me as my wife is German and both her grandfathers were killed in WW2. One of them never even got to see his child, he died on the eastern front before the birth. His body was never recovered and Birgit's Grandmother spent the rest of her (long) life never coming to terms with it and refusing to give up hope he might have somehow survived.
In the imperial war museum there is a small black and white picture of a railway bridge in Bulgaria.It was taken during the cold war .
The person who took that picture risked his life to take it so that others could risk their lives to blow it up.
When I saw that picture a few years back I realised that I could go to the bridge and take as many pictures of it that I liked. I could buy a house next to it and live there. I realised that we had made massive steps towards peace.
We are now are taking our first steps backwards .
By the way, did anyone else notice this at the bottom of the Sky story where the boss of Unipart dismissed Little Liam out of hand as having ‘extremely low credibility’?
A friend of Dr Fox said: "The people trying to discredit Liam need to accept that the UK voted to leave the EU in a democratic referendum and the result must be honoured".
I wonder......was this another ‘special friend’ that our Liam had taken along on a junket using public money?
‘Extremely low credibility’ is actually doing him a favour. He is very lucky to have a total spanner like Grayling attracting all the ridicule as he is also a total tosspot.
Blank sheet of paper no red lines.
Where do you think the 'common ground' is - Norway?
EU just closed the medicines approval office 900 jobs gone...
To paraphrase another scumbag.
Where there is harmony May will bring discord.
Where there is truth May may will bring error.
Where there is faith May will bring doubt and where there is hope May will bring despair.
Compare Herr Bergmann's tweet with another of our Little England ERG idiots.
https://twitter.com/BBCPolitics/status/1088814152037138435
EU just closed the medicines approval office 900 jobs gone…
Maybe we could make a medal that says " I gave my job for brexit".
Every June 23rd they could march up the street while we all clap them then the rest of the year we can call them scrounging parasites.
I really don't get how people bring the suggestion of War into the equation.
The EU has basically ended all war in the European geographical area.
Look at the rest of the world..
Yes my friend is off to Amsterdam wth his wife and family. That’s about 150k of salaried tax paying money leaving the country. We’ll be fine.
I really don’t get how people bring the suggestion of War into the equation.
Take a look at the films we made about the war, the TV shows and the way it used to be remembered. It's about being plucky and right, it's about beating the odds and showing the world how we are just a bit awesome. It's been taken on by those who want poorly fill the shoes of those who made tough decisions in the face of poor odds.
Other countries remember how it destroyed them and have learnt from that.
As for the prick of an MP, he better get used to being bullied if we leave, the EU will do it, the US will do it, in fact most countries will do it and succeed.
My dad was wounded after landing at Anzio, he loved that Europe was united and bore no ill will to the Germans, that twit Francois is talking utter bobbins.
what an absolute ****
And his Mum is / was Italian..... you know, the Italians our brave lads fought against as well as the Germans he seems to be so disdainful of.
I really don’t get how people bring the suggestion of War into the equation
Not sure if you read up but good ol' rule Britannia has been causing shit worldwide since oooh the crusades, without it it seems we are ERM well **** all as a nation to some
Those 9 f35s , an aircraft less aircraft carrier and an army that needs to hire ****ing anyone they can at the minute should deal the deal as one of the most potent military powers in the world
What kind of tosser prints off a letter only to rip it up on camera. You’ve ripped up your own letter on your own paper. I wonder what went wrong in his life, or what is missing from his life that he turned out to be such a ****.
Well this is a thing https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-47014322
So in a similar vein can we get everyone to call for an end to Brexit?
Where do you think the ‘common ground’ is – Norway?
If the hardliners voted against the backstop deal they aren't going to go for Norway style. So it depends on what Labour do.
I think on a free vote you would have4 400+ mps vote for staying in the customs union and the single market - so Norway +
Nice to see Francois is getting a bit of a drubbing on Twitter from the phone folk of Rayleigh.