I am regularly lambasted on here for my views on Farming, The Type 2 varient of Farmer is slightly less rare than rocking horse shit.
The only way that i can see UK farming doing well post brexit is by increasing subsidies significantly. Just for clarity that is irony....
I dont think the Farming community is stupid anything but, many do know how precarious their position is but as "discussed" back in this thread many (not all) assume the gov. (Tory) will look after them. Many dont believe the gov. will allow cheap food imports? Many have little understanding of WTO rules around tariffs and subsidies.
Many have followed their local Tory MPs rhetoric and believe it. Hill Farmers round my way are not worried by Defra slaughter plans as they assume they will get a cheque from Defra.
Welsh Farmer is correct in his analysis the problem is even the smart type 2 farmers will have to compete with "similar" products that are 2/3 of the cost, not all can grow (and sell) organic kiwi fruit to a narrow affluent market.
On a slightly different topic talking to an expat who lives in the US and has just retired from a very high level role as a CFO. He has pointed out that many US companies are doing extensive due diligence on UK business of all types, the US is currently awash (his words) with cash for acquisitions particularly overseas....
The big change in NZ agriculture was sheep to dairy conversions, New Zealand exports 95% of the milk it produces, which is equal to about a third of its goods exports.
Nigh on 40% of the EU budget is spent on farming, fisheries and conservation.
welshfarmer, I actually worked in agriculture (research) for a couple of years, of course there are some intelligent/educated farmers but they are a minority. And round here every field had a vote leave billboard followed by a vote Tory one. They of all people should know they real what they sow, and since they were happy to **** up my world, I'm happy they get a taste of their own medicine.
So far this week Enola has stoked us up with the proper project fear.
Troops on the street with a no deal. Then Amber Rudd mentions a second referendum .
Both sides are now rabid with anger ...but what’s this....
It’s Saint Theresa with a really shit deal that we will now lap up as it’s not as shit as the other options.
It was a page ago that people were talking about the IEA and TPA .. For those who want to know more I recommend this link article in the indy.
They don't just share donor anonymity, right wing views and a lot of time on the BBC. They also share addresses in London.
The need for "balance" in news has led us down some weird paths. Dyson and Weatherspoons versus the rest of UK business in the Brexit coverage. Nigel Lawson versus global climate science in environment section. Now we have IEA and TPA (and others) given free reign to lead us down an economic path that might destroy the fabric of the whole country.
Who needs russians with facebook accounts when you have the BBC?
It's not just the BBC though, is it. This bit of "balance' was on C4 news, sadly. These organisation are deeply troubling. Did they have a Union leader on? Someone involved in Irish export/import work? So many interesting differing views available, from people who aren't part of this shady group of organisations.
Radio4 this morning all about the stupid squirrel!
Latest EU guidance about no deal Brexit seems to have been completely ignored. Here's a snip…
https://twitter.com/jp_biz/status/1075388818071662592?s=21
…please share some more.
What exactly did he say that was so outrageous? I didn't know who he was and thought what he said was pretty sound (more objective that most stuff peopel come out with about Brexit)
Snow did introduce him as Mr Brexit or something like that so gave away his bias. It was also a more casual discussion anyway as they had an author, a comedian and the IEA guy.
I didn’t know who he was and thought what he said was pretty sound
Well, there you go.
Radio4 this morning all about the stupid squirrel
Well Angela loathsome just came in to redress the balance, in summary if we say something shitty it's banter, if they do it...
We are preparing for any and all outcomes (except stopping it) managed is exposed as bs.
It's as if she is working through the collected works of Sean Spicer
while not exactly the smartest comment, and not one to openly be caught saying - is it even really misogynist? I mean, she is a woman? And she is in the opinion of some (which we're all entitled to) stupid.
It's not as if he said 'stupid woman, should be at home doing the washing up and then this would never have happened'
Why is stupid people any better, surely the insult is in the stupid?
Ooh! Squirrel!
and yes, loathsome was super loathsome today. Horrible woman.
People is plausible. Who cares? Just ignore the Squirrel! Get back on topic.
AL was yet again repeating the "biggest" and ignoring the "closeness" of the result of a referendum in which people voted for very different things, and very few wanted either a no deal exit, or May's mess… and what they want to happen now is more relevant than what the wanted before they saw the true calibre of the people who'd be seeking to carry out their wishes.
Well, there you go.
Not really. Again, what did he say that was so outrageous or made up? (in the context of a discussion with an author and a comedian)
Horrible woman
Misogynist
Twice in two days - caught out by R4!
Yesterday I missed the start, but hear most of Sajid Javed being interviewed and assumed that it was a junior minister at best or perhaps just a run of the mill MP on a committee - but then realised it was in fact the Home Secretary. So ill informed and utterly inept was he that I laughed out loud.
This morning exactly the same thing happened, but it was Leadsome instead. Nick Robinson was just puncturing the fantasy of 'Managed No Deal' ('managed' yes, but entirely by the EU) and she just sounded utterly clueless. Eventually she blurted out that 'Managed No Deal' was not necessarily leaving without a deal..........
Either these people are monumentally stupid, or they are held prisoner by the worst prejudices of their support so the doublethink required just looks like insanity. I suspect a near 50/50 mix of the two.
Rule number on on the Net, don't have tow windows open for the same site
It’s the patriotic duty of every British-looking, British-sounding, Queeny-loving adult to procreate!
So what we need is a more patriotic tinder? Where selfless single men sign up to help create the generation that shall return us to the age of empire!
I was replying on the we don't want to be grand parents thread, Mike, soryy about that. My post didn't look obviously out of place here though.
You could put something back!! Mine just looks a bit creepy now 🙂
while not exactly the smartest comment, and not one to openly be caught saying – is it even really misogynist? I mean, she is a woman?
I thought that, but then I asked myself how I would insult a man. I don't tent to say 'stupid man' and I've not heard it said often. It's usually 'stupid idiot' for a man and 'stupid woman' for a woman. See the difference?
See the difference?
Between a sitting PM goading the leader of the opposition? Leading her MP's in some chanting panto style? How about returning the whip to a couple of guys still under investigation for some serious complaints or brushing under the carpet what else they have been up to?
There is no moral high ground in this one but it has given the PM a 30s break from the complete incompetence she has shown in the last 2 years.
The sooner the press get back to that the more chance we will have of moving things on.
Not really. Again, what did he say that was so outrageous or made up? (in the context of a discussion with an author and a comedian)
Okay I'll spell it out...
The fella said that a no deal scenario would be okay because the EU will let us carry on pretty much as we are... He sounds plausible, so folks watch that and think no deal is therefore okay... Except that was just something he has a made up opinion on presented as fact.
The very next day the EU publish their outline plans for a no deal scenario and make it clear that they very much will not let us carry on pretty much as we are. Far from it... see the article on the BBC linked earlier.
So this is how we end up with this situation where the country is flooded with folk who think that a no deal Brexit, won't be that bad.
To me that is outrageous
I thought that, but then I asked myself how I would insult a man. I don’t tent to say ‘stupid man’ and I’ve not heard it said often. It’s usually ‘stupid idiot’ for a man and ‘stupid woman’ for a woman. See the difference?
That's if it was even said at all - but either way once again Corbyn was so close to making the PM look stupid has shot himself in the foot. He is ineffectual.
The whole government seems to have forgotten that only just over 50% voted for this, so there is going to be just under 50% of the population that are pissed off. Either way they are ignoring half the population. Weirdly at the moment leave voters are the loudest & most vitriolic, even tho we are leaving.
I thought that, but then I asked myself how I would insult a man.
The correct phrase is Stupid Boy (Dad's army)
Except that was just something he has a made up opinion on presented as fact.
It was his opinion, just as we heard the options of the author and the comedian. I tend to agree with his opinion that the EU wouldn't let a disaster happen in the UK as they are not like that (combined with the fact it wouldn't help the EU either)
You may feel otherwise but we will find out at the end of March won't we...
Either these people are monumentally stupid, or they are held prisoner by the worst prejudices of their support so the doublethink required just looks like insanity. I suspect a near 50/50 mix of the two.
I've come to the conclusion that their expensive educations aand privilidged upbringings has enabled them to make apparently witty bon mots in Latin, during a press conference, or adopt some Churchillian phrase while stood up in the house of commons (Rees-Mogg and Boris) but they haven't got the first clue about how the 21st global economy actually functions.
And in the cases where they haven't had an expensive educations aand privilidged upbringing (David Davis) then they genuinelly are, to quote his former aide: 'as thick as mince.
One thing that Brexit has visciously exposed is just how utterly clueless our elected representatives are as to how the real world, outside their cosseted bubble, actually operates
Press portraying indignance of horror
Reality is 48 lercent of people probably dont think she is actually stupid cognatively.... But obviously think shes stupid cognatively for the road we are being dragged down at her whim
It was his opinion, just as we heard the options of the author and the comedian. I tend to agree with his opinion that the EU wouldn’t let a disaster happen in the UK as they are not like that (combined with the fact it wouldn’t help the EU either)
You may feel otherwise but we will find out at the end of March won’t we…
Yeah, hope for the best plan for the worst - is what the EU has done. The EU will look after their interests as they have been doing so well. Anything the UK wants that is not in the best interest of the EU will be in the bin.
Any one who thinks this is even an option that should be considered needs to have a really good think about what is going to happen.
Proposing something like that at work would probably see you at best sidelined or at worst fired.
It was his opinion
Just like it's my opinion that the Earth is flat. The EU have said explicitly what will happen in the event of a no deal.
I tend to agree with his opinion that the EU wouldn’t let a disaster happen in the UK as they are not like that
Quite a few Greeks would disagree with you. In fact the EU are EXACTLY like that, which is why, as someone who will personally suffer from Brexit, I am not 100% sad that we are leaving.
So far the negociations have turned around the UK trying to negociate an unfair competetive advantage and Barnier saying sorry I don't have a remit to give you that. And on the EU side trying not to put an end to peace in Ireland.
Gimme, gimme, gimme, take, take, take, take... no give. **** off.
Macron, Merkel and many other European leaders have worries of their own to deal with and don't want to risk being seen as weak on Brexit.
Quite a few Greeks would disagree with you. In fact the EU are EXACTLY like that, which is why, as someone who will personally suffer from Brexit, I am not 100% sad that we are leaving.
Yep - but that's what you get for cooking the books to be admitted to a club then pretending you will get your house in order (whilst whispering to your own electorate "don't worry, as soon as we're in, it's gravy all the way") - and doing nothing to address the real internal problems.
A bit like being the awkward, entitled, wanting cake and eating it and annoying member of a club for forty years that then turns around, kicks the other members in the plums and ten minutes later actually expects them to grant their every wish.
Funny isn't it?
I tend to agree with his opinion that the EU wouldn’t let a disaster happen in the UK as they are not like that
Quite a few Greeks would disagree with you.
There are quite a lot of Italians who are presently taking issue with that too
The irony of what the Brexiteers have managed is that they've demonstrated the EU is far, far stronger than indivual states (who'd have thunk it?), and will back its members (in this case Ireland) to the hilt, when required. They've also seen off any realistic chance of anyone else to do something so stupid, and massively reduced any chance of meaningful reform within the EU
Yay for us!!!
cooking the books
Blah blah blah. Haven't we had enough of simplistic nonsense yet?
dannyh - exactly
Macron has two problems, the extreme left and extreme right. 42% of gilet jaune vote Le Pen and a lot of the rest extreme left. Only 5% of Macron's voters are gilets jaunes. So the extreme right and left Frexit supporters need convincing Frexit is a bad idea. Two Brexit results will help that; no Brexit because if the Brits don't do it must be a very bad idea; a catastrophic Brexit which proves it's a very bad idea. Merkel too, and any other centre right or lft leader.
Macron has two problems, the extreme left and extreme right.
He only has one problem really. The French. 😉
The whole government seems to have forgotten that only just over 50% voted for this, so there is going to be just under 50% of the population that are pissed off. Either way they are ignoring half the population. Weirdly at the moment leave voters are the loudest & most vitriolic, even tho we are leaving.
Actually it's worse than that; turnout was 72.2% of which 51.89% voted Leave, meaning only 37.6% of the then registered voting population said they wanted to leave, 34.6% said they wanted to stay and we don't get to know what the remaining (presumably apathetic or confused?) 27.8% wanted.
And it's not just the Government that's forgotten, the media seem to have forgotten, TBF it was almost two years ago and it's not like you can just look these things up on Wikipedia...
But yes people seem to forget just how marginal it was, of course had someone had the foresight to set a minimum quota/proportion rule for the vote any confusion could have been avoided, You know in a country with a first past the post system for general elections, it wouldn't have been that controversial... 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing of course.
Instead even those of us who weren't in favour we are apparently beholden to keeping the shoutiest third of our population "Happy" it seems. But they're always kept (or been held?) one step away from the job of actually having to deliver what they claim they wanted...
Personally I can't understand Why May is bothering to hang on in there, I don't like her particularly but she's done her bit, seized the poisoned chalice and brought an EU deal back to parliament, so why not just let them vote it down, resign and let the Brexiteers take over, lets see what they can actually "Deliver" in the next three months?
Let the Torries swing all the way towards right wing populism While Labour/momentum push towards making themselves a Left wing opposition (that far too many voters can't really see in power) and we can get back to some good old fashioned polarized politics as we crash our way out of the EU...
I don’t tent to say ‘stupid man’ and I’ve not heard it said often. It’s usually ‘stupid idiot’ for a man and ‘stupid woman’ for a woman. See the difference?
Not really, I've heard stupid man said loads of times.
By the same token then. 'Bloody difficult woman' Misogynist? (I can't for the life of me remember who used that phrase 😉 )
This Corbyn and the "stupid woman" business is really serious.
He's denied it and I believe him. The lip readers in Parliament are obviously crappy.
What concerns me is when did they let mind readers in?
By the same token then. ‘Bloody difficult woman’ Misogynist? (I can’t for the life of me remember who used that phrase 😉 )
Ken Clarke (the only Tory I have any time for). Maybe Corbyn should have called her that as the precedent was already set.
Actually it’s worse than that; turnout was 72.2% of which 51.89% voted Leave, meaning only 37.6% of the then registered voting population said they wanted to leave, 34.6% said they wanted to stay and we don’t get to know what the remaining other (presumably apathetic or confused?) 27.8% wanted.
I think the key thing here, is the people who didn't vote, we can presume they wished to stay, as the didn't care enough to want to leave, so it's actually a minority, a very loud vocal minority who are leading us down this path.
Ok, it's rare I pop in and out of this thread but.... Im going to copy paste a post I put on my personal FB page this morning.
To put this into context run/own a village shop with my wife.
The British Independent Retailers Association has today advised all independent retailers to start stockpiling stock and where possible reduce overheads and increase margins in case of a no-deal Brexit.
And it doesn't stop there many of our wholesalers (both large and small wholesalers) are saying that they run on a 4week basis for much of their stock (principally fresh stock), so we may expect shortages.
Now we run a (very) small village shop, the stock is very much on the shelves, if we don't have it on display, it's unlikely that it's in our 2sqm stock room. So stockpiling just isn't an option. The supermarkets were preparing for this situation within days of the referendum, spending millions on new distribution centres and warehouses. Theres an independent warehouse company in Wales that was full last year and has had to double inside to accommodate stockpiles - so I'm sure that there will be food on the shelves after March 29th, but IF it does all go wrong, it won't be on our shelves.
As for a margin increase, one of the reasons our village shop survives is because our margins are competitive - it gives the customer a reason to try us before driving the 15<20min drive to the nearest supermarket. If we increase margins, we loose customers. Increasing margins will drive customers away (literally). We want to keep our customers.
Now the only overhead we can reduce is staff and or wages, ALL others are kept as low as possible and constantly are reviewed - again this is how small business survive. Laura and usually do a 5day week and a 7day week really isn't appealing, so the only way of reducing overheads is to cut weekend hours as these are staffed - not good for the business, our staff, us, our customers or ultimately the country (Less wages means less money back into the economy = worse for the country).
Now multiply this by all the other 1000's of independent retailers across the country, not just the village shops & convenience stores, I'm talking fashion retailers, games shops, jewellery, bike shops etc, you name it. A no-deal situation is a very very bad thing.
OK year or two down the line, the country will be out of Europe and may (or may not) be in a better situation. However many many livelihoods, business and people will be affected by even the smallest disruption at the ports. Let's see how the high street changes, the shop fronts across the country could become a darker place.
Now the good news, we (Laura and I) have a plan, we are diversifying, the shop will continue. We have accepted the outcome of the referendum, but, just like larger buisnesses, a back up plan.
