I think TJ you can get a job there now to secure your right to work, then stay for 5 years to get citizenship. Should be easy with no dependents and someone to give you a job.
Meanwhile, on Facebook:
Martin Lewis created a poll.
7 hrs
Today's quick poll: If we ignore PM's Brexit deal (as many seem to) and make it a stark choice- 2nd referendum (aka people's vote)
- No deal Brexit (aka WTO rules)Which'd u prefer?
PS. Dont take the result too seriously. UNfortunately I can't split it here between leave and remain voters as I do on Twitter, so there's no way to know here how this group reflects public opinion (e.g. on Twitter it is substantially pro remain skewed)
55%
2nd ref
45%
no deal
Scary stuff.
But who's going to free your homeland from English colnial tyranny if you bugger off to the Netherlands?
Another genius tory policy.
It is a pretty good policy if you happen to be a landlord, which by coincidence a fair number of Tory MPs are. Just need to get the suckers to vote for your party.
Scary stuff.
Not a surprise to me as mirrors what I have been suggesting. Just because you think the voters are now better informed doesn't actually mean they are. Try talking to a few of them...
No-one thinks a 2nd ref is a shoe in, it'll all depend on what's on the ballot. And that's subject to political manoeuvring.
I have already gone too. But my wife is English and we go back to the UK frequently. And I own a house in England too.
So no deal could be a pita.
Just because you think the voters are now better informed doesn’t actually mean they are.
Indeed. Stick 5 Live's daily Brexit phone ins on at 9 o clock one morning and listen to angry, red-faced white van men ranting about how we're being punished by Brussels. Or check out a frankly terrifying piece by channel 4 news recently where they featured vox pops with a succession of semi-literate, toothless trogladytes in Barrow, all saying how they'd vote leave again tomorrow, then trotting out something they once saw written down the side of a bus, or an a billboard Nigel Farage was photographed gurning in front of.
The irony being that these are exactly the people who will feel the properly pointy end of the nastiness that will follow Brexit, as the newly liberated free-marketeers take a hatchet to the welfare state, NHS, workers rights and environmental controls
If we weren't all about to be bent over in the same fashion at the same time I'd say that they deserve everything they get
Canada PLus or Norway plus are options
As Ivan Rogers piece said, any concept with + written after it broadly isn't viable. Apart from the fact that we might not be offered the base deal anyway, the mere fact there is a + after it means that deal isn't suitable and we will want extra bits added on. Bits that are going to be different to what the EU can / is prepared to negotiate on to them.
And certainly not negotiable in 3 months.......
I am genuinely worried about the whole no deal scenario and many peoples total lack of understanding about what this would entail. Especially after having a conversation with someone at work just now about it. They said why don't we just leave, no deal then start negotiating again.... I pointed out that we would need to still pay the 'divorce bill' if we wanted any hope of negotiating better than WTO terms with the EU. I tried to say it was like doing a runner from a meal, then heading back and saying 'right, what price will you do me for 3 courses'.
Norway plus are options
I don't understand how this works, but Norway is on record as saying "no it's not."
They said why don’t we just leave
As I said earlier: this question was reasonable two years ago. If anyone is still saying it now then they're either completely disengaged from the whole situation, or they're an idiot.
In the case of most leavers I've spoken too they appear to be both
I don’t understand how this works, but Norway is on record as saying “no it’s not.”
It's my understanding that Norway's deal (as part of the EFTA, along with Iceland, Poland & a couple of others) essentially have membership in order to trade, free movement etc... but have zero say in the law making.
They're on record as saying they won't allow Britain to join the EFTA, so we're unlikely to get a better deal that way... as the EU don't want to piss them off. This whole situation really is just unbelievable.
I don’t understand how this works, but Norway is on record as saying “no it’s not.”
No they are not.
No they are not.
As it's panto season... Oh yes they are.
Norway-plus, the softest form of Brexit, requires the UK to seek to apply to join the European Free Trade Area grouping, consisting of Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Liechtenstein. The scheme, as revised by Boles, would require the UK also to remain in the EU customs union indefinitely, or at least until a solution to the border in Ireland could be found.
But the plan was rejected by Heidi Nordby Lunde, an MP in Norway’s governing Conservative party, and leader of Norway’s European movement. She said her views reflected those of the governing party even though the Norwegian prime minister, Erna Solberg, has been more diplomatic by saying Norway would examine a UK application.
Lunde told the Guardian: “Really, the Norwegian option is not an option. We have been telling you this for one and a half years since the referendum and how this works, so I am surprised that after all these years it is still part of the grown-up debate in the UK. You just expect us to give you an invitation rather than consider whether Norway would want to give you such an invitation. It might be in your interest to use our agreement, but it would not be in our interest.”
Is she a government minister? Does she speak for Norway anymore than Jacob Rees Mogg speaks for Britain.
Is she a government minister? Does she speak for Norway anymore than Jacob Rees Mogg speaks for Britain.
No - but she is tho...
https://www.politico.eu/article/norwegian-pm-uk-cannot-cherry-pick-eu-membership/
& let's be honest, the EU won't allow us a better deal than that, & if we had Norway's deal the Brexiters would be even more upset than the current deal.
If anyone is still saying it now then they’re either completely disengaged from the whole situation, or they’re an idiot.
Or the third option, they may gain from it, i.e Rees Mogg, Tim whatsit from Weatherspoons and so on. Not exactly disengaged or idiots and they know full well what they are doing.
Meanwhile as the shitshow continues, the Maybot announces she'll hold the vote back until the 11th hour, a week before the cutoff dat, in the hope that her own insane backbenchers blink first. They won't, of course.
Then we're all on for chaos, constitutional crisis and the very real possibility of No Deal
Andrew Rawnsley's analysis is always worth reading, and he was bang on in yesterdays Observer
Failed by both its major parties, betrayed Britain lurches towards the abyss
Hope no one missed Raab asking if the preparations for a No Deal would involve cutting tax rates for businesses!
If anyone needs to have it spelt out for them what Brexit is really about for the spivs, then we are truly beyond help.
In the case of most leavers I’ve spoken too they appear to be both
Conversation I had with a work colleague last week who is both an arch-leaver and a degree-educated employee of a world leading consultancy firm:
Him: "So if we're in the customs union does that mean we won't be able to do any trade deals"
Me: "Yes"
Him: "So then what's the point?"
Me: "Exactly!"
Him: "So what if we're not in the customs union?"
Me: "Then we have a hard border in Ireland and most of UK Industry which relies on supply chains with Europe grinds to a halt or goes bankrupt"
Him: "But we don't do that much trade with Europe, most of it is with America"
Me: "No it's not"
Him: "and India and China"
Me: "No it's not"
Him: "Well what about the rest of the commonwealth?"
This went downhill quite quickly after this into stuff about Libyan immigrants who blew up Manc Arena being imported by MI6. AND HE IS ONE OF THE SUPPOSEDLY EDUCATED ONES!
Or the third option, they may gain from it, i.e Rees Mogg, Tim whatsit from Weatherspoons and so on. Not exactly disengaged or idiots and they know full well what they are doing.
Are either of those saying "why don’t we just leave," then? Only, that's what I was referring to in your half-quote.
If they are, then I suppose I should add "or are deliberately misleading the gullible for personal gain," that should cover those two.
what would you then do?
I would dedicate my life to making sure that the people responsible suffer for their actions. The ones who voted for it mostly will anyway. I might teach them to spell schadenfreude, just for a laugh.
If anyone didn't see the link a few pages back to the Sir Ivan Rogers speech, it is well worth reading to see what a state we've got ourselves in. They've done us up like Ukippers, and it's all our own fault..
https://news.liverpool.ac.uk/2018/12/13/full-speech-sir-ivan-rogers-on-brexit/
Cougar I had a conversation on "Britex" with a work colleague the other night.
Fully believes no deal is better than a bad deal, they need us more than we need them and they will be begging for a deal if we leave. Also the slaughterhouse is full of Poles and nobody from the area can get a job. Cue child benefit going abroad. Oh and Germany are taking over Europe again.
To be honest I only vaguely bothered trying to argue, I mean what's even the point at this stage?
Beeb reporting a Corbyn tables a No Confidence motion
In the PM not the government though
An odd one tho - not no confidence in the government but no confidence in May. A new one on me and I am not sure what it will acheive other than further damaging her - and she is still the black knight - "tis merely a flesh wound"
It’s probably a truly devious Machiavellian piece of political manoeuvring...
Just read the Ivan Rogers piece, I'm even more depressed now.
This weekend my (racist) SIL commented that they should just hold a 2nd ref. As it'd be a landslide for Leave & my mum piped up that the EU have bullied May.... My wife shut me down before I ruined Xmas.
I can't see a sudden conversion to the kind of openness & honesty from May or the other Brexiters that is required to prevent the next 10 years of negotiations being a bigger screw up than the last 2.
Canada +++ is looking good right now- that involves us relocating to Canada or as far away from this sludgepit as possible.
It’s probably a truly devious Machiavellian piece of political manoeuvring…
Well the theory would be that we know there are 117 tories who share the view that they have no confidence in the PM, it wouldn't take many and all of this depends on how big they think this issue is and how long the current government has to run.
One MP interviewed (who had just been surprised by the announcement) managed a not vote against on "this" issue
He's still fence sitting by calling a VONC against her directly.. Probably not confident about a proper VONC.
That said, will the whole house vote in it now? Not just the tories? If so she's toast?
Maybe he's banking on a Brexiteer replacing her, in which case they can stage another VONC, this time against the Gov and probably win?
Tories do not even have to allow a vote on it or debate. Its a piece of political machination intended to weaken her further. If they do allow a vote then she loses. If they don't she is running scared and has lost the confidence of the commons.
A proper vote of confidence in the government needs to be after she loses the vote on the deal - only then does it have a chance of passing IMO and even then its slim to none.
Fully believes no deal is better than a bad deal, they need us more than we need them and they will be begging for a deal if we leave. Also the slaughterhouse is full of Poles and nobody from the area can get a job. Cue child benefit going abroad. Oh and Germany are taking over Europe again.
Sounds like we work in the same place. The gammons are up in arms about the shit deal, preferring no deal, and even the more moderate leavers think the deal is shit but still better than staying in the EU.
Just watching channel 4 news and the level of political *-wittery on display is truly staggering.
We’ve a hundred days to go before a potential economic catastrophe the likes of which this country has never seen.
I know... let’s kick it into the long grass and take a few weeks off, eh?
I’d say that it was *ing unbelievable, but it’s anything but.
Just another standard day in the Brexit shitshow
I'd love to be interviewing some of the **** wits now.
We have given your mental brexit ideas over 2 years of consideration - they are all SHIT!!!!!! All of them, they contradict each other, you can't agree on anything but yet you still want to be respected!
Voting on your shit house deals will be entirely fair, I actually like the idea of multiple non binding votes in parliament to hear some of the truly bat shit crazy stuff come out and be laughed out of town.
The only hope is that it depressingly veers this way and that until we can get to a point where intelligent and clear thinking can eventually find a way in. Somehow.
Brexiteers are looking down the barrels of a no deal scenario and thinking this is fine and what they actually wanted/voted for. These people should not be in charge of anything. No deal would be a car crash for the UK way beyond the current carnage.
The leavers clearly voted for something - a protest vote, a dislike of foreigners, a sense of despair and lack of 'control'. Their issue are real and need a response. They need a vision of the UK they can believe in. Fair enuff. But pitching the UK into a no deal nosedive won't do this. It's just bad decision making.
Scarily, I listened to a phone in this morning, and some of these tards seem to think no deal is basically the status quo.
Jesus wept.
Nice little revealing snippet there on channel 4 news.
That Brexit is referred to in Whitehall as ‘The Bonfire of the Sanity’s’
Funny, in a bleak ‘we’re all doomed’ kind of way. Imagine having to deal with this ****-wittery on a daily basis
Meanwhile, Jacob rich snob now has confidence in the PM after losing his own no confidence drive.
Anything to keep labour out I suppose, party before politics and all that.
https://news.sky.com/story/jacob-re...dence-after-winning-vote-of-tory-mps-11584302