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"Parliament will have a meaningful vote and to be clear there will be no hard Brexit, Anna Soubry says"
"Full details of the amendment to be tabled to the EU Withdrawal Bill will be published later, ahead of a 5pm deadline for debating it in the House of Lords on Monday."
If that’s true, did Brexit just die in all meaningful ways?
The MPs in Westminster can have as many votes as they want if there is no credible plan and the negotiations fail then hard Brexit will be the default.
this is not something that is just a UK choice there are 27 other players and at the moment we have no plans, no direction and no hope...
Seems to me the UK is going to end up accepting the four freedoms whilst technically being out of the EU. And most likely paying 90% of current contributions but without any say in making the rules.
^^^ if that's what may goes for there will be a coup in the tory party probably led by JRM
Seems to be about the sum of it!
Still, blue passports
May won't go for it but, as far as I understand it, if the government can't sort out a deal then parliament steps in and I think that's the most likely deal they'll end up with.
Of course, you'd hope someone would say, 'Maybe this is so stupid we should have another referendum just to make sure the country is still populated by idiots?'
I think if May cannot get a deal thru the most likely result is the government collapses and there will be a newelection. What happens then? Who knows. Hopefully a bit of sanity.
And it’s all fallen apart again.
Meanwhile back in the Lords...
Remember TJ that the government can falter but that the right of parliament to reject the deal and instruct any new government to ask for more time or retract A50 would still be there - if the amendment passes (and I believe the Lords have reintroduced it). How the rest of the EU would react is another (very interesting) question.
To those saying Corbyn is useless on this - he is facing the same issues in some ways as May - his party is divided badly and attempts to hold it together are failing. He whipped "abstain" on one amendment, and got a a rebellion both ways with some rebelling to vote yes and some no. So no position he takes can unite the party and any movement away fromn a middle ground wil create more rebels on the side he moves away from
May won’t go for it but, as far as I understand it, if the government can’t sort out a deal then parliament steps in and I think that’s the most likely deal they’ll end up with.
I'm suggesting there will be a coup if May lets this be the no deal recourse
What could a coup achieve? What would be the point? Do you think either party could give control to people proposing an actual deal/plan of any kind? It seems you can only lead by not leading at the moment.
And who in thier right mind would want to take on the responsibility of this groundhog style repeating shitstorm..
I don't think there will be any leadership challengers just yet...
And who in thier right mind would want to take on the responsibility of this groundhog style repeating shitstorm..
the no deal brexit wing of the tory party are anything but rational it's all ideology and dogma with them. I don't think think they will be sucessful btw
seems mute now, to hold off a rebellion from the brexit wing she's re alienated the remainers
"a house divided against itself cannot stand" comes to mind for some reason 🙂
Could Grieve be lining up a leadership bid? I mean, we're all just assuming that if May goes one of the lunatics will get the job.
Does anyone believe the commons would support no deal?
Does anyone believe the executive would be stupid enough to go for it without explicit commons support?
Then the rEU should simply refuse to negotiate in the full knowledge that either they will get everything they want or the UK will try to retract A50.
Brexit is lost either way.
And we should remember in this the Brexies who have tried to trash the UK. They are to blame and should be made to pay.
I’m suggesting there will be a coup if May lets this be the no deal recourse
Even if there's a Tory coup, it's still a party that's got plenty of remainer MPs
So no position he takes can unite the party and any movement away fromn a middle ground wil create more rebels on the side he moves away from
he's not in the middle ground, he's hard brexit but keeping as quiet as he can about it in the hope that as few people notice as possibe, but as time goes on everyone is starting to see his position, even though it was obvious from the start. His popularity is failing as people see how duplicitous he is.
He just says the same rubbish about keeping all the benefits of the customs union apart from the bits he doesn't want, like free movement, as the tories said originally but not saying how he would magically be more successful in his negotiations than this lot, where it is likely that he would be worse.
he doesn't need to say anything - he is not in government screwing it all up. Very unlikely he would do worse, you have seen the progress so far haven't you? (take your blinkers off and have a look)
he’s not in the middle ground, he’s hard brexit but keeping as quiet as he can about it in the hope that as few people notice as possibe, but as time goes on everyone is starting to see his position, even though it was obvious from the start. His popularity is failing as people see how duplicitous he is.
See, this is why you cannot win as a politican. He's said he's prepared to put his own ideas aside and work towards consensus. Which is pretty damn reasonable in my view. And yet you call it duplicity.
Very unlikely he would do worse, you have seen the progress so far haven’t you? (take your blinkers off and have a look)
in your opinion, not in mine.
Progress so far is in such a mess basically because of all the remainers trying to put obstacles in the way.
The only ways to force any sort of decent deal was to play hardball, we've seen what happens when people try to normally negotiate and we've seen what happened to Greece.
Remaining in the EEA or customs union is in no way leaving the EU, which is what people voted for, but the remainers refuse to accept the plainly obvious meaning of the referendum and the result. If we are going to be screwed over by the end result, it will be the half-wit remainers fault.
so no infighting in the government and Tory party ?
^ and that is why the country is completely ****ed. Too many utterly delusional fantasists prepared to vote for idiocy.
See, this is why you cannot win as a politican. He’s said he’s prepared to put his own ideas aside and work towards consensus. Which is pretty damn reasonable in my view. And yet you call it duplicity.
but do you beleive him based on his track record of misleading statements - I certainly don't and more and more people are noticing and hence labours support is dropping, which is quite an acheivement in these times.
^ and that is why the country is completely ****. Too many utterly delusional fantasists prepared to vote for idiocy.
take a look in the mirror...
Ask anyone who negotiates trade deals in business...
Turner guy we all have the right to fight for what we believe in, the reason that Mrs May is struggling to deliver the will of the people actually has more to do with business, civil service etc going hang on this is not a good thing for jobs/prosperity unless you believe Rees Mogg Tim "Wetherspoon" and a whole raft of people who have hugely benefited from the EU and now need a low regulation country to make more cash.
Don't look at remainers look at the sheer desperation and greed that drives the above people pushing for Brexit- they smell profit...
If you are sat in the same financial position as them then I understand your concerns...
You may struggle to find someone who negotiates trade deals- hens teeth etc
Progress so far is in such a mess basically because of all the remainers trying to put obstacles in the way.
Nope. This mess is 100% down to the Brexies. They set out to trash our country for ideological reasons bordering on religious fanaticism and what a surprise - they’re making a hash of it.
All the Brexies were ever good at was moaning and criticising - not so good at doing anything constructive.
And as an interesting aside, it bizarrely turns out remainers are more likely even now to take an optimistic view of Britain’s future than Brexies.
Progress so far is in such a mess basically because of all the remainers trying to put obstacles in the way.
Ahh… the "it would have been all okay, if it wasn't for those of you who warned it wouldn't be okay" line. One of my favourites.
So, which obstacles are you referring to? There are many, of course, but I'd be interested to know which ones you think have been constructed by "remainers".
Progress so far is in such a mess basically because of all the remainers trying to put obstacles in the way.
No it's because your mob couldn't organize a piss up in a brewery.
Remaining in the EEA or customs union is in no way leaving the EU, which is what people voted for, but the remainers refuse to accept the plainly obvious meaning of the referendum and the result.
Do leave off: the average voter hadn't even heard of the customs union before the vote.
If we are going to be screwed over by the end result, it will be the half-wit remainers fault.
You shit the bed. Don’t try blaming someone else..
"Remaining in the EEA or customs union is in no way leaving the EU, which is what people voted for, but the remainers refuse to accept the plainly obvious meaning of the referendum and the result"
What a load of tripe. It's you that's refusing to accept the meaning of the referendum and the result, you brass necked hypocrite.
Actually, why not tack on some more made up nonsense onto the referendum. "It wasn't just a vote to leave the EU, despite that being the only question, it was a vote to leave the EU, the EEA, the Customs Union, and a new bike for Northwind". Since we're making it up I can't see why only hard brexiteers are allowed to make things up. I mean, obviously that's the precedent but it's about time we had a go.
The obstacles are there. NO one put them there - they just are. Such little things as the GFA, The EU constitution and laws / rules. International treaties which we signed up to. That sort of obstacle.
A brewery you say!! Brexiteers had better get started with their hops, malt, sugar and yeast, as I like a beer and I have no wish to drink the muck they make in such far flung places as Belgium and Germany.
Apparently they make wine in Australia and South Africa, and Wetherspoons wishes to introduce us to them. Has anyone tried wine from these continents and are they better than the vinegar that passes as wine from France, Spain and Italy?
Brilliant turnerguy, as predicted on here way back you and your head banger mates are blaming us now what we told you would happen is happening.
Have a read back, it was all predicted. Absolutely ace. For what it’s worth i’m doing exactly what I said I would do which was sit back and watch you lot **** it up. Lol.
Apparently us remainers are putting our wallets before freedom.
They nutters are getting all their excuses ready.
It is an interesting narrative isn’t it? Blaming the messenger for pointing out reality. It is one I can see gaining traction amongst the delusional nut jobs who had no real idea about how Brexit would work when they voted for it. Perhaps that is what you get if you base your campaign on an emotional fiction in the first place and continually denigrate and disregard the facts.
If we are going to be screwed over by the end result, it will be the half-wit remainers fault.
In other news, those who won a divisive referendum with a slim margin see fit to demand that the rest of us simply get on and go along with it, notwithstanding the fact that the Leave camp had no cocking idea what it actually wanted, had no plan as to how to get there, bet the farm on the EU rolling over and doing our bidding and had not considered how difficult it might be to untangle ourselves from forty five years of shared supranational legislation.
I guess that I'd better accept my portion of the blame for these events, then.
I spoke with a Leave voter on the 24th of June who joyously proclaimed that there would be "no more bloody commissioners from bloody Bombay telling us all what to do" just as my employer launched a restructuring exercise to mitigate a loss of revenue from our EU partners.
We're completely screwed, aren't we?
We'll get through. No one will be thanking key Brexit campaigners though, as they disappear to other countries.
We’re completely screwed, aren’t we?
Yes. Realistically the only way out now is partition.
“no more bloody commissioners from bloody Bombay telling us all what to do”
Politics, Populist, population, populus, popularis, idiots.
That's exactly the point. The Leavers won the vote but have lost every single thing since.
It won't affect them of course. Lord Lawson will drift into his dotage in France, Arron Banks will decide that politics isn't for him and will follow his cash via Gibraltar, Tinkerbell Cocksnott will continue being a jobbing journalist at large, Farage will try his hand at presenting news shows on Fox or RT, Jacob Rees-Mogg and Priti Patel will continue to campaign hard for a return to 1953 and it's a safe bet that Boris, Liam, David and Michael will make a mint despite their congenital incompetence.
TG wins the internet with this comment
If we are going to be screwed over by the end result, it will be the half-wit remainers fault.
Coz it's definitely the fault of treasonous remainers & not the bullshitting Brexiiteers or the gammony fools that voted for brexit without checking to see if there was a plan for it first 😂😂😂
Apparently they make wine in Australia and South Africa, and Wetherspoons wishes to introduce us to them. Has anyone tried wine from these continents and are they better than the vinegar that passes as wine from France, Spain and Italy?
That depends entirely upon whether you judge wines from SA and Oz on the basis of the crap wine they export, or the good wine they keep 😉