[Closed] England, FIFA and Poppies.

I think FIFA have a point, its a political and national message beyond the remit of sport, this time it seems quite a reasonable exception but then they have to start deciding on every request and it all becomes a big political mess.

poppys are the thin end of the wedge. allow those then it will be unicef on shirts then sponsorship.

the players can wear the poppy on the training kit before hand which can be auctioned, that's good enough.

So Cameroon and the FA are trying to make it into a political "them and us" situation, just escalating the view to the rest of the world that we expect to be treated more equal than the rest.

If the FA really wanted to make a statement maybe they and the players could donate all profits/fees etc for the day to the legion.

I find it particularly distasteful that some government bod is claiming that 'Wearing a poppy is a display of national pride, just like wearing your country's football shirt.'
One shows respect for the fallen, one shows that you are either an international footballer, or haven't quite grown up yet (are the two mutually exclusive?). IMO, and that.

the game is on the 12th, so its not even relevant.

i support FIFA in this, the players can wear a poppy on the coach, warming up, on their tracksuit as a sub, the manager can wear one, the trainers can wear one, the stewards can wear one - if they individually chose to...

but leave the match kit alone.

I trust the FA is also making sure none of the players are wearing a crucifix?

Yeah as much as I think FIFA are a bunch of corrupt tossers I think it's a reasonable decision.

Can they wear black armbands?

If I were a club director I'd suggest every player walk onto the pitch wearing a poppy. If every player in every match in every league does it FIFA would soon back down, and if they fine the clubs/players, each player/club should donate the fine to the british legion. Let FIFA take every player in the British Leagues to court.

There's power in a union etc

Is the poppy a political symbol then?

If it isn't why can't they wear them?

I would say it isn't but I'm sure there are plenty of people out there who disagree.

Personally, I would have the team wear the poppies on their shirts and sort FIFA out afterwards. Whats the worse that can happen? Stop us from hosting a World Cup?

I'd rather not see John Terry wearing a poppy thank you.

Surely it is political. Fighting for your country is a political conviction as is dying for it. War is political.

this time it seems quite a reasonable exception but then they have to start deciding on every request and it all becomes a big political mess.

This, basically. I think FIFA's position is reasonable.

Its grandstanding by Cameron - pick a fight with someone and we will forget the mess he is making of running the country.

"Fighting for your country is a political conviction as is dying for it. "

The poppy is symbol of remembrance. Not a symbol of fighting.

I do not agree with the war in Afghanistan but I respect those who are willing to fight on behalf of a democracy. If the democracy is letting them down by sending them to fight unjust/illegal wars that is a separate issue.

The soldiers only go where the government sends them and we elect the government.

Wear the poppies and tell FIFA to fc!k off.

It may be grandstanding by Cameron as TJ suggests.

But Cameron is right.

The founders of Adidas and Puma were in the Nazi party, doesn't stop their badges adorning many an international countries shirt?

Oh I didnt know that I'll go out and buy an adidas tracksuit asap.

To remember the fallen that FOUGHT for this country.

Hugo Boss supplied uniforms to various parts of the Nazi Party.

Might explain why they were always so smartly turned out.

rats - If it's a political symbol, it is a symbol of political freedom and democracy. Surely something worth fighting for?

Freedom and democracy are worth fighting for if that is what is really the aim.

If we were really fighting for freedom and democracy during WWII in Europe, why did we allow Fascism to continue in Portugal and Spain for so long?

If the Boers were fighting for freedom from British rule in Africa can the British be seen as fighting against freedom and democracy in that war?

Were the British anti-democratic in the repression of the Irish struggle for freedom and democracy?

Just a couple of thoughts.

There was a bit about it on the news, no poppies on the shirts but on the jackets as the team comes out for the line up, there will be a minutes silence and representatives from the Army/Navy/RAF etc before the game starts.

Will wait and see how this plans out during the week.

Sounds like the 1936 Olympics to me.

If we were really fighting for freedom and democracy during WWII in Europe

If we were really fighting for freedom and democracy during WWII in Europe, why did we allow Fascism to continue in Portugal and Spain for so long?

because we weren't.

we fought ww1 and ww2 to attempt to stop germanic hegemony in europe. we might have had spurious notions of polish neutrality but we were more than happy to stop the war in germany and let the red army have poland.

the only country that fought an ideological war in the 20C was germany in the ussr.

rats - It gets all very subjective. 1 mans terrorist is anothers freedom fighter and all at.

Spain and Portugal did not project any significant power or influence after WW2. There is also the sanctity of the nation state.

The Boer war took place before there was true democracy in the UK, full womens suffrage was not granted until 1928, so you could argue we weren't a deomcracy until then.

The Irish problem is so complex and has so many different viewpoints that it's impossible to discuss on a forum. Although probably not the UKs finest hours.

Remember no democracy has ever gone to war against another. The system may be flawed but its the best choice out there.

It doesn't matter why we were fighting.

This is in remembrance of the men and women who have been killed, not the country's cause.

As for why we fought, I think the Sino-Russo war in the 1900s may give a few clues.

BTW the UK still doesn't have full democracy.

drop a load of the Haig fund poppies onto the pitch a few minutes before kick-off. From a Lancaster. The overpaid show-ponies will probably be quite good at throwing themselves to the floor and acting dead, in a 'resident of Leipzig' stylee.

+1 epicyclo

Here is The Daily Mash's take on this:

[url= http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/england-to-play-dressed-as-stormtroopers-201111074512/ ]Daily Mash[/url]

The overpaid show-ponies will probably be quite good at throwing themselves to the floor

To be fair, that's quite harsh. The RAF don't earn [i]that[/i] much.

The daily mash really is crap these days.

It's a complete non-story. If the FA is so keen on supporting the poppy appeal, then they can donate the ticket sales to the British Legion.

My idea was get the players to wear a poppy for warm up, and the match photo's. Then take them off , sign them , and give them to a mascot .
All signed poppies to be auctioned and profits given to RBL .
Sepp Blatter can have his minute of glory , and so can DC . Win. Win.

Just wear it and pay the fine afterwards - then embarrass FIFA into paying the fine to the RBL 😀

FIFA have allowed black arm bands with poppies on them. Just reported on 5LIVE.

Looks like the heartfelt letter from the president of the FA did the trick!

can we merge this with the "what have the royal family ever done for us" thread now... or should we give the credit to the EDL 😆

They've presumably kicked up a fuss about this, in an attempt to deflect attention from the fact that our captain for the night is likely to be an "almost" confirmed racist.

And as we're always banging on about racism in other countries we'll look rather stupid.

So what happens now, when Israel wants to wear some symbol to remember their dead who died defending peace in the middle east?

FIFA should have stuck to their rules.

So what happens now, when Israel wants to wear some symbol to remember their dead who died defending peace in the middle east?

FIFA should have stuck to their rules.

Could not have said it better.