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I’ll look forward to the mass roadblocks across all rural B roads then
I'm not sure why you think this needs to be the case. Your entire argument hinged around it being a huge operation and a huge use of resources.
The reality is a couple of cars targeting one pub that had a few reports for a couple of hours every now and then would be something of a deterrent for all but the committed drink driver - and be fairly light on resources.
There is always a middle ground between doing nothing and going scorched earth.
this is why cutting roads policing is counter-productive.
I'm all for going back to traffic cops on the roads instead of speed cameras. It would stop my mrs getting speeding fines and points. It would also help to catch the boy-racers who seem to get away with driving double the speed limit everywhere they go in their stupid pimped up cars. If you ask me that's a much higher priority for the cops to focus on than Mr 3 pints of bitter.
Another rural dweller here who can confirm it's pretty common around here too, nobody seems to give a shit. Not that I would do it myself of course.
One paticularly bad offender i.e. seven nights a week did get caught and banned following a police tip off from another local. Wish I could say the tip off was given out of a sense of public duty but it was infact out of spite, something to do with his wife and said drink driver.
I dare you to stand outside any pub in our valley and personally challenge anyone leaving who looks like they’re about to jump in their car to do the 10 minute drive up the hill. What do you think will happen?
I'd only do that with someone I know. And still have to do it with some regularity, I have some friends who become more convinced they can drive safely the more they drink. Drink makes idiots out of us... one of the reasons I like it, but you can't deny that has dangerous downsides. Well, I can't, you seem to be trying very hard to in this thread for some reason. Anyway, a stranger? No chance. I've always just left that to the police. This thread is making me realise that's a nonsensical approach... without reports, how are the police going to prioritise their limited resources?
We live in a small rural community, and word gets round quick. Honestly, you really don’t want to be known as the guy who calls the cops on casual drink drivers.
Ah, great... don't mess with the crims, eh?
(and round here the cops all know and hang out with the main offenders in any case)
You're making me want to watch Early Doors again.
After all domestic violence is widespread & notoriously difficult to stop. You give the impression that drink driving isn’t really important.
Not an extreme comparison either. A friend of mine was head of the domestic violence response unit for our area... the cross over between repeated obvious drink drivers and domestic abuse was marked.
Ah, great... don't mess with the crims, eh?
It's generally a good rule of thumb in a working class community where not everyone is a strait-laced church-going pillar of the community. Probably less of an issue down your way as it's a bit posher but up here at the top of the valley it's a bit more rough and ready. 🙂
Will, I can't, you seem to be trying very hard to in this thread for some reason.
Think I'm just more inclined to let people make their own decisions and deal with the consequences themselves. I have on occasion strongly recommended to a mate or two that they might want to get a taxi home, and I would probably step in if I thought they were completely incapable of getting themselves home safely, but I've never had to because in my experience the sort of person who is inclined to drive on the wrong side of the limit doesn't usually get that pissed (functioning alcoholics basically).
in my experience the sort of person who is inclined to drive on the wrong side of the limit doesn't usually get that pissed (functioning alcoholics basically)
Well, that's a complete misunderstanding of how accidents can be caused by intoxication. "Seeming" sober, so no slurring, basically holding down conversation and performing manually dexterous tasks as if sober, doesn't mean your awareness, reactions, judgement and proclivity to take risks aren't all seriously affected.
there was an experiment years ago on this with bus drivers. they were asked to set out cones as close together as they could and drive their bus thru it. Sober not an issue. After 1 pint ie below the limit half of them set the cones narrower than the bus.
alchol impairs skilled tasks and increases reaction time and decreases spatial awareness at below the legal limit but also removes your insight in to your impairment. A deadly combination.
I just remembered another time when local police went after a drink driver on a tip off - that was while I was working alongside the police. So yes - police do act on tipoffs on drunk drivers
I’ve been educated on this thread (seriously) “functioning alcoholic” is someone who hides the effects well.
It doesn’t mean someone who can still drive competently!!
Alcohol will still affect their judgment, reactions and reasoning.
No excuses, even if you live in the Uk version of the lawless Wild West. Report them.
A "functioning alcoholic" 3.5x over the limit at 11am on her way to work as a nurse in local hospital, killed a grandmother & injured her two grandchildren as they walked along the pavement in our village.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-11396438
A "functioning alcoholic" 3.5x over the limit at 11am on her way to work as a nurse in local hospital, killed a grandmother & injured her two grandchildren as they walked along the pavement in our village.
It's not important though apparently. People should be left to make their own decisions and live by them. It's none of our business if we see people doing this. It's not our job to try to prevent such tragic outcomes. You might upset some locals if you grass people like her up and anyhow, the police shouldn't waste their time responding to busy bodies who report people like her when there are "murderers" to catch. Apparently.
It doesn’t mean someone who can still drive competently!!
I didn't say it does. Of course it affects their ability to drive. What I'm saying is I'm not going to be the arbiter of that and I'm certainly not going to call the cops every time I witness poor decisions. I'd be calling the cops pretty much every day if I did that.
As another example, one of my mates always drives like she's on a racing track (German, not sure if that's anything to do with it), should I be grassing her up too? Or the mates who drive when tired or with a light out, or who don't give cyclists enough room? I understand the general principle of peer pressure to encourage good behaviour, but when it comes to driving the standard is so low if I intervened or called the cops every time I thought someone was impaired or driving dangerously I'd get myself in trouble or wouldn't have any mates left.
I somewhat envy everyone on here who seems to live in a perfect world where everything is black and white and right or wrong. It must be very comforting to know you can be the moral arbiter in any situation and stand on your pedestals passing judgement on all and sundry safe in the knowledge that you won't suffer any impacts from that. Here in the real world though many of us have to make compromises in order to live an easier life, and one of those is not calling the cops to snitch on anyone we think is breaking the law in whatever form it is we witness.
Dazh - you are either part of the solution or you are a part of the problem. there is no neutrality on this.
would you not report someone waving a gun around in public?
You are not being an arbiter - you are reporting a potential crime. The police will be the arbiters
would you not report someone waving a gun around in public?
This is getting silly now.
You are not being an arbiter - you are reporting a potential crime. The police will be the arbiters
I'm sure the Stasi probably said something like that in East Germany.
“functioning alcoholic” is someone who hides the effects well.
Point of order. A functioning alcoholic isn't someone who hides the effects, it's someone who can still operate fairly normally in their lives despite their alcohol consumption. I'm not saying that should extend to driving, it clearly shouldn't, but in reality it is a factor which some people might consider when deciding whether to drive or not after consuming 3 pints.
there is no neutrality on this.
If everyone took your view the cops would need to open a few call centres and provide a separate hotline dedicated to reporting 2 or 3 pint drivers. Thankfully the vast majority of people aren't like you and don't have this weird police state mentality where we're all snitching on each other and having to endure road blocks and surveillance everywhere we go.
Whilst there is no legal requirement to report a crime, there is a moral duty on everyone of us to report to the police any crime or anything we suspect may be a crime.
https://www.askthe.police.uk/faq/?id=643d6d10-2a4d-ec11-8f8e-000d3ad556e5
there is a moral duty on everyone of us to report to the police any crime or anything we suspect may be a crime.
Any crime? Christ TJ, you must have an open telephone line to the cops. Maybe you need your own radio?
Funny though, cos the cops themselves obviously ignore their own advice. Like I said, most of us live in the real world..
So, a functioning alcoholic can do anything except drive?
Whilst there is no legal requirement to report a crime, there is a moral duty on everyone of us to report to the police any crime or anything we suspect may be a crime.
Remember ‘Crimestoppers’? The ‘hotline’ for reporting crimes anonymously?
They packed it in because the only people ringing it were rival drug dealers trying to get each other busted
Absolutely not condoning it but I agree with the other rural dwellers that this is way more common than most urban people think. I used to have a job that involved visiting farms and most of them have a car/4x4 somewhere with smashed up bumpers ect that had been driven back from the pub one too many times. One farm in particular had 5 smashed up Isuzu Troopers parked behind the barn that the old Farmer had crashed while pissed.One of the problems is that they all know each other and so stuff doesn't get reported ( they just phone them in the morning eg "Hi Bert! Look .sorry but I knocked some of your wall down last night on my way home from the pub. Do you want me to ring for a dry stone waller to put it right or shall we just call it even after your lad smashed my gatepost last week?") There are certain roads around here that it is wise not to be on when it's chucking out time.
there is a moral duty on everyone of us to report to the police any crime or anything we suspect may be a crime.
Don't be silly. I have no qualms reporting a potential crime which might result in the death of an innocent person but I would certainly not report my neighbour if I knew that their car tax had expired!
In fact I would question the moral compass of anyone who did!
In very simple terms I would not report any crime which I could see myself committing. That probably automatically excludes quite a lot! 😂
Let he who has never sinned cast the first stone and all that.
Well done OP. Along with drunk drivers, those who see this as snitching need to look carefully at themselves. If the law says something that is right. Don't like it? Don't live in our society or do something about it in a socially acceptable manner. Those who object to this obviously have low moral standards and care little for society. Every crime costs something to some body. I assume that by not objecting to car tax avoidance the OP never ever complains about lack of government funding for anything. Of course this is STW, home of hypocrisy. I would make it a crime not to report a crime.
I was just thinking we haven't had a Peak STW thread in a while.
When I lived on a peninsula accessible by ferry the guys working the ferry used to call the pubs to say if the police where on the way. It took them 40 minutes to reach our pub so time for another pint. Best to avoid the roads at closing time but there was no last orders only last man standing time. I used to stagger home on my wobbly feet but driving was perfectly normal.
I would make it a crime not to report a crime.
Trump approves of this.
Think I'm just more inclined to let people make their own decisions and deal with the consequences themselves
Hang about. Am I missing some context here?
Because the consequences of drink driving don't just affect the guy who made the decision to drink drive..you understand that right?
If you have a mate who is getting into his car over the limit and you take that attitude and say nothing, you are very much part of the problem
The problem with making it a crime not to report a crime is that you would never be off the 'phone!
Speeding driver? report!
Fouling dog? Report!
Smell weed? report!
Someone using mobile when driving? Report!
there is a moral duty on everyone of us to report to the police any crime or anything we suspect may be a crime.
Any crime? Christ TJ, you must have an open telephone line to the cops. Maybe you need your own radio?
Funny though, cos the cops themselves obviously ignore their own advice. Like I said, most of us live in the real world..
direct from the ask the police website
Remember that just because something is a crime does not make the law a moral one. Eg The bloke who reported where Anne Frank's family was hiding was just being a fine law abiding citizen.A modern equivalent would be would you report someone who had sympathies for Palestine Action? ( a proscribed terrorist organisation). Don't get me wrong the Drink driving law IS a moral law and no right thinking person would have any problem with it being a criminal offence but the whole "make it a crime not to report a crime" has very bad overtones.
Remember ‘Crimestoppers’? The ‘hotline’ for reporting crimes anonymously?
They packed it in
Someone forgot to tell them. Perhaps you should tell them, if its not snitching?
Going back to drinking and driving in rural areas. Unfortunately Tony Parsons is one of them who found out the hard way that the locals had a habit of doing so. His family then suffered for several more years not knowing what had happened.
The problem with making it a crime not to report a crime is that you would never be off the 'phone!
How many layers of not reporting the crime of not reporting the crime do we go? It's a fascists wet dream.
The problem with making it a crime not to report a crime is that you would never be off the 'phone!
Speeding driver? report!
Fouling dog? Report!
Smell weed? report!
Someone using mobile when driving? Report!
Well 2 of those, whilst a bit antisocial don't really lead to a potential child's death, so I'm not going to dob someone in for them. That said I've often challenged someone who hasn't picked up their dog xxxx
Speeding drivers, well unless I have a speed camera that's not going to really work is it
If I saw some entitled prick on their mobile phone whilst driving and had the opportunity to film it (unlikely given id either be driving myself or if not they'd be past me before I could have the chance) then yeah I absolutely would
One of our cycling club members was killed by a woman on her mobile phone, so I'd do it without hesitation
I was just thinking we haven't had a Peak STW thread in a while.
As if to prove your point, we’re comparing drink drivers to Anne Frank now.
Someone using mobile when driving? Report!
Right up there with drink driving in its very real potential to kill other road users. I'm pretty surprised a cyclist would put that in the same category as dog fouling ffs! If I had decent dash cam footage of some knob doing this, I'd upload it to Operation snap without hesitation. Yeah, yeah stasi, self righteous, whatever. I'd give zero f***s about anyone accusing me of those for doing it either.
Wow, this thread is a bit all over the shop.
All I will say is that I live in a rural area and often ride on county roads in the night.
The driving here is always pretty awful but it gets worse later at night. It’s not as bad as it used to be a chuckin out time but I’m quite happy of someone takes action to reduce the chance of me sharing the road with a pissed driver.
Well at least this thread has shown who was bullied at school but too short to join the police 😂
Did you not read the rest of the post? The point was that making it a crime not to report a crime can lead to some dark places.I was just thinking we haven't had a Peak STW thread in a while.
As if to prove your point, we’re comparing drink drivers to Anne Frank now.
I live in a fairly rural area (of Scotland, if that makes a difference) and the amount of drunk driving has reduced significantly over the years. So much so that many rural pubs have closed over the past 40 or so years. These are the pubs you'd often see more city folk in at the weekends.
I think the reduced limits has an effect. I know many folk would have previously considered a couple of pints as no big deal. I just don't see that these days. Folk either make other arrangements, go AF, or just don't go to the pub.
Speeding driver? report!
Fouling dog? Report!
Smell weed? report!
Someone using mobile when driving? Report!
Do people on here (and kaiser TJ in particular) seriously want to live in a society where everyone's snitching on eachother all the time for every single misdemeanor and transgression? I can't think of anything worse to be honest and I'm glad I live in the real world rather than this weird moralistic and authoritarian STW version of it.
Right up there with drink driving in its very real potential to kill other road users.
Much worse than drinking 3 pints IMO. What's TJ's solution to this? More road blocks? Thrashing people who've been caught at the side of the road? Chopping their texting fingers off?
Well at least this thread has shown who was bullied at school but too short to join the police 😂
I'm sure you are probably an alright person in real life, but you don't half come across as a bit of a c### on here
Yes but you would have to do it EVERY time you saw it ( I've just got back from my break and on my short walk along the road saw 9 people on their mobiles whilst driving.Do I take a notebook and jot all their registrations down and report them all together when I got back to work? Or do I ring the police separately for each one? Remember you don't need evidence to report a crime (that's the investigating Officer's job) so you would also have to report every speeding driver you see (speed camera or not).The problem with making it a crime not to report a crime is that you would never be off the 'phone!
Speeding driver? report!
Fouling dog?
Smell weed? report!
Someone using mobile when driving? Report!
Well 2 of those, whilst a bit antisocial don't really lead to a potential child's death, so I'm not going to dob someone in for them. That said I've often challenged someone who hasn't picked up their dog xxxx
Speeding drivers, well unless I have a speed camera that's not going to really work is it
If I saw some entitled prick on their mobile phone whilst driving and had the opportunity to film it (unlikely given id either be driving myself or if not they'd be past me before I could have the chance) then yeah I absolutely would
One of our cycling club members was killed by a woman on her mobile phone, so I'd do it without hesitation
whilst drink drive rules (and just as importantly attitudes to it) must have had an effect it’s probably not the whole picture. Staff costs, energy bills, duty etc have all pushed the price of a pint up quite a lot - which means that popping down the pub is a financial commitment whilst finding and retaining staff in rural areas to work unsocial hours, potentially seasonally, is particularly hard. Attitudes to drink have changed and so more of us expect food - which means more staff… and gen Z have come along with their new ideas and 20-25% of them don’t drink at all…I live in a fairly rural area (of Scotland, if that makes a difference) and the amount of drunk driving has reduced significantly over the years. So much so that many rural pubs have closed over the past 40 or so years. These are the pubs you'd often see more city folk in at the weekends.
I think the reduced limits has an effect. I know many folk would have previously considered a couple of pints as no big deal. I just don't see that these days. Folk either make other arrangements, go AF, or just don't go to the pub.