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Junkyard, sorry, but most people would expect you to have a dog on a lead in some cases - I think it's reasonable behaviour to have a dog trained to walk on a lead when taking her through places where the owners put up a sign asking me politely to keep the dog on a lead.
You may say that your dog was under this hypnotic state of obedience when walking with you and that under no circumstances would he/she leave your side (well, you didn't say this bit, but I'm paraphrasing). You may say it all you like, but I can't believe it. There are too many variables involved with a dog - even the best trained. Mind you, anybody that trains a dog that well normally does lead training as well. But you didn't. Strange that.
+1 for Stanley, lovely looking dog.
well, you didn't say this bit, but I'm paraphrasing BADLY for troll or comedy effect
FTFY
What differences does it make it seems I am wrong in law though some stuff I have quickly googles still just says under control for the countryside code.
I said earlier it depends on the dog and the scenario I have owned dogs I would not let of the lead as they were not under my hypnotic powers. I assume even you can accept the controversial point that some dogs behave better than others and that I may have owned one of the better behaved ones.
She used to walk that close to me if stopped she just hit the back of my legs and she used to bob her head from side to side to miss my kness .. I could see this in the shadows God I miss that dog 😥
It's not just livestock. some muppet let a dog off a lead which get into our nighbour's garden. neighbour was looking after our chickens, two of which were killed. pretty upsetting for the neighbour having to clean up a load of blood and guts in her own garden as well as tell us that two of our pets had died whilst in her care. still, i'm sure the dog-owning fkwit will tell anyone his vermin were "under close control" and they're "really cute"
there'll be some poison getting laid out, and maybe a steak or two
i'm sure the dog-owning fkwit will tell anyone his vermin were "under close control" and they're "really cute" there'll be some poison getting laid out, and maybe a steak or two
Strange dog behaviour. If the neighbour identified the dogs then a call to the police would be in order. Killing the dog just for being a dog is utterly ridiculous; punish the owner instead.
Thanks for the FTFY Junkyard. As ever though, you knew what you I was trying to say.
I assume even you can accept the controversial point that some dogs behave better than others
Indeed I can accept that, because it's not in the slightest bit controversial.
We can bat it back and forth - I'm simply saying that there are cases where you should have your dog on a lead - whether that's correct "in the law" or not is bollocks to me - it's not like you're breaking the law by not having it on a lead, you're just being a bit more reasonable than the law dictates - in some scenarios. But if it gives you strength to argue it here, then bully for you.
she just hit the back of my legs
The more I hear about this dog, the less I believe you though 😉
back on topic
Killing the dog just for being a dog is utterly ridiculous;
does this apply when they are worrying sheep?
not bothered whether you think I am lying or not tbh this thread has just made me realise how much I miss her.
not bothered whether you think I am lying or not tbh this thread has just made me realise how much I miss her.
🙁
Sorry fella. I know the feeling. It's shit when they're gone.
Still, it was aliens that killed the sheep. They do it all the time.
Sorry fella. I know the feeling. It's shit when they're gone.
I'm sure her lambs live on.
They will have their revenge 😉
[url= http://static.zooomr.com/images/9787883_63b78882ff_o.jp g" target="_blank">
does this apply when they are worrying sheep?
Clearly not according to the law, but I think it should
The farmer keeps sheep purely for economic purposes - to breed, to crop wool, or to sell for meat. They certainly don't keep them for fun; though there are people who do this, these people tend not to keep guns, so they don't really enter this argument.
So for the farmer, what they're really concerned about is loss of profit. Effectively they're not worried about Fluffy-Wuffy the ickle baby lamb, they're worried about the £300 they're losing. And rightly so.
So I'd be in favour of fining dog owners heavily if their animal killed a lamb, or indeed even attacked them. But to shoot a dog for this? I suppose if you can't track the owner, there's a lot of damage etc, then there may be no choice. But there are any number of cases where a farmer has shot a dog in full view of the owner, which gains the farmer nothing other than allowing them to prove how tough they are.
Sue me for your economic loss, fine me for your time wasted......not an issue. But, as I said at the start, don't touch my dog.
I wonder what TJ would say on the matter?
Our Molly goes nuts when she sees a kid - just wants to say hello all the time but she's just a four month old ultra-cutey BT at the moment - so everyone loves her and wants to say hello. Thankfully the nipping is gone now, it's just lick, lick, lick So we're stuck trying to discourage "jumping up" for the reasons above - i.e. one day, she'd end up doing it to someone who really doesn't want it, but Even other dog owners say "Oh it's ok, I don't mind" when we say to them not to greet her until she has four feet on the ground FFS. A week of training gets undone in one afternoon in the park
Happened to me last year.
Riding home along the canal and came upon a chap with two dogs. Slowed down & shouted ahead so he could catch them etc, thanked him as i passed & rode off. Heard shouting behind me & the young chocolate lab was running happily after me. Not wanting the owner to potentially lose his dog i stopped & the dog ran up and jumped up at me. I petted her and stroked her ears, lovely dog. Bloke ran up shouting "No! No!" and i wondered what was going on..
Poor bloke told me he'd been training her not to jump up at people 😳
But, as I said at the start, don't touch my dog.
So it's ok for your animals to kill someone elses, regardless of why they keep them - for profit, enjoyment or to prop up their feeble little egos?
My father in law was a farmer til he retired. He shot 2 of his own dogs for going native (in a pack) with stock. This included the one my wife grew up with / knew as a pet. It bothered him but he didnt hesitate apparently. He also shoots other's dogs (which I've had the misfortune of witnessing) if they cause bother to his animals.
His last dog was killed after an attack from 3 neighbours dogs. None of them survived the week (nothing to do with him - just what happens out his way).
I dont have a dog but if I did it would be on lead anywhere near livestock - especially his.
But there are any number of cases where a farmer has shot a dog in full view of the owner, which gains the farmer nothing other than allowing them to prove how tough they are
...and stops the dog attacking any of the other sheep it has not yet "worried"?
You're right nick that most farmers are in it for the (little) profit. However that profit margin is eroded when their assets have to be replaced. One sheep gets mauled, dog gets shot, farmer has to replace one sheep, maybe even takes the hit rather than messing around with the paperwork of fining the owner. One sheep gets mauled, farmer decides to leave dog and fine owner instead, dog carries on mauling sheep, farmer's bill getting bigger and bigger, owner less likely to pay fine, courts need to get involved and so on and so on.
All this hypothetical tooing and froing about what is the right thing for the farmer to do would be avoided if dog owners put their dog on a lead, but we're not going to agree on that, are we?
A local farmer when I was about 15 threatened to shoot my dog and waved his shot gun in our general direction even though the dog was on a lead. He never did it again after a few people had a quiet word.
I can also report that if a farmer shot my dog I would be very tempted to rip his head off, however its very unlikely to ever happen as I'm a responsible dog owner
if a dog is off a lead on private land where it poses a threat to livestock the farmer has ever right to shoot it ive had i happen a few times with stray lurcher's on my land theres no excuse for dogs to be out of control running about killing livestock
taka, very true. As I have said in this type of thread before the vast majority of farmers I know would not shoot a dog unless it was a repeat offender or they had no choice.
Oh and you shouldnt confuse a code with a law
I believe my dog can walk past sheep and cahs and not bother them (she has done this in the past when encountered unexpectedly). I'm really pretty sure about this. I cant guarantee it though. So she goes on the lead. I'm happier knowing there is no risk, and because of that she is happier.
So I'd be in favour of fining dog owners heavily if their animal killed a lamb, or indeed even attacked them. But to shoot a dog for this? I suppose if you can't track the owner, there's a lot of damage etc, then there may be no choice. But there are any number of cases where a farmer has shot a dog in full view of the owner, which gains the farmer nothing other than allowing them to prove how tough they are.
I would suggest they have every right to shoot your dog [b]and[/b] sue for economic loss. That's if they could find you, as dog owners never do a runner do they
http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/news/8158106.Dog_attack_victim_speaks_out/
http://www.echo-news.co.uk/news/8312171.Owner___s_horror_as_another_Staffie_attacks_dog_in_park/
etc, etc, etc
and of course the best one (but not for the victimn or family, hope she recovers fully) even a professional can't keep control of their dog
http://www.****/news/article-1263932/Girl-4-attacked-police-dog-plays-park.html
what an excellent and well developed sense of empathy your dog has ...you are very lucky
I'm happier knowing there is no risk, and because of that she is happier.
I know junkyard, most dogs have no idea how their owner is feeling. 🙄
Haven't read the whole thread so may be repeating what has already been said - as a dog owner myself this kinda thing is completly unacceptable. If my dog killed livestock like this then I would fully expect the worst from the farmer. That is why my dog is never off-leash around sheep, cows and horses. Whilst he is extremely obedient and comes immediatly when called, i just don't risk it. Not sure he would be capable of something like that though, he would chase them and piss them off at most - which is still completly unacceptable.
I would be very tempted to rip his head off
good luck with that, i should imagine its very hard to rip another humans head off.
It is absolutely beyond my ability to resist trolling this thread:
Blimey, that's pretty horrific, and no way for a dog to be allowed to behave, however, if you honestly believe that the commercial use of animals doesn't see far greater cruelty, suffering and subjective horror on a minute-by-minute basis then you are, in my sub-bridge-dwelling view, rather tragically deluded.
dandelionandmurdoch - Member
It is absolutely beyond my ability to resist trolling this thread:Blimey, that's pretty horrific, and no way for a dog to be allowed to behave, however, if you honestly believe that the commercial use of animals doesn't see far greater cruelty, suffering and subjective horror on a minute-by-minute basis then you are, in my sub-bridge-dwelling view, rather tragically deluded.
POSTED 11 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST
Have you ever been on a farm an seen the living conditions of the animals right through to the slaughter process? there are a very small number of farms where the animals are kept in cruel conditions and there mainly in america because of consumer demand.
Steve-Austin - Member
"good luck with that, i should imagine its very hard to rip another humans head off."
It is, that's why I was practicing on that sheep
Have you ever been on a farm an seen the living conditions of the animals
Oh yes.
right through to the slaughter process?
Admittedly, no.
I certainly saw enough, at different farms, to marvel at the industrious of it. Even on rather small-scale farms the animals are kept in the most efficient way possible - which is more often than not not the most humane, comfortable and stimulating manner the animals could live in.
Even having seen these farms, we need to remember that most of the animal products we consume come from far, far away, as our wallets demand. [s]You[/s] The animals get what you pay for - you don't pays a lot: they don't gets a lot, in the way of humane treatment.
Oh balls, this has got beyond mere trolling now! I'm sorry indeed for diverting the course of this thread, but I am simply unable to understand the killing of sentient things just to provide us with food.
are you a vegetable? 😆
What is this, twenty questions...? 😉
yeh you better be ready to be up all night 😉
I am simply unable to understand the killing of sentient things just to provide us with food
that last bit makes you sound like a vegetarian
Yeah but bacon tastes good. Pork chops taste good.
Mwhahahahaha, nope, not vegetarian, even 'worse'...
Now my bias is obvious, and we should perhaps leave it at that.
EDIT: and pigs have personality!
good luck with that, i should imagine its very hard to rip another humans head off."It is, that's why I was practicing on that sheep
😆 😆
The main reason farmers dont often shoot dogs is because it is easier to get compensation from most owners if you havent just shot their dog. That and most farmers like dogs too I suppose.
Gamekeepers are often a breed apart mind.
The world would be a better place if dog owners used leads to control their dogs when appropriate, and all children under about 16 were banned from restaurants.
I know junkyard, most dogs have no idea how their owner is feeling.
Your claim is a little more than suggesting it can tell how you feel apparently it can detect your inner states and be happy when you are happy as well. That would be impressive for a human never mind a dog.
You are anthropomorphising and giving the dog emotional/intuitive/empathetic abilities it does not have
anagallis_arvensis - MemberA local farmer when I was about 15 threatened to shoot my dog and waved his shot gun in our general direction
Most the farmers I have worked for in the past has never needed a gun to threaten anyone, their fists were leathal enough 😉
& yes I have had a 12 bore pointed up my nose by a hot headed farmer in the past, anagallis_arvensis I know how you felt, not funny at the time!
Only ever heard of one dog that has been shot by a farmer, tbh most farmers could not shoot the skin off a rice pudding let alone dispatch a dog cleanly!
Have in the past asked a dog owner to put a dog on a lead during the lambing season, never been a problem, dog owners seem to understand how the countryside works round these parts.
Foxes on the other hand! I have seen them eat a ewe from the inside out, while trying to give birth! Not nice!
and all children under about 16 were banned from restaurants.
Perhaps you should go and find your own exclusive restaurant late at night, so you won't be bothered by them. Or should we just stop feeding kids?
Mebbe you were joking though?
Mebbe you were joking though?
That was what counts for a subtle dig in D_J World at people who use the "won't somebody think of the children" approach as a blanket response to dogs in public places. Small children who run about restaurants screaming annoy the living crap out of me - I don't see poor parenting as any better than poor dog ownership (they both need pretty much the same skill set at the end of the day).
In practice, I don't regard a municipal park as an appropriate place to exercise a dog, whether on the lead or off. I wouldn't own a dog if I didn't live in an appropriate environment - we are fortunate to live across an access road from the 'countryside', so I can walk the dogs off the lead from our gate. They go on the lead near livestock, get called in when I see bikes or horses on the main trails, and the rest of the time they are off the lead but under control. I see all this as responsible dog ownership, but I don't consider it appropriate to allow other people's phobias, whether about dogs or anything else, to shape what the rest of us consider normal activity.
I also really like kids - so much so that I spend 3 nights a wee, and several weekends throughout the year, voluntarily working with other people's offspring. We also take the collies - kids and dogs are a great combo as long as they are both well socialised.
they both need pretty much the same skill set at the end of the day
apparently you cannot walk them inpublic on a lead nor rub their faces in their mess.. the social worker do gooders told me this
I don't regard a municipal park as an appropriate place to exercise a dog, whether on the lead or off
Don't see why not most dogs I see in parks are far better behaved than the kids I see in parks and they are all supervised by their owners