...it’s a tricky one.
Lets hear your thoughts, some of you may have even had one in the 60s/70s. I didn’t have one but certainly remember the dolls.
Any one fancy a jam sandwich!
Least tricky thing ever
Society has deemed them racist so go with that.
Can open, worms everywhere....
What on earth could be wrong with the term wog? It's pc gone mad, what next?
One of my earliest memories is being in hospital and the nurse taking away my golliwog, would have been mid to late sixties.
I wasn't racist, I was about four years old. I think they are racist now tho, not that its my opinion that matters.
As tricky things go, it’s not. But it is racist.
hth
Yes.
…it’s a tricky one.
No, it's not.
Glad we cleared that up, next question.
I would not generally determine my reaction on the majority reaction of well-meaning, white liberals, but rather that of the potentially-affected people themselves. And in the case of the golliwog, it is definitely seen as racist.
So, yes.
A golliwog to me is just a doll. They bear no resemblance to persons living or dead.
That's just me though. If people don't like them then fair enough; I haven't lost anything.
Born in the seventies, FWIW.
A golliwog to me is just a doll. They bear no resemblance to persons living or dead.That’s just me though. If people don’t like them then fair enough; I haven’t lost anything.
Born in the seventies, FWIW
Who do you think might see it as rude or offensive? Why might that be!
Who do you think might see it as rude or offensive? Why might that be!
As I tried to suggest, to me they don't resemble any human being, but if people view them as a caricature of people with an African background then I can accept that, so censure away.
My life is neither enhanced by their existence, nor detracted by their omission.
I always preferred floral gardens to the dolls anyway.
Puppets were a different matter however.
Banned by the Nazis weren't they?
When I was a child they were make believe creatures that lived in the woods in a noddy book. They did not represent people especially not any of the black people I knew (the were never repairing cars in the street for at start, mind you this appeared to be a national pastime for decades).
<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;">sometimes it seems adults push meaning on things that children don't see. That being said they are inappropriate for today</span>
Would anyone like to comment on the hideous white caricature I posted above...?
It's great, does anybody do it in doll form?
They are now deemed racist, I'm 42 and back in t day I and many others were ignorant as to what they seemingly represented. I lived in a town with a pub called the blacks head with a picture of a blackamoor hanging up outside the pub ffs. We even got to the point where a mixed race lad at school (he was half cast back then) was and still to this day is known as golli. He has no issue with it but I'm certain if i saw him now id call him by his real name.. Make of that what you will.
Yes, it's racist.
Once upon a time my brother and I sported matching golliwog jumpers knitted by my Mum, height of fashion.
Only people can be racist not things.
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12px; background-color: #eeeeee;">Only people can be racist not things</span>
you might want to re-think that,
@Wrightyson, having been there, he probably did have a problem with it, but was sick of the alternative.
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12px; background-color: #eeeeee;">My life is neither enhanced by their existence, nor detracted by their omission.</span>
agreed.
The may not of been intended to be racist but they became a symbol of racism.....not tricky is it.
see also swastica and the n word,
@nickc Go look up the definition of racism and ask yourself if that could be a property of an inanimate object. It can't. Like so many arguments this is down to sloppy use of language. What the golliwog is is offensive, not racist and that's an easy thing to decide: if people find it offensive then it's offensive.
I had one as a child and loved it, and still quite like them, current feelings probably influenced by childhood memories.
However I grew up in a largely white society, pretty isolated at that time, and, as far as I can remember, never saw a black person until my teens. I can see why they're considered racist, and am happy to go along with that opinion, but I don't think that I see them as 'black' or indeed of any race.
It’s not racist. It takes intent to be that, and a golliwog is a thing, not a person. To own, display or otherwise endorse Golliwog symbology is definitely racially insensitive, and may well be racist, depending on the intent.
I have one in my "memory" box.My Great-grandmother made it in 1970 and when I hold it, I'm sitting in her house ,over the road from the pit. My Great-Grandfather is cursing in his chair with a pipe and sometimes an accordion! They still had a tin bath and a wringer in the garden!
The doll was my friend & I loved it, so if anything,in a simple, subconscious way, it helped me be the broad minded citizen I am today. & not a racist bigot.
Needless to say, my son doesn't have one. Though he and his friends often fight for the Black fireman & workmen toys! Which happen to have better names than the one my Great-grandmother made.
It wasn't racist in the 1950s, but it has acquired that aura since, so it's a definite no no now.
Wog has been an offensive term for a long time. British officers from the prewar Indian army complained about the propensity of war service officers from the UK using it about Indian servicemen.
This is pretty poor trolling 🙂
For those that do not think that a golliwog doll is racist, would you take one to work and put it on your desk, and not expect to get fired? How about a picture of one on your T-Shirt?
Would you be embarrassed if a black colleague visited your home and noticed one on your shelf (didn't this happen on an episode of 'Extra's'?)
They are very widely considered (almost universally?) to be inappropriate, and have been since, what, at least the early-mid 1980's, if not well before. Is that enough to sway your judgement, or do you think you know better?
Reckon just about everyone here thinks it's racist. Some argument about the details. Best close the thread here otherwise we will end up with the usual STW fight in an empty room
No.
But not all 'the usual racists' haven't been on to have their say yet?
The issues with them are blatant. Anyone that needs to ask or hasn't worked it out by now has some race problems.
First person to use the term 'snowflake' (that one doesn't count) wins the internet
I'm wondering how many of the above posters "have black friends".
Fwiw, it's considered offensive, and to own or endorse one is considered an endorsement of racism, and brings question to your racial beliefs.
There is a historical content - see Senor Js post above - which transcends the line, but keep it locked away in company's so's not to cause offense.
It's easy for white people to say they're not offensive.
Only people can be racist not things
you might want to re-think that
Actually I think Spin makes a valid point.
see also swastica and the n word,
Same applies really. Both those can be used in a non-racist manner.
That said, gollywogs now have a widespread association (rightly or wrongly) with racism. It's a shame really, as kids we collected Robinson's badges and I'm pretty sure didn't associate them with "actual black people", as vinnyeh says. But we were kids then and this is an issue amongst adults. But because they may be considered offensive it's probably right they are largely consigned to history. Mind you I think if I was a black American I would be pretty pissed off about lawn jockeys.
is calling a white person snowflake racist? probably
Would i be offended if some called me snowflake? not really as there is no history of violence and hatred associated with this term.
'is calling a white person snowflake racist? probably
Would i be offended if some called me snowflake? not really as there is no history of violence and hatred associated with this term.'
Just to clarify (because I didn't even consider it), the term 'snowflake' has no racial connotation as far as I am aware. I was using it from the point of view of a bigoted trump supporter, who widely use the term to disparage anything they consider Liberal (or anything they disagree with). You have to be a special type of backwards hillbilly to use it without irony right now.
More rascist than the local morris troop who feel the need to "black up" like the B&W minstrels because it's "tradition" but not much
Given the term snowflake was coined by white folks abusing white folks it's going to be a stretch, especially as it's now been turned around to highlight those free speech loving haters can't take a tiny little bit of criticism.
Anyway the doll (or the presence of it without a serious context such as explained very well in a museum) is racist.
<span style="color: #444444; font-size: 12px; background-color: #eeeeee;">Same applies really. Both those can be used in a non-racist manner.</span>
would you wear either on a t shirt?
Supposing you saw a black child with a golliwog, woud that be considered racist? I'm not all that comfortable with the use of the n word by Richard Prior and Chris Rock either.
It's used extensively in films as well. Personally, I think if you want something to be truly beyond the pale, it has to be unaccaeptable to all parts of society, like use of the Swastika for instance.