[Closed] Do Not Discuss Your Will with Your Family?

Very very dodgy

That’s rather concerning.

Is it worth a call to the original company? Did they really call in the first place? Why would they get someone else to do the work if they’re perfectly capable themselves?

Bit of a red flag. Also that seems quite a lot for a will unless it's massively complicated.

sorry, but this sounds like a con to me, maybe not a big one , more a way to generate a nice quick bit of extra income. But i would be looking at the small print in great detail if you can get your hands on the t&c's

£650?!?! Holy crap. Robbers.

Seems a lot for a simple will, about 3 x what it should be for a simple will really.

What is the new law that meant they need a whole new will when they already had one.

What benefit would there be in not discussing it with the family.

Sounds very much there is something in the will they (the company) don’t want you to know about

(I would guess that the trust is administered by them, or a company related to them, and comes with some hefty fees for that “administration” )

If its for both of them and includes setting up the trust, it might be not too expensive. But I'd be feeling tingly about it. Should at least include you as executors, and the bit about being 'unrelated' company sounds very odd.

Sounds like a scam to me, ie, the phone call wasn't from the original company and the trust doesn't do what they say it does. I'm not aware of any recent laws affecting wills.

Also, if they've put money in a trust, it's not in their will (that's the point of a trust), so not discussing the will would be irrelevant.

The money would not have to be in trust to be distributed to blood relatives though You can write that into a normal will, so in the case of a divorce blood relatives receive monies and the ex doesnt. At leeast that what i think i put in mine , well i hope so.

Agree with above posts - you can get a simple will done for around £100 with a solicitor, although setting up a trust with the various exclusionary clauses is likely to cost more. It seems to me that the key reason for setting up the trust is to exclude any assets going to a spouse in the event of the death of the beneficiary, and could pass to one of the other beneficiaries or the beneficiaries children. It would be interesting to find out who is / are the trustee(s) of the trust, and if there is any expenses associated with managing and executing the trust fund.

I would be looking at the terms and conditions of the trust to see if this company is being paid to act as trustee and how much is being charged to do so. I think a conversation between you and your siblings and your parents would be a good start.

Have a read through this as it may be a reason and the bit about direct descendants

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/inheritance-tax-main-residence-nil-rate-band-and-the-existing-nil-rate-band/inheritance-tax-main-residence-nil-rate-band-and-the-existing-nil-rate-band

“do not discuss your will with your family at all”. A quick google suggests discuss end of life plans including wills is a good idea.

That's very worrying. It sounds like they've signed up to something weird.

My only remaining direct reletives are my dad and my nan and we (depressingly) talk about it a lot as these discussions need to take place for all our peace of minds.

That sounds well ****ing dodgy..

It sounds like a simple will split equally so...

Is there a get out clause?
They may have to create a new will.

Doesn't feel right.

Check out who the company is.
My MIL was scammed into putting her house etc. in to trust - it cost her several £k to do it and about the same to get out of it......

£650 is daylight robbery for a simple will. Can be about that for something with trusts tho. However, coupled with the "don't talk to your family" I'd be very suspicious.

I'd absolutely be a bit suspicious for sure op.

Something you really need to look into, just in case.

The change in the law about nil rate band for main residence left to descendants would reduce the need for a trust or changes to the will to benefit children.

Is this intended as some kind of care home fee dodge or IHT avoidance?

I'm sure the OP is getting onto this now, but I'd be more concerned about who the new trustees were, and what arrangements have been made for ongoing payments.

I insure will writers and so keep abreast of legislation etc. I’ve heard absolutely nothing about about changes that works require a re-draft and the going rate for a joint will is somewhere between £150-350 depending on complexity.

This sounds dodgy as all hell and I’d suggest your parents get a proper solicitor to look into the changes.

Most will writers I have spoken to actively encourage engagement with the beneficiaries.

Note one areas that the more unscrupulous will writers make a pretty penny is to make themselves the executors and then charge ‘interesting’ fees and expenses when they come to administer the will.

(fwiw I'm pretty sure we paid something like £500 for a will years and years ago. Gave it no thought at the time as my wife's a solicitor and I assumed she know more than me about this. But then she probably assumes I know stuff about my work.)

Anyway, posting to say that old folks hate to admit when they've been scammed, including to themselves. (They're a bit isolated, get flattered, persuaded they're doing the right thing for their family, part with money. Yes I've seen this happen to people who thought they were clued in falling for what's effectively a cold call.) It really gets at their self-worth/pride. And once it's happened once, there's a good chance they'll get targeted again. Things like 'suckers lists' do exist and scammers (which these may or may not be) can really get their hooks in. So to the OP I'd say be sensitive and keep an eye out.

I have just taken an exam in wills law and procedure so am quite up to date. At no stage were we ever told of anything that would require old wills to be re-drafted. Over the years the government have clamped down on schemes that enable the avoidance and evasion of inheritance tax but there is nothing recent that I am aware of.

The only reason not to discuss a proposed will with your family is if it likely to be contentious e.g. cutting them out of it and leaving everything to a donkey sanctuary.

On the face of it, I would be concerned.

Does the £650 include the creation of the trust for the inherited funds? That's a little more complex than a "simple will". I've previously been quoted up to £4k for creation of inheritance trusts for my children (I didn't proceed with that legal firm).

On your point around don't discuss with anyone, is that more about avoiding conflict with anyone who perhaps doesn't look likely to inherit as much as they expect?

G

Apparently the people who drafted them originally contacted them and said due to the changing law they should consider redrafting it. They then put them in touch with a new company.

Horseshit from start to finish. They've been done.

the woman said “do not discuss your will with your family at all”.

No doubt about it. No doubt at all.

I suggest they get competent advice on whatever it is they've signed, immediately.

At best they've been conned out of £650. Middling scenario is they've been done out of £650 and their estate will suffer more loss when the inevitable and sad day comes. At worst, their entire estate is at risk. This isn't one to leave "until we get round to it."

I just showed this thread to a riding buddy who works in trust and estate law. He reckons it's definitely a scam. Probably personal data from the original will writer was stolen / hacked and fraudsters have contacted your folks using that data claiming to be from the original will writers or affiliates. At best they've been fiddled for £650. At worst they may have signed their entire estate over to fraudsters. You need to get a competent solicitor to review what they've done and report to Action Fraud and the police if anything is amiss.

Thanks everyone. I'm very keen to find out who the trustees are and what the fees are.
IHT shouldn't be an issue - even with the house they don't have anywhere near enough money for that to be a consideration.

Yes we just paid c 300 for a fairly complex will with a home visit to witness.

Certain family members who suspect they may not be being treated fairly have kept copies of the original one, as that was the source of funds.

Check the new will writer is regulated in any way. A simple will is a solicitors bread and butter, 150 I think I paid.

I own a will company - www.will-probate.co.uk if you want to check us out - and I have a seat on the professional standards board of the Society of Will Writers where my brief is to deal with complaints against members.
There are lots of good reasons for using trusts in wills and the cost is not too much if there are trusts, land registry work etc involved in your parents case. For transparency we would charge £599 in a similar case.
The most recent change in the law that would have required some redrafting was in 2017 when the residential nil rate band came into force, meaning that some Wills that had discretionary trusts in them needed to be redrafted to ensure that the maximum relief from Inheritance Tax was being obtained. But that doesn't sound like it is what was being done in your case.
The big alarm bell sounds with the don't discuss this with your family line. It is the absolute opposite of what good advice should be. The more open you are about your end of life plans, the better the outcome for everyone when you pass away. We positively encourage family meetings where possible so that everyone is on the same page when it comes to the death of a parent.
I think that you are right to have some concerns, and if it were me I would be getting a copy off Mum and Dad just to see what has happened. If the company have named themselves as executors and trustees in the Will then I am afraid your parents have just written a blank cheque to the firm to administer the estate after their death.
If you can get a copy I would be happy to have a look FOC and let you know what has been done on their behalf. Just drop me a private message.
Sadly our industry is beset by issues with firms that are a bit iffy.

Bump in case this gets missed.  This looks like it might be real info., one of the joys of this place

Thanks NJA that's useful advice and matches up with what I've read elsewhere online. Will attempt to get a sensible conversation with my parents..