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andyl - Member[Pirelli P6000s] used to be standard fit on 306's in the 90's. They were generally referred to as "ditch finders"
They were meant to work better on heavier cars.
They didn't.
Winter tyres and summer tyres (swapping when appropriate) > cross climates.
Thread done.
Kryton you don’t need an AllRoad unless you want the very marginal increase in ground clearence. Just get a normal Quattro and try and avoid the RS temptation
@hot_fiat interesting post re the systems
I've got Crossclimates on a Prius. A very good compromise. Driven to France and Alps and they've been great. Much more grip in cold weather as well. Not a bad summer tyre either. I would have thought for most people in UK they're ideal rather than having two sets.
Better traction than a XC90 4x4 with summers.
*do they make anything with their original design of a torsen centre diff any more?
According to the Wikipedia page, anything with a longitudinally mounted engine still has some form of Torsen (or derivative) centre diff; so that'd be S4, RS4, etc.
Those with transverse engines (S3, RS3, etc) will have some form of Haldex system.
Apparently...
4 degrees, heavy rain and loads of standing water across dartmoor this morning. I tried really hard to upset these tyres but they were faultless.
Winter tyres and summer tyres (swapping when appropriate) > cross climates.
I don't think anyone's denying that. However, for a lot of the UK where temperate, damp weather is more of an issue than genuine cold 'winter' driving the CrossClimates make for a good year round tyre.
interesting clips. The CrossClimates I am getting tomorrow are however not winter tyres. So I will be going from a 4x4 with standard tyres to same 4x4 with CrossClimates. I hope the results are along the same lines though !
[i]"...the actual blocks of the tyre are flexible - they vibrate as the car is going along, allowing the snow to be shaken out."[/i]
Well I never.
Does any other company make a cross climate equivalent?
I'm relaxing in the warm glow of fitting proper winter tyres to both our cars - but I do around 100 miles a day and have really noticed the increased grip over the past week in some pretty shitty conditions across Scotland.
Does any other company make a cross climate equivalent?
Not yet AFAIK, but given their popularity it can only be a matter of time.
I don't think anyone's denying that. However, for a lot of the UK where temperate, damp weather is more of an issue than genuine cold 'winter' driving the CrossClimates make for a good year round tyre.
Winter tyres are NOT just designed for snow ploughing, they are designed for winter weather which ranges from increased wet roads (larger puddles), cold temperatures or snow.
They have tread which usually is designed to not only collect snow to aid grip but also dissipate water quickly when that snow becomes slush for example, hence the arrow like tread with no end to the channel to have channels to push that water out and away from the tyre.
For example what I have on my car -
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They have tread which usually is designed to not only collect snow to aid grip but also dissipate water quickly when that snow becomes slush for example, hence the arrow like tread with no end to the channel to have channels to push that water out and away from the tyre.
You mean like cross-climates do?
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My tyre man suggested Goodyear Vector as an alternative.
My tyre man suggested Goodyear Vector as an alternative.
Or Nokian All Weather, Vredestein Quatrac, etc, etc...
My tyre man suggested Goodyear Vector as an alternative.
Or Nokian All Weather, Vredestein Quatrac, etc, etc...
The sipes in cross climates are too big and sparse to make them an effective snow or ice traction tyre.
On an MTB the sipes allow the tread to mould around and into the terrain, on a winter tyre they’re there to squeegee away the tiny amounts of water that forms when the weight of the car presses down on the surface of the ice (it’s this bit you float on, just like a ski).
The sipes are there to present multiple sharp edges to grip the snow and also to stick the snow to the tyres because snow grips snow remarkably well.
You mean like cross-climates do?
Clearly missed the point.
Point being winter tyres are not just for snowy conditions they fit the typical UK weather bill but also the extremes of better than all season types.
^^^^ maybe the dozen or so snowy extreme days but surely not the dozen or so hot sunny extreme days ?
Point being winter tyres are not just for snowy conditions they fit the typical UK weather bill but also the extremes of better than all season types.
Cross-climates fit my extremes better than full winters.
But you know what they say, pick a tyre type and be a dick about it. 😉
well they are round, and black, and rubber 🙂
Brief spin around the back roads on way home from fitting, temp is about +1 deg and some icy patches remaining from this morning's icefest. Early days but definitely more grip than the 3mm tread Michelin Premacys that came off 🙂
Watched 2 of my and a taxi sliding all over the place on the black ice on my street this morning. I just drove out carefully - no drama
So Cross Climates work pretty well
Clearly missed the point.Point being winter tyres are not just for snowy conditions they fit the typical UK weather bill but also the extremes of better than all season types.
I don't think he did. But you carry on arguing that proper winter tyres are ultimately better in deep winter than a highly capable compromise tyre, which they are.
Does any other company make a cross climate equivalent?
Nokian Weatherproof. Slightly more of a winter bias.
Different range of tyre sizes too - I have weatherproofs because cross-climates don't come in the right size for my car.
My wife's car we swap summer and winter tyres, mine we use the all weathers. Both faring pretty well in ice and light snow this week.
Geniune question just interested in the mechanics... modern auto or manual - is it still a default to manual as a preference for driving in slippery conditions?
Most modern autos have a fairly sophisticated snow setting integrated with the TC and ESC algorithms however DSG gearboxes with their inherent slightly jerky takoff when manoevering at very low speeds might not be quite as effective as a modern torque converter auto. The old problems with pre-electronics torque converter autos are long gone I think. When was the last manual Range Rover built I wonder?
7 speed Audi RS dsg is fantastic and way better than manual. Just got out of the car after a sub freezing 500k drive over the juras. Currently enjoying a poo and christening the hotel room.
Mine is STronic and I have tried it in normal, Sport and manual. My limited testing suggests that normal auto works best in the snow. The cross climates have been great on our icy stuff the last few days.
@kryton good question. We never had any trouble with the auto in our 2006 A6 (tiptronic ?, had the paddles) ours was driven quite a lot in fairly deep snow in UK and in Alps
So... looking af getting some winters. Two questions before i commit bearing in mind im talking a UK winter here:
Steel or Alloy - steels obvously cheaper so other than looks is there any advantage to Alloys?
And more importantly mine is a run flat equipped car, and my run flat choice from Mr Winter Wheels is Conti TS830P. With the mild long range forcast of 5-11 degrees are these overkill and should i look at lesser snow capable non RF tyres with some kind of puncture kit or a 5th wheel in the boot?
Sorry for the q’s but ive no experience to call on.
Thanks.
I went from runflats to regular winters on second hand BMW alloys. I've a can of squirty stuff and an auto aid subscription if required.
Just consider the pressure sensing valves too.
I'm running Yokohama Winter runflats on steel wheels but only because I got a set with the car. I don't think I'll bother with full Winters again, I'll probably just get something like a Cross Climate for the alloys and forget about RFs altogether. Can of squirty stuff and recovery membership will do I reckon. Tyre choice is a lot more limited (and pricier) with RFs, plus none of the main factors will repair even minor punctures in them AFAIK.
Just consider the pressure sensing valves too.
Unless they've changed, RWD BMWs don't use pressure sensing valves, they detect changes in tyre diameter via the ABS sensors. I think Mini are the same.
Steels are slightly better - you can bash them straight when you slide into kerbs and the hammer-on balance weights aren't affected by the cold. I've always run alloys myself as second hand they're generally easier to pick up, and less likely to need refurbishing. I've had a couple of stick-on balance weights freeze off (water gets behind them) in very cold conditions. But this is rare.
I tend to run alloys because repainting steelies after every winter is a pain in the arse. I suspect you're a bit too much of a tart, Kryton, to be running rusty steelies on a BMW.
My 2 pence.
Forget the run flat part. Steel is just cheaper vs alloys no other pro. IMO you should factor in cost of steel plus “hub caps” so may not save that much vs simple alloys / second hand ? You might want to investigate changing wheel size for better tyre choice and ride comfort but can be complicated with abs etc. If you ask bmw they are just going to steer yountowards one of their options for £££
[quote=Kryton57 ]So... looking af getting some winters. Two questions before i commit bearing in mind im talking a UK winter here:
Steel or Alloy - steels obvously cheaper so other than looks is there any advantage to Alloys?
And more importantly mine is a run flat equipped car, and my run flat choice from Mr Winter Wheels is Conti TS830P. With the mild long range forcast of 5-11 degrees are these overkill and should i look at lesser snow capable non RF tyres with some kind of puncture kit or a 5th wheel in the boot?
Sorry for the q’s but ive no experience to call on.
Thanks.
you live in the urban SE? just get some cross-climates, run them all year and forget about it.
I’d like to Jambo but weird BMW rear wheels size means they are not available.
I have the same problem Kryton on my mercedes so I've bought some second hand alloys off eBay that match the fronts, which are an easily available size.
I'll then be fitting 4x Goodyear 4 seasons G2 next week.
I paid £100 for the wheels and then £413 for the tyres in 225/45 R17. Worked out £30 cheaper for the Goodyear's versus cross climates plus I support the local Indy tyre place in town.
I’d like to Jambo but weird BMW rear wheels size means they are not available.
The 19"s that came off my car were staggered (8j front, 8.5j rears).
The 18"s that I've put on are all 8j ie all tyres are the same size.
I have CrossClimates on my T4, more for other peoples safety than my own 😀
(they were on offer and sufficiently load rated, and cheaper than most other branded options. Not sure I'll be trying them on an icy road unless I REALLY need too)
The 18"s that I've put on are all 8j ie all tyres are the same size.
Good plan. Seeing as I live in the sunny SE, the other option is just to go for something like a Rainsport or A rated Michelin - I wouldn't go out in the snow anyway and if there was an emergency we have the Kuga with All Seasons.
Got 4 Crossclimates on a 53 plate Vulva XC70 with quarter million miles and it is a grippy barge that can be thrown around.
Tires worth nearly as much as the cor
^^^ grippy barge 🙂
250k nice
The 18"s that I've put on are all 8j ie all tyres are the same size.
Or go smaller - 16 or 17.
Wheels and tyres will be considerably cheaper.
Picked up a set of 16s and got some Bridgestone winters for a little over 300
Do you have the tyre pressure monitors in the valves?
If so they can be expensive on another set of wheels.
If not, happy days - get on ebay and get some second hand alloys - they will be cheaper than new steels if you look hard enough and then get some suitable tyres from an online place. Tyre leader were pretty good for winters last time I looked (it is over 12 months ago though).
Or go smaller - 16 or 17.
Not always possible depending on brake size.
I can't go smaller than 18 as I'd never get it over the front brakes.