Is anyone else struggling to justify flying for pleasure in light of the overwhelming climate issues ? I’m starting to wonder if I can justify flying anymore and would love to hear other peoples thoughts.
Tbh no. I'm not flying because there's nowhere I really want or need to fly to.
But it's been 5 years since I last got on a plane.
Not me. Planning a month on west coast USA next year.
I can offset the CO2 for a very reasonable £30
Yes. I used to fly for work and I loved it. But now I can't justify it. Our company has also restricted it.
Yes and no. I've not flown anywhere since before Covid but had a once-in-a-lifetime holiday to Australia last month so I guess that's a couple of years worth of emissions in one fell swoop.
Not planning on any further trips - a mix of cost/hassle etc but also feeling slightly guilty at contributing to the problem.
I've dramatically reduced my driving as well (not that it was ever much to begin with) but things like day or weekend trips to the Lakes have been cut back a lot - again, partly cost but partly environmental considerations.
Not flown at all for 17 years now. Have one more set of flights planned in my lifetime, USA return trip… and then that’s it. Flying every year, never mind many times a year, seems like self indulgently laughing at the destruction of habitat, in my opinion. Different if you have loved ones that can only be reached by air, of course.
No plans to fly at the moment. My last flight was almost exactly 4 years ago - Glasgow/Barra for a few days. Previous was Spain, a couple of years before that. That would be my total for 10 or more years.
Yes, climate concerns do put me off.
I've reduced the amount of driving I do too.
I’ve swapped driving to the office ~200miles week for flying 500miles to an office once a month. No idea if it works out better but I prefer it.
I ain't getting on no plane fool.
Become a bone of contention with MrsMC. Getting to the point where kids are old enough that we could go abroad for now on our own, but while there are places it would be "nice" to visit, I'm not feeling a "need" to, and there are loads of places in the UK I'd sooner discover with a lower environmental impact. It's one of the reasons I haven't bothered renewing my passport, and she is not happy about it. (I will renew my passport this winter for ID purposes and maybe some Eurostar trips next year)
In a fit of STW type hypocrisy, I'm happy for my kids to do non-holiday foreign trips and fly to give them experience of countries and cultures that I've already had.
Was flying every other year pre-covid. You can't help but be aware of the huge amount of energy required to lift off and land, and the thought of however many thousands of people currently airborne is a bit weird.
Flew recently, to Italy. Enjoyed it. That'll do for a while.
*brings glass of milk for kayak23*
23 years since I last flew (though I was flying around 75 times a year with work never for pleasure) with no plans to ever fly again.
Not an issue for myself as I’ve only flown 3 times in my life for 6 month extended trips and haven’t flown since 2001, won’t be on a plane again.
I do have a log burner/multi fuel stove though and get through 2/3 bags of anthracite and a few bags of logs per week so I guess I’m still going to hell.
Yep defo. I used to do between 6 and 9 foreign holidays a year, every year until 2020. Not flown since then.
No passport for over ten years, causes problems as no photo driving licence either. Good, very good friends in California that we’ve visited a good few times, but, we decided that Britain was ok, plenty to see without flying, and we’ll keep in touch in other ways. Obviously not the physical ways but the best for our descendants.
Yes - it concerns me. Not in a keeps me awake at night kind of way but in a I'd feel like a selfish dick kind of way.
But whilst there are mugs with a bit of conscious that fall for*....
Not me. Planning a month on west coast USA next year.
I can offset the CO2 for a very reasonable £30https://ba.chooose.today/
/blockquote>and bellends like Mrs C's company owner that insta's her champagne quaffing business class weekly travels as some sort of status symbol....
my snowflake hand wringing comes to **** all.
* or is it just convenient to run with the carbon offset concept without thinking it through too hard to do the stuff you really want to do?
@somafunk where do you get anthracite from and why do you need to use it?
It's not the "climate change" element of flying that's cut down the number of flights I do, it's just that I find the whole process of "airports" so bloody un-pleasant.
Need to get there stupidly early
Traffic/Car parking regulations/Car parking charges (extortion)
Hire car cost
Queuing everywhere
Over-crowding everywhere
****s who recline seats and invade what little space the airline have reluctantly let me occupy
Lost luggage etc etc - the list is endless! 😠
Then having to do it all again one/two weeks later...
Pre covid we thought maybe we we would fly once a year as we can afford it now. That happened once. We will fly again including once to Australia where we have relatives. But it will be less than it might have been
But I really like my holidays abroad !! Theoretically, how many mature trees would you have to own to off-set say 1hr of flight time ?
where do you get anthracite from and why do you need to use it?
Coalman drops off 2 or 3 bags week depending on how much I use, I use it to keep warm, kinda strange question though?.
It’s not the “climate change” element of flying that’s cut down the number of flights I do, it’s just that I find the whole process of “airports” so bloody un-pleasant.
Definitely agree with this!
Haven't flown for almost 16 years, mainly the stress/agro of it all, then the passports expired nearly 10 years back. Aware of pollution at the time, but wasn't the critical factor.
We probably will fly again, my Mrs probably wants to see her parents a few more times before they die.
No.
I used to work in Latin America. When I came home in 1999 I decided to try not to fly; for climate reasons. Since then I have only flown to Belfast once for work.
I do get very ichy feet at times. Maybe I will take a flight across the Atlantic one day for a long trip where my overall impact would be less than living at home… (yes I know that is a little bit spurious but it keeps me happy dreaming) but I can’t justify flying for short holidays.
I find it kind of odd that some colleagues (I work in an organisation the whole purpose of which is env and sustainability) and friends are in denial about the impact of flying and the think I’m odd.
Never much enjoyed the process of flying.
Used to fly several times a year for work... Fly out check location, fly back. Fly out for the put in, fly back. Fly out a few days later for the takedown. Crazy. Got to the point where I would ask for the train to the location if it wasn't too much bother with changes and time.
Flew out to Split a few months back for a job and it just reminded me how much I dislike the process.
Recently took the train from Munich to London and back via Paris. Much nicer experience, only an hour or so longer door to door and 20€ more than flying. I get to sit and drink beer whilst watching the world go by. No constraints on what you can take weight wise.
Having said that I've left Munich and am going to have to rely on flying for work. Not proud of that.
I've a mate who flies to various sites across Europe, often taking a flight everyday of the week.
It's the business travel that really is the problem. A family going on their one foreign holiday a year not so much.
It’s definitely something I think about. I certainly wouldn’t take a long haul flight for a short holiday, seems totally unnecessary. Likewise I try to cut down on driving.
Carbon offsetting is snake oil
I haven't flown for a holiday for over 20 years and last time I flew for work was about 10 years ago. Not really through choice though (too many animals to go on holiday and work hasn't required it)
I wouldn't actually worry about it if I did want to fly as I wrote off the world doing anything to slow down climate change about 10 years ago and looks like I am being proved right. It now looks more definite than ever that the world will just have to deal with/live with the impact of it as it gets worse.
It’s the business travel that really is the problem.
I fly a lot for work, roughly 4000 km a month. Thinking about the principles of mass-transit and the drive to get more people out of cars and onto trains/buses, if split between ~200 people per flight then how does flying compare to my old job driving around in a van doing maybe 1500 km a month?
*brings glass of milk for kayak23*
I love it when a plan comes together...
I’ve flown for two trips since covid started and both have reminded me why I hate commercial airlines. The second trip (to the U.K. sadly) was not even on a budget airline, but was just a horrific cattlejam all the way there and back. That and the having to wait for immigration and security and the cost….
Prague still had the security and that, but the Schengen travel makes everything feel easier.
I do find it hard to justify trips by air though. There’s so much of Sweden I can get to by car or train that I have not seen yet that going to Europe is a bit excessive. A lot of people “have to” go somewhere sunny in winter here, but I’m fine with enjoying the skating and cross country skiing.
it’s just that I find the whole process of “airports” so bloody un-pleasant.
This is a fair point too - the anxiety of all that wrecked any short term breaks for me, but that my own weird head
Yes - personally I've not flown since 2015 (although wife and daughter have). Had every holiday in the UK since. Not 100% down to climate guilt, but it does make me think when ever the opportunity has risen to go abroad.
Aim to have a trip to Italy in the next 5 years or so, but nothing other than that - wife's family live in southern Spain and fly regularly back and forward to the uk replying heavily commercial air travel, we haven't visited them in Spain as a family in years, which is a big bone of contention.
Not really cutting down. I fly a reasonable amount for work (3 return flights to west coast USA a year at the front), a few European flights per year with the family doesn't make a huge dent in that. A European flight doesn't emit a huge amount of co2 compared to lots of other things we do so I'm comfortable with it
Yes. One of the reasons we went to Spain this summer was to take the ferry instead. One stopped any UK internal flights.
We're kicking around an autumn bike tour next October, and last night were looking at train options and therefore where we could go.
That said, I'm not totally against. My kids flew this year, I've staff today returning from Slovakia, yesterday from South Spain, and they had to fly because it was a couple of day, expensive option to take train.
Bring on the new ferry from Rosyth in 2023 I say...
I fly a reasonable amount for work (3 return flights to west coast USA a year at the front), a few European flights per year with the family doesn’t make a huge dent in that.
Wow I guess it depends on your opinion of what "reasonable" is - I'd say that's 3x to the US + over 2 family holidays abroad a year is excessive / unusual at the least.
One of the contestants on Strictly this year (so I'm told...obviously) flew to Mauritius for his brothers wedding. Was there 2.5 hours then flew back to carry on rehearsals.
It's more the sort of thing you'd keep quiet about nowadays rather than make a virtue of it as they did on the show the other night (so I'm told)
In a fit of STW type hypocrisy, I’m happy for my kids to do non-holiday foreign trips and fly to give them experience of countries and cultures that I’ve already had.
I have this as well. My kids are young but I would like them to travel as the point of view especially if via work where you are not a tourist really helps give a good perspective of many things and many moans people have about were they live etc.
I’ve a mate who flies to various sites across Europe, often taking a flight everyday of the week.
This is were the majority of air miles are I suspect and it's not what people think of people just going for meetings that they could do remotely. The number of specialist service engineers, fitters, installers heading off all over the place is massive. I am not sure how you fix this as specialists are by their nature not everywhere and this is doubly true when it comes to company specific equipment.
Wow I guess it depends on your opinion of what “reasonable” is – I’d say that’s 3x to the US + over 2 family holidays abroad a year is excessive / unusual at the least.
A few hoildays a year is a lot on a personal level but 3 work flights is not and these need to be separated.
My old job was ~2 return trips a month but I have only flown about 2 times over the last ten years for personal trips.
Climate issues are definitely something that would make me think hard about flying for leisure, along with the airport experience.
I've only flown for holidays (within Europe) 3 times in my 53 years and once to Australia for work. I have flown a good number of times (maybe 20?) between Shetland and Aberdeen or Edinburgh when i lived up there, but mainly for hospital trips. Even then after a while I decide the overnight ferry was less hassle. Also a similar number of inter-island flights up there for work.
Next year we plan to ferry to the Netherlands to bike tour (was cancelled due to covid). The flight I have in mind is to return to Norway at some point, but no idea when!
By contrast my daughter seems to fly on holiday 3-4 times a year without a second thought. Not sure how she affords it.
I had a colleague and friend in Shetland who was always hammering on about the climate crisis, peat habitat s, and co2, but regularly flew to Glasgow or London for concerts, had long haul holidays around the world, and a SUV despite living 15mins walk from the office 🤣
In short, we're **×*×*!
Agree with the OP, going back a decade or two I was mostly flying for work and tacking on a few days of holiday to make the most of the trip. Nowadays I don't really have that excuse, it's all holiday. Being a climate scientist, there is a bit of guilt involved...just had my first flight since the pandemic, a great trip but I do wonder how much I should be doing...
A few hoildays a year is a lot on a personal level but 3 work flights is not and these need to be separated.
A friend of mine, in his previous job, had to fly from the UK to Brazil once a month to do 3 days of work.
Out on Sunday night, back on Thursday morning. 12 times a year. 😳
On one level you hear about stuff like that and think "well **** it, my flight to Spain is nothing amongst all of that" although on another level I do wonder how anyone thinks that sending an employee across the Atlantic 12 times a year is an efficient use of time and resources?!
Last flew 5 years ago, won't be any more. Must've taken 80 flights over my lifetime, not hugely proud of that. Train or ferry to Europe is great, spent a month interrailing this year, may use ferry / train to Spain in the future.