I honestly have no idea, I can find no actual numbers - can you?It wasn’t much greater than zero, now, was it.
this is the quote from the ADLS which you might be alluding to:
which to me reads as if volunteers were present on RN commandeered ships even if only a small number were actually commanding & crewing their own vessels independently? An important nuance perhaps.The Boats were towed by tugs to Sheerness where they were fueled and checked over then taken to Ramsgate where Naval Officers, ratings and volunteers were boarded and directed to Dunkirk.
The majority of Vessels were requisitioned by the government, some were taken without the owners knowledge, a small percentage were taken over by owners themselves as they volunteered for the rescue mission.
I can’t quite figure out why there is still a requirement to mock the French since ooh, 500 years ago.
Neighbours innit? People from a neighbouring countries are often the butt of jokes, primarily because they are seen as rivals.
And Ref Dunkirk, it might well have been a surprisingly successful evacuation, which without doubt included many acts of individual heroism, but it was also without doubt a massive military setback.
The 2017 film Dunkirk, which I know has been criticised, paints a hopeless and very dark sombre picture, which I suspect is fairly realistic.
Obviously it was vitally important to create this 'Dunkirk Spirit' in the minds of a presumably increasingly demoralised nation, ie 'we will return'. But the rhetoric doesn't for obvious reasons really give credit to how disastrous the situation was.
Incidentally many years back I lived for a short while in Dunkirk, I remember seeing bits of masts and other bits of the boats/ships which never managed to leave the beach protruding from the sand when the tide went out, I always very moved by it. No idea if it still happens or if it's all corroded away.
Still visible, Ernie:
Try Googling "lefigaro epaves dynamo" for the article, I cant link it. (second result in my browser)
And for anyone who reads French or is capable of using Google translate:
An important nuance perhaps.
Honestly, I don't think it is, either way.
Yes it’s always been an endless source of fascination for me how “sod this for a game of soldiers, let’s leg it” should have become a proud moment on British history.
It was a case of 400,000 allies versus some 800,000 Germans. Sensible thing was to leave, and if they hadn't they would have likely been decimated/captured and we'd all be speaking German.
I suppose it was a proud moment. In that the military leadership learned from the terrible losses in WW1 and didn't fight on regardless.
My Grandad was at Dunkirk, Cant remember the actual regiment but part of the 51 Highland division, He was a corporal in transportation and made up part of the rear guard. Far as Im aware his unit didnt get out with the main group but a day afterwards.
then why mention it at all?! 🤔Honestly, I don’t think it is, either way.
Just thought it was interesting, is all. But hey, don't worry about it - you were absolutely right, I fully accept I was wrong and I retract whatever dull, uninteresting and inaccurate point I made that caused you to engage. 🙂
Still visible, Ernie:
Wow that's far more exposed than I remember. I guess sand moves considerably over time. What I remember seeing was quite a few individual craft poking out of the sand but not possible to work out their full size.
It was very moving to think of what had happened at the very spot I was standing on all those years previously.
As was visiting the Commonwealth graves near Dunkirk. Seeing stuff on TV never really gives the same insight into the horrors of war, and the senseless loss of life, as standing in the middle of a war cemetery surrounded by thousands of graves.
I once heard that the French & Italians were the only forces who had tanks with 1 forward gear & 4 reverse.
🤷♂️
sound more like British Army procurement at its finest.
The Soviets reckoned they weren't worth a sherman.
T-34s is what "tore the guts out of the Wehrmacht", to use Churchill's words
I can’t remember hearing that expression in the last decade and remember clearly who did use it back then, very much in character.
My French mate certainly calls me a rosbif on a regular basis 🙂
I once heard that the French & Italians were the only forces who had tanks with 1 forward gear & 4 reverse.
It was SOE propaganda spread about the Italians. Later it became about the French as well. It was never true for either. The first lie had a genuine wartime use. The second lie is just part of our collective pointless “it’s just a joke, no harm done” xenophobia towards the French. And it shouldn’t just be lived with, we as a nation should grow up when it comes to talking about the wars of the last century, and learn that the real lessons to take from them are nothing to do with turning our words and actions against our neighbours, quite the opposite.
It was never true for either.
Did you really feel it was necessary to point that out?
Edit : In other news Hitler really did only have one ball.
Although it's not known if Himmler had something similar.
Yes it’s always been an endless source of fascination for me how “sod this for a game of soldiers, let’s leg it” should have become a proud moment on British history.
Erhard Milch flew over the Dunkirk beaches after a very Happy Goering had let him know of the marvellous victory they'd had over the British. He asked the pilot of the plane where all the bodies were, when he was told what had happened he wrote in his diary later (I'm paraphrasing) "That's it, we're ****ed."
That's why it's such a victory. The Germans had one chance to really it done, and they had to open the Eastern front a full year earlier that they had intended, and most of the senior officers released that by late '41 (maybe early '42) it was all done for bar the shouting. Letting the B.E.F get away was the biggest mistake of the war.
Goring was always a right drama queen, look at the tantrum he threw over the Mosquitoes.
The small boats were being used to ferry troops to the larger boats that couldn't get close on shore. Once they started to use the Mole on Dunkirk beaches they didn't need the small fleet anymore. The vast vast majority of troops were evacuated by the RN not the small boat fleet. (and I think most of the losses amongst the small ships fleet were accidents
Interestingly, (or not) the Navy was so huge that they didn't even feel the need to send any capital ships to hep in Operation Dynamo. The largest ships was a Cruiser most were destroyers, and out of a fleet of 200 or so available, only about 40 were used for the entire evacuation, and the Navy lost (i think without checking) about ten or so...a teeny percentage of the fleet.
look at the tantrum he threw over the Mosquitoes.
To say nothing of the endless fancy uniforms soft boots (for his poor feet) and the eyeliner. 🙂
Ernie. Why do you enjoy being so rude?
Didn't realise that I was, my apologies.
Ah, okay, carry on then.
It was never true for either.
No shit Sherlock.
I 1st heard that when I was about 14, 51 years ago. Didn't believe it was true then either.
look at the tantrum he threw over the Mosquitoes.
In fairness considering the Germans strategy was based around schnellbombers it must have been rather irritating that the allies produced the best one despite generally preferring heavy bombers even without their rather unsubtle approach to jamming his broadcasts and that the wooden materials meant there was less competition for rare materials.
it must have been rather irritating that the allies produced the best one
And in a piano factory.
It's almost as if they were taking the piss!
