Hello,
The OH and I are looking at moving into the world of Van Ownership.
Does anyone know if any of the small vans (Connects, caddys, combi etc) qualify as Car Derived with <2 Tonnes, so therefore can use Car speed limits.
Seems a bit of a minefield when googling.
Hope is to use the van as sole vehicle/ bike carrier.
Jon
Look at the V5. Anything else is just guesswork and speculation.
If you want to find out more information about the design of your vehicle and whether your van is car-derived, you can check your log book and the description in the field ‘body type’. This will tell you how the vehicle has been classified by the manufacturer.
Thanks Scotroutes, problem with that is it requires me having the V5.
Was hoping someone on STW had some experience from their own van.
As far as I understand if it's got a GVW of over 2000kg , then its 50mph on a single carriage way. I could be wrong though. Later caddys are over, mine was a 2014, but earlier ones are not 20??. Pretty sure connects are over aswell.
It all seems a bit of a grey area without having a V5 in your hand. We are trying to narrow down which model to look for (thinking 10 years old) without wasting peoples time.
This is a minefield, I can't for the life of me work it out.
Probably best to ask a policeman for a definitive answer, they ought to know the law on it.
[quote=tomatoevousparlour ]It all seems a bit of a grey area without having a V5 in your hand. We are trying to narrow down which model to look for (thinking 10 years old) without wasting peoples time.
Yeah - your best bet is for someone with a van of similar vintage to look it up for you and hope they were all classified the same (there's lots of variation in the likes of T4s/T5s). As I said, anything else is just speculation.
vongassit - Member
As far as I understand if it's got a GVW of over 2000kg , then its 50mph on a single carriage way. I could be wrong though.
This.
Caddys are definitely over the limit. Berlingo/Kangoos are under iirc. Dunno about Connects
Yeah - your best bet is for someone with a van of similar vintage to look it up for you and hope they were all classified the same (there's lots of variation in the likes of T4s/T5s). As I said, anything else is just speculation.
It's what i'm hoping for.
Our logic is if we have to deal with faff of speed limits we might as well get the next size up (Dispatch, expert etc) rather than the compact one.
Jon
Off the top of my head I think connects are over but the older vauxhall combo is under from what we had at work.
Unsure about the newer combo
07 transit connect here - I'm over so it's van speed limits for me.
[quote=tomatoevousparlour ]Yeah - your best bet is for someone with a van of similar vintage to look it up for you and hope they were all classified the same (there's lots of variation in the likes of T4s/T5s). As I said, anything else is just speculation.
It's what i'm hoping for.
Our logic is if we have to deal with faff of speed limits we might as well get the next size up (Dispatch, expert etc) rather than the compact one.
Jon
I drive a Trafic and, TBH, the lower speed limits never really bother me. It's better for fuel consumption/running costs/the planet too.
Dispatch is N1 on reduced limits, Dispatch Combi is definitely M1 car on my V5. Presumably same for Scudo and Expert as they all got homologated together. Still found anomalies with one insurer not recognising mine as a car.
Connect and Caddy definitely vans, but Life and Tourneo usually cars.
Crew vans usually come as N1 vans on V5 but could argue they are DPV depending on windows and seats.
Think some Doblos are just over 2t gvw so N1.
Lower limit only becomes a hassle on big A road runs - 50mph in a van on the Stranraer road will have an Irish arctic on your bumper.
just do what me and probably 95% of van drivers do and ignore the lower limits, not much chance of getting caught
i got stopped by plod and told i was speeding in my transit
but spoke to a customer who is a policeman and he said he thought unto 3.5 ton you can do normal speed limits
but i think he's wrong
it seems a grey area
there are more important things in the world
Berlingo Van is subject to lower limits, but Berlingo Multispace is the same as car limits.
As far as I understand if it's got a GVW of over 2000kg , then its 50mph on a single carriage way. I could be wrong
My VWT4 Multivan is classed as a "diesel car" on the V5 and it's way over 2000kg GVW.
Been discussed before
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/speed-limits-and-insurance-for-citroen-dispach
To have the higher limit, it has to be the EXACT same bodyshell as a car, so Fiesta van, Corsa van etc
Anything that is just a Van like a Connect or Caddy has lower limits.
No one really bothers though and, like has been said, doing 50 mph on a NSL single carriageway will sometimes have an artic pushing you. The artics should be doing 40......in England anyway.
T5 LWB here, I drive at car speed limits, don't see how fitting a gas bottle, permanent bed, water supply and whatever else they want fitted for camper conversion should allow a higher speed limit.
Shoot me.
My VWT4 Multivan is classed as a "diesel car" on the V5 and it's way over 2000kg GVW.
Yes but as you say the V5 says it's a car, so in the eyes of the law it's a car and the GVW is completely ignored
It is a massive minefield. I was reading a case of a chap who was done in a berlingo van (60 on a single carriageway NSL road, van limit 50) he argued he was in a car derived van. Citroen themselves didn't know what category it should fall into. I think it went to court and he was found guilty
Unless it's a Astra/corsa or fiesta assume it's a van.
You could do worse than getting a people carrier and taking the seats out...
Simmy - wrong.
Caddy Maxi Life is M1 and classed as an estate car as are the other manufacturers variants.
It is not just about the body shape - it's more about the seating/windows that changes the classification as a previous thread(argument) on here proved.
Yes but as you say the V5 says it's a car, so in the eyes of the law it's a car and the GVW is completely ignored
Right.
So how is this correct then.....
As far as I understand if it's got a GVW of over 2000kg , then its 50mph on a single carriage way.
Had this with my pick up sees a grey area around LCV and dual purpose vehicle ,the NFU advised if it was my limited company on the logbook lower speed limit on NSL roads apply, you know like us bumbling farmer types , if its private and carrying good country bumpkin folks ,dual and not insured commercially you can go as fast as legally allowed.
bearing in mind 0-60 is measured seasonally rather than in seconds it didnt matter as someone else put you get more mpg going slower anyway and its far more relaxing
Ps is it classed as light commercial only...
Right.So how is this correct then.....
Because it's referring to vans*. Imagine what would happen to Range Rover sales if it applied to cars!
*on the V5
Buy a van, fit windows, change registration to dual purpose vehicle, fin.
Or drive slightly slower in certain circumstances.
As far as I knew as it was car derived, ie the front end of a car, with the rear of a van or a camper you can travel at the correct limits, if it was built specifically from the ground up as a van, ie, Connect, Caddy etc, then van speed limits
T5 LWB here, I drive at car speed limits, don't see how fitting a gas bottle, permanent bed, water supply and whatever else they want fitted for camper conversion should allow a higher speed limit.
Think the theory behind it is the load you can take, so in a camper in theory you won't be stuffing full of heavy cargo so the braking distance is shorter.
I used to own a Vauxhall Combo van - Corsa derived with a side door, fitted 4 bikes fully assembled (just) but with just 2 bikes there was a tonne of room.
Insurance wise Aviva seem to be one of the only places that insured commercial vehicles for domestic use.
Or NFU. Or Adrian Flux. Quite a few others too. I've never had any problems getting a quote.Insurance wise Aviva seem to be one of the only places that insured commercial vehicles for domestic use.
According the V5 my T4 factory Kombi is, body type - van with windows, taxation class - diesel car, vehicle category? - M1.
I have no idea if van or car limits apply to it.
M1 is car limits
N1 is van limits
T4 Kombi isn't likely to have a ton of pallets shoved in the back.
So not a goods vehicle.
Or NFU. Or Adrian Flux. Quite a few others too. I've never had any problems getting a quote.
Me neither, just phoned up Direct Line told them we're changing vehicles. £30 cheaper than the VW Golf for some reason.
T4 Kombi isn't likely to have a ton of pallets shoved in the back.So not a goods vehicle.
Whereas my t5 Kombi is N1. There is very little consistency.
As said above. It depends on what is stated on the V5. M1 or N1. Two vehicles the same can have different classifications.
You can check what the V5 says on the DVLA checker: [url= https://vehicleenquiry.service.gov.uk/ ]VEHICLE CHECKER[/url]
Or get a Sprinter? They seem to have the same limits as a German company car.
Sensible answer, get the car version, it will come better spec'd, be less hassle to insure and you can just reverse fit it to what you want.
Simmy - wrong.
Caddy Maxi Life is M1 and classed as an estate car as are the other manufacturers variants.
It is not just about the body shape - it's more about the seating/windows that changes the classification as a previous thread(argument) on here proved.
I wasn't aware of M1 & N1 before, all I knew was the same bodyshell had car limits.
Another STW learning curve 🙂
Well, as said further up, the same body style, eg a T5 factory kombi can be M1 or N1.
I don't know why. Maybe the weight capacity? Are M1's T28s and T30s and the N1 T32s? That has a semblance of logic if true.
2011 Peugeot Partner Tepee classed as M1
On the flip side, N1 tax is cheaper than M1 tax
Not always Jambo
My Maxi Life was cheaper than the same year "van" by enough to make a difference in the real world.
N1 is a flat fixed rate year dependent.
M1 changes as "normal" cars on emissions.
Well worth checking the log book 😉
The artics should be doing 40......in England anyway.
Not any more, it's 50 now and 60 on dual carriageways. Which makes a bit of a mockery of the fact that you can be in an unloaded small van, well maybe a 14kg bike, and have to stick to the same limit. Which is fine as long as you like your rear view mirror filled with HGV grill.
If its any help I can fit my bike in the back of my Corsavan if i take both the wheels off. And its under the parcel shelf so completely out of view.
Alot of this is determined by who bought it and how they want to pay tax on it this is why some of you have vehicles that can do 70 an others only 60
Afaik you cannot change m1 to n1 or vice versa. But once it's a camper you can get it changed to a motorcaravan.
I have an iveco daily that can do 60/70 I have no interest in doing 70 i tend to sit at 55 on the cruise uses less fuel.
As for berlingo. - the 600kg payloads come in at car derived and the 900kg payload becomes a van for speedlimits.
I know a number of people that have been tugged for it and points make prizes.
My Peugeot Expert is limited to about 110 by aerodynamics.
Just do 80mph everywhere then there's no guess work involved.
Just do 80mph everywhere then there's no guess work involved.
I usually stick to just over 80, about 83, which gives about 75 according to my satnav, and I have large commercial vans hammering past me as if I'm doing about 50!
I've had a couple of vans, one a car-sized panel van, that was physically limited to 70, actually 68, most have been capable of doing over 80-90. I did have an ex-Royal Navy van a few weeks ago which did have a label on the dash about speed limits, but it wasn't physically limited.
It's clearly a really difficult issue to pin down.
Not that difficult. Just have to read your v5 and stick to the prescribed limit really.
Thanks for all the advice.
After driving today (following comments from above) it made me think that the lower limit won't be all that bad.